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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Discussion in 'Creative Writing' started by Mr Zoat, Jan 27, 2019.

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  1. PDV

    PDV Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer

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    Nah. It's strictly better than no utilitarianism at all, and far more sustainable even if you aren't enlightened. If you demand flawless utilitarianism what you get is burnout and 'deconversions'. If all you require is for people to spend a decent portion of their time (and/or their money) doing the best they can manage, and the rest of their time being selfish or working toward whatever ineffective 'nice' causes they want, what you get is quite a lot of effective, thoughtful utilitarian action.
     
  2. BR549

    BR549 This is filth! FILTH!!

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    Colonial language correction:

    That's good British English, which Clark wouldn't be using. Either 'cause you to suffer a serious injury' or 'to give you a serious injury' would be better, although (thinking as I'm writing) 'to seriously hurt you' would probably be the most likely phrasing he'd use.
     
  3. jonasquinn

    jonasquinn I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    I enjoyed this update but I just, still have no idea where it’s heading. It’s fun seeing Superman be Superman but it’s completely unbelievable, and in my opinion undesirable, that OL will ever be anything similar, it would be a fundamental change to his character and would completely alter everything in the story
    That… seems like an enormous exaggeration

    Even if we say that Superman will eventually save enough children from situations that were potentially dangerous to equal the lives OL would save or improve doing any of the things he listed off for a couple of days the odds of the former having the same or greater impact as the latter are extremely small
     
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  4. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Considering the fact that Narrative as a force of nature is an actual, canonical part of DC Superman doing Superman things may genuinely have a greater impact than any number of utilitarian acts. If Superman, the most Narratively important person in the DC multiverse, genuinely believes people are, underneath it all, fundamentally good then reality may well actively try and conform to that standard purely because The Main Character of DC wants it to be that way.

    Combine that with The Collective Unconscious influencing things (more Mankind really since we get to special snowflakes because the writers said so) on an ontological level, making it so something just is so long as enough people believe that something is that way and you get a fun little picture where Uncomplicated Good Works + good PR = The most effective possible method of improving the multiverse.

    I doubt that's where Zoat is going with this, or would ever even consider going, but metaphysics in DC as written make The League and Superman specially the META for improving people's lives. The fact that it comes in the form of Righteous Face Punching just makes it more entertaining for the readers.
     
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  5. Threadmarks: Uncomplicated Good Works (supplementary, Renegade Option)
    Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    12th December 2012
    15:23 GMT +1


    "…returning from Ungara within a few days."

    I bring up the star chart.

    "We're not expecting any real difficulty en route, so President Horne and I have organised a formal reception. Lex will be doing a… An internationalist speech, 'brotherhood of men' and not 'community of nations'." I lay down my notes and look around my colleagues in The Light. "Oh, I've been meaning to ask; how does everyone feel about involving aliens in the fleet?"

    Circe turns her head slightly to the side, narrowing her eyes.

    "I realise that Earth is your adopted home-."

    "Other than me. I mean, as ratings, not administrators. I've been making my children watch Star Trek: the Next Generation, and I thought, you know, we could do that."

    Clea shakes her head. "No. Perhaps in a few decades, once the institution is firmly established. Bringing in alien populations without a clear operational culture is simply asking for trouble."

    Adom nods. "I am similarly sceptical. If it were a matter of an alliance with another power, I would leave it to you to asses their value. But everything we have learned about our neighbours in the stars is that they are weak and timorous. If we must implant steel in their spines before we can make any use of them…" He nods again. "I would rather wait."

    Cranius smiles. "Implant zhe steel in zhe spine is not zo hard."

    "Ah?" Richard smiles. "You've worked on aliens?"

    "Not on whole ones, no. But zhe humanoid form has certain commonalities. It really would be no great difficulty to adapt zhem. In zhe brain, courage is expressed in zhe structures responsible for group-affiliation. Unless our neighbours are purely solitary creatures coming togezher only to mate, nudging zhem a little is no great task."

    Lex's screen makes a small noise at it turns towards Cranius.

    "I do not think that editing the brains of our recruits should be our first choice. Even if they are of limited use, there will be a few individuals who stand above their fellows." Another quiet whine from the screen's pedestal. "I am also against including aliens in the organisation. For now, at least."

    I nod. "Fair enough. Richard?" He just shrugs. "Circe?"

    "Are there magicians on any of them?"

    "Other than Mars? No."

    "Then I will also vote 'no'."

    I nod. "Alright, that's a 'no' for now. Revisit in… Say, five years?" Nods. "Okay, that's me done. Ah… Richard."

    "The Justice League have managed not to die for another month. Somehow." He leans forward, eyes peering over the top of his smoking glasses. "Do you know how much kryptonite there is on Earth?"

    I shake my head. "Maybe half a tonne?"

    "He turned into a giant with a double-digit IQ! I didn't know kryptonite could even do that!"

    "I.. think the red stuff can have mutagenic effects..?"

    "Consider that confirmed." He leans back, a black tendril restores his glasses to their accustomed perch. "Oh, and it turned out that Ian Karkull survived as a wraith in the Shadowlands. Once he stuck his head out of cover I was able to give him the boot, but you should probably keep an eye out so that Lane doesn't acquire him for his expertise."

    "Samuel isn't quite as eager to recruit people likely to cause long term problems as some of his contemporaries, but thank you for the reminder. Any idea what he was up to?"

    Richard sneers. "Infecting the minds of mortal men with dreadful visions, so far as I can tell. Though according to him, his original Transareal Beam has some sort of life-extension property. I'll be forwarding a copy of everything the League learned to The Screen."

    The Screen displays a green oscilloscope of agreement. "That does sound interesting. Everything you've told me suggests that contact with the Shadowlands is inimical to human health."

    "As far as I know, it is. All I can suggest is that it's something to do with how he made the connection, rather than the connection itself. Oh, and naturally Batman already has everything I've got."

    "That is of no concern. Batman will work on a way to counter someone else using Karkull's technology. I would be exceedingly surprised if he used it to benefit humanity."

    "Good! Good. And I'll get started on working out how to persuade my lady wife to use the thing." He reaches out with his right fist and knocks on the meeting table surface. "Next."

    Cranius inflates his air sacs, but Clea pre-empts him.

    "If you don't mind, Cranius. I fear that what I say will impact you most of all."

    "But of course. I wait with circular breath."

    "Ahri'ahn has appeared."

    My armour starts to glow, and Cranius glowers. "Where?"

    "Poseidonis. He just appeared in the middle of a meeting of city-state ambassadors for a meeting with High King Orin. The ambassadors were dismissed, so I'm not entirely certain what they were discussing."

    She looks over to Richard with eyebrows raised, but he just shakes his head.

    "Orin's been away for a few days, but that's not all that unusual. Nothing's been mentioned. Has he been ensorcelled?"

    "I doubt it. High Queen Mera is an archmage, and the royal family have any number of enchanted artefacts to defend themselves with. Nothing that would stop Ahri'ahn for any length of time, but overwhelming them wouldn't be a simple matter."

    Circe looks disgruntled. "I would offer my services, but I'm… Not yet strong enough to counter Ahri'ahn reliably."

    I nod. "Obviously, we need to know what's going on. Orin having a chinwag with a man who attacked and killed US military personnel is going to disrupt a lot of things."

    Clea nods. "Since I'm the face of the engagement movement, I am the natural choice to find out what he thinks he's doing."

    "Do you want me to be there? Or Sunset? I'm confident that I can tough out anything he can throw at me, and Sunset's a rather good thaumaturgist."

    "No, this is an internal Atlantean matter at present. It would be better, politically, if I handled this myself."

    I nod again. "Alright. Just remember that the rest of us are a phone call away."

    "I will. Thank you. The only other thing of note I have to report is that Aurania is suffering from my trade embargo. People are actually leaving the city to live elsewhere as the economy falters."

    I shrug. "Does that..? Affect our operations in Atlantis in some way?"

    "There will be a few more magic tutors looking for work. I'll send Circe a list of the more capable ones who might be interested in relocating to the surface." Circe gives her a grateful nod. "But I mostly just wanted an opportunity to be smug out loud. Revenge after so long feels like a tremendous weight I'd forgotten I was carrying has been lifted from me."

    It's unproductive, but it's not really a problem if one Atlantean city gets frozen out.

    "Alright, but try to keep it under control. I don't want to alienate Orin."

    She waves off my concern. On her head be it, then.

    "Adom…"
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2022
  6. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    That's the usual purpose of superheroes in fiction. If they existed in the real world, I imagine people would be a lot more practical about it.
     
  7. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    Thank you, corrected.
     
  8. Breadnaught

    Breadnaught Experienced.

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    That's going to bite him in the ass, isn't it?

    Yes Grayven, Atlantean Moses, who happens to be a dangerous extremist, is becoming active. And oh look, an Atlantean city suffering economic hardship, with a population probably growing increasingly disgruntled and venerable to radicalization. I'm sure those two things won't cause a problem at all.
     
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  9. Zig

    Zig Not too sore, are you?

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    This obviously isn't the Ahri'ahn that appeared in Season 4 but I doubt it's the real one either.
     
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  10. Chojin Patriarch

    Chojin Patriarch Veteran Lurker

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    Since most of the Renegade's New Light would have little knowledge of the stars. Except to be aware of what dangers may spring forth from certain alignments, or alien fleets coming their way... Not that that will be as big a threat as they used to be.

    I mean, one alien is already involved. Are you talking exceptional individuals, or taking in conquered forces?

    ...And that is entirely normal for the Renegade to consider a good reason to ask, I suppose.

    The veteran rulers have the right of it, I think. Better to master what you have than try to make a potentially volatile mix.

    I don't think Adom meant that literally, Cranius. Not one for figures of speech, are you? :p

    "I'm a part-time mad scientist, and even I think that's a little much..."

    Well, of course Lex would say that. :rolleyes: Though given humanity's track record with aliens thus far...

    Well, none who are what you'd call neighbours, anyway.

    Giving his little update on the League, since the Renegade isn't as closely tied to them, of course.

    To be fair, all it takes is a pebble to have some effect on Kryptonians.

    Ah, silver-age madness. Where the eye-catching cover came first, and the actual story second...

    Yeah, best not to work with people who consider poking eldritch alternate dimensions to be a hobby. :confused: Much less their life-work.

    ...I assume that's just the Renegade having a little fun with Lex's little remote contact display. :D Since he's still trying to be anonymous in this thing?

    Now, Bruce Wayne, on the other hand... Though I suspect it will still be one of those 'dangerous to the user' methods.

    Since his lady love, Hope O'Dare, is merely human... For now, anyway. Who knows what could happen?

    ...Because he can't hold his breath, I suppose. Drawback of said air-sacs being comparatively small...

    And how soon can they get there? The old fellow's still in need of a good beating or two.

    So, Aquaman hasn't mentioned it to the league? Suspicious.

    Unless he's using some sympathetic aspect of their very biomantically-enhanced physiques to do so. Like having root access via remote terminal on a PC...

    I'm surprised he even talked to the guy. Presumably aware that he's very dangerous, or simply taken in by a handsome face and a diplomatic manner...

    Though not as good a battlemage as she could be. Comes from being a horse at heart, more likely to retreat from a threat than fight it...

    And a boom-tube away from planting a boot so far up Ari'ahn's backside he'll taste shoe leather. :p

    Yeah, will Orin be concerned enough to step in, or...

    ...Until it turns out you need something from that city somewhere down the line.

    Renegade as ever, making short-term decisions without considering the results...

    A pleasant little business meeting, and a good catch-up on things on the Renegade side. Let's hope those things don't come back to bite them in the arse. Then again, it's always amusing for us to watch when that does happen. :oops: A little messy, but....At any rate, it's always nice to be reminded of how far the two timelines have diverged. Wouldn't catch the Renegade doing community service stuff...
     
  11. AmericanNumbers

    AmericanNumbers Not too sore, are you?

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    I mean, yes Arion will likely be a problem for Grayven's group but with the assets they have in play they're pretty well equipped to handle it most likely. Adom, Shade and post merger Grayven with Pony support could likely handle anything other than Darkseid directly.
     
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  12. Ngamer11

    Ngamer11 Experienced.

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    That should say 'glasses'.

    It was confirmed in-universe that Ahri'ahn time travels to the future and periodically appears before time travelling again and I think Circe was able to confirm that the guy who showed up was the real deal.
     
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  13. Assblaster5000

    Assblaster5000 I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    'and I thought'
     
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  14. Fellow

    Fellow Know what you're doing yet?

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    I thought that the planet the chaos lord Mordru was from was in regular contact with Renegade. They're magic aliens.
     
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  15. DrThoth

    DrThoth I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Maybe it's 'just' another dimensional counterpart of Earth? But I forget specifics so I could be wrong.
     
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  16. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    I haven't watched series four, and I'm probably not going to.
    Thank you, corrected.
    Yes, but they're well outside of the Sector.
     
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  17. Belenus

    Belenus Versed in the lewd.

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    You have tremendous faith in humanity.
     
  18. Dakkan Sall

    Dakkan Sall Random Encounter

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    I'm not entirely sure what Grayven means here by 'ratings.' With the mention of Star Trek does he mean in the way of audience/viewer/observer opinion, or something else?
     
  19. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    'There are, as ever, only evil people and evil people. But some of them are on opposite sides.'
    Ratings.
     
  20. Stsword

    Stsword Versed in the lewd.

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    This is probably "burnt out his magic and so is reliant on magical artifacts" Arion, since that was the Arion known for time travelling to the present to make a nuisance of himself in the comics.

    Zerox. Which in the comics is sometimes a different planet, and sometimes it's the extradimensional Gemworld, becoming known as Zerox in the future when it is transported into the universe.

    Generally colonized by mages from Earth who decided they were tired of sharing the planet with muggles.
     
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  21. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    Well this version isn't so eager.

    His comic counterpart is eager.
     
  22. Darko

    Darko Connoisseur.

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    Either Arion is preventing him, or maybe they didn't tell Shade since they know about his connection to renegade and wanted to keep him out of it.

    The fact that he's dangerous could be why he talked to him.

    He could have been worried about the guy going on a rampage if he feels disrespected.

    Plus, Arion is a very major figure in Atlantis, so who knows what kind of influence he could have wielded.

    YJ showed what would happen if he came back.

    It would be like George Washington returning.

    With all the negative sides.

    She's more of a researcher than a fighter.

    While she has been in fights before, they were very few.

    Now Twilight may be a better choice, since she's dealt with all sorts of crazy crap.
     
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  23. Windona

    Windona Beetle Queen of Crackshipping

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    Ah, Mr Zoat, you were disenchanted with s3 too?

    It's good to catch up with the Renegade. Gotta love Shade complain about Kryptonite and the way they all casually work together. It feels more congenial than the Canon Light.
     
  24. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    I watched a few episodes of S4. I stopped after the Legion appeared for the first time. I don't remember exactly why I lost interest, but S3 didn't exactly impress me with Batman's stupidity and the League in general. Also, their characteristation of Black Lightning was completely off.
    The canon Light only really appear when they're sinistering for the camera.
     
  25. Windona

    Windona Beetle Queen of Crackshipping

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    Yeah, for all Black Lightning was said to care about the kids and be a leader, he didn't really show it. But uh, don't think this is the place for me to rant about s3.

    True, but even then they don't have quite the same casual talk that the Renegade's group does. We have sent business meetings on screen, but Bad Samaritan seems the only one to comment on their own weaknesses and be so forthcoming in canon.
     
  26. Mr Zoat

    Mr Zoat Dedicated ragequitter

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    Seems on-topic to me, but what do I know?

    I remember reading an interview with the creator of Black Lightning, and he was not happy about how later writers treated his conservative Christian superhero.
    Who is Bad Samaritan?
     
  27. Windona

    Windona Beetle Queen of Crackshipping

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    Mike Barr also complained about the previews a bit, and some of his comments were spot on. I'm also not over how much s3 went to be progressive with rep... then tripped into being offensive a lot. I will say it got me to read the Outsiders comics though, and fall in love with those characters.

    Ah, he's only called Zviad Baazovi in the show. He's in s3 and has psychic powers, he's in a meeting in s4 and really has that affable attitude
     
  28. Stsword

    Stsword Versed in the lewd.

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    Not made up for the show, he's a minor Outsiders villain, although the YJ version is more of an "in name only adaptation," since comic Bad Samaritan was a powerless Georgian spy for hire, not a Markovian mind controlling evil vizier.

    Despite that, he was so slimy on YJ even before the reveal that I was thinking to myself "Is this guy Bad Samaritan?" so I guess they got the quintessential sliminess down.
     
  29. Zig

    Zig Not too sore, are you?

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    Well then it will be interesting to see how close you get to that storyline.
     
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  30. I_S

    I_S Getting sticky.

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    That's the self stated goal of most superheroes within the context of their works.

    Batman, superman and the Flash explicitly state they seek to inspire others with their costumes.

    If they existed in a practical setting Batman would hire a PMC and police Gothman as a corpo state

    Superman wouldnt have a secret identity for more than a single run.

    And the Flash would mostly use his superpowers to get to work on time and have a human sleeping schedule, since violent crime is honestly quite rare. He'd basically do one thing a week unless he was willing to respond to emergencies nationally. Barry is kinda too nice to deal with the American criminal justice system.

    Heroism is by definition extraordinary behavior outside the expected bounds of practicality. People who engage in heroics regularly are people with bad or non existent standard procedures for dealing with a crisis. Or more succinctly, they are short sighted and poor planners, elsewise they'd be professionals.

    Batman is the cat with a piece of toast strapped to his back of superheros... A plan and tool for every conceivable situation, that he's just not shared with anyone else
     
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