Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[DelightedOne]

So Selene level up to Knock 5.

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Can she even do that considering we don't have access to that level up mechanic yet?

 

[Shaper47]

Can she even do that considering we don't have access to that level up mechanic yet?

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It's locked between Velvet getting the Sacrament first and Velvet got the Silver Key.

So Selene should just need Velvet Axe to do the same and she already promised to help Selene with leaning more Knock.

 

[DelightedOne]

It's locked between Velvet getting the Sacrament first and Velvet got the Silver Key.

So Selene should just need Velvet Axe to do the same and she already promised to help Selene with leaning more Knock.

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Did you miss this QM comment by any chance?

I am honestly, legitimately, still thinking about what "Follower Level 5" might entail.

No, really. The greatest perk for a follower is the re-roll at level 4, and I am not currently interested (nor do I have the bandwidth) to create individualized sacrament skills for every character. And finally, reaching a Sacrament is a "big thing" that makes sense to focus on named or important characters such as Velvet.

So for now, I do not know. And we are a bit too close to the end of the quest for me to think the effort that this will involve will be worth it.

More on that later, really. It is not a huge problem, or a great loss. Just a mechanical issue I haven't made a decision on yet.

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So it might take a bit longer to get a Exalted follower.

 

[spiderhellian]

It's locked between Velvet getting the Sacrament first and Velvet got the Silver Key.

So Selene should just need Velvet Axe to do the same and she already promised to help Selene with leaning more Knock.

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Bird was flat out "I don't know what the requirements to get followers to Level 5 is, I don't even know if I'm going to allow it, but it's not happening right now" lol

Maybe it's a fun thing to ping him with or you can write an oh so tempting Omake and cross your fingers, but I don't think this is going anywhere anytime soon.

 

[Shaper47]

Did you miss this QM comment by any chance?

So it might take a bit longer to get a Exalted follower.

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Huh, I was still going by his old comment when he talked about how he wasn't letting us make Jade an Exalted follower via Baldomare as it was locked behind Velvet getting a Sacrament first.

I.e. The it's allowed after Velvet has a Sacrament bit. And well... Velvet has a Sacrament now.

Edit. Reading it the QM comment was about personalized Sacraments. The Silver Key is a Name Sacrament. Also Selene is a named important character.

 

[Greymere]

You know, since he can miniaturize into a Forge 6 artifact, this means that technically once he's "befriended" we can have him miniaturize and channel a max Forge Influence for us for our Forge Sacrament (+113 total). We'd lose out on being able to take advantage of our reroll, I think, but I haven't done the math yet to check whether a single reroll adds more value than an additional +20 per roll, if we Experiment twice on the same turn.

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Okay, checked the math on this (thank you AnyDice). Both of these assume that we're spending two AP in a single turn, so only one reroll is available.

Under a max Forge Influence and using Mr. Clockwork as an artifact, and assuming that doing so means we cannot invoke a reroll: 73.7% of success

Under just a max Forge Influence: 54.2% chance of success

These can be increased to 91.0% and 81.2%, respectively, by sacrificing a single Forge 3 reagent.

So yeah, there's a pretty noticeable difference w/o a reagent in favor of using Clockwork's Forge level via miniaturization, and a lesser but still significant one even with a Level 3 reagent.

Edit: Of course this assumes that our Forge Sacrament's rolls work like other Knowledge checks do and our personal Forge level can be subbed in by a higher level artifact.

 

[Shaper47]

These can be increased to 91.0% and 81.2%, respectively, by sacrificing a single Forge 3 reagent.

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We need them activated for befriending so we can't do it next turn but the turn after should be good.

So long as we get the bits of course.

We've already had to put off befriending Forge Name thus turn due to bit wastage.

 

[DelightedOne]

We've already had to put off befriending Forge Name thus turn due to bit wastage.

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Could you explain how exactly there was a waste of bits?

With the note from the QM we know Rarity's dividends for turn 22 were already included in our budget and we also didn't know what the Forge Name would ask for, so I don't see how it could be a waste.

-You can assume you will have 623 bits at the beginning of Turn 22. (Your current 421, plus 160 from your salary, plus 42 from Rarity's dividends).

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[Greymere]

Could you explain how exactly there was a waste of bits?

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Probably moaning about the blackmail vote again.

 

[Pittauro]

@OurLadyOfWires I had a thought.

We can have the Forge Name turn into an artifact.

I don't suppose it can turn into an Edge artifact giving bonuses to combat for the Biedde fight?

You are entirely correct, the decision to use Spoiled Rich was based in the thread's anymosity against her, not that she doesn't deserve it, but Velvet herself has no idea about who Spoiled Rich really is besides her public persona and whatever Mareinette told her.

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Well, she might deserve the false friendship. She arguably did the same to her own husband, after all.

She does NOT deserve to be eaten!

You can criticize going after someone separate for being less AP efficient all you like. But acting like eating a random gangster or something that Biedde kidnapped off the street is somehow freakier than luring someone that trusts you implicitly to your house, revealing that your relationship was a lie this whole time and that you never even actually met them, and then killing and eating them, is ridiculous.

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THANK YOU!

That's like 80% of my whole point!

Sure, she's a bad person. We can justify to ourselves the Moth Sacrament, because it's KIND of comparable to what she does to her husband and most other people she interacts with (that she feels the need to be nice to).

(obligatory "2 wrongs don't make a right", but if you're telling me that doing a wrong to someone who did wrong as well feels the same to you as doing a wrong to someone arguably "innocent", you're either lying or a saint)

But eating her right after is so CRUEL that I can't argue strongly enough against it. One can argue about convenience, and it IS indeed very convenient.

It spares us a Selene action to scry for the criminal, a Biedde action to imprison that criminal, an action to make the prison (probably from the Forge Name), a rebinding price from Mareinette (probably a lvl 2 artifact? I forget if we can give her an unstudied one though), and it gives us extra Mareinette actions in the meantime from the friendship.


That's a high price. I WON'T DENY THAT.

but let's not argue that she deserves it, OR that it's the same to eat her as it is to eat a criminal. Or that it won't change Velvet SIGNIFICANTLY to willingly EAT someone who looked up to her as a friend because it was more convenient.

I don't want to play that Velvet. I want to play a more hesitant, morally gray, "tries her best even if she does evil stuff at times" Velvet.

Not that I'd abandon the quest if we did it. But I'd be unhappy with it.

If nothing else, having sent Mareinette to cultivate a relationship with Spoiled Rich can be taken as Velvet asking Mareinette to prepare and season the meal that she would like to share with her, but only after assessing the ingredients before it is finished. Nothing else could give her a greater understanding of what it means to CHANGE or appreciate the meaning of one's blood.

For Velvet Covers, there would be nothing more fitting than consuming a mother that she finds wanting.

I can't imagine something more Moth and Grail than to combine these two.

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...

I'm still against it, but I won't argue that the narrative fits pretty well.

This would be Velvet passing judgement over a bad mother... maybe in her mind she's avenging herself on her OWN parents, even.

I can see her rationalizing it that way.

I'm still against it, as I said... but Daaaamn.

Also. "It"? "He"? He is a colt, in my eyes, but I am not sure which to use.

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I'd go with he, all things considered.

Yes, yes, Sacrament, Sacrament. Later.

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Definitely him, if we Recalibrate his lesser lore to Grail he auto-passes with his general bonus on it and only needs to roll a 10 to succeed at the Forge check, with the reroll it is very safe to trust him to do it. And since it doesn't seem to cost him an action to instruct Velvet there is no need to not have him do it.

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we can even just use a forge 1 reagent from 5 bits, if we don't have a need for another one.

Considering we'd be using so many bits... I suppose the alternative would be a lantern 3 reagent for more scrying?

I personally think that befriending the Forge Name is better than getting an edge sacrament, if we are forced to choose between the two. Biedde's edge sacrament is an unknown effect, or we could befriend the Name, which has a known effect (2AP + ALL IN). Not to mention just how unlikely it is that we actually do get the sacrament, seeing the chances involved. And it very well may be that we need to choose considering the Poisoned Blood Malus, even if we heal it off as soon as possible.

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well, luckily? It's not a choice.

We don't have the APs, the bits, OR the forge 4 reagent to start befriending him on turn 22, which is when we're planning to try the Edge Sacrament (with around 80% chance of success).

We can do it on turn 23 though. 190 bits, the free reagent action, 2 Velvet APs and 1 Forge Name AP (which we get back from him being befriended basically).

just one question: Do we heal the same turn we get wounded, or the turn after?

Because there's a chance of us getting from 3 to 2 or even 1 HP from the Edge Sacrament. and then making the Uranium/Blue Gold ingot will take another HP.

As long as we don't go to 0 HP it should be fine though.

Side note, are we doing Biedde BEFORE or AFTER Tall Tale? If we do it after we can try to have Velvet play it safer... maybe pretend the wounds are from it, even.

1. We can convert it to a Forge 6/X 3 artefact for a turn.
2. We can convert its secondary lore to whatever we'd like, as a free action.
3. We have a use for low-level artefacts! Neat!

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Nah, we'll definitely befriend him before the need for a renewal. PROBABLY on turn 23 if we can afford it, for effectively 190 bits and 2 Velvet APs.

the artifact bit though... I was underestimating it before, but it DOES have an interesting use case: It can be used on Expeditions to improve the odds of a single Name, while not paying for sending an extra pony.

Send Axe and make him a Forge 6 Grail 3 (or 4) artifact. Send Biedde and make him a Forge 6 Lantern 4 Artifact. Send Mareinette and make him an Forge 6 Edge 4 Name, maybe.

or Send Selene, and make him Forge 6 "insert Lore Selene Doesn't Have" 3-4 artifact.

He loses the rerolls, admittedly, and the chance of using influences to help, but it's still a cheap way to improve an expedition's chances.

Note that on the subject of Expeditions...

the fact that it can turn itself into an "artifact" essentially means IT CAN ACCOMPANY AXE FOR ZERO BITS to expeditions!

AND WE CAN TAKE IT INTO THE MANSUS!!!(!)

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Right after I thought of it, I read this
Admittedly it still costs its action, AND he loses the Forge reroll (and, after friendship, the secondary lore's reroll), but it can still be worth it at times.

As an artifact it could even potentially be used in MULTIPLE Expeditions (or to help in rituals) in the same turn, as well as helping us in the Mansus.

After befriending, if we're not yet at Heart 4, we could use it for Forge 6 Heart 4. Every little bit helps.

Okay I know how I want to center the name now

I'm in favor of Rare Item!

(Rarity I'm sorry-)

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just you wait for us to take it as we're naming it after her...

"I'M TOO YOUNG TO BE A MOTHER!" Rarity, probably

bonus points if he has a white coat and purple hair!

...what about "Rare Silk" or "Rare Fabric" instead? a pun on Rarity AND Velvet.

Inb4 Stormchaser adopts the colt despite Velvet not wanting to give him the colt, to follow in Silky's hoofsteps of Name acquisition.

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...admittedly she has befriended all of our Names to some extent...

except Mareinette, for OBVIOUS reasons.

Ok, so to befriend the Forge Name as soon as possible we would have to:

Use our free reagent AP and 80 bits to craft a Forge 4 reagent in turn 23 (since we don't have the bits to do so in turn 22)
Use 110 bits, 2 Velvet AP and 1 Forge name AP and 1 Velvet max HP to refine the reagent and feed it to the Name in turn 24.
At some point do the Forge's redemption to recover our maximum HP.

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We kinda get the forge name AP back as friendship = 2 APs. And we can then use that extra AP IMMEDIATELY for a forge redemption to recover than one HP, changing his lores to Forge 6 grail 4.

And less valuable a Forge 6 reagent is not going to be the only thing in an expedition to retrieve it. We have firmly established that Expeditions pay off big time.

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Not necessarily true. Remember the book we got from the grave expedition, for example? That was the ONLY thing there, because we scried for the easiest book to find and we got "fine, but that's the ONLY thing there too" as a result basically.

It's very possible we'd be pointed at a short expedition with that reagent as the only reward.

and it would still cost us 30 bits and 1 (Selene?) action to scry it, and then one more action, or potentially 2 if it's a medium expedition (Selene or Axe probably) to get it AND the bit cost for it (AT LEAST another 15-20 bits, could be more)

so, conservatively we'd still have to spend 50 bits or so. We'd be trading something like 140 bits in exchange for our free reagent (irrelevant), 2 Velvet AP and 2 Forge Name APs (for reagent and to heal us after).

the Forge Name APs and the Selene/Axe APs are more or less equivalent, so I'm not even counting them.

mh... I suppose an expedition would have us save 140 bits (maybe less, but probably more than 100) AND 2 Velvet APs though. It's not a bad idea all things considered.

How about this? We have Selene scry for a forge 6 reagent NOW. If she finds it, we can do the expedition first thing next turn, and

CORRECTION: even if we get the Forge 6 reagent, we STILL need to turn it into "Blue Gold", so we're not replacing the FULL cost of it.

...let me compare the cost directly.

FULL COST WITH EXPEDITION FOR REAGENT 6	FULL COST MAKING THE REAGENT
Selene scries for Reagent 6 (30 bits, 1 Selene AP)	Free Reagent action and 80 bits for Forge 4 reagent
Do the expedition. Probably send Axe (Probably 1 Axe AP and 20 bits or so. Potentially 2 Axe APs and something like 50 bits if Medium Lenght Expedition	110 bits, 1 Velvet AP to turn the Forge 4 reagent into Forge 6
1 Velvet AP and 1 Forge Name AP to turn Forge 6 into Blue Gold	1 Velvet AP and 1 Forge Name AP to turn Forge 6 into Blue Gold
1 Forge Name AP to heal "Poisoned Blood" with Redemption of the Forge.	1 Forge Name AP to heal "Poisoned Blood" with Redemption of the Forge.
TOTAL COST: EXPECTED 50 to 80 bits, 1 Selene AP, 1 Axe AP (could be 2), 1 Velvet AP, 2 Forge Name APs.	TOTAL COST: 190 bits, Free Reagent point, 2 Velvet APs, 2 Forge Name APs

So, assuming the ritual and expedition go well, by searching for Forge 6 reagent we save... 140 to 110 bits AND 1 Velvet AP, at the cost of a Selene and Axe AP.

...it's not a bad deal, actually. Let's say conservatively that we in reality save 100 bits, a nice round sum.

Can we agree that

100 bits + 1 Velvet AP > 1 Selene and 1 Axe AP

I think that's true, is it not?

There's also a chance of MORE rewards coming from such an expedition, besides the reagent.

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posting this as the post is getting too long already

 

[DelightedOne]

Well, she might deserve the false friendship. She arguably did the same to her own husband, after all.

She does NOT deserve to be eaten!

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I was reffering to the general dislike of the thread towards her, not the Grail Sacrament.

 

[Greymere]

Because there's a chance of us getting from 3 to 2 or even 1 HP from the Edge Sacrament. and then making the Uranium/Blue Gold ingot will take another HP.

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It only affects our maximum Health, not our current one. So even if we end up at 1 Health this turn, we'd still be in the clear to make the Blue Gold.

 

[DelightedOne]

After befriending, if we're not yet at Heart 4, we could use it for Forge 6 Heart 4. Every little bit helps.

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Wait, if the Forge Name is befriended and we change his lesser lore to Heart can we study him(as an artifact) or ask for a Heart lesson? We could reach Heart 4 in a single turn if he can give lessons.

 

[Greymere]

Hm. Hmm. I have an idea. It's kind of janky, but it
should get everything lined up well enough.


Detectives - Dodge City
Constables - Tall Tale Proto-Hive
Commissioner - Get our hooves dirty
Free Lore Introduction - Lantern

Mareinette - Spoiled Rich
Baldomare - Lantern Influence
Biedde - Edge Influence
Forge Name - RotT for Level 7 book
Selene (3) - Soothe the Night, Edge AotL (x2)
Rarity - Work focus or Commission
Cover your bases (+2 AP) - Servants, Risen, Fluttershy, DoA (x2)

AotL - Edge
Knock - Shattered Stairways
Forge - Forge 2 for Forge Name
Grail - Spoiled Rich
Social - Cheerilee
1+2+3) Study: Moth 5 book, Lantern 4 artifact, Winter 4 artifact, Manehattan book, Moth 3 artifact, Knock 2 artifact
4) Soft Sweeps FO
5) Edge Sacrament
6) Rite of Joyous (Re)Forging

Is it kind of a waste to use Selene's AP on mere AotLs? Yes. But it was also the only way I could find to cram the Edge Sacrament in there while also studying more artifacts so we can liquidate them next turn.

 

[Bakkasama]

Clearly, the best use for the Forge Name is as follows:

1) Use forge name AP to turn him into an artifact
2) Sell Forge 6 artifact for extra bits.
3) Have the Forge Name turn back into a pony and perform a daring escape so that we can use him next turn
4) Profit

 

[Nevermort]

Clearly, the best use for the Forge Name is as follows:

1) Use forge name AP to turn him into an artifact
2) Sell Forge 6 artifact for extra bits.
3) Have the Forge Name turn back into a pony and perform a daring escape so that we can use him next turn
4) Profit

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Genius.
Tell him to steal everything that he finds on the way out too.

 

[DelightedOne]

[X] (MAREINETTE) Mareinette is her own mare, and Cadance could use some company. Don't do anything, and see how things turn out.
-You will not take any particular action this turn.
-From what you hear, Mareinette will be more absent from your home than usual. Something about spending more time in Canterlot.
-This is a free action, and will not interfere in Mareinette's ability to serve you.

[X] Rare Item

 

[Greymere]

[X] (MAREINETTE) Mareinette is her own mare, and Cadance could use some company. Don't do anything, and see how things turn out.

[X] Daedalus
[X] Clockwork

 

[Pittauro]

Rarity's Big Surprise

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She was in loved it. Yes.

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sure, that's what you meant.

we believe you!

What was unexpected was the foal-sized earth pony with a white coat, mane, and tail standing to the side looking at Velvet's spare horseshoes in the shoe rack.

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WHITE COAT!

"Hello," he spoke with a quiet ring, walking up to you and Velvet like water whistling down a river, "I am Rare Item."

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I'm loving this, but I'd go for something like "Rare Fabric" or "Rare Silk" for a double, maybe even TRIPLE stealth pun.

1) Rare, as in Rarity
2) Silk, as in a fabric, just like Velvet
3) and I only thought of it later, Silk as in "Silky Stream", because it's her new little brother, and I think she's going to adopt him even if Velvet does not mean it as a son for Stormchaser.

…blue eyes…

…blue eyes kind of like her own…

…and a white coat like her own…

…and Velvet Cover's white mane and tail…

…

…his name is Rare Item-

-and Rarity's thoughts exploded.

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Rarity:


Me:

Waitwaitwait! That can't be true! Velvet and I have never even… done that, so to speak! Rarity thought… And then she thought some more. But there was that one time-

NO! How would that even work?! We're both mares! I know neither of us have the… equipment for that!? Rarity bargained for an answer. An answer her mind was all too ready to give her.

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The Dark Side of the Force Lores are a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural...

Rarity immediately regathered her composure. "I-WELL, never let it be said that your FATHER-" her voice cracked, "-can't step up to the plate! Now! Let's go get you settled in Sweetie Belle's room until we can prepare something better!" Rarity mentally moved her home expansion plans to her top priorities. If this was going to be more common after this week, she needed to expedite a bigger house to better care for him.

Rare Item blinked after her statement, but he gave a happy smile. "Yes, father."

Rarity's heart soared. That feeling she was having earlier was back and stronger than it had ever been.

But in the back of her mind, she couldn't help herself from whining:

I was going to name my firstborn after you, not me!

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We've got the study them first, in which case it'd be most efficient to go ahead and study the Moth 3 and Knock 2 artifact since those combined should get us 300 bits (Lv. 3 -> 200 bits, Lv. 2 -> 100 bits), which should be enough to cover the costs of alchemizing uranium blue gold and then some.

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a single action for 300 Bits is not a bad deal, yeah. And if we can do this then we have ANOTHER incentive for more expeditions though.

Hopefully Bird keeps to his statement of "I'd probably be fine making selling them a free action".

I agree but they also need to be studied to be sold.

I unfortunately see the wisdom in skipping Edge Sacrament for the sake of studying Moth 3 and Knock 2 artifacts. We can keep the Moth 3 and sell the Knock 2 for 100ish bits less sales commission. So at absolute minimum 50 bits worst case.

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mh... delaying Edge Sacrament to study more artifacts and replenish our bits reserve?

There's a logic to that. but... I still lean towards Edge Sacrament now.

Ideally I want to do at least one Sacrament turn from now on. which we could very well keep to for at least the next 4 turns.

Edit: And before you try to wriggle out of this even with a quote, this was in direct response to me asking for confirmation if we needed to study artifacts before we can sell them.

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I forget, were we told if we also need to study them to give them to Mareinette for a rebinding? Because we might want to keep the Moth 3 one for THAT if (as I hope) we DON'T eat Spoiled Rich next turn.

I believe we should still be able to make the Forge 6 reagent next turn; it only requires the Name be active (has fuel) and be summoned (not destroyed), not be full-sized. But better to double check @OurLadyOfWires?

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Name is not active if it's in artifact form though.

Minaturizing is such a waste of an AP. We should just commit to the scry and accept the general bonus in the rare possibility that the Lantern artifact ends up horribly cursed. Seriously with the number of study rolls were doing this turn it's fine.

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miniaturize can make sense if we're using this resulting "artifact" MULTIPLE times per turn.

Expeditions, ritual casting, Mansus bonus.

It's worse than him dedicating himself to any one of these (he can go on expedition, he CAN do rituals, he can give us an influence for Mansus) BUT it's a cheap inferior alternative with more flexibility.

You know, since he can miniaturize into a Forge 6 artifact, this means that technically once he's "befriended" we can have him miniaturize and channel a max Forge Influence for us for our Forge Sacrament (+113 total). We'd lose out on being able to take advantage of our reroll, I think, but I haven't done the math yet to check whether a single reroll adds more value than an additional +20 per roll, if we Experiment twice on the same turn.

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depends on if miniaturizing himself still only costs 1 point, or uses its whole turn's worth of actions, but yeah.

I don't expect her to keep this pace, but assuming that she can, we will otherwise meet our end on turn 24. I would personally expect that it will probably take her two turns to level from here on out, and would absolutely take at least two turns to reach Lantern 5 if not more. For that reason, we need to act as though we must be ready by turn 26 or turn 27.

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Beginning of turn 25, not 24.

And we get a chance to start All In at the end of a turn, and BEFORE Celestia technically reaches the new level of Lantern, so no matter what we get a chance of emergency All In expedition with everything we have at the time

Each turn we can buy ourselves through Sooth The Night, Moth Artifact/Sacrament or so on is a turn to make us better prepared for All In though, through extra summons and Names and minions and Artifacts

We should still plan as if she'll be ready in turn 25 though, just to be sure. If we get more turns that's MUCH better, but we don't KNOW how her ranking up work.

I suspect she's rolling against slowly increasing DCs, but we don't know that for sure. And technically speaking she's dedicating herself basically 100% to this (and to keeping Daybreaker contained, I think), so what if she's actually doing something like "rolling 5 dice against a lesson DC, she only needs one success to level up?"

Hope for the best, plan for the worst.

On another note, I would like the Grail sacrament done next turn too, and will argue in favor more at that time. We may or may not need a prison for that. So I approve of having the prison built.

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I'm against eating Spoiled, as repeatedly stated, BUT if we're eating her we should NOT need the prison. Bird seemed fine with the idea of removing the need for it as long as we're combining the actions, it's effectively "you imprison her and eat her right after removing the mask", so it makes sense that, with both Velvet AND Mareinette there, we wouldn't need an actual prison. You could say THEY are keeping her imprisoned... for the few hours necessary to go through with the ritual.

IF we're not eating Spoiled, we need a prison as we'll likely need to keep someone in there for at least a turn, as we can't start a sacrament having all pre-requisites ready, and there's always a chance Biedde could fail in capturing the prisoner.

As for Biedde's sacrament, it is because I genuinely believe that we will need to be combat ready when we undertake All In, and the moment is now or never because we're gonna have many other priorities going into next turn. Edge is a lore that often needs the individual to be strong rather than relying on group strength, as the assault on our manor showed. To this end we should ensure that Velvet is ready for that, and I expect this to be our last major chance at it. So perhaps we may want Fluttershy and the Risen to give us Edge AotL instead.

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Mostly agreed.

Next few turns we'll have a LOT of stuff to do, between expeditions, SH/Forge/Lantern/Moth/Grail sacraments, many rituals, and so on.

We COULD probably do Edge Sacrament anyway, but... we'd have to delay something else in return. Better to risk it now that we COULD potentially afford a failure if it goes badly. and it IS still 80% chance of success or so, which isn't bad for a Sacrament.

as for AotL, we definitely want 3 of them, so the free one and 2 from followers. Fluttershy (well, Comet) and Risen would be the best ones, if Risen is not fine we probably pick Axe or Selene.

On other topics being spoken or considered in discussion in no particular order:
I dislike the idea of going on an expedition for a Forge 6 reagent since we have a more guaranteed method to achieve it that can be completely done next turn for 2 Velvet AP, 1 Name AP, and 200 bits. I would expect the expedition to be intermediate and take attention away from next turn where we can try to scrounge up funds for a LV7 book expedition for Baldomare.

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a lvl 5 book was "short". It's probably going to be another short and easy one, OR a longer one with more rewards.

It also saves us 100 to 150 bits and 1 Velvet AP in exchange for a Selene and Axe APs (for scrying and expedition), which is all in all a very good trade.

AND if the expedition fails, we can STILL make the reagent ourselves.

Shame we can't outright scry for an "Ingot of Blue Gold", but then again I imagine it doesn't exist right now. Also carrying it would be complicated.

Velvet Axe is in a weird spot where we don't have much for her to do this turn since she shouldn't go on an expedition to save bits. Whatever she does, more Knock lessons won't do much for us at this point.

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If she can give us more keys we should do that now, but yeah, she's going to be very useful the next few turns but... not this one specifically.

Unless... @OurLadyOfWires I don't suppose you could allow us to send Axe THIS TURN on the expedition site we'd have Selene scry for the forge 6 reagent?

Edit: Also, just to point out re: Shaper's plan, if you guys want to promise Spoiled Rich to Mareinette at the end of this turn, then we're going to need the Leash active on her so she counts as an available Minion unless you expect her to jump three(!!!) relationship levels with a single action. And even then that's hoping for a two-stage jump, which I'm only inclined to think might be possible due to Spoiled explicitly being easier to get to Confidant + Mareinette's ridiculous social-fu.

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nah, the idea is we imprison her right after the moth reveal, but then as we eat her near immediately we don't need a prison because, narratively, Velvet and Mareinette are right there so how would she escape?

Basically we make her a prisoner, but we don't need a prison because she only STAYS a prisoner for hours at best instead of a full turn/month.

So about using Spoiled for Grail Sacrament. I don't think anyone expect Mareinette to stop eating ponies after being befriended by Velvet. If anything Velvet accepting her ways is permission to do so. But in the best case scenario Velvet's choice of the victim may inform Mareinette on who is acceptable targets. In this case criminals are definitely better.
On the other hoof Velvet becoming a Hour known for eating bad mothers (or sending Mareinetee after them) is hilarious.

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...it IS hilarious, admittedly. She's the monster in the closet there to eat the bad MOTHERS instead of the bad children

Wait, if the Forge Name is befriended and we change his lesser lore to Heart can we study him(as an artifact) or ask for a Heart lesson? We could reach Heart 4 in a single turn if he can give lessons.

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...can we study it and get BOTH forge and heart scraps, even?

 

[Bakkasama]

[X] (MAREINETTE) Mareinette is her own mare, and Cadance could use some company. Don't do anything, and see how things turn out.

If we are planing to do her sacrament soon, it should not matter who she spends time with. If we are not planning to do her sacrament soon, we can let Candance have a go at befriending her.

[X] Rare Item

Edit: On second thought, naming himsomething literal like Rare Item when Velvet doesn't love him gives me "Hill naming his pegasus son Wings" vibes.

[X] Rare Fabric

 

[Greymere]

nah, the idea is we imprison her right after the moth reveal, but then as we eat her near immediately we don't need a prison because, narratively, Velvet and Mareinette are right there so how would she escape?

Basically we make her a prisoner, but we don't need a prison because she only STAYS a prisoner for hours at best instead of a full turn/month.

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But if we want to use her for the promise of dinner as Mareinette's renewal price, she needs to be a Minion or Prisoner by the end of this turn. That's what I meant by promising her to Mareinette, not just Grailmoth/Girldinner in general.

 

[Sveta08]

Hey! Congrats to @spiderhellian for the threadmark!

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

The Same Scene, Eras Prior

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Oh wow... this was beautiful. I mean it.

Even the small passages like these-

To them, it might very well be so great as to be worshipped as a god. But to a god, it is not.

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Scarce-heard amid the hammer-falls and bellow-blows, the clock, like a tiny heartbeat of a metronome, begins to tick.

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it is… perfecting itself. Like anything alive, it creates itself, and destroys itself, moment to moment and era to era.

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All that has happened is the slightest turning of a hundred-hundred gears, but each portends an evolution, and you can see all those changes as clearly as you can see that slightest shift.

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-felt so damn poetic.

I really like the Forge-of-Days as an Hour. And I was a little bit (just a tiny little bit) miffed I would never be able to write about the Malleary in its full glory, given the current Era of this Quest.

But this was great! Even the lines-long description of her surroundings was more than enough to make me happy.

And as for the Forge herself, I think this is exactly how she felt. This line in particular struck a chord in me:

in the massive volume of moments this era has left to offer you.

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Thank you for sharing this with us! I kind of want everyone who read the Forge Name summoning to read this, immediately after. So, I hope you don't mind if we do that.

Rarity's Big Surprise

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I love this so much. And I knew it would be "The Art of the Dress" even before I clicked the link.

And what the hell, this can become canon if a Rarity-aligned name wins

I believe we should still be able to make the Forge 6 reagent next turn; it only requires the Name be active (has fuel) and be summoned (not destroyed), not be full-sized. But better to double check @OurLadyOfWires?

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Yeah.

Forge 4 -> Forge 6 transformation can be done while he is miniaturized. He will just instruct you. (But he needs to have fuel, otherwise he is completely turned off)

Forge 6 -> Blue Gold needs an action from him, so naturally he needs to have fuel.

Huh. @OurLadyOfWires I believe we once asked about follower studying low-level artefacts, and you said wait and see. Is there something we're still waiting on? Is it something you're still not sure of? Something you've thought through and deemed "leave it to Velvet"?

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Oh, right, right.

There is so much going on I completely forgot about this.

Jade was supposed to formalize her "researcher" trait after completing A Memory of Light. But the Follower's Report had so much going on it slipped my mind.

So yeah. Please remind me of this later, but Jade can now study artifacts and be asked to research for new rituals. (Her studying artifacts won't yield you Lore scraps, and more on "Ritual researching" later, it won't be as straightforward as you think).

@OurLadyOfWires you still have to add the Name Forge Sacrament by the way

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Yes.

@OurLadyOfWires I had a thought.

We can have the Forge Name turn into an artifact.

I don't suppose it can turn into an Edge artifact giving bonuses to combat for the Biedde fight?

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No. He turns into a "mundane" artifact (as in, an artifact with no special skills). And not only would his Edge level be inferior/equal to yours, artifacts also don't give application bonus to begin with. (They give bonus for expeditions, but wouldn't give Personal Combat bonus for Edge).

Unless... @OurLadyOfWires I don't suppose you could allow us to send Axe THIS TURN on the expedition site we'd have Selene scry for the forge 6 reagent?

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What? No.

Being able to do things in the same turn, without the proper set up, is a concession, not the rule.

If you don't have a known expedition or a ready book, you can't go on an expedition or study a book. Go find/purchase it first. Doing otherwise is an exception.

And narratively, Selene needs time to set up a ritual. Even Velvet, who can cast rituals with "a paperclip and some bubble gum" still (narratively) needs time to buy reagents and do preparations.



Alright, this seems to be it. Kindly let me know if I missed anything. The platform I am using right now is sub-optimal, so I may have just not seen a ping.

I hope you are all doing well. And remember, Mareinette's vote has been reset. Only votes cast after the Forge Summoning threadmark will be counted.

(And a warning for people creating tallies, remember the omake-turned-canon is the "latest threadmark", so you might miss a few votes if you count the votes from the latest threadmark". Count them from the summoning post.)

 

[Greymere]

Alright, this seems to be it. Kindly let me know if I missed anything. The platform I am using right now is sub-optimal, so I may have just not seen a ping.

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I think just this one (at least from mine), regarding how things would work with promising Spoiled to Mareinette at the end of this turn. (should I ping again? Idk. Just in case @OurLadyOfWires)

So technically, if Spoiled got to Minion this turn via Mareinette socialing her to Confidant + Leash (if it's even possible), the people who want to do the weird Grailmoth combo could promise her to Mareinette without messing up the Moth Sacrament targeted at her? @OurLadyOfWires

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Edit:

Oh, right, right. There is so much going on I completely forgot about this. Jade was supposed to formalize her "researcher" trait after completing A Memory of Light. But the Follower's Report had so much going on it slipped my mind. So yeah. Please remind me of this later, but Jade can now study artifacts and be asked to research for new rituals. (Her studying artifacts won't yield you Lore scraps, and more on "Ritual researching" later, it won't be as straightforward as you think).

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Also, nice! Doesn't matter so much for this turn, since her action was credited last turn, but her being able to study artifacts for should be handy, even if only for liquidating the Lv. 1s if their unique traits aren't particularly useful.

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

"The first time I played Cultist Simulator with some degree of success, and was able to navigate the game rather than just not drown in it, I was surprised by how easy the Forge ascension was. Grail Marks required bodies, alive or dead. Lantern Marks required prisoners, for us to have the Conversation with. But Forge? It sucked up one single fund every Season of Ambition and that was it.
The description claimed it was to buy exotic fuels. And that insulted me. One fund? One fund? To purchase the fuels that would char my skin into the sixth Mark of Forge?
I always felt the price should escalate. I always felt I I should pay at least one Fund per Mark I wished to reach.
I always felt the Lore of Forge should demand a downpour of money, rather than just a trickle."

Anyways, sorry for thinking out loud.

Sacrament tab updated.

EDIT

I think just this one (at least from mine), regarding how things would work with promising Spoiled to Mareinette at the end of this turn. (should I ping again? Idk. Just in case @OurLadyOfWires)

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Ah, thank you for pointing it out.

So, yes and no. The biggest problem with the GrailMoth combo is that you guys don't have the Moth scraps, and I can't guarantee you will get it in time.

But one thing at a time.

First
If you have Spoiled as a Confidante by the end of this turn, you will be allowed to promise Mareinette to Sacrament on Turn 23 in lieu of her rebinding price.

Second
If you reach the end of this turn with 4/4 Moth scraps, I will assume you will be able to Moth Sacrament on Turn 23.

Third
If you fulfill BOTH requirements at the same time, I will create a personalized action to make the combo-Sacrament more convenient on Turn 23. And, of course, you will be able to promise Mareinette as much.

But if by any chance you guys promise Mareinette to Sacrament, and come Turn 23 you don't pick the combo-Sacrament option, you will still be "forced" to at least pick the Grail Sacrament (because you promised as much).

Well, you won't be forced to do it. But the alternative is a slighted Name of Grail. Which I would allow you guys to walk into just because it sounds interesting. (But that's, uh, a path to possibly losing the quest).

Did I miss anything else?

 

[Greymere]

The Name of Forge's invitation: "This body lacks its workshop functionalities, but I am able to provide instructions. It should be possible to perform imbuement in profane items even in this rarefied atmosphere, devoid as it is of patronage from the Hours."
-Perform the action "Set up a workshop".
-The action "Set up a workshop" costs 200 bits, and requires an action from both Velvet Covers and the Name of Forge at the same time.
-The action "Set up a workshop" cannot fail.
-Velvet Covers must have reached 4/4 scraps of Forge before she performs this action.

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Artifact crafting?!

Also... Lore of creation and destruction indeed. More like destruction of our wallet.

 

[Random Anon]

[X] (MAREINETTE) Mareinette is her own mare, and Cadance could use some company. Don't do anything, and see how things turn out.

 

[ses]

[X] Rare Item
[X] (MAREINETTE) You introduced her to Cadance, yes, but you are still very interested in her endeavors.

 

[DelightedOne]

The Name of Forge's invitation: "This body lacks its workshop functionalities, but I am able to provide instructions. It should be possible to perform imbuement in profane items even in this rarefied atmosphere, devoid as it is of patronage from the Hours."
-Perform the action "Set up a workshop".
-The action "Set up a workshop" costs 200 bits, and requires an action from both Velvet Covers and the Name of Forge at the same time.
-The action "Set up a workshop" cannot fail.
-Velvet Covers must have reached 4/4 scraps of Forge before she performs this action.

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We are so doing this. We can befriend him next turn then take his Sacrament 2 turns later.

 

[Witherbrine2671]

[X] (MAREINETTE) You introduced her to Cadance, yes, but you are still very interested in her endeavors.

[X] Rare Item