Feudal Quest

[Arkeus]

I had the impression that other players in this quest do not want to marry her. I may have been mistaken though.

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She is the least personally useful of all our potential brides, and marrying her may interfere with our uncle Pavel the Epic Warlord plans.

However, at first glance if no solution is found our family is going to lose two baronies because of a lack of heir from Pavel, so there is that: and marrying her will grant us those two baronies, which is the only option that does so.

I am just pretty sure that Pavel already has someone he wants to marry her to (probably something like "Have grandfather adopt trusted captain of Pavel, and they marry", but possibly something else).

 

[Adyen]

I don't mind marrying Chesna.

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ditto. It just brings the least in terms of character power and marring a cousin.

And sniped. Still posting this.

 

[Jiven]

I am not really interested in Chesna, and I am kind of indifferent to her. I would prefer us to marry someone else.

 

[fitzgerald]

Having Chesna marry the heir (or heirs heir) of the 'neutral' Duchy is a very strong move politically for the family.

Marrying Chesna is pretty much the lowest upside choice; pretty much her gleefully jumping into harem route

 

[Walkir]

Chesna isn't really interesting, but she's not a no go.

Also, great about the Kat thing.

 

[megrisvernin]

Chesna isn't really interesting, but she's not a no go.

Also, great about the Kat thing.

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I do find Kat the most compelling of the characters we've found. I would like to have her as a wife whatever we do.

 

[Arkeus]

I do find Kat the most compelling of the characters we've found. I would like to have her as a wife whatever we do.

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ShaperV has made a superb job of slowly revealing how Kat had character and actual agency, for all that she totally wants to bone us.

Dita, too, has a lot of character, but she is pretty much written as a teenage girl and hits all of my "younger cousin who had crush on me while growing up" buttons (i had multiple of those). This is great writing, but it also mean i am not unbiased, and i do NOT want to marry her.

I believe that if we had more time spent with Chesna or Ezti they will also be shown to have actual interesting characters, but so far we haven't done that.

As i trust ShaperV to be able to do interesting characterization for our wife regardless of our choice, AND that they are mostly equal when it comes to the gain they bring in a vacuum, i think this will all be about synergy between the role we plan on Dominic having and what our wife brings.

 

[megrisvernin]

ShaperV has made a superb job of slowly revealing how Kat had character and actual agency, for all that she totally wants to bone us.

Dita, too, has a lot of character, but she is pretty much written as a teenage girl and hits all of my "younger cousin who had crush on me while growing up" buttons (i had multiple of those). This is great writing, but it also mean i am not unbiased, and i do NOT want to marry her.

I believe that if we had more time spent with Chesna or Ezti they will also be shown to have actual interesting characters, but so far we haven't done that.

As i trust ShaperV to be able to do interesting characterization for our wife regardless of our choice, AND that they are mostly equal when it comes to the gain they bring in a vacuum, i think this will all be about synergy between the role we plan on Dominic having and what our wife brings.

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*Nod*. I tend towards the Sorceror Feudal Lord Route myself.

On a side note is Kat going to age slower(or not at all) compared to normal people? She commented her beauty won't fade with age though I couldn't decide if that meant she wouldn't age, or that she just wouldn't show it. It's not a minor consideration when you remember that flesh magic, which we're good at, is one of the main ways to extend your life & reduce the problems of age. I strongly suspect having a wife that can match our passions & energy over time won't be a minor consideration a decade or so from now.

 

[ShaperV]

1°) What are Seekers and Spiritual Guides?

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'Seeker' is short for 'Seeker of Wisdom', the official title of a priest or priestess of Thoth. There aren't many of those, and they claim that each of them is personally advised and guided by the spirit of a long-dead Seeker (their 'Spirit Guide').

2°) What are our Sisters' names, and do we have noticed any particular talents they might hold (both if we want to use them ourself, or if we want to try to marry one off to Rogatica or some such).

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Added to the Lore post.

On a side note is Kat going to age slower(or not at all) compared to normal people? She commented her beauty won't fade with age though I couldn't decide if that meant she wouldn't age, or that she just wouldn't show it.

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Some of both. She thinks she'll likely live a few decades longer than normal, and will probably look like she's in her 20s for most of that time. That's the normal pattern for women with her sort of supernatural bloodline, at any rate.

 

[megrisvernin]

'Seeker' is short for 'Seeker of Wisdom', the official title of a priest or priestess of Thoth. There aren't many of those, and they claim that each of them is personally advised and guided by the spirit of a long-dead Seeker (their 'Spirit Guide').

Added to the Lore post.

Some of both. She thinks she'll likely live a few decades longer than normal, and will probably look like she's in her 20s for most of that time. That's the normal pattern for women with her sort of supernatural bloodline, at any rate.

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You mentioned it before but specifically how much additional life extension would our level of Flesh magic give us? Would the level of enhancement that give us be usable on other people? Say wives?

 

[ShaperV]

The Final Contender Pt I

Zarana arrives as scheduled, with four maids and 20 men at arms in tow. The knight in command of her escort is obviously a seasoned veteran, and her ladies in waiting are a bevy of sophisticated beauties who are obviously not your typical peasant girls. They don't seem terribly impressed with Corzu, and at one point you overhear one commenting to the others about what a 'fixer-upper' this place is.

But Zarana herself shows no signs of disappointment, instead courteously greeting you and smoothly making small talk as you show her to her quarters. You can immediately see that at least one part of her reputation is deserved:



Over dinner that evening, Zarana proves to be cultured, well-spoken, inquisitive and considerably more forceful than one would normally expect of a girl who just turned 18. She takes Dita's presence in the keep in stride, and seems fascinated by Katiana.

Dita quietly reports that there is an odd, faint aura magic of about Zarana and all of her maids. It's as if they've all been affected by some sort of permanent magic, but it's either a weak effect or very subtle one. Whatever the cause may be, she doesn't see any sign of taint about them.

So, time to decide how you want to handle this visit. Which of the following do you want to reveal to Zarana during her stay?

[ ] Your sorcery.
[ ] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[ ] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[ ] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.
[ ] Your less than wholehearted adherence to church doctrine.
[ ] Your plans to continue supporting the chosen.
[ ] The fact that you're seriously considering making Katiana your second wife.
[ ] Write in

Also, what questions about her do you want to try to get answers to?

 

[megrisvernin]

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

Questions to ask
[X] Is the magic she has with her maid Sorcery or Wizardry?
[X] Was she so ready to come and see us because she already knew things about us that interested her more than about Boris?
[X]If so, was she looking at this alliance partly because of our access to a powerful Wizardess?
[X]Is she looking toward learning Wizardry herself, being in the company of a hero, or just looking toward having access to both for her intrigues?

 

[Silversun17]

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

Dunno about this one. [] The fact that you're seriously considering making Katiana your second wife.

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i'd say be open about it. hiding it might cause more problems. her fascination with Kat might work in our favor as well.

 

[staplesdex2]

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.
[X] The fact that you're seriously considering making Katiana your second wife.

Questions for her:
"I hope it's not too rude but I could tell that there's some faint magic almost subtle enough to miss. As a mage-in-training it makes me curious. What can you tell me about it?"

Edit:

[X] Plan DarkLight140

 

[Seventeen]

Why is Dominic revealing his secrets and plans in a casual conversation with a woman he's only just met? People who are voting already, have you actually thought about what is happening? You're giving free information to a woman with no ties to Dominic, and she's a woman who supposedly has great skill at intrigue. It's pretty obvious that's true if she can get Dominic to give this stuff up straight away. She's basically a no-effort spy.

My first guess is that her magic is some kind of aura that makes people want to tell her and her maids things.

 

[Arkeus]

So, time to decide how you want to handle this visit. Which of the following do you want to reveal to Zarana during her stay?

[ ] Your sorcery.
[ ] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[ ] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[ ] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.
[ ] Your less than wholehearted adherence to church doctrine.
[ ] Your plans to continue supporting the chosen.
[ ] The fact that you're seriously considering making Katiana your second wife.
[ ] Write in

Also, what questions about her do you want to try to get answers to?

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Can we assume that we can use multiple of those?

For the questions, i was thinking that we could do some sort of "we ask questions about each others and reveal if the other is correct game", with the caveat that the questions must not be overly dangerous, and we can choose to abstain to comment.

The questions we would answer readily if she asks:

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

I am pretty sure she knows about most of the rest, but i would think she doesn't want a husband that just babble about dangerous things without knowing for sure he can, hence being circumspect is what i believe she wants us to be.

Questions to ask
[X] Is the magic she has with her maid Sorcery or Wizardry?
[X] Was she so ready to come and see us because she already knew things about us that interested her more than about Boris?
[X]If so, was she looking at this alliance partly because of our access to a powerful Wizardess?
[X]Is she looking toward learning Wizardry herself, being in the company of a hero, or just looking toward having access to both for her intrigues?

Edit:
[x]plan Darklight140

 

[Thomasfoolery]

[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

Anything else can wait until we know if we're going to marry her to be revealed, or she can try to ferret them out herself if she's curious.

[X]Stance toward neighboring baronies, Timis, Rogatica, and Kiscun specifically.
[X]What exactly she's expecting from the marriage, and how far from cultural norms she's willing to go.
[X]How much she knows about magic.

 

[Jack Trade]

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

[X] Is the magic she has with her maid Sorcery or Wizardry?
[X] Was she so ready to come and see us because she already knew things about us that interested her more than about Boris?
[X]If so, was she looking at this alliance partly because of our access to a powerful Wizardess?
[X]Is she looking toward learning Wizardry herself, being in the company of a hero, or just looking toward having access to both for her intrigues?

 

[Falconis]

[ ] Your sorcery.
[ ] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[ ] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[ ] Your plans to continue supporting the chosen.

and the questions

 

[Captain]

Given how much you all want to tell her, I vote

Skip the bullshit, propose to her right now.

Because that's what telling her all this sensitive stuff amounts to.

 

[fitzgerald]

[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.
[X] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[X] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

[X] Is the magic she has with her maid Sorcery or Wizardry?
[X] Was she so ready to come and see us because she already knew things about us that interested her more than about Boris?
[X]If so, was she looking at this alliance partly because of our access to a powerful Wizardess?
[X]Is she looking toward learning Wizardry herself, being in the company of a hero, or just looking toward having access to both for her intrigues

[X] Plan Darklight

 

[Seventeen]

Seriously, you guys are ready to argue on nearly every other point but suddenly you're unanimous on this? No discussion at all, just voting -- and not even good voting, since you've all just copy-pasted Arkeus' votes without mentioning his other thoughts. What the hell?

 

[DarkLight140]

There are several important facts which we have, but may not have considered the full implications of.

Most importantly, Zarana is not our ally. There is a marriage alliance on the table, but at the moment her family is neutral, not friendly. They're allying with us if and only if we give them sufficient cause to do so, not because they truly need to; effectively, we are chasing Zarana in this interaction rather than her chasing us, as has been the case in most of our other marriage prospects. Do not forget this. It means that there is a very real possibility that if she finds out anything she doesn't like, Zarana can and will go back to her father the baron, tell him that we're a terrible prospect, and then every bit of information that we've given her becomes a liability. Similarly, if we marry someone else and she perceives it as a snub, whatever information she's gained is something that she can use against us.

Second, Zarana is trained in intrigue. We are not. That means that we are entering into this social engagement at a disadvantage. It is likely that if she wants to withhold her true reaction to some bit of information from us, she can; likewise, she can be expected to take note of everything we say and analyze it for political value. Mistakes will be noted. Anything potentially embarrassing or incriminating can and will be reported to her family (see the first point). Her escort are likely to be lesser socialites operating in the same sort of way that men at arms back us in battle; they'll act to flank us, surround us, and support their lady in achieving her goals. In practice, this means that they're likely to chat up our retainers and servants and report all the gossip and information they can get to Zarana. Depending upon how bold and good they are, they may also act to support her directly in conversation.

Third, Zarana has nothing to inherit on her own. If she was going to net us a barony it would already have been noted, which means she has at least one brother, possibly more. By marrying us she can be the lady of a fief, if a small one- something she won't be getting on her own. Landholding lords are not so common that she can afford to treat the opportunity to marry one lightly, both for her family's sake and because being the wife of one is more independence and influence than she is likely to ever see otherwise personally.

So, taking these into consideration, we have some basic conversational principles.

Avoid mentioning anything which would be severely damaging if it got into the hands of an enemy with high-powered intrigue talents. This means that we should mention none of these:

[ ] Your plans to become a powerful mage.
[ ] Your less than wholehearted adherence to church doctrine.
[ ] Your plans to continue supporting the chosen.
[ ] The fact that you're seriously considering making Katiana your second wife.

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The mage one is something to avoid because, if we recall the very beginning of the quest, there are lines in it like:

the church doesn't approve of humans studying magic

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It's fairly common for mages to either go nuts or turn evil, especially the powerful ones.

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It sounds too much like magic, and nobles practicing magic would be scandalous.

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We're really into magic, but that is bizarre, not normal, and while not necessarily unacceptable it's definitely a political negative. More than that, Gavrilla doesn't even take the idea that we might become a truly powerful mage seriously, because it's so uncommon. This isn't on the level of Dita's inherent crazy, but it is still a major angle from which we can be attacked socially.

Mentioning that we aren't into church doctrine is another one of those "even if it's true, don't bring it up, idiot" things. Supporting the Chosen, more of the same- and if the fact that we've done so thus far is brought up, we can play it off as being more than happy to give some shelter and trinkets to nearly anyone who shows up to kill demons, witches, and haunts that are posing active problems.

Katiana as a second wife is the sort of thing that's too potentially crushing politically to mention to anyone before we actually are set to go through with it. If Zarana is sharp, and she is, she'll already have decided that it's likely we'll want to keep Katiana around in some capacity in the long term and are likely to sleep with her because she's a beautiful woman who is almost certainly willing to sleep with us. The second wife bit is just a way of formalizing and strengthening that tie, and if Zarana hasn't thought of it then it's not a possibility that we want entering her head, or those of her family, before our family's alliance with them is entirely secured.


Thanks to her intrigue skills and posse of busybodies, we can assume that she'll find out minor/obvious secrets, so these are obvious things to share:
[X] Your sorcery.
[X] Katiana's wizardry, and the fact you plan to continue employing her.

She'd have to be blind not to learn about those, and both of them make us look slightly radical, but not so much that anyone could get a decent return on their effort for criticizing us. Her family will already know who Katiana is and her past if they've got an ounce of sense, and they do, so there's no loss in talking about it. Better, we show ourselves to have some strength and resources.

This last default option is trickier.

[ ] Your plans to continue going on adventures, at least within the kingdom.

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A lot of whether this is a good thing to share depends upon our read of Zarana's personality. If she's the sort of woman who wants to basically run things while her husband does whatever, then it's likely that this will appeal to her and make her want us more. If she doesn't want an absent husband, or has serious concerns that she'll end up stuck living in a penniless backwater that her husband doesn't care about because he's never around anyway, then we don't want to bring it up because it could be a potentially serious negative. We want to learn more about what she wants before we decide whether to share this kind of information.

I do have a write-in here:
[X] Your plans to improve Corzu's conditions and economy.

I don't see a significant potential downside to showing ourselves to be ambitious in terms of stewardship; that's something which we can't be attacked on politically and which is potentially a very important part of how Zarana perceives us. Yes, we're running a run-down backwater, but doing so and being content with that is very different from doing so and having plans to fix everything- build granaries, repair and improve the keep, construct and repair roads between all the settlements, increase the population, and more. It is one of our genuine virtues as a lord that we want to strengthen our fief and it's a potentially key part of putting our best face forward. The biggest potential downsides are showing that Corzu is weak (which was obvious anyway) and turning Zarana off if she was hoping for a husband that would leave the fief and let her run everything (unlikely to be a deal-breaker).


On suggested questions for Zarana... in short, the most supported group are ridiculously specific and shouldn't be used in their current forms. Generalized versions of them are viable, but as things stand none of them are something to say. As the GM phrased this, they're what we "want to try to get answers to" rather than actual questions we ask, but that's only a small saving grace.

[X] Is the magic she has with her maid Sorcery or Wizardry?

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This question says "I've picked up on the magic on you and want you to tell me about it." Considering how subtle it is, that's effectively a show of force- basically, saying "my magic-fu is stronger than yours". This is potentially desirable, but given that we haven't locked them in as an ally, we might not want to let them know that we've caught on to their buffs. Why not try this first?
[X] See if Katiana can discern the purpose and nature of the magic on them without making it obvious that she's looking.

From there, we can either return to inquiring directly (and why ask if it's sorcery or wizardry, instead of a more general question about what it does?) or give a more forceful message as to our own competence by being able to compliment them specifically on their fine whatever-the-heck-it-is. Or politely not mention it, if it's something that bears politely not mentioning.

[X] Was she so ready to come and see us because she already knew things about us that interested her more than about Boris?

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[X]If so, was she looking at this alliance partly because of our access to a powerful Wizardess?

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Our family has literally been trying to negotiate this alliance for years. We've had Katiana in our corner for mere months. This line of questioning is either meant to wildly flatter Zarana as to her own prominence within her family and information-gathering abilities, or simply shows our own ignorance of politics and spying. Neither is desirable, so we shouldn't be saying these. Generalizing is possible, things like
[X] What does she consider our better qualities?
[X] What are her feelings on magic, in general or as she sees it used by us and our retainers?

[X]Is she looking toward learning Wizardry herself, being in the company of a hero, or just looking toward having access to both for her intrigues?

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This is a ridiculously leading way of framing this question. Learning wizardry- since when is that even on the table? Being in the company of a hero- how self-absorbed is that, to call ourselves a hero? Skip the details and generalize to get more useful information.
[X] What would she look forward to after marriage?
[X] What are her primary interests?

[X]Stance toward neighboring baronies, Timis, Rogatica, and Kiscun specifically.
[X]What exactly she's expecting from the marriage, and how far from cultural norms she's willing to go.
[X]How much she knows about magic.

Click to shrink...

These are good questions.
Edit: Good questions in that we really want the answers, not in that we can bluntly ask them right out. She'll probably pick up on what we're looking for even if we start with a few careful probing questions, given her background and training, but so long as we are delicate about it I don't think getting these answers will bite us too badly. The neighboring baronies one can be spread to apply to more than just those three and might reveal that we haven't been fully briefed on high-level politics in the region, but so long as we keep things personal ("Have you visited Place A/met Baron X? What did you think of it/him?") it shouldn't be too much of an issue, I hope.


I know this isn't in the suggested "get answers" format, but it's worth noting:
[X] Be as engaging and charming as reasonably possible.

Sure, she's trained in intrigue and probably isn't that susceptible to being seduced. That doesn't mean that Charm 4+Seduction 1 is irrelevant, and a woman who genuinely wants and likes us as well as being politically/intellectually interested is one who will be much easier to deal with overall.

As a final general note, we want to be spending a lot of time with her to get to know her as much as possible and get her to think well of us as much as possible, and that means talking a lot. The more relatively harmless topics we have to talk about so that we can fill time without touching on sensitive matters, the better. Secrets are secret, but much of our life isn't, and socialization empty of meaning is fine if only because it lets us know whether we can enjoy her company.

 

[Arkeus]

Snip awesomness.

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Well, definitely good points all around.

I mostly wanted to be willing to answer about wanting to be a mage ( with the caveat of she must ask about it first) because i felt now was a good time to introduce the idea that the fief lord of corzu was looking toward being a Magic Expert. You are right, though, that 'powerful mage' can be twisted however she wants to spin it, and she is our superior in intrigue.

As for the questions i wanted Dominic to ask, they were obviously in the context of a game of truth where the other must answer ridiculously specific non-dangerous questions. In any other context they become much too forward, and your alternative are probably much better for word-fencing and long conversations.

As for ThomasFoolery's questions, those are also not questions we can ask directly, but it should be things we are trying to find out thorough the courtship.

Oh, and we should probably assume she either has minor telepathic link to her maids, or that they have some "you want to answer us" minor magic, at least until Kat can tell us more (we should definitely ask her to analyze it).

[X]Plan DarkLight140

 

[Walkir]

Yeah, no. As much as I'd make clear that Kat's going to be second wife... now is not the time, and I can't think of anything making her run home as much as that. Both for the fact of it and for getting it rubbed into her face so early.

And, huh, white hair. Didn't expect that.

[X] Plan Darklight

 

[megrisvernin]

[X]Plan DarkLight140

 

[fitzgerald]

Seriously, you guys are ready to argue on nearly every other point but suddenly you're unanimous on this? No discussion at all, just voting -- and not even good voting, since you've all just copy-pasted Arkeus' votes without mentioning his other thoughts. What the hell?

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At the end of the day we'll argue when the specific actions dont fit fit the agenda each of us believes Dominic will pursue or the methods used.

The arguement over the Witch is a good example. I wanted to for her asap but the the more methodical comprimise worked out even better

 

[Anaerobie]

I think DarkLight140 pretty much nailed it for our personal interaction.

For the rest of the fief, I don't think we can do much to prevent them talking. A warning could have been good (but perhaps Dominic took care of it before her arrival). As most of our staff and men only have a discipline of 1, we just have to cross our fingers and wince.

Dita's faeric quirks may be damaging though, so having Kat looking out for her could be wise. Either that, or Dita could simply accompany us so that she could see an example of courtship, as she is supposed to be going to have to deal with this. Learning experiences and all that.

Asking Kat to analyze the magic on Zarana and her maids is also important.
Could be a ritual or a benediction: an odd, faint aura magic seems to be an indirect or subtle magic, something to enhance their charm or protect them.

Anyway, Dominic shouldn't forget that Zarana is not an ally -nor an enemy per say. As part of a family legendary for their intrigue skills, she won't be manipulated, especially compared to our other marriage prospects who all needed our help to some measure.

[X] Plan DarkLight140

 

[kinglugia]

[X] Plan Darklight

 

[ShaperV]

...and DarkLight's plan saves you from several missteps that would have seriously affected her opinion of you. Darn.

Working on the update now. I'm going to give you the results of the first few exchanges of info, and then you can adjust your approach for the rest of her visit accordingly.