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General chat thread

Discussion in 'General' started by Nanimani, Dec 27, 2015.

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  1. Amazon Climber

    Amazon Climber Wholesomely Depraved

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    …Jesus, I don’t think I’ve ever seen someone project this hard. You getting into the cinema business? Seriously, I have my religion? You’re the one making a bizarre and wholly unsupported claim about a secret throng of pedophiles trying to groom kids by writing gay porn featuring doggie dicks and mpreg. And posting it to AO3, which, I remind you, is intended as a smut repository. Until you put up more than Facebook-tier bullshit speculation, I don’t owe you anything more than I’ve given you, which is total incredulity.
     
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  2. TanaNari

    TanaNari Verified Dick

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    ... Once again, if you would actually talk about what I'm actually saying, and stop making shit up, that would be great, thanks.

    The strawman you invented is absolutely ridiculous, and deserving of mockery, yes. It is not, however, the position I have taken.
     
  3. Amazon Climber

    Amazon Climber Wholesomely Depraved

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    Here is the initial conversation:
    Here’s your reply to my initial response:
    If your thesis isn’t that A/B/O smut is proliferating because pedophiles are trying to use it to groom kids by exposing them to extreme sexual content, you are doing a very poor job of explaining your thesis. And if you have any actual anything to support this besides ‘everyone knows this is a thing people do to groom kids,’ I’ve yet to see it.
     
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  4. TanaNari

    TanaNari Verified Dick

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    Oh, it is... but, again, it's not some conspiracy theory or any sort of undocumented behavior.

    In fact, it seems to happen with just about every medium that finds its way into appealing to younger teens with little or no adult supervision. As I said- youtube had a serious problem with it a few years back. They've... mostly... turned that tide around.

    And this is because pedophiles, as anyone with a brain would realize, tend to target places with children lacking in adult supervision. Or set themselves up to be said supervision. That's why there's a disproportionate number of teachers, coaches, activity counselors for various youth groups, and priests molesting children as compared to the general population. In roughly descending order of commonality.


    Writing erotic literature for potential victims is quite popular among pedophiles, since it A: gives them access to 'fans' of their work while starting the grooming process in a way that they can't be easily called out on, and B: signal-boosts which draws in more children to the fandom. Though, where possible, they go for fandoms that don't need much signal boosting.

    As I said: they want lots of children/teens, and as little adult supervision as possible.

    As noted above- the Omegaverse tends to propagate on sites that don't curate their audience (aka: places where there are children without adult supervision) or content (allowing for adult material). Because of that, those sites in particular are very popular for this sort of literary-groomer pedophile behavior.

    Not due to any collaboration... they are not a flock of birds or herd of bison following the leader. They are a menagerie coming across the same watering hole on the savannah. And, when the water hole dries up, they'll move on to find a new one. As one does.

    Really, it's less about Omegaverse and more about unregulated websites making it easy for pedophiles to reach a young audience to prey upon.

    Right now, that fandom is just one of the currently popular ones. As Twilight was a few years back. As something else will be in a few more.


    Now, if I were asked to explain why groomers producing porn for children and young teens go for such bizarre expressions of kink? I don't know, I'm not a pedophile. But it's pretty well documented, and you can see by a lot of the stuff that came out of the Twilight fandom (of which Fifty Shades was among the most tame and palatable to the mainstream).

    My best guesses are A: Whatever it was that fucked their sexuality up enough to target children knocked a few other screws loose, B: They think an extreme enough fiction will make their desired sexual partners more inclined to more extreme real-world acts, or C: A weird sort of power creep, this time around escalating sexual debauchery.


    Now, what part of that is the conspiracy theorist strawman you're accusing me of being?
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022
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  5. Amazon Climber

    Amazon Climber Wholesomely Depraved

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    So what you’re saying I was entirely accurate in reacting to your thesis, I just wasn’t respectful enough in expressing my incredulity to it.

    Okay.

    That isn’t what a strawman is. A strawman is presenting a different argument like it’s yours, and responding to that. Presenting your argument and ridiculing it isn’t a strawman. I responded to what you were actually saying, I just called it a conspiracy theory. Because, again, I don’t know a better word to use for ‘theory that would be a conspiracy theory if it was alleging collaboration instead of serendipity.’
    First, the phrase “disproportionate number” doesn’t actually say anything as to the proportion of pedophiles to healthy folks. A quick Google search says up to 5% of people are pedophiles, and up to 10% of students have been victims of pedophilia. If we assume each student was preyed on by a different adult, then that’d mean teachers are 100% more likely to be pedophiles than the standard person. But that’s still 90% of teachers who aren’t pedophiles.

    The reason why that matters is because, like with every other walk of life, the vast majority of smut authors aren’t going to be pedophiles. Which means suggesting a smut trend is being driven by a tiny minority demographic - pedophiles - is an extraordinary claim. And that requires more than ‘but it’s totally a thing pedophiles would do, guys.’

    And that’s the meat of why I’m calling it a conspiracy theory. You have no justification for why child grooming is a more likely reason for the proliferation of A/B/O smut than any other possible explanation. In fact, you’ve presented several more likely explanations: It’s simple follow-the-leader, it gets readers, people like the sense of community being an A/B/O writer is getting them, and will move on later. Just driven by the primary demographics of AO3 rather than a tiny subset. None of this supports the pedophilia connection. It’s pure Facebook-tier scare-mongering nonsense.

    As an aside, this is an erotic literature site whose verification process is ‘tell me your age.’ We’re as secure as AO3, and likely as inundated with kids getting their smut on. You could make the exact same conspiracy theory involving any of the popular QQ trends. Do you understand how shitty throwing around that kind of allegation would be if you made it here?
     
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  6. Autocorruptor

    Autocorruptor Corrupting Innocent Grammar

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    I started working at a library recently. We have a section dedicated to paperback books. We get most of these books as donations from an old lady who donates when she finishes reading them. They are mostly romance books of some kind.

    I shit you not, one of the paperbacks is called “My Immortal Highlander”.
     
  7. TanaNari

    TanaNari Verified Dick

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    Well, now that I got my story out of the way, let's get back to this party.

    ... I find that every time someone opens a sentence with 'so you're saying', what they are about to say is going to be anything but what the person is actually saying.

    This is no exception.

    You did it a-fucking-gain! Even your attempt to claim you're not using a strawman includes another strawman!

    It wouldn't be, if you presented my actual argument. But you didn't. You haven't. And you're still not.

    Sure, but that wasn't really the point of the topic so much. If you'd like to go deeper into that tangent, we can do that. I'd like you to stop claiming I said stuff I never said, first, however.

    Most studies get raw numbers are closer to 0.3% . And a significant majority of that .3% are... difficult to really nail down as pedophilia... like 12 year olds sexually experimenting with 7 or 8 year olds, or a remarkable percentage of child molesters that aren't attracted to children so much as attracted to the cruelty of the act.

    It's all very complicated... but the belief that there's a total of 5% is... the most extreme possible extrapolation of what is observed and speculating on the unobserved- first accepting all edge cases 'totally count' and then adding to that the claim that over 90% of all pedophiles never act upon those urges.

    In short: it's a pretty rare paraphilia. Less common, even, than such oddities as agalmatophilia (that's dolls and/or statues, if you're curious).

    So rare that most people would likely never have even heard of it if it wasn't so destructive and shocking. 'If it bleeds, it leads' and all that jazz.

    As opposed to Hebephilia, which is significantly more common and the overwhelming majority of sex crimes against minors.

    See, I never said otherwise. I never said anything to imply otherwise, save in your imagination. You pretending I have is why I'm saying you're strawmanning my argument.

    The proliferation of extreme pornographic material on sites that make their material easily available to children and offer convenient access for the authors to interact with said children is generally caused by child groomers. Because those sorts of sites are where pedophiles typically look for targets.

    Like I said- it's really more about the way certain websites manage themselves than any specific fandom. But for relatively niche fandoms- and Omegaverse is a very niche fandom- it doesn't require a great many to get involved to dramatically twist the culture. So niche even most people on this website have probably never heard of it.

    I've only heard of it pretty recently (couple years ago, maybe?), myself. And I take active interest in these sorts of social patterns.

    No, not really. Much as I have distaste for them in other aspects, they're actually pretty good about that, here.

    I'm certain some of them have tried. Hell, I wouldn't be shocked if one or two even succeeded... but there's too few users and too active a modbase for it to be any sort of real risk. There are fatter, easier, targets out there.

    Meanwhile, I'm not entirely sure AO3 even has mods. I mean, I'm sure they must... but I've not seen any actual evidence of such. Which makes them even more poorly moderated than Youtube.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
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  8. Darrenb209

    Darrenb209 Only way to survive is keeping your eyes on screen

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    They have a nebulous "staff" who are as far as I can tell, as effective and visible as Fanfiction.net's moderation staff.

    In other words, they might as well be a myth.

    This is reinforced by the fact that the site officially allows only that which is legal, but they have tags upon tags of actually illegal content.
     
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  9. Amazon Climber

    Amazon Climber Wholesomely Depraved

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    I’m tired of this stupid conversation. I’ve responded to your argument. You admitted I did. Remember? “Oh, it is... but, again, it's not some conspiracy theory or any sort of undocumented behavior.” And here you go, claiming I’m misrepresenting you, again. Without actually explaining how. Just fussing and fuming that I’m not giving sufficient deference to your unsourced and unsupported ranting.

    Because, ultimately, that’s all you’ve given me, over and over: ‘This is a thing pedophiles could do, therefore it is a thing they have done.’ Which is, once again, Facebook-tier bullshit. You, the person making a claim, have the burden of supporting it. Until you do, I’m giving you all the credulity you deserve.
     
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  10. GhostHaxStomp

    GhostHaxStomp I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    I keep waking up in the middle of the night because of migraines from a sinus infection. I should probably get that dealt with instead of overdosing on Aleve, huh?

    On the one hand, these headaches are a pretty convenient internal clock. On the other, I currently want to fight a woodchipper with my forehead. Decisions decisions…
     
  11. Secret Secretion

    Secret Secretion Hi!

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    Do you have examples of the forums trends? That sounds interesting.

    Counterpoint: Waifu Catalog, Jumpchains in general, and the very distorted characterization of most fanfics. And there's almost no M/M here, period, which is much broader than just the lack of ABO. There's none of that classic Ao3 stuff, soul bonds, Marvel shipping, coffeeshop AUs, whatever's left of the Supernatural/Sherlock craze, etc. There's little stereotypical female writing, as opposed to the fight scene, harem, power fantasy stuff that's usual around Royal Road, which I would consider stereotypical male writing.
     
  12. MadGreenSon

    MadGreenSon Verified Devil Tiger, The Childish Yandere

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    One of my young nephews has potential respiratory issues which require him to see a pulmonologist. The one he sees is located in an office park called "Town Square".

    All in all, a sad but unremarkable story.

    Then my other nephew, his older brother, used his trait of "interesting misspeaking" to tell people that "My little brother is with the pornologist in the town square."
     
  13. Daytripper

    Daytripper Connoisseur.

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    So may shows to binge. It’s so overwhelming.
     
  14. Johnlemmingson

    Johnlemmingson Versed in the lewd.

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    The only manga I finished reading from start to finish is rurouni kenshin
     
  15. Hyzenthlay

    Hyzenthlay Is that your answer? Then so be it.

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    Its funny. The more content there is, the less there is to enjoy. There's a certain grief to it -- that there is less and less of a way to ever know if your consumption is a good decision or not. Barry Schwartz describes it as "the paradox of choice", that satisfaction has diminishing returns based on the complexity of making the decision and the number of potential better answers which could have existed.

    Maybe the trick is to pick one thing and go really hard on it, in a way nobody else has and to make that your thing for a while.

    Worst comes to worst, you get a unique experience out of it that nobody else is capable of having, and that in and of itself is something you can't feel remorse for because it is yours, and yours alone.
     
  16. Autocorruptor

    Autocorruptor Corrupting Innocent Grammar

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    I work in a library, and one of my coworkers is in charge of getting new books. She is getting more manga in the future, and asked me for more recommendations. However, I am no longer really active on the anime/manga scene, I don’t have any recommendations.

    Does anyone here know anything good? Preferably something rated p-13 or lower, because we are a public library and we don’t want any porn in here.
     
  17. MadGreenSon

    MadGreenSon Verified Devil Tiger, The Childish Yandere

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    <shrug> The Shonen Jump catalog is probably okay
     
  18. Guardian Box

    Guardian Box Theocratic Capitalist

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    Spy x Family is recent, good and appropriately wholesome.
     
  19. Arc-on-Fire

    Arc-on-Fire I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Man... after learning about what's happening to Ao3 right now. Makes me glad I didn't fucking sign up for an account.
     
  20. GhostHaxStomp

    GhostHaxStomp I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    What happened over there?
     
  21. Arc-on-Fire

    Arc-on-Fire I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Well, I don't know if it treads over rule 8 or not so I'll play it safe. China, that's it.
     
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  22. Treble

    Treble Connoisseur.

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    If I had to find images of fantasy women/girls that are clothed or armoured properly, but are also barefoot- where should I go?

    Artstation is difficult to navigate, but it's one of my sources. The other is just scrolling 4chan threads.
     
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  23. GhostHaxStomp

    GhostHaxStomp I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Not gonna lie that sounds really fuckin niche. I’d ask why but I’d rather not know.

    Uh, best guess is looking for hobbit paladins I guess? Hobbits are typically barefoot, I think. Did just watch Lord of the Rings, though, so fuck if I know.
     
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  24. Treble

    Treble Connoisseur.

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    Absolutely is. Most I find have only foot fetish art or nude art.

    I want a clothed barefoot woman.
     
  25. John_Oakman

    John_Oakman Come touch my hentai machine

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    Go on danbooru, go to pools, look for casually barefoot (and not casual nudity). There.
     
  26. GhostHaxStomp

    GhostHaxStomp I trust you know where the happy button is?

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    Less Than Zero released its final update today. Hard to believe it’s been 8 years since it started. Honestly, hard to believe it ended at all. Fanfiction usually putters out or gets canceled.
     
  27. A simple world

    A simple world Not too sore, are you?

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    Anyone watched the old Highlander series? Anyone thought what would happen if Methos returned back to the first time he awakened after his first death? The changes he can bring?
     
  28. JohnTitor

    JohnTitor Getting out there.

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    Please don't take it to a shelter (yet). First, because it will probably set of a fight between you and your sister, and second, because the shelter probably won't be a real great place for it. Most shelters don't have a whole lot of resources, and their attention is split many ways.

    I'd suggest trying to teach your sister about how to take care of an animal, since it sounds like you know how. Try not to preach or command, instead try to demonstrate and show. Of course, there is a danger she'll use the opportunity to dump the responsibility on to you, so be cautious to set boundaries. Your sister sounds like she is a younger sibling?
     
  29. Ragnarok

    Ragnarok Well worn.

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    It's weird reading that there is a plasma shortage in the United States when every time I go into donate plasma the building is packed and there is a long line and over a dozen beds are always full. If they had more staff I suspect the beds would be filled to capacity
     
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  30. crimsonobu

    crimsonobu Your first time is always over so quickly, isn't it?

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    I don't really find it awkward.
     
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