General World of Darkness Discussion Thread QQ Edition

[Repentant_Dragos]

Yeah, she isn't that bright. But it's funny and cute and wholesome. So if you are into that give it a try. And yeah someone made a Soulsborne crossover, that keeps the "funny and cute and wholesome" alive, but also does justice to the games. It*s insane on paper that's not supposed to work, but somehow it does and it's great.

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Understandable, although I prefer my protags smarter.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

shadowdice , gereh , can I have your opinion on this long piece of exposition and whether it accurately reflects Mage the Awakening's lore (not Ascension, Awakening)?

Spoiler: Hidden For Size

Brodime Prometheus' lecture, with Elise accompanying him, was much more entertaining and worthy of record, with Prometheus creating a whiteboard made up of pure, congealed Mana (Tass, which is also a term used in the other Mage, Mage the Ascension) while Erisse just took out a mundane erasable marker and began writing on it.

"All right," Prometheus said in a warmer, softer tone which nevertheless echoed through the small room which had been reserved for the four of us beforehand, "Let us begin; how much do you know of the Silver Ladder from your previous incarnations?"

His eyes and posture were relaxed, in a way that made him look more like a dork than a properly elegant and refined man even as he held a cane with a top of pure electrum and used it as a pointer.

I raised my hand like the dutiful schoolboy I am (of course it was difficult not to cringe internally, I probably looked too eager and ridiculous in that respect) and said, "Well, to summarize, the Silver Ladder are descended from the alleged Priest-Kings of Atlantis, the ancient civilization of Awakened that most Magi claim their heritage from, and believe that Mages should lead Humanity but all Humans should be Mages and that the difference between them and the Seers of the Throne, their enemy, is that they want the entire Human race to be 'uplifted'... Under their leadership."

Prometheus chuckled at that and said, "Well...you aren't wrong, but the phrasing you've decided to use...It draws a clear line between 'us' and 'them'. Making the other side appear to be little more than megalomaniacs, barely removed from the Seers."

The congealed Mana which made up the whiteboard began forming letters that assumed a matte-black color, letters which spelled out: The Elemental Precepts of the Silver Ladder.

"Diamond; the Awakened are one Nation," Prometheus spoke as he twirled his cane theatrically, catching the glimmer of the electric lights above, "Diamond is earth, purified and strengthened under the crucibles of fire, hardship, and time. A natural transformative process that forms the foundation of our philosophies - that Mages have a common bond, descending from the Awakened Civilization of Atlantis. They are then further united by the struggle of exaltation, guiding mankind beyond divinity."

Elise then wrote down on the whiteboard, Drawback: The Silver Ladder believe themselves to be above all mundane laws, which is dangerous when people who hunt 'Witches' are more powerful here than they are in other versions of the setting and have technology which is equal to Magic.

Prometheus nodded gravely, acknowledging the point before smiling and taking a step back, "This is valid and true, but we have more to gain than we have to lose. Dual citizenship to both mundane and magical nations is always an option, of course... Not that I have ever had to worry about such things before. Now, for the second tenet."

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[gereh]

-snip-

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So what exactly are you looking for? You asking if I 100% agree with everything they say? I mean those are peoples "observation", which of course are subjective and I definitely can see were they are coming from. I'm not sure what the context for

Drawback: The Silver Ladder believe themselves to be above all mundane laws, which is dangerous when people who hunt 'Witches' are more powerful here than they are in other versions of the setting and have technology which is equal to Magic

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is, so can't say how accurate that is.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

So what exactly are you looking for? You asking if I 100% agree with everything they say? I mean those are peoples "observation", which of course are subjective and I definitely can see were they are coming from. I'm not sure what the context for is, so can't say how accurate that is.

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It's a snippet from my 'Reincarnated into CofD' story, Mixed Family. Context is a lecture and comparison of Silver Ladder and Free Council's beliefs, and what needs to be checked is how accurate they are to the lore in the sourcebooks.

Context for the second quote you made is the fact that I did buff Hunters (the Hunter:The Vigil ones) to be more powerful than in Canon and be able to go toe-to-toe with Mages if they are 'advanced' enough.

Here is the exposition session in full:

Spoiler: Hidden for Size

Prometheus' lecture, with Elise accompanying him, was much more entertaining and worthy of record, with Prometheus creating a whiteboard made up of pure, congealed Mana (Tass, which is also a term used in the other Mage, Mage the Ascension) while Erisse just took out a mundane erasable marker and began writing on it.

"All right," Prometheus said in a warmer, softer tone which nevertheless echoed through the small room which had been reserved for the four of us beforehand, "Let us begin; how much do you know of the Silver Ladder from your previous incarnations?"

His eyes and posture were relaxed, in a way that made him look more like a dork than a properly elegant and refined man even as he held a cane with a top of pure electrum and used it as a pointer.

I raised my hand like the dutiful schoolboy I am (of course it was difficult not to cringe internally, I probably looked too eager and ridiculous in that respect) and said, "Well, to summarize, the Silver Ladder are descended from the alleged Priest-Kings of Atlantis, the ancient civilization of Awakened that most Magi claim their heritage from, and believe that Mages should lead Humanity but all Humans should be Mages and that the difference between them and the Seers of the Throne, their enemy, is that they want the entire Human race to be 'uplifted'... Under their leadership."

Prometheus chuckled at that and said, "Well...you aren't wrong, but the phrasing you've decided to use...It draws a clear line between 'us' and 'them'. Making the other side appear to be little more than megalomaniacs, barely removed from the Seers."

The congealed Mana which made up the whiteboard began forming letters that assumed a matte-black color, letters which spelled out: The Elemental Precepts of the Silver Ladder.

"Diamond; the Awakened are one Nation," Prometheus spoke as he twirled his cane theatrically, catching the glimmer of the electric lights above, "Diamond is earth, purified and strengthened under the crucibles of fire, hardship, and time. A natural transformative process that forms the foundation of our philosophies - that Mages have a common bond, descending from the Awakened Civilization of Atlantis. They are then further united by the struggle of exaltation, guiding mankind beyond divinity."

Elise then wrote down on the whiteboard, Drawback: The Silver Ladder believe themselves to be above all mundane laws, which is dangerous when people who hunt 'Witches' are more powerful here than they are in other versions of the setting and have technology which is equal to Magic.

Prometheus nodded gravely, acknowledging the point before smiling and taking a step back, "This is valid and true, but we have more to gain than we have to lose. Dual citizenship to both mundane and magical nations is always an option, of course... Not that I have ever had to worry about such things before. Now, for the second tenet."

He cleared his throat and said, "Thunder: Imperium is the Birthright of all Humanity. No God or Metaphysical Personification of any given Concept has the right to control Human Destiny and there is no Original Sin, no deserving of the punishment levied by a Fallen World. That phrase I emphasized is in the sourcebook you've read in your previous lives, by the way, 'Mage the Awakening Second Edition', right?"

We cringed at that, considering how before we got reincarnated into the Chronicles of Darkness/New World of Darkness 2e, we did believe in some form of 'Original Sin' as it made sense to us, more so than the restrictions on who we can love.

After all, before we died the first time, we saw enough of our own world to know that Humans are not innately good and that it is as naive as a belief in any God to believe that Humans have an innate goodness that will cause them to help each other when every 'impediment' to doing so is destroyed.

This is only my personal opinion; I am not going to preach to you guys - Find your own path.

Prometheus' eyes glinted as he looked at me and Leon and said, "Point is, all Humanity has the right to Awaken and become Mages and the Silver Ladder shapes society so that more people can Awaken, become Mages, and then Ascend, retaking Reality from the Seers and the Exarchs and breaking this cycle of futility, death, and despair."

Then he gave an exaggerated sigh as he wiped his brow with the head of his cane - How impractical! - and admitted, "Note that this effort is undermined by the fact that no one knows what exactly causes people to Awaken as Mages; some people say that the 'Oracles', allegedly Atlantean Mages who defied the Exarchs and their minions, the Seers of the Throne in order to retain a presence in the Supernal Realms and keep part of Reality free, created the Watchtowers which act as a mechanism for Mages to Awaken. Of course, as a member of the Silver Ladder, I do not disbelieve in this dogma as the 'Supernal' portion of Reality is literally malleable and subject to multiple entities who can literally rewrite reality so that their intended changes were already part of the universe since their origins…"

Elise interrupted by raising her hand and saying, "Uh-huh. Enough with the suspiciously specific denial and allow me to write down the Free Council's compatible yet competing tenet."

And she wrote down on the whiteboard: Humanity is Magical.

"By Humanity," Elise said sternly, "I mean mundane Humanity, unawakened Humanity, in groups and as a species. Human culture, science, technology, and art already reflect the Supernal Realms, corresponding to new symbols which they themselves create in 'Supernal Reality'. Note that like the Silver Ladder, we seek to make all Humanity worthy of Ascension, but we do so not by teaching or 'leading' individual humans or groups of them but by destroying the Capital-L Lies which crush the Human soul so that all Humans, everywhere, can Awaken simultaneously in a revolution!"

Prometheus blinked and said, lightly tapping the whiteboard with his cane, "And that is not actually in opposition to our own beliefs; most of us just disdain Sleeper, aka mundane human, culture, science, and technology and that holds us back." He then made red writing appear on the whiteboard, Blood: The Sleepers Follow.

His tone turned firmer, more serious, "If Diamond is Earth and Thunder is energized Air, Blood is living Water. Sleepers are wounded by The Lie, which keeps them from becoming Mages themselves. Until we create a Utopia where everyone becomes a Mage, the Silver Ladder must lead Humanity."

He then stood aside to let Elise write the next countervailing creed of the Free Council on the whiteboard with her marker: Democracy fosters the Trurh.

"Yes, you can be skeptical," Erisse spoke as she waved her right index finger in a tut-tutting way, "But one must remember that the people using lies to get an advantage in democratic politics are those who believe in Hierarchy, and Hierarchy innately dilutes the power of the Supernal World, power shown by Humanity acting in groups, even if the Hierarchy is led by Mages. Thus, we preserve the potency of Supernal Truth by making group decisions, taking on collective responsibility, and electing temporary leaders based on current needs."

Prometheus cleared his throat and said, "Which nevertheless leaves room for cooperation as said temporary leaders are often experienced Mages."

Then with a flourish of his right hand and a twirl of his staff, the entire top section of the whiteboard turned into floating liquid mana which floated up and congealed into the glowing, blue-white words: Star: The Silver Ladder is the Path to Victory.

"The Ladder is made up of the stages of enlightenment, and all Humans have the right to select which rung they want to be on, even if it's not at the top. Despite the Free Council railing against Hierarchy, freedom means the right to choose not to be on top. Of course, this also means that the Awakened, or Mages, have the obligation to uplift Humans towards Awakening, which leads us to…"

He glanced at a faux-offended Elise, who wrote on the bottom of the board, Destroy the Followers of the Lie.

Elise then intoned in a solemn tone which sounded like a gothic mausoleum, "The Lie represents the hostile forces keeping Humanity from Awakening, and which forces the artificial divide between Mage and mundane Human by existing. The Seers of the Throne, our enemies, want to keep said divide existent because they are literally motivated by wealth, power, and pleasure. Note that due to the Silver Ladder being arrogant like the Seers and even making occasional common cause with them 'to save the Awakened as a people, some among us see the Silver Ladder as 'Followers of the Lie' too."

Prometheus then spoke, "Which I assume is a notion I've disabused you two of. So, I presume that you two will at least consider being part of the Silver Ladder?"

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Feel free to just skip past the character actions and other fluff if you found this snippet too long, btw. Or just skim if you don't have the time.

 

[gereh]

Fair warning: I started to ramble a bit at some points and don't have the energy to go through it and clear everything up, I hope my points will still be clear.

It's a snippet from my 'Reincarnated into CofD' story, Mixed Family. Context is a lecture and comparison of Silver Ladder and Free Council's beliefs, and what needs to be checked is how accurate they are to the lore in the sourcebooks.

Click to shrink...

That's difficult for one the "Free Council" is pretty diverse in their way of thinking and where they stand on different subjects. There seems to be a clear bias from the MC against the Silver Ladder here:

... believe that Mages should lead Humanity but all Humans should be Mages and that the difference between them and the Seers of the Throne, their enemy, is that they want the entire Human race to be 'uplifted'... Under their leadership.

Click to shrink...

which depending on the character may very well fit. The way it reads is that the "Silver Ladder" acts out of selfish reason, making them sound a lot like the Technocracy in M20, which they really aren't. The idea in the Ladder philosophy is a lot closer to a teacher than that of a leader, their "right to lead" comes from being trained in it and knowing what they are doing and not from a selfish desire to be in charge (even if there are some individuals who do so but that in general doesn't fit the Ladder doctrine).

It's like let's say you have a big international company and you have to decide who to put in charge of it, do you choose the guy who has gone to buisnes and managment school or do you take some average joe who works a normal job and put them in charge?

Drawback: The Silver Ladder believe themselves to be above all mundane laws, which is dangerous when people who hunt 'Witches' are more powerful here than they are in other versions of the setting and have technology which is equal to Magic.

Click to shrink...

If you mean by "mundane law" the "physical" laws of the fallen world, that holds true, also many don't do much to disguise their practice. Magic is their birth right after all they use it freely. Which brings the risk of becoming "Mad" (aka Wisdom reaching 0).

If we talk about "mortal laws" like in actual laws to use in a court that statement is debatable. Not falling the laws makes you an outcast in society, which is contraproduktiv to their goal of shepherding humanity to awakening. In general they are thought culture norms and how to act with mortals to best work to their goal, which would obviously include not breaking the law.

Hunter, Defiant, and Promethean are the CoFD books I don't own, because I never really cared about those settings, so I can only talk about what I tend to know about them. From my understand conspiracy hunters can already take one Mages, especially if they work together as a cell and I don't think technology is there way to do so (for most). I know there is like a group of half-demon/demon descendants that can fuck Mages up really bad by drawing on the Abyss. And of course the Mage Hunter conspiracy "Knights of Saint George" who use "Demons". So I don't know if going with more tech'd up hunters is the way to go. Especially as that would of course "destroy" the balance between Hunters and other supernatural, if a Hunter can go toe-to-toe with a Mage, he can also do so with a Vamp or Were, so they should be a lot more efficient. (But yeah that not really a critique point now that I think about it, it's just I would have gone a slightly different way, but it's your story so it's fine to do it your way)

The one thing Ladder Mages as an organization is known for is that they will do what is necessary to save the Mage communities from bigger threats, even if it means working together with enemies an example given for that is them working together with the Seers doing the Crusade to stop a demon from killing all mages around. So if the Hunters got so much more dangerous the Ladder would most likely adapt, they wouldn't like it, but from what we know of how they handled stuff in the past they would do so.

Context for the second quote you made is the fact that I did buff Hunters (the Hunter:The Vigil ones) to be more powerful than in Canon and be able to go toe-to-toe with Mages if they are 'advanced' enough.

Click to shrink...

*Looks at Knights of Saint George with concern*

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

Fair warning: I started to ramble a bit at some points and don't have the energy to go through it and clear everything up, I hope my points will still be clear.

That's difficult for one the "Free Council" is pretty diverse in their way of thinking and where they stand on different subjects. There seems to be a clear bias from the MC against the Silver Ladder here:

which depending on the character may very well fit. The way it reads is that the "Silver Ladder" acts out of selfish reason, making them sound a lot like the Technocracy in M20, which they really aren't. The idea in the Ladder philosophy is a lot closer to a teacher than that of a leader, their "right to lead" comes from being trained in it and knowing what they are doing and not from a selfish desire to be in charge (even if there are some individuals who do so but that in general doesn't fit the Ladder doctrine).

It's like let's say you have a big international company and you have to decide who to put in charge of it, do you choose the guy who has gone to buisnes and managment school or do you take some average joe who works a normal job and put them in charge?


If you mean by "mundane law" the "physical" laws of the fallen world, that holds true, also many don't do much to disguise their practice. Magic is their birth right after all they use it freely. Which brings the risk of becoming "Mad" (aka Wisdom reaching 0).

If we talk about "mortal laws" like in actual laws to use in a court that statement is debatable. Not falling the laws makes you an outcast in society, which is contraproduktiv to their goal of shepherding humanity to awakening. In general they are thought culture norms and how to act with mortals to best work to their goal, which would obviously include not breaking the law.

Hunter, Defiant, and Promethean are the CoFD books I don't own, because I never really cared about those settings, so I can only talk about what I tend to know about them. From my understand conspiracy hunters can already take one Mages, especially if they work together as a cell and I don't think technology is there way to do so (for most). I know there is like a group of half-demon/demon descendants that can fuck Mages up really bad by drawing on the Abyss. And of course the Mage Hunter conspiracy "Knights of Saint George" who use "Demons". So I don't know if going with more tech'd up hunters is the way to go. Especially as that would of course "destroy" the balance between Hunters and other supernatural, if a Hunter can go toe-to-toe with a Mage, he can also do so with a Vamp or Were, so they should be a lot more efficient. (But yeah that not really a critique point now that I think about it, it's just I would have gone a slightly different way, but it's your story so it's fine to do it your way)

The one thing Ladder Mages as an organization is known for is that they will do what is necessary to save the Mage communities from bigger threats, even if it means working together with enemies an example given for that is them working together with the Seers doing the Crusade to stop a demon from killing all mages around. So if the Hunters got so much more dangerous the Ladder would most likely adapt, they wouldn't like it, but from what we know of how they handled stuff in the past they would do so.



*Looks at Knights of Saint George with concern*

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Thanks! And the discussion, once I finished it elsewhere, ended with the MC's bias being overcome and him considering the Silver Ladder as a viable option to join.

 

[tem345]

i am thinking of a fic. Question would ki affect kindred? Would they be badly affected by life-force energy?

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

i am thinking of a fic. Question would ki affect kindred? Would they be badly affected by life-force energy?

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Which Ki? DBZ ki?

 

[Maragas]

i am thinking of a fic. Question would ki affect kindred? Would they be badly affected by life-force energy?

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Probably not? Not unless it's specifically used to harm them anyway. Though I can see Yang-Ki burning them away if it's potent enough.

At least that's what I remember from Kindred of the East and Demon Hunter X. I would suggest giving them a read.

 

[tem345]

Which Ki? DBZ ki?

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Standard life energy. Would kindred being undead suffer from its opposite life energy.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

Standard life energy. Would kindred being undead suffer from its opposite life energy.

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Honestly, I don't think so; it's Holy Energy they suffer from, I think?

 

[tem345]

Honestly, I don't think so; it's Holy Energy they suffer from, I think?

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I mean not really. True faith hurts every supernatural. I am thinking more of the lines of hamon from jojo. Solar powered life energy

 

[shadowdice]

Standard life energy. Would kindred being undead suffer from its opposite life energy.

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No

If they bite kuei jin, who are the guys that collect ki in their bodies, nothing really happens

Tremere also make their chantries over ley lines which is also what Kuei Jin do to try and tap ki from the world and bid just humans

Kindred aren't really powered by an "undead energy" if anything they need to take life energy/bits of the soul via blood

 

[Gedou_Meta]

The only life energy types I can think of that do something to vampires are mummies. Possibly specifically just the ones under the remit of Ra and Horus's crusade, but possibly also others. Their supercharged blood gives temporary Humanity.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

shadowdice , realistically, how would Zeltretch from the Nasuverse react to someone (a Mage) from the Chronicles of Darkness using Spirit 5 + Prime 5 to steal a Servant from Fate/Grand Order to fight for them?

We're also going to assume that Mana from the Nasuverse can be converted to Mana from Mage the Awakening or Quintessence from Mage the Ascension, with 2 units of Nasuverse Mana converting to 1 unit of Mage!Mana and vice versa.

For that matter, how would Chaldea react to the Chronicles of Darkness/New World of Darkness 2e?

 

[shadowdice]

shadowdice , realistically, how would Zeltretch from the Nasuverse react to someone (a Mage) from the Chronicles of Darkness using Spirit 5 + Prime 5 to steal a Servant from Fate/Grand Order to fight for them?

We're also going to assume that Mana from the Nasuverse can be converted to Mana from Mage the Awakening or Quintessence from Mage the Ascension, with 2 units of Nasuverse Mana converting to 1 unit of Mage!Mana and vice versa.

For that matter, how would Chaldea react to the Chronicles of Darkness/New World of Darkness 2e?

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People do heroic spirit summoning all the time o don't think he'd care

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

People do heroic spirit summoning all the time o don't think he'd care

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So... what would Chaldea think of the Chronicles of Darkness?

Or even the Old World of Darkness?

 

[gereh]

shadowdice , realistically, how would Zeltretch from the Nasuverse react to someone (a Mage) from the Chronicles of Darkness using Spirit 5 + Prime 5 to steal a Servant from Fate/Grand Order to fight for them?

We're also going to assume that Mana from the Nasuverse can be converted to Mana from Mage the Awakening or Quintessence from Mage the Ascension, with 2 units of Nasuverse Mana converting to 1 unit of Mage!Mana and vice versa.

For that matter, how would Chaldea react to the Chronicles of Darkness/New World of Darkness 2e?

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From my "fanfic" Fate knowledge I would assume some on also would need "Fate Arcana" to summon/steal a servant to form a contract and/or stabilize them by binding them to a "grail" or any other power source. I would say at least level 3 to alter the servant contract so they fight for you instead of whoever they did so before. But with Fate 3 they can also "hide destinies" which should allow them to hide their servant (I think Fate is weird).

At that point they should already be able to manipulate the "contract" they have with a "grail" in the war, allowing them to become "cheating cheaters who cheat". Probably allowing them to curb-stomp anyone else in the war.

Such an existence of course would be on "recruit or kill" for any magical organization around. As they aren't a treat to the survival of humanity I would assume Chaldea would be favouring "recruiting" (any given individual in it may of course be of an other opinion).

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

From my "fanfic" Fate knowledge I would assume some on also would need "Fate Arcana" to summon/steal a servant to form a contract and/or stabilize them by binding them to a "grail" or any other power source. I would say at least level 3 to alter the servant contract so they fight for you instead of whoever they did so before. But with Fate 3 they can also "hide destinies" which should allow them to hide their servant (I think Fate is weird).

At that point they should already be able to manipulate the "contract" they have with a "grail" in the war, allowing them to become "cheating cheaters who cheat". Probably allowing them to curb-stomp anyone else in the war.

Such an existence of course would be on "recruit or kill" for any magical organization around. As they aren't a treat to the survival of humanity I would assume Chaldea would be favouring "recruiting" (any given individual in it may of course be of an other opinion).

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Actually, while the Fate Arcana (CofD) governs oaths and contracts, Servants would be bound by Spirit and Prime, and it would be Space that hides identities and names from scrying.

The Holy Grail in Fate is basically just a large collection of Magical Energy/Mana that emulates the real Holy Grail (its complicated) and uses that to grant wishes. So it can actually be controlled with Prime 4 or 5.

 

[gereh]

Actually, while the Fate Arcana (CofD) governs oaths and contracts

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Yes and from my understanding a "summoner" makes a "contract" with the "grail" and the "servant" when they summon one. So to steal someones servant I assume you would need to change the contract to be with you instead of the original summoner. At least from my understanding.

Servants would be bound by Spirit and Prime, and it would be Space that hides identities and names from scrying.

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Space hides you from "scrying" but anyone who sees you would still regocnize your servant as one, while with Fate you can "hide your servants destiny" which if I understand Fate correctly (let's be real there is no chance for that) would make them appear as normal person as their "destiny/story/fate" is what gives them their power.

The Holy Grail in Fate is basically just a large collection of Magical Energy/Mana that emulates the real Holy Grail (its complicated) and uses that to grant wishes. So it can actually be controlled with Prime 4 or 5.

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There are still some rules in the "war" right? Like only starting when everyone has summoned a servant, everyone gets one servant and so on. I would assume with Fate you could changes those rules. (Which means a Mage with at least 3 dots in Fate would make a great antagonist for a crossover fic)

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

Yes and from my understanding a "summoner" makes a "contract" with the "grail" and the "servant" when they summon one. So to steal someones servant I assume you would need to change the contract to be with you instead of the original summoner. At least from my understanding.


Space hides you from "scrying" but anyone who sees you would still regocnize your servant as one, while with Fate you can "hide your servants destiny" which if I understand Fate correctly (let's be real there is no chance for that) would make them appear as normal person as their "destiny/story/fate" is what gives them their power.

There are still some rules in the "war" right? Like only starting when everyone has summoned a servant, everyone gets one servant and so on. I would assume with Fate you could changes those rules. (Which means a Mage with at least 3 dots in Fate would make a great antagonist for a crossover fic)

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Ah, and yep, all those ought to be true.

shadowdice , can I ask for your opinion on this?

 

[shadowdice]

Ah, and yep, all those ought to be true.

shadowdice , can I ask for your opinion on this?

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I assume that you meant to access the throne to summon one

summoning a servant is like downloading part of a pdf for what you need, printing it out, and later sending a file on what you did with it rather than getting the original spirit

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

I assume that you meant to access the throne to summon one

summoning a servant is like downloading part of a pdf for what you need, printing it out, and later sending a file on what you did with it rather than getting the original spirit

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Yes.

So Spirit is the primary Arcana/Sphere for stealing a Servant from the Throne, then?

 

[Lucidum]

Yes.

So Spirit is the primary Arcana/Sphere for stealing a Servant from the Throne, then?

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Eh, I'm not super sure how great of an idea that is. The Throne is meant to be used as one of the most powerful defenses the Planet has available to it from my understanding, it's okay with loaning a limited partial copy that will eventually be returned but actually stealing a spirit from the Throne? Which is a subset of the Akasha Record... that could potentially get a rather violent response. What with that being the equivalent of the Nasu-verse afterlife, Heroic Spirits are just bookmarked as being effective tools for potential use later on by the planet.

So... what would Chaldea think of the Chronicles of Darkness?

Or even the Old World of Darkness?

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To be honest? Nasu!Magus are pretty similar-ish to NWoD Mages from what I understand in attitude but work more like oWoD Mages where Magic is controlled by belief, for the most part, so they're pretty much reclusive magical academics that only care about their personal benefit first and their family legacy second(If they can't achieve their goal then their Heir will; repeat ad infinitum) while looking to expand their understanding and skills while the clock slowly clicks downwards as Mystery is breathing its last breath pushing them to ever more extremes.

Err... in other words, Magus generally have tunnel vision to what's relevant to themselves unless it's something that's an opportunity of a lifetime(IE The Grail War). So Chaldea as an organization honestly wouldn't care about the WoD in general unless it somehow culminated in an existential threat to humanity, though potentially like most Magus they wouldn't mind putting bodies on the operating table to find what makes various WoD!Splats tick and see if they can't get any benefits out of them.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

Eh, I'm not super sure how great of an idea that is. The Throne is meant to be used as one of the most powerful defenses the Planet has available to it from my understanding, it's okay with loaning a limited partial copy that will eventually be returned but actually stealing a spirit from the Throne? Which is a subset of the Akasha Record... that could potentially get a rather violent response. What with that being the equivalent of the Nasu-verse afterlife, Heroic Spirits are just bookmarked as being effective tools for potential use later on by the planet.


To be honest? Nasu!Magus are pretty similar-ish to NWoD Mages from what I understand in attitude but work more like oWoD Mages where Magic is controlled by belief, for the most part, so they're pretty much reclusive magical academics that only care about their personal benefit first and their family legacy second(If they can't achieve their goal then their Heir will; repeat ad infinitum) while looking to expand their understanding and skills while the clock slowly clicks downwards as Mystery is breathing its last breath pushing them to ever more extremes.

Err... in other words, Magus generally have tunnel vision to what's relevant to themselves unless it's something that's an opportunity of a lifetime(IE The Grail War). So Chaldea as an organization honestly wouldn't care about the WoD in general unless it somehow culminated in an existential threat to humanity, though potentially like most Magus they wouldn't mind putting bodies on the operating table to find what makes various WoD!Splats tick and see if they can't get any benefits out of them.

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1.) Point; so just using Spirit + Prime to summon one of those copies without needing a Holy Grail, then?

2.) Understandable. Note that the crossover(s) I am planning involve the God-Machine from CofD/nWoD 2e eventually threatening both Nasuverse and the Old World of Darkness.

3.) Fun fact: I genuinely thought that the Nasuverse!Mages' obsession with The Root was so that they can find the supernatural concepts of tyranny and control and fuse with those to oppress Reality, like the Seers of the Throne from CofD/nWoD 2e. Let's just say I was 'corrected' very brutally by other folk...

 

[Lucidum]

1.) Point; so just using Spirit + Prime to summon one of those copies without needing a Holy Grail, then?

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I'm not super familiar with how M:tAw nor M:tAsc spell systems work so I'd go with what was recommended/said by the others. So, probably yeah.

2.) Understandable. Note that the crossover(s) I am planning involve the God-Machine from CofD/nWoD 2e eventually threatening both Nasuverse and the Old World of Darkness.

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Sure, though I will note that the God-Machine was/is in favor of the Masquerade but I won't get too finicky over what amounts to a Mad God.

Also, so this is a crossover between oWoD/nWoD and Nasu?

3.) Fun fact: I genuinely thought that the Nasuverse!Mages' obsession with The Root was so that they can find the supernatural concepts of tyranny and control and fuse with those to oppress Reality, like the Seers of the Throne from CofD/nWoD 2e. Let's just say I was 'corrected' very brutally by other folk...

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Yeah, Nasu is one of those fandoms where being wrong or going against the common consensus of the LoreTM​ is likely to get you put to the stake. Ignoring the fact that the lore is obscure and obtuse and most translations were rather poor so the entire english fate community has very conflicting info about a setting that lives in the details.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

I'm not super familiar with how M:tAw nor M:tAsc spell systems work so I'd go with what was recommended/said by the others. So, probably yeah.

Sure, though I will note that the God-Machine was/is in favor of the Masquerade but I won't get too finicky over what amounts to a Mad God.

Also, so this is a crossover between oWoD/nWoD and Nasu?

Yeah, Nasu is one of those fandoms where being wrong or going against the common consensus of the LoreTM​ is likely to get you put to the stake. Ignoring the fact that the lore is obscure and obtuse and most translations were rather poor so the entire english fate community has very conflicting info about a setting that lives in the details.

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1.) Understood.

2.) Thanks!

3.) Eventually, but the crossover will only be revealed in-story in the Epilogue(s) and the Sequel.

4.) Yes!

 

[Snakescribe]

I have a question I want to ask. I'm trying to play and create an NPC character in Vampire the Masquerade the Dark Ages. Is there anything else I should get before I play it here?

Also does anyone know the best places to talk about Vampire the Masquerade Dark Ages online? total newbie here.

 

[Repentant_Dragos]

I have a question I want to ask. I'm trying to play and create an NPC character in Vampire the Masquerade the Dark Ages. Is there anything else I should get before I play it here?

Also does anyone know the best places to talk about Vampire the Masquerade Dark Ages online? total newbie here.

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Not sure myself, but we have a few knowledgable people here.

 

[gereh]

I have a question I want to ask. I'm trying to play and create an NPC character in Vampire the Masquerade the Dark Ages. Is there anything else I should get before I play it here?

Also does anyone know the best places to talk about Vampire the Masquerade Dark Ages online? total newbie here.

Click to shrink...

Just play the Crusader Kings "Prince of Darkness" mod and you should be good (jk).

The V20 Dark Ages book has about everything one would need. I personally like the "old" Dark Age Companion book, it comes with a complete chapter about "faith" and one about "infernalism", so it can be highly useful, but if you don't plan to take your character in those directions you can safely skip it.

Depending on the location the play is in you may want to big some other book e.g. there is a chapter aboute "Rome" in the V20 dark age companion, or if it set in Britain there is a whole book about Britain during the "Dark Ages". But that depends.

So if you know what kind of character you want to make and the city/location the chronicle is that one I maybe could recommend something else, but overall the v20 dark ages book should give you about everything you should need.