With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

PDV · Jan 22, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
The Imperial Creed.

For example, take the Arch Zealot of the Redemption, the theoretical head of the Redemptionists of Hive Primus on Necromunda. He is a religious authority. What is his position in the Ecclesiarchy? Well, he wanders around rilling people up, which makes him a confessor. Except it doesn't, because he's not a member of the Ecclesiarchy. He is claiming divine authority without being a member of the state church.

I fail to see how this is relevant either.

No, they do. That Warrant of Trade supercedes everything except practical reality. Something authorised by the High Lord of Terra is the highest Imperial law.

No, the books provide repeated examples that it doesn't. Rogue Traders have independence much like Unseen University - the Warrant gives them a free hand provided they never try to use it to disrupt anything the High Lords actually care about. When a Rogue Trader tries to claim the Warrant allows them to go through a military blockade (as by literal interpretation it does), the Admiral doesn't immediately blow them out of the sky but he does immediately match speed with all guns targeted and ask once more before the Trader concedes. Even though it's not a threat to the blockade.

Because they nominate the speaker? He literally works for them and would be replaced if a majority thought that he wasn't doing his job? He's a representative like the Inquisitorial Representative, not a department head like the Master of the Administratum.

99% of chartist captains are on short routes so far from Terra that they'll never in their life meet someone who has met their ostensible speaker. 90% probably haven't even met someone who was two steps away. They have no ability to know what the speaker is saying, let alone vote to remove them. The speaker belongs to the Terran political class, not the captains.

It does, because it's a response to reality rather than an ideological decision.

It is very clearly an ideological decision. They treat it as an ideological decision. They combat it ideologically, with secret police and thoughtcrime. It doesn't matter that it's based in reality; they could choose a response based in reality and they didn't. They built up the threat of mutants when before the Genestealers showed up (in M37 or so?) mutants who were not heretics were both common and harmless. They treated everything as absolute and a matter of religious faith.

Put it this way: who is the ruler of the Imperium?

That's right, no one is.

The Emperor is the head of state but isn't capable of making decisions. The High Lords cooperate as heads/representatives of their organisations and don't have the authority to give direct orders to each others followers. The next biggest locus of legitimate powers is... Marneus Calgar as nominal ruler of the 100 worlds?

Again, not relevant. The Imperium is ossified enough that no one has power to change the system, but the system itself remains fascist. It's probably not really plausible to have the figurehead become a pure figurehead and not have it fall apart, but that's hardly one of the setting's larger breaks from reality.

Ardy · Jan 22, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
I'm pretty sure that he's dead at this point, though it's possible that his soul is pulsating around the webway.

Even in death, he's still looking for that gene-stealer Gussy

Neruz · Jan 22, 2025

Ardy said:
Even in death, he's still looking for that gene-stealer Gussy

Assuming his soul hasn't run into a Dark Eldar who decided it would make a neat ornament.

Darko · Jan 22, 2025

Neruz said:
Assuming his soul hasn't run into a Dark Eldar who decided it would make a neat ornament.

Even they might grow disgusted with him.

Mr Zoat · Jan 22, 2025

Neruz said:
Assuming his soul hasn't run into a Dark Eldar who decided it would make a neat ornament.

No, it's okay: he's from 2nd Edition. Dark Eldar don't exist yet.

PDV said:
I fail to see how this is relevant either.

This is what I get for not asking you for your definition of fascism. I don't know what you're arguing for. What definition are you using?

To quote Benito Mussolini, who can be considered something of a subject matter expert: "All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."

A single unified religion revering the divine leader may be a fascist institution. You can even argue that the Temple of the Saviour Emperor was meant to be that. But when you look at it in any detail you realise that the Imperium doesn't have that any longer, if it ever really did. Vast differences in faith are tolerated. Organisations can claim divine authority without any tie to the official state church. The Mechanicus don't even pay the structure lip service. That is not a fascist setup. Fascism cannot tolerate that, except as an enemy within.

No, the books provide repeated examples that it doesn't. Rogue Traders have independence much like Unseen University - the Warrant gives them a free hand provided they never try to use it to disrupt anything the High Lords actually care about. When a Rogue Trader tries to claim the Warrant allows them to go through a military blockade (as by literal interpretation it does), the Admiral doesn't immediately blow them out of the sky but he does immediately match speed with all guns targeted and ask once more before the Trader concedes. Even though it's not a threat to the blockade.

Let's say that I accept that example, despite the lack of a reference.

Yes, the High Lords of Terra can, in concert, revoke a Warrant of Trade. They are the highest functioning level of government of the Imperium. But you don't appear to be arguing about that. You're saying the exact same thing that I did; that the state on the ground isn't the same as the theoretical legal state.

Since we agree, I see no point in arguing this further.

99% of chartist captains are on short routes so far from Terra that they'll never in their life meet someone who has met their ostensible speaker. 90% probably haven't even met someone who was two steps away. They have no ability to know what the speaker is saying, let alone vote to remove them. The speaker belongs to the Terran political class, not the captains.

I suspect it's more that it's a sometimes-seat precisely because they seldom unify enough to back someone hard enough. But you appear to be saying that because a lobbyist is the one dealing with government officials, the corporation paying him doesn't matter.

It is very clearly an ideological decision. They treat it as an ideological decision. They combat it ideologically, with secret police and thoughtcrime. It doesn't matter that it's based in reality; they could choose a response based in reality and they didn't. They built up the threat of mutants when before the Genestealers showed up (in M37 or so?) mutants who were not heretics were both common and harmless. They treated everything as absolute and a matter of religious faith.

In a place where thinking the wrong thoughts can cause literal demons to appear, practical decisions look a lot like ideological ones.

Redemptionists wearing masks because they feel that they should be faceless when doing the Emperor's work is a matter of ideology. Burning witches is a practical matter, because untrained psykers are an existential threat and burning prevents the spread of warp corruption.

And yes, mutants are warp-altered humans. That's the difference between a mutant and an abhuman. Much like psykers they are a problem, even if they're personally quite nice.

Again, not relevant. The Imperium is ossified enough that no one has power to change the system, but the system itself remains fascist. It's probably not really plausible to have the figurehead become a pure figurehead and not have it fall apart, but that's hardly one of the setting's larger breaks from reality.

Name one fascist state that didn't have a charismatic leader.

GhostKing 666 · Jan 22, 2025

Neruz said:
Power Rings are an Outside Context Problem, so whether whatever mind running the Fortress could detect their effects would depend entirely on the author.

Also, for all we know it did react, just not in a way that is immediately noticeable to Paul.

The nicest reading of the situation is that the T'au castes, or tribes as they were back then, were literally too emotional to ever achieve peace and the only way any kind of peace and unification could be developed was by Ethereals using their pheromones to calm everyone the fuck down so that they could have a proper rational discussion instead of mindlessly trying to murder each other all the time.

Which is kinda shitty by human standards, but the T'au aren't human, and by 40k standards it's actually pretty okay all things considered.

One funny thing about the T'au is that they are apparently a surveillance state where everyone is under 24 hour surveillance with no privacy. What's funny is that they are apparently T'au don't really have a problem with this because T'au psychology actually doesn't place much stock in privacy and in-fact T'au get stressed and uncomfortable if they think that they aren't being watched. A leftover instinct from their time as a herd species.

Vaermina · Jan 22, 2025

Neruz said:
Power Rings are an Outside Context Problem, so whether whatever mind running the Fortress could detect their effects would depend entirely on the author.

Also, for all we know it did react, just not in a way that is immediately noticeable to Paul.

Mr Zoat re-wrote things so emotional spectrum energy and warp energy are the same thing it's why Paul can recharge his ring.

Neruz said:
The nicest reading of the situation is that the T'au castes, or tribes as they were back then, were literally too emotional to ever achieve peace and the only way any kind of peace and unification could be developed was by Ethereals using their pheromones to calm everyone the fuck down so that they could have a proper rational discussion instead of mindlessly trying to murder each other all the time.

Which is kinda shitty by human standards, but the T'au aren't human, and by 40k standards it's actually pretty okay all things considered.

I mean sure, if they had stopped after doing so, but they didn't.

And of course there's the deep dark secret of whoever is controlling the Tau.

Mr Zoat said:
No, it's okay: he's from 2nd Edition. Dark Eldar don't exist yet.

But you just proved he isn't in 2nd edition by having things from 8th edition show up.

RoninSword · Jan 23, 2025

Vaermina said:
Mr Zoat re-wrote things so emotional spectrum energy and warp energy are the same thing it's why Paul can recharge his ring.

My take away was that it converts warp energy into emptional spectrum energy. Not that they were the same thing.
This is the only source in the 40K universe that talks about what powers his ring.

Mr Zoat said:
"Right. That might explain why it can draw power from the warp. And why travelling using it is so safe. Bound daemons… Sometimes they openly exert an influence on the people carrying them… There's a sword that a Space Marine called Garran Crowe uses that talks to him constantly. Others don't, or just create a general desire in the person using them. My ring only talks like a drone, but… Emotional impressions? That's basically what it does."

So it draws power from the Warp but based on how it was working in the WHF universe it converts that power to Orange Light. Recall that they did already get shown a ship because one of the higher ups recognized a hologram of a Guardian-Maltusian. You could argue either way but unless you can provide a quote of @Mr Zoat saying otherwise we don't actually have an answer either way.

Mr Zoat · Jan 23, 2025

7th May 2013
04:23 GMT -1

The Royal Citadel is a fort, laid out in the expectation that an attack could come from any direction. While the palace in Poseidonis has-. Had gaping holes in the walls so that it was easy to enter and exit, this place has solid stone walls punctuated by small entrance and exit balconies very obviously intended to serve as choke points. Or just be blocked off when they're not expecting to need to grind down an invading army.

"Huh." Zatanna frowns at it as she maintains the illusion concealing our presence.

Sha'ark bends his neck in her direction. "What?"

"Oh, it's-. I just.. assumed that an Atlantean fort would have better magic protections that that does."

"Why?"

"Be-cause.. your civilization uses lots of magic?"

He snorts, returning to watching the guard patrols. "Traditionally, we use blood magic. It doesn't work well for binding spells to stone."

"Oh. Oh, like Lamprey?"

"HAH!" He grins. "The lamprey wish they knew our magic. Eelfolk just use-."

"No, Lamprey the person. He came over from a parallel universe and tried to eat Tempest?"

"Hn. What, all of him?"

"Well, he just bit him while they were fighting, and he had runes carved into his teeth."

"Was he a shark?"

"No. He was a parallel universe version of Aqualad."

"Oh. That's interesting. With us, carving runes onto our teeth is mostly a waste of time because of how fast we replace them. I suppose with someone shaped more like you they would have more staying power. Smaller, though."

"I'll draw you the runes he used once your city isn't being mind controlled any longer." **Miss Martian, we're ready.**

**We're-. I'm scanning.**

**[Raised eyebrows.] 'We're'?**

**Ah, when I'm like this I have several different-. Well, my brain isn't centralized, and it's a little like being different people who each think about different things and then talk about it. It's a bit weird, but I'm used to it now.**

**Alright, Miss Martian's ready. King Sha'ark, how do you-?**

"Hey!" He swims right out the illusion and towards the front entrance. "What in the abyss was the mess at the arena?!"

The guards brace, but when they immediately recognise him they relax a little. Their leader swims up a little. "Your majesty?"

"I was having a peaceful conversation and my guards tried to eat me. Me!"

"I don't know anything about that. Was there a spar going on that got out of hand-?"

"Do you think I don't know the difference between fighting and talking?"

"No, your majesty, but they might have misjudged things?"

"How!?"

"I wasn't.. there, so I don't know. Do you want to talk to Captain Carcharo?"

"Yes! Find him! And-."

The lead guard shakes his head-

**They're broadcasting! I'll start tracking it.**

"And-" Sha'ark swims up to the guard and shakes him. "-are you not paying attention, soldier?!"

-then his eyes focus on King Sha'ark. "You're an impostor."

Sha'ark grabs his shoulders with both hands and shakes him. "YOU WANNA SAY THAT AGAIN?!"

"He's an impostor! Get him!"

He breaks Sha'ark's hold, his mouth opening to bite-! But Sha'ark is faster, hitting him in the top of the head and then the back of his neck. The guard shudders, then goes limp and starts floating as the other guards swim upwards towards Sha'ark.

**Do you have a direction?**

**[DIRECTION]**

Robert and Zatanna wince, and-

"There's more of them!"

-the illusions sheltering us drops. But at least we know where we're going.

"Sha'ark, disengage! Cornwall-."

He's already pointing, and the guards who were swimming towards us shudder and slow. "Wrapping them in ice didn't work, so I'm cooling their bodies down. Makes it easier to get away."

"Good. Sha'ark!"

He grabs the lead guard and hurls him at his other pursuers, the laws of motion giving him a boost as he turns and swims away from them. I head in the direction that M'gann just indelibly etched into my brain, Zatanna's glowing bubble keeping up with me.

"Should I make an illusion?"

"No, save it until we've got more attention."

A moment later Robert catches up, Sha'ark alongside him and… More guards behind that. No hue and cry, so whatever other citizens are around aren't joining in. The area around the Citadel is mostly industrial workshops and warehouses, unlike the high-end residential area the palace in Poseidonis is situated in. I see a few outdoor labourers look around as we swim past at speed-.

We're losing the guards. Ah, swimming higher would make us visible from too far away, but the streets here aren't exactly laid out in a grid pattern so it's not easy to let them keep seeing us if we stay low.

"King Sha'ark, how-?"

**I'm losing the trace!**

"How do we leave a trail for them?"

He pulls a knife off his harness, makes a shallow cut on his left palm and then squeezes it. A small waft of blood trails in the water-. Which every shark in the city will be able to scent.

He stows the knife. "Like that."

**Is that better?**

**Yes. I think it's getting stronger.**

"Gwraaagh!"

A shark from one of the nearby workshops smashes through a wall and swims after us, powering through the water! Several of his colleagues swim after him, but he's the only one actively gaining on us. I fabricate an impeller harness, drop it behind us and active the motor. It roars away, the sharkman's single-minded pursuit blinding him to the danger as it wraps its arms around his torso and shoves him off target. He partially snaps out of it, tearing at it as it slams him into a nearby wall.

"Paul, they're in front!"

I turn my head-. It's not every shark anywhere near us, but a lot of random members of the public have joined in the hunt for the 'impostors'. Most are coming at us at street level, while a few are swimming high.

"Prepare an illusion." I generate a large construct shield. "We're pushing through."

Darko · Jan 23, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
Oh. Oh, like Barracuda?"

"HAH!" He grins. "The barracuda wish they knew our magic. Eelfolk just use-."

"No, Barracuda the person. He came over from a parallel universe and tried to eat Tempest

He was called Lamprey.

Mr Zoat said:
"Oh. That's interesting. With us, carving runes onto our teeth is a waste of time because of how fast we replace them

Your teacher seemed to have runes on his teeth.

Mr Zoat said:
Make it easier to get away."

"Makes"

Ngamer11 · Jan 23, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"Oh. Oh, like Barracuda?"

"HAH!" He grins. "The barracuda wish they knew our magic. Eelfolk just use-."

"No, Barracuda the person. He came over from a parallel universe and tried to eat Tempest?"

"Hn. What, all of him?"

"Well, he just bit him while they were fighting, and he had runes carved into his teeth."

"Was he a shark?"

"No. He was a parallel universe version of Aqualad."

After double checking, I found that Barracuda is Aquaman's counterpart. Aqualad's counterpart is Lamprey.

Mr Zoat · Jan 23, 2025

Darko said:
He was called Lamprey.
Your teacher seemed to have runes on his teeth.
"Makes"

Thank you, corrected.

Chojin Patriarch · Jan 23, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
7th May 2013
04:23 GMT -1

The Royal Citadel is a fort, laid out in the expectation that an attack could come from any direction. While the palace in Poseidonis has-. Had gaping holes in the walls so that it was easy to enter and exit, this place has solid stone walls punctuated by small entrance and exit balconies very obviously intended to serve as choke points. Or just be blocked off when they're not expecting to need to grind down an invading army.

I expect it looks more like a bunker resembling a giant shell than any sort of elegant structure. Nanauve seems the sort to favour functional architecture over fanciful. And given how fierce the population seems to be, that's not surprising.

"Huh." Zatanna frowns at it as she maintains the illusion concealing our presence.

Sha'ark bends his neck in her direction. "What?"

Since simple invisibility wouldn't work great underwater. Big ol' hole in the water? No, not suspicious at all.

"Oh, it's-. I just.. assumed that an Atlantean fort would have better magic protections that that does."

"Why?"

Nanauveans tend to be more muscle wizards, from what we've seen. Self-enhancements and touch-range effects.

"Be-cause.. your civilization uses lots of magic?"

He snorts, returning to watching the guard patrols. "Traditionally, we use blood magic. It doesn't work well for binding spells to stone."

Especially underwater. Even in dry rooms, dried blood probably wouldn't last long.

"Oh. Oh, like Barracuda?"

"HAH!" He grins. "The barracuda wish they knew our magic. Eelfolk just use-."

One of the few kinds of Piscine-Atlanteans who might well have nastier bites than sharkfolk.

"No, Barracuda the person. He came over from a parallel universe and tried to eat Tempest?"

"Hn. What, all of him?"

I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she misremembered his name, since I don't remember if she was involved in meeting the Young Offenders. Certainly, her alternate, Zorinna, would have been more memorable to her. (And since Mr Zoat corrected it, it was an honest mistake on his end...)

"Well, he just bit him while they were fighting, and he had runes carved into his teeth."

"Was he a shark?"

"No. He was a parallel universe version of Aqualad."

Surprised OL didn't correct her, but he's probably a bit focused on their current situation.

"Oh. That's interesting. With us, carving runes onto our teeth is a waste of time because of how fast we replace them. I suppose with someone shaped more like you they would have more staying power. Smaller, though."

"I'll draw you the runes he used once your city isn't being mind controlled any longer." **Miss Martian, we're ready.**

Because of course OL has a good-enough scan of Lamprey's runes and the memory to recreate them. Also, your teacher had carved teeth. Does that mean he spends time getting the equivalent of manicures to get fresh teeth etched?

**We're-. I'm scanning.**

**[Raised eyebrows.] 'We're'?**

Six brains, OL, at least.

**Ah, when I'm like this I have several different-. Well, my brain isn't centralized, and it's a little like being different people who each think about different things and then talk about it. It's a bit weird, but I'm used to it now.**

**Alright, Miss Martian's ready. King Sha'ark, how do you-?**

I shudder to imagine if one of them is just 'teen horni brain', thinking about Conner a lot...

"Hey!" He swims right out the illusion and towards the front entrance. "What in the abyss was the mess at the arena?!"

The guards brace, but when they immediately recognise him they relax a little. Their leader swims up a little. "Your majesty?"

I suppose this is the easiest way to induce a broadcast. Which means Nanaue is playing bait...

"I was having a peaceful conversation and my guards tried to eat me. Me!"

"I don't know anything about that. Was there a spar going on that got out of hand-?"

I'd say it was more than that. Especially when they went after clear noncombatants.

"Do you think I don't know the difference between fighting and talking?"

"No, your majesty, but they might have misjudged things?"

Oh, I'd say it was pretty clear in their heads. Wouldn't be surprised if they had headaches and confused memories right now.

"How!?"

"I wasn't.. there, so I don't know. Do you want to talk to Captain Carcharo?"

A variation of the Latin for Shark, I note. Akin to someone being called 'Person'...

"Yes! Find him! And-."

The lead guard shakes his head-

Ah, signs of confusion? Here we go.

**They're broadcasting! I'll start tracking it.**

"And-" Sha'ark swims up to the guard and shakes him. "-are you not paying attention, soldier?!"

-then his eyes focus on King Sha'ark. "You're an impostor."

Easier than implanting 'hostile foreigner' in their heads.

Sha'ark grabs his shoulders with both hands and shakes him. "YOU WANNA SAY THAT AGAIN?!"

"He's an impostor! Get him!"

Bad move, guard. Shouldn't have let him get that close. Can probably be excused because of mind control.

He breaks Sha'ark's hold, his mouth opening to bite-! But Sha'ark is faster, hitting him in the top of the head and then the back of his neck. The guard shudders, then goes limp and starts floating as the other guards swim upwards towards Sha'ark.

**Do you have a direction?**

Ha, a simple stunning blow. People have escaped shark attacks with that sort of thing before.

**[DIRECTION]**

Robert and Zatanna wince, and-

She's probably under attack, so her shouting is understandable.

"There's more of them!"

-the illusions sheltering us drops. But at least we know where we're going.

Tiem to get going, then. Exit, pursued by sharks...

"Sha'ark, disengage! Cornwall-."

He's already pointing, and the guards who were swimming towards us shudder and slow. "Wrapping them in ice didn't work, so I'm cooling their bodies down. Make it easier to get away."

Much subtler. And less permanently dangerous, if the effect stops quickly enough to avoid total hypothermia.

"Good. Sha'ark!"

He grabs the lead guard and hurls him at his other pursuers, the laws of motion giving him a boost as he turns and swims away from them. I head in the direction that M'gann just indelibly etched into my brain, Zatanna's glowing bubble keeping up with me.

I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't have a headache after that, honestly.

"Should I make an illusion?"

"No, save it until we've got more attention."

Besides, keeping eyes on them makes it less likely the source will think to look for their previous allies

A moment later Robert catches up, Sha'ark alongside him and… More guards behind that. No hue and cry, so whatever other citizens are around aren't joining in. The area around the Citadel is mostly industrial workshops and warehouses, unlike the high-end residential area the palace in Poseidonis is situated in. I see a few outdoor labourers look around as we swim past at speed-.

A reasonable choice for a city used to wars. Keep the materiel production close to the centre of command, and all that.

We're losing the guards. Ah, swimming higher would make us visible from too far away, but the streets here aren't exactly laid out in a grid pattern so it's not easy to let them keep seeing us if we stay low.

"King Sha'ark, how-?"

So, skimming the rooftops, basically. Allowing them to duck into cover if guards pop up too close.

**I'm losing the trace!**

"How do we leave a trail for them?"

Ah, right, logical enough. If they disappear, the effect will cut off to avoid wasting energy.

He pulls a knife off his harness, makes a shallow cut on his left palm and then squeezes it. A small waft of blood trails in the water-. Which every shark in the city will be able to scent.

He stows the knife. "Like that."

The Nanauvean equivalent of launching a flare, Then.

**Is that better?**

**Yes. I think it's getting stronger.**

"Gwraaagh!"

They'll just have to deal with more guards zeroing in on them, but that's not too hard.

A shark from one of the nearby workshops smashes through a wall and swims after us, powering through the water! Several of his colleagues swim after him, but he's the only one actively gaining on us. I fabricate an impeller harness, drop it behind us and active the motor. It roars away, the sharkman's single-minded pursuit blinding him to the danger as it wraps its arms around his torso and shoves him off target. He partially snaps out of it, tearing at it as it slams him into a nearby wall.

So, they're forcing civilians to join the pursuit? Looks like they might be getting worried.

"Paul, they're in front!"

I turn my head-. It's not every shark anywhere near us, but a lot of random members of the public have joined in the hunt for the 'impostors'. Most are coming at us at street level, while a few are swimming high.

"Prepare an illusion." I generate a large construct shield. "We're pushing through."

I can just picture them combining a shaped shield and something suitably fishy, like a whale shark... While inside Zatanna's just muttering 'don't notice us, don't notice us' backwards.

Talk about poking the hornet's nest. Not exactly a subtle approach, but they do need the person behind this broadcasting continuously to zero in on their location. I wonder if they're stationary or actively moving... The worry is if they're passing this on to anyone else, like Ahri'ahn. Make too much noise, and he may decide to come down in person.

Ngamer11 · Jan 23, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"HAH!" He grins. "The lampreywish they knew our magic. Eelfolk just use-."

Missing a space here.

Mr Zoat · Jan 23, 2025

Ngamer11 said:
Missing a space here.

Thank you, corrected.

m_d · Jan 23, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"I wasn't.. there, so I don't know. Do you want to talk to Captain Carcharo?"

Chojin Patriarch said:
A variation of the Latin for Shark, I note. Akin to someone being called 'Person'...

More likely it would be akin to being called "Adam" if the name doesn't have that meaning in ordinary use. Not that there aren't lots of names used in English with literal meanings (see various month, season, and plant names), but we also have a whole lot that are derived from words in other languages that aren't commonly used in English speaking countries. Though I specifically used Adam (man) as an example since it parallels the name actually describing the person-ish (shark vs shark-man).

mastermenthe · Jan 23, 2025

It's nice to see worm-speech again.

Vaermina · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
He snorts, returning to watching the guard patrols. "Traditionally, we use blood magic. It doesn't work well for binding spells to stone."

But it would work great for binding spells to giant shells or coral.

Mr Zoat · Jan 24, 2025

7th May 2013
04:27 GMT -1

"Cornwall, disperse them."

One comes down at me from high-left, and I dodge back and hit her in the head with a sonic construct gun.

Zatanna glances at me as her runes shift. "What kind of illusion?"

"Full sensory, us swimming in another direction."

"That's easy."

"If you can think of something better, don't let me cramp your style."

Water streams into Robert's hands as he waves them in a circling motion that Nickelodeon would sue us over if this was recorded. Water doesn't compress well… Unless you can use your command of magic to alter its fundamental nature. One last swirl and he tosses, the ball of churning water propelling itself into the approximate centre of the oncoming mob… But they are a mob rather than being organised, and they're not clustered up that much-.

"Eraperp noisulli."

And it looks like Robert's spell doesn't care. Out of his grasp it pulls on the water harder, drawing the sharkfolk towards it as the churning core expands outwards-.

"Cornwall?"

"It's safe." … "Ah… I think."

Sha'ark looks back at the approaching soldiers. "Is it quick?"

Robert's looking increasingly concerned as the sharkfolk get sucked into the middle. "It-."

Ppppppppppppppwwwwwggggghhhhhh!

The core of the spell explodes, high pressure water-

I generate anchor constructs and tether them to each member of my party.

-and sharkfolk being hurled in the direction they were being spun when it burst! Some go flying upwards, some away from us, some into the walls or ground and some-

"Tfel!"

-narrowly miss us as they go flying passed us and into the pursuing soldiers, forcing them to evade. The initial pressure wave having died down I dismiss the anchors and power onwards.

"Go go go!"

The few sharkfolk who were less stunned try weakly grabbing at us as we power past them, Sha'ark punching one hopeful would-be biter on the nose to dissuade him. There are… More sharkfolk incoming, but they're spread out and don't appear to have our precise location yet.

"Zatanna."

She nods, and… My body-. Our bodies become translucent as fleshed out versions of us swim away to our left. I look around, watching as the shoal of sharkfolk begin to turn away to intercept them. I point downwards, and my team descends to swim along the sea floor.

No cars underwater, which is nice.

**Are we still on track?**

**Yes, the source isn't moving. Do you think it's a trap?**

**No. They're already throwing the entire city population at us. If they didn't want to keep us away they wouldn't bother. Heck, we're resistant to enemy telepathy, not invulnerable to it.** Hm. **Not moving?**

**I could try taking a look at them directly?**

**No, I don't want to give your location away.**

**Orange Lantern… I'm… Pretty powerful.**

**I'm not questioning that.**

**It's just-. If this was another Orange Lantern then I'd assume you could overpower them.**

**I see what you're saying, but it's a lot easier to know what Lanterns can do than what telepaths can do. If we get in trouble then sure, jump in. But I'd rather not take the risk if we don't need to.**

**Okay.**

More sharkfolk pass overhead, soldiers and civilians. They're not-.

Zatanna winces. "They got to the illusions."

"Does that dispel it?"

"Something did."

"Your majesty?"

"We can use countermagic, but we mostly do that by biting things."

Ah.

"Zatanna, can you break the link between the magic energy you had invested in the illusion and yourself?"

"Ah… Yes? What's the problem?"

"We got attacked by a blood mage earlier, who could leach our abilities by biting things. He didn't resist the mind control, so-."

"Reves noitcennoc!"

"Thank you. It-." She looks nervous. "What?"

"Just before I did that, I… Felt something. A pull."

"Double-check that you've disconnected. Sha'ark, what's that master blood mage's name?"

"We've got more than one."

"Yes, but I've been doing this long enough to notice the pattern." He gives me a look of irritated confusion. "For a mind control specialist, trying to control a high-end magician is a risk because you can't feel everything that's affecting their behaviour. Or that could affect you. Simon Jones got into my head once and then the Ophidian got her fangs into him, which he didn't know was a risk because he can't feel elementals."

"And?"

"And if you've got one under control, you don't take a chance on getting a second unless you really-"

Everything goes black.

"-have-" I send filaments towards Zatanna's projected path and drop a galvanised steel frame there. "-to."

CRUNCH!

"Ew nac lla ees hguorht krum!"

Ah! Indirect, that's clever. Doesn't help me because my tattoos mean that the spell can't find me, but it should help everyone else. I expand my filament into an insulated cable and pour electricity into it. Not a good attack in salt water, but it it's only conducting where he's bitten into it-.

AAAGH-my leg!

KharnTheBrotrayer · Jan 24, 2025

Paul is now that one fish from Spongebob.

MY LEG!

BlackCoat13 · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
"And?.

And?"

Did they mind control Zatanna there? I don't really get what happened.

WereDragon · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
7th May 2013
04:27 GMT -1

Scaling difficulty can be useful in games, although often isn't.
In a pure narrative story it is merely tiresome.

Mr Zoat · Jan 24, 2025

BlackCoat13 said:
And?"

Thank you, corrected.

Did they mind control Zatanna there?

No.

I don't really get what happened.

The blood mage caught up with them.

Chojin Patriarch · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
7th May 2013
04:27 GMT -1

"Cornwall, disperse them."

One comes down at me from high-left, and I dodge back and hit her in the head with a sonic construct gun.

This promises to get annoying, unless they can fake a dodge. Perhaps scattering multiple copies of themselves, while the real ones slip away concealed? If nothing else, it might confuse the sharks. And even then, the need to be wary.

Zatanna glances at me as her runes shift. "What kind of illusion?"

"Full sensory, us swimming in another direction."

Don't forget the trail of blood in the water from Nanaue's hand, which I hope he's healed by now.

"That's easy."

"If you can think of something better, don't let me cramp your style."

Don't go getting overconfident here, Zee. Torn apart by sharks is not a pleasant way to go...

Water streams into Robert's hands as he waves them in a circling motion that Nickelodeon would sue us over if this was recorded. Water doesn't compress well… Unless you can use your command of magic to alter its fundamental nature. One last swirl and he tosses, the ball of churning water propelling itself into the approximate centre of the oncoming mob… But they are a mob rather than being organised, and they're not clustered up that much-.

So, literally waterbending? Classy, and there's only so many gestures that work stylishly with water spells.

"Eraperp noisulli."

And it looks like Robert's spell doesn't care. Out of his gasp it pulls on the water harder, drawing the sharkfolk towards it as the churning core expands outwards-.

Magic cares naught for physics.

"Cornwall?"

"It's safe." … "Ah… I think."

Worst case, they swim away with a few bruises and broken bones. Easily fixed, and they're tough enough to withstand the kind of impacts this might cause against stone buildings.

Sha'ark looks back at the approaching soldiers. "Is it quick?"

Robert's looking increasingly concerned as the sharkfolk get sucked into the middle. "It-."

To be fair, a long build-up during a chase like this is a bit of a drawback.

Ppppppppppppppwwwwwggggghhhhhh!

The core of the spell explodes, high pressure water-

Because even magic knows when big kabooms need appropriate sound effects.

I generate anchor constructs and tether them to each member of my party.

-and sharkfolk being hurled in the direction they were being spun when it burst! Some go flying upwards, some away from us, some into the walls or ground and some-

Hopefully no fatalities.

"Tfel!"

-narrowly miss us as they go flying passed us and into the pursuing soldiers, forcing them to evade. The initial pressure wave having died down I dismiss the anchors and power onwards.

Upside, even the ones not caught in it are going to find it a bit hard to see anything given how much that would disturb the water, between traces of silt and bubbles.

"Go go go!"

The few sharkfolk who were less stunned try weakly grabbing at us as we power past them, Sha'ark punching one hopeful would-be biter on the nose to dissuade him. There are… More sharkfolk incoming, but they're spread out and don't appear to have our precise location yet.

Good chance to ditch the pursuers, then.

"Zatanna."

She nods, and… My body-. Our bodies become translucent as fleshed out versions of us swim away to our left. I look around, watching as the shoal of sharkfolk begin to turn away to intercept them. I point downwards, and my team descends to swim along the sea floor.

So far so good. Let's hope that works.

No cars underwater, which is nice.

**Are we still on track?**

...I assume he means no pursuit faster than they can swim.

**Yes, the source isn't moving. Do you think it's a trap?**

**No. They're already throwing the entire city population at us. If they didn't want to keep us away they wouldn't bother. Heck, we're resistant to enemy telepathy, not invulnerable to it.** Hm. **Not moving?**

Suspicious. A mobile source would be easier to relocate. This just invites attack.

**I could try taking a look at them directly?**

**No, I don't want to give your location away.**

Especially because, you know, psychic starfish. If they have an easier time controlling sea creatures and Atlanteans with sealife adjacent physiques...

**Orange Lantern… I'm… Pretty powerful.**

**I'm not questioning that.**

**It's just-. If this was another Orange Lantern then I'd assume you could overpower them.**

It's not a matter of trusting her skills. Or her raw power...

**I see what you're saying, but it's a lot easier to know what Lanterns can do than what telepaths can do. If we get in trouble then sure, jump in. But I'd rather not take the risk if we don't need to.**

**Okay.**

I get the feeling she wants to join in the fight, but... Better as an ace in the hole than throwing her in an easily-countered combo.

More sharkfolk pass overhead, soldiers and civilians. They're not-.

Zatanna winces. "They got to the illusions."

I'm guessing they didn't last long once they did.

"Does that dispel it?"

"Something did."

"Your majesty?"

"We can use countermagic, but we mostly do that by biting things."

Makes sense, given their existing psychological quirks.

Ah.

"Zatanna, can you break the link between the magic energy you had invested in the illusion and yourself?"

Worried about the fangs guy again?

"Ah… Yes? What's the problem?"

"We got attacked by a blood mage earlier, who could leach our abilities by biting things. He didn't resist the mind control, so-."

Not visibly, anyway. Maybe he's working on Ahri'ahn's side, maybe he just likes what it makes him want to do.

"Reves noitcennoc!"

"Thank you. It-." She looks nervous. "What?"

"Just before I did that, I… Felt something. A pull."

...Shit. Better start layering on all your magical defences, Zee.

"Double-check that you've disconnected. Sha'ark, what's that master blood mage's name?"

"We've got more than one."

Yes, but narrative causality...

"Yes, but I've been doing this long enough to notice the pattern." He gives me a look of irritated confusion. "For a mind control specialist, trying to control a high-end magician is a risk because you can't feel everything that's affecting their behaviour. Or that could affect you. Simon Jones got into my head once and then the Ophidian got her fangs into him, which he didn't know was a risk because he can't feel elementals."

I expect he didn't enjoy the experience, did he? It has been a while...

"And?.

"And if you've got one under control, you don't take a chance on getting a second unless you really-"

Especially, as noted, he goes along with you because he wants to do what you're asking.

Everything goes black.

"-have-" I send filaments towards Zatanna's projected path and drop a galvanised steel frame there. "-to."

Incoming sharkbite?

CRUNCH!

"Ew nac lla ees hguorht krum!"

Incoming sharkbite indeed. I half expect that plate to be bent into the shape of a particular Nanauvean blood-mage's snout...

Ah! Indirect, that's clever. Doesn't help me because my tattoos mean that the spell can't find me, but it should help everyone else. I expand my filament into an insulated cable and pour electricity into it. Not a good attack in salt water, but it it's only conducting where he's bitten into it-.

AAAGH-my leg!

On the upside, now you have a nice, direct connection to zap them.

Presumably, either shark-guy is a lot faster than he looks, or he brought help along with him. Either way, they may need to fight a wee bit harder against this foe. Maybe a nice, ideally-temporary severing of his limb would slow him down. Unless he can just pull them back in place because blood magic is crazy overpowered. We'll see tomorrow, I expect.

NightmareWarden · Jan 24, 2025

During the angel invasion, I think OL replaced his blood. Obviously someone with his blood can link it to the associated body, but that doesn't mean every spell works that way. Blood can be used to find more blood, after all. I'm just wondering if there is a temporary workaround, since it looks like Paul is about to lose some blood to a master bloodmage.

iamnuff · Jan 24, 2025

BlackCoat13 said:
And?"

Did they mind control Zatanna there? I don't really get what happened.

Bitey the bloodmage backtraced her through her illusion.

boo600 · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
Water streams into Robert's hands as he waves them in a circling motion that Nickelodeon would sue us over if this was recorded.

Huh. Seeing as how he saw Azula as a future Orange Lantern during the Ambush Bug incident, and he reported each world he saw to the League (which is why Plastic Man pretended to be Nightmare Moon), I had rather assumed that ATLA and other Ambush Bug Vision Worlds (as well as future Lantern Worlds like Gate) did not have media representation in Earth 16. (Seeing as how nobody mocked him over the visions in the manner of the Ninja Turtle Incident).

On other matters, I'm enjoying this arc tremendously. Zee and M'gann are showing their stuff, Rob's getting to rock his elemental skills, and it looks like Kaldur's going to be important, possibly with a good hard look at his own views (depending on what Discount Mage Lovecraft does to him) regarding Atlantis, Magic, or his relationships with his friends on the surface. Seeing as how Kon still pops up for Themyscyrian stuff, and Alan still chats with Paul a lot, and we just saw Richard finally talk to Paul about the Batman Incident… well. After all the Space Goodness (especially when the OL Corps encountered Grayven), and the Earth Badness (of the Anti-Life Arc), we've finally looped around to the original cast again!

Of course, once Paul's rebuilt his relationships on Earth a little, we're all going to start wondering about space again. And complaining that Paul should talk to Jade more on screen. (I, personally, will be rooting for More Magic Worlds. More Mars, more of the Under-Achiever's home world and Paul talking to their queen, and the ever-present hope he'll stumble across Mordru and decide he's gotta go. I know Paul's less threat-removal than the renegade, but Mordru's gotta go.)

We're distractable. Human audiences, eh?

Ngamer11 · Jan 24, 2025

boo600 said:
Of course, once Paul's rebuilt his relationships on Earth a little, we're all going to start wondering about space again. And complaining that Paul should talk to Jade more on screen. (I, personally, will be rooting for More Magic Worlds. More Mars, more of the Under-Achiever's home world and Paul talking to their queen, and the ever-present hope he'll stumble across Mordru and decide he's gotta go. I know Paul's less threat-removal than the renegade, but Mordru's gotta go.)

Mordru can't manifest in the Paragon timeline as there is no opening for a Lord of Chaos.

boo600 · Jan 24, 2025

That's honestly even better. Zerox is free!

I'd love it if Paul tripped over it. The details of Magic in Zoat's worldbuilding tend to be loads of fun, so I'll be over the moon if we get to see more of the Planet of the Sorcerers - in Paragon or Renegade timelines.

FuzzyZergling · Jan 24, 2025

Mr Zoat said:
Out of his gasp it pulls on the water harder,

grasp

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer

I trust you know where the happy button is?

HISSSSSS!

Connoisseur.

Dedicated ragequitter

Know what you're doing yet?

Well worn.

Sky God

Dedicated ragequitter

Connoisseur.

Experienced.

Dedicated ragequitter

Veteran Lurker

Experienced.

Dedicated ragequitter

Fascinated by storytelling

Mint Thistle

Well worn.

Dedicated ragequitter

Getting sticky.

Versed in the lewd.

Bookwyrm

Dedicated ragequitter

Veteran Lurker

Versed in the lewd.

Connoisseur.

Welp

Experienced.

Welp

Getting sticky.

Users who are viewing this thread