Breadnaught
Experienced.
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Christ, I forgot that even existed. I vaguely remember watching that series when it was new.
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- self insert young justice
Chojin Patriarch
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No easy task, It makes sense he'd touch base with Sunset about this. While the Harmony magical system might not be the optimum setup they might prefer, it's probably a bit easier to seed than others. I'm sure the Tree would like to help them on that front.
Ah, shorn of the thing she's been able to sense all her life? I can imagine that would be a bit of a shock to the system.
Like suddenly missing all input from a sense you know is still functioning. No wonder she was unsettled.
Circe's talents laying more in illusion and transformation than direct manipulation of thaumic fields. Though i don't doubt she's been studying up since her Awakening and split with Hecate.
Not that it being so would stop her, she'd just have to be a little more discreet, wouldn't she?
Farming by itself is probably a little too prosaic a thing to be represented by a lofty metaphorical thing.
Ah, looking to introduce his own tailored elements, eh? It's got to be some measure of esoteric aspect to things, Something tied to the Dream, perhaps.
Probably starting with taking readings of the thaumaturgical makeup of Equestria, Earth, and various other worlds she's familiar with to establish a spectrum of variances...
I know Lex isn't the most mystical fellow, but even he should understand her expertise.
That'd be a helpful aspect of Conquest: Knowing just who to assign to a task and when to let them work without oversight.
Given Savage seemed to treat the other members of the Light more like barely-trusted lieutenants than equals? Not surprising.
Ah, that explains it: No index to the Construct-Savage's memory dump. And I doubt he cared to pay much attention in linear order, so...
Can you trust Lex not to abuse the use of a Power Ring, even one as handicapped as a Construct-Lantern Ring?
Not that Lex would trust that so casually.
The Renegade's never really invested into the study of Construct Lanterns, after all. His control of them is probably about as subtle as a choke-chain.
...Ugh, no-one wants to see that.
Oh, put some pants on, you primitive screwhead.
To some degree, he's acting as the Renegade wants him to act, I guess. Capable of communicating normally, but not of taking action without being commanded to.
...Goddammit, he's an idiot. If he'd thought to do any research on the matter, he'd have realised the Reach are too crafty to be fooled that way.
See what I meant about not considering them equals? Not even using their names, just calling them by their Light membership numbers...
At least this way, he has a leash on Savage.
Petty vindictiveness. Typically, really.
Fortunately, Earth is easily overlooked. If some jackass wasn't sending out mailing lists of Earth tourism/conquest brochures...
Bitch, the Renegade killed the Sheeda. And then used their remains for his own purposes.
True, he did make use of them.
Well, unlike you, Vandal, the Renegade can think past the tip of his sword-arm.
And now we see what the Renegade meant by yelling at Construct-Savage.
Perhaps you'd like to bounce the Construct's head off the desk for a bit, Lex? I'm sure it'd help you feel better.
Heh. Two references for the price of one, eh? Vandal wasn't really someone concerned with foresight, was he? Fitting for his origins, but incredibly frustrating for those trying to unfuck his plans afterwards. Now would be a good time to actually ask the Construct-Savage just which off-world groups he tried to contact, and how much success he had with each...
Darko
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"making a"
Vaermina
Well worn.
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Personally, I feel the ones I'm writing now that are in my signature are better.
Ngamer11
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L Two was Ra's. Lex was L Three.
PJ739
Know what you're doing yet?
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Link to the chapter please?
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.
Off-screen, I'm afraid.
AverusBlack
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The mental image of Sunset spazzing out because she can't use magic for simple shit like picking something up from across the room is really funny to me for some reason. All I can picture is her sitting on the floor hugging her own arms and screaming at a tablet that won't move.
PJ739
Know what you're doing yet?
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Cool10007
I can't see in this damn thing
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Eheheheh!
How you have grown, Lexie! It's nice seeing the two of them being friends.
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Mr Zoat
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Thank me, corrected.
Darko
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Their whole thing is manipulating societies so that they can enslave them, so they already have that.
And Savage and the rest of the Light seriously did not consider certain factors about the Reach.
For one their arrogance made them consider the Reach as being their equals when that's just not true.
The Reach have a lot more resources than all of the Light put together.
Say one member of the Light screwed another one. The one that was screwed may not be able to retaliate because their resources took a hit.
The Light may have been able to screw that ambassador, but he could have just called on the rest of his people for help.
The Light also had an interest in the Earth and would generally try to avoid not destroying it beyond repair.
The Reach don't give a shit about that.
Ardy
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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Uhhh, cauldron didn't do what the entities wanted, 90% of their efforts went to keeping earth stable, while destabilizing earth into a series of ever-warring cape-lead city states was item 2 on the agenda for the entities. The last 10 percent of their effort was spent on deliberately breaking the restrictions the entities put on powers so they could kill them. Again, the opposite of what the entities wanted.
Did I miss a reference?
Did I miss a reference?
Mr Zoat
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Was it, though?
They planned using Contessa's power. A power that is part of an entity, and will seek to inact the entity's objectives. They assumed that it was honest, trustworthy, and would always tell them the whole of the truth. Cauldron are the reason why the Endbringers are active. Cauldron are the reason why supervillain banking is a thing. Cauldron created the Nemesis Program. Why? Because they thought they were more intelligent than the thing giving them the plans.
Agumentic
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Wrong. Powers are entirely independent of entities and will gladly throw down with them if that's what their host wants.
boo600
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They genuinely avoided using PtV for data (that's wht the Brockton Bay experiment happened; they didn't trust PtV as a simulator or a planning tool, only a manipulator/weapon). Since they couldn't use it to just kill Scion.
A lot of their dumbest plans are very much theirs. The results of less-than-perfect (to say the least) in an absolutely desperate situation with no good option, papering over their decision-making with powers (like Alexandria thinking faster). It's the exalted problem - until you reach unrestricted PTV levels, competence and wisdom just aren't the same.
Which isn't to say that using the shards against the entities was a 'good' plan - they hated it. But human civilization couldn't fight Scion, period. They had no other option in that particular regards, whatever their atrocities afterwards - trying to break the system and get capes that broke the restrictions was their only chance. Given that the Simurgh masterminded the Golden Morning, and they let her out? They did indeed save the world - something they genuinely believed they'd fail at.
Cauldron did a lot of dumb shit, but it's important to remember that they're not the Light - they didn't bring the monsters here, and they knew they were absolutely fucked from the get-go. Even killing Eden was a stroke of unimaginable luck - and frankly, the kind of thing that should have earned PTV more trust… if it hadn't had restrictions slapped on it as she died.
Which doesn't mean that they didn't commit unspeakable and unspeakably pointless atrocities, but what Lex is criticizing is the one thing that they never had any other option but to do. So.
If nothing else, at least he's learned what a Bad Plan looks like.
A lot of their dumbest plans are very much theirs. The results of less-than-perfect (to say the least) in an absolutely desperate situation with no good option, papering over their decision-making with powers (like Alexandria thinking faster). It's the exalted problem - until you reach unrestricted PTV levels, competence and wisdom just aren't the same.
Which isn't to say that using the shards against the entities was a 'good' plan - they hated it. But human civilization couldn't fight Scion, period. They had no other option in that particular regards, whatever their atrocities afterwards - trying to break the system and get capes that broke the restrictions was their only chance. Given that the Simurgh masterminded the Golden Morning, and they let her out? They did indeed save the world - something they genuinely believed they'd fail at.
Cauldron did a lot of dumb shit, but it's important to remember that they're not the Light - they didn't bring the monsters here, and they knew they were absolutely fucked from the get-go. Even killing Eden was a stroke of unimaginable luck - and frankly, the kind of thing that should have earned PTV more trust… if it hadn't had restrictions slapped on it as she died.
Which doesn't mean that they didn't commit unspeakable and unspeakably pointless atrocities, but what Lex is criticizing is the one thing that they never had any other option but to do. So.
If nothing else, at least he's learned what a Bad Plan looks like.
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PDV
Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer
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They still had a plan that relied heavily on farming shards to get new powers via controlling the level of conflict, AKA exactly how the Cycle is supposed to work with a slightly different goal.
That's true of weak powers but not strong ones. Second triggers and deeply-integrated powers like Glaistig Uaine's class of "noble" powers become less limited by power supply and more limited by the shard's mind, which becomes more like its source.
That's true of weak powers but not strong ones. Second triggers and deeply-integrated powers like Glaistig Uaine's class of "noble" powers become less limited by power supply and more limited by the shard's mind, which becomes more like its source.
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Agumentic
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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Queen Administrator literally hyped Taylor up when they were facing Scion.
AverusBlack
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1) Contessa's power was from a 3rd entity, not from the Warrior or Planner. Before they arrived on Earth the Planner had scuffle/meeting with this third, independent and solitary version of them. Her power is the only one to remain 'activated' after the Planner is killed and Scion is destroyed because of this third entities evolutionary history refining independent operation without a partner.
2) The Endbringers were designed by the entities as a way to put pressure on Earth and were on an activation schedule according to their destruction. All the stuff about Cauldron or Eidolon is misdirection. We actually see this demonstrated in one of the possible futures the Planner was working through.
3) The banking thing seems to have been a way to fund themselves while also gaining control over other parahumans, I'm not sure that had anything to do with the entities at all. Just humans being humans.
4) The reason Doctor Mother was in charge of decision making and not Contessa is the exact scenario you're talking about. She would ask Contessa things and then make her decisions around that.
5) Each power was a tiny, independent entity where Scion and the Planner were a sort of core organizational system whose powers was using other powers. They evolved to be an interconnecting system, but as a gestalt, where each individual power started out as an individual and was either subsumed by the whole or constructed by the other powers of the set. This way the shards could offload certain duties to the 'core', organizational things like power definition, and devote more of their energy to the use of the power. It also lets them draw from the network of powers if the power fails, runs low on power or needs re-contexting (second trigger).
6) The whole point of the story is that the powers 'personalities' bleed through to the humans but the reverse is also true. After landing on Earth, the entities didn't account for the abstract nature of dreams or emotions in general and it was this bleed through from the human part of us, combined with the Planner being out of the picture, which allowed humans to get some measure of control over powers while allowing other powers to go 'rogue'. Broken triggers and such.
Worm/Ward were another of my story obsessions at one point. I got REALLY into it and even spoke to Wildbow a couple times about it, he was kind enough to provide some notes for an RP game I was running based on the universe.
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Duke Long
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How old is Vandal exactly? Because now that I take a look it seems inconsistent, I see some mentions of him being hundreds of thousands of years old (this one, and another from Bleez saying him and Nommo were that old), but in another place Oh El says he thinks Vandal is forty eight thousand years old and Nommo eleven thousand.
Frozen20XX
Getting sticky.
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Ugh, at least Larfleeze's constructs wore lantern uniforms.. though I'm now imagining the orange lantern sigil over his crotch like a censor bar.
Surprised he's so vocal. When Renegade assimilated him, he shut right up.
Wonder what Ra's and Brain think of their current situation? Vandal seems to be "annoying but I can come back someway".
While there are ways to restore construct lanterns to their prior forms, I doubt Renegade will allow Vandal out enough for him to somehow miraculously find and use them.
Renegade: "BWAHAHA! .. Oh, wait, you're serious... LET ME LAUGH EVEN HARDER! BWAHAHAHA!!"
Mr Zoat
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Then explain the tower. Heck, explain 133t. Explain Tinker headaches, or the fact that second triggers can happen, indicating that powers are holding out on their hosts.
As for Doctor Mother, it hasn't escaped my notice that at no point did she even consider what happens if the other Entities (which they know exist) find out that Zion died. Why is 'kill this thing we can't kill the plan?
Grayven just made up that number. He doesn't know how old Vandal was.
AverusBlack
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The tower was the result of a tinker power that couldn't tap the network for definition and safeties. Each shard was individually configured when bonding with a host with a wide range of safeties and would tap the Entity to provide definition and understanding of what it would be doing and how it would be doing it. The shards don't have that kind of thinking power, it's why they made a gestalt in the first place. Tinker headaches are one of those safeties, forcing the host to ease back on the power use to conserve energy or prevent physiological issues.
The powers are absolutely holding out on their hosts. They come with a wide range of functions and would be attuned when bonding with a human, limiting some while leaving others in place. Not every shard has multiple uses but a lot of them do, especially tinker shards.
boo600
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Have you read worm/ward now? If so, did you enjoy it?
The tower - if you mean the Tinker 15, Scion saw he was a serious threat to the cycle and crippled him.
Leet: Most shards love their hosts; the shards are all more impacted by their hosts than the other way around (and given the superpowers, the hosts are far from unaffected). But not every shard does get along with their host - just the vast majority, because they pick people that they think they'll get along with and that they like.
And shards aren't allowed to give their hosts extra powers barring a second trigger - them's the rules and the system - except when they do anyway. We get to see the perspective of something like 5 shards in a few chapters of Ward; basically all of them are on the page of 'I
my host and really want to help them." Heck, Victoria's outright falls in love with her, crush style. They cheat whenever they can get away with it - that's why a lot of their limits are hard-coded into them, so they won't fuck up the cycle by giving their host the power to fart nuclear explosions. It's why Scion physically crippled Queen Administrator - to make sure she couldn't retain the ability to administrate other shards directly, before he handed her out, just in case she tried to fiddle with the other shards for her host.
Which she did, the moment Taylor jailbroke her brain.
The tower - if you mean the Tinker 15, Scion saw he was a serious threat to the cycle and crippled him.
Leet: Most shards love their hosts; the shards are all more impacted by their hosts than the other way around (and given the superpowers, the hosts are far from unaffected). But not every shard does get along with their host - just the vast majority, because they pick people that they think they'll get along with and that they like.
And shards aren't allowed to give their hosts extra powers barring a second trigger - them's the rules and the system - except when they do anyway. We get to see the perspective of something like 5 shards in a few chapters of Ward; basically all of them are on the page of 'I
my host and really want to help them." Heck, Victoria's outright falls in love with her, crush style. They cheat whenever they can get away with it - that's why a lot of their limits are hard-coded into them, so they won't fuck up the cycle by giving their host the power to fart nuclear explosions. It's why Scion physically crippled Queen Administrator - to make sure she couldn't retain the ability to administrate other shards directly, before he handed her out, just in case she tried to fiddle with the other shards for her host.Which she did, the moment Taylor jailbroke her brain.
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AverusBlack
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The Fragile One probably wouldn't even exist if not for Victoria's family. Once bonded with Victoria and given access to the concept of emotions, it's not surprising at all that she learns to love Victoria. That powers whole existence was the result of all the shards in her family being empowered enough to just build a new power and let it bond. It didn't exist before the Earth Cycle, which is kind of cool. It means new powers come from the powers around them gaining experience, the entities whole evolutionary history is more or less the skill tree of an RPG from their perspective.
Ardy
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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Zoat, we've established a few pages back that you don't know enough about worm to make a comment without starting a huge argument. It's 20x more complicated than every verse you've written about so far, and reading fics are the opposite of helping you understand it.
Zig
Not too sore, are you?
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Powers are independent of the entities to various degrees but in general, the entities place restrictions and directives on them and then send them out afterwards. At that point they become independent and have can choose to work with or against their host. Contessa's power in particular, actually comes from a third entity which explicitly wanted Eden (and probably Scion too) dead. Now, Contessa and Dr. Mother had no way of knowing that, so yeah don't know why they trusted the power so thoroughly.
Mr Zoat
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I don't remember. Did he?
AverusBlack
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It was Bane and Sportsmaster he killed with the Sword of the Fallen, not Savage.