Amelia, Worm AU [Complete]

[EnderofWorlds]

I am 100% sure that's incorrect. Taylor triggered twice in the locker, one right after the first. That's not possible if second triggers are repurposed buds; QA wouldn't have generated any buds at all in the short period of time between the first and second trigger. Second triggers are the passenger removing restrictions, such as arbitrary Manton Limits, or allowing the host access to more of the passenger's powers, such as Grue gaining power-copying or Lisa gaining post-cognition. A host-second triggering does not "consume" a bud, so Lisa second-triggering does not prevent Victoria's new power from being a bud of Inference Engine.

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Generally the trigger cause fits in the same general category. Brian had his second trigger for much the same reason he had his first. They can differ in nature. What's happening is that the entity is drawing from context and exploring/conceptualizing new uses for the powers (which are still in the metaphorical computer's memory, but not in the hardware that burned out in the trigger process). The entity begins splitting off, ready to find a generally young & similar host to target (piggybacking off the parent's context & experience for an easier triggering process/analysis) but then a major event prompts it to catalyze and consolidate in the current host instead.

If it's in an adult before finding its way to the child, it can begin this splitting-off process (generally requiring time or a degree of stress to allow for the maturation).

They are exceedingly rare (two noted in-story. Taylor didn't second-trigger in the last arc, to be clear), and generally speaking they do more harm than good. If it's a straight power-up, you're probably doing it wrong.

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A second trigger is basically the shard pulling whatever spare information it can and pumping it into a mod for itself instead of a bud of a new power like it normally is supposed to. Despite this seeming contradicting canon with Taylor, it actually doesn't; we know that as a trigger event happens the shard burns out and locks away any other parts of itself not relevant to the resulting power the trigger event and the host parameters determines. A double trigger would basically be grabbing at some of that burned/locked out information due to the situation not changing; the trigger event still continuing despite the power being granted. Granted, this is just a theory formed from looking at various WoG and canon, but I personally feel that it's the most fitting.

 

[skychan]

Yeah, latino jackasses tend to feel insulted when you use racist slurs against latino people.

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Go watch Gran Turismo. Now then, watch the scene where he's teaching him how to be a man. Now, note how it is okay for friends to use slang and insults at one another, and how it is not okay for others to do so. That entire movie is an absolutely briliant display of racism in all its forms. It makes use of all of them at one point or another, from deep seated prejudice, through casual unthinking use, to the breaking of preconceptions.

Once you are done, then think about what you are posting and come back.

 

[dasstan]

I'm guessing some form of diagnostic vision, likely a ping/bud off of Amy. The glow...I'm not so sure of. However, if Vicky actually thought she was 'worthless' that self-loathing might mean a Changer power...

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This:

Dizzy spell brought on by... something... no long term risk.

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I looked around. Mom and Dad shook their heads. Mom's been overworking herself, I realized. Probably not sleeping much. Dad's in okay shape. Aunt Sarah... eww, I didn't need to know about that. I'd never be able to look her in the eyes again in my life.

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Reminded me a lot of this:

"I've heard a lot about you, too," the woman said with a less than healthy smile. Obvious smoker, I noted. Other drug use as well.

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My own tinker knowledge filled in the blanks. Approximately thirty years old, female, scars and damage from a number of injuries over the course of years. Bullet and knife wounds included. Two pregnancies, second ended in miscarriage or abortion.

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But you're probably right. It's far more likely that Amy's shard would latch on to Vicky. I can't really think of a time when Vicky and Riley have been close, unless you count the time when Riley was growing Vicky's body.

I am 100% sure that's incorrect. Taylor triggered twice in the locker, one right after the first. That's not possible if second triggers are repurposed buds; QA wouldn't have generated any buds at all in the short period of time between the first and second trigger. Second triggers are the passenger removing restrictions, such as arbitrary Manton Limits, or allowing the host access to more of the passenger's powers, such as Grue gaining power-copying or Lisa gaining post-cognition. A host-second triggering does not "consume" a bud, so Lisa second-triggering does not prevent Victoria's new power from being a bud of Inference Engine.

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No, pretty sure it's right. Second triggers eat the buds to remove restrictions. Taylor got a double trigger, which is a different kettle of fish.

Oh look, new messages. And they cover this. Neat.

An alternate explanation for double triggers is that the initial trigger is so stressful that it provides the shard with enough data to near instantly bud. This is supported by canon: Brandish trigger followed by Lady Photon getting her bud a few seconds/minutes later.

 

[SwiftRosenthal]

To be fair to Vicky, not only is she a teenager, but it's Worm: It would be easier to list the people who didn't use Wisdom as a dump stat.

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It's more that 'being a parahuman' and 'being an authority figure' grant characters such strong WIS penalties that only a few characters ever think to grind the stat back up to normal levels. (I firmly believe that this assumption should be on almost every fic writer's list of stuff-from-canon-to-throw-out, and TanaNari certainly has, but that's for a different thread.)

 

[GiftofLove]

I would be insanely amused if her shard, a bud from one of the people in the room, just realized 'oh shit, my human is right there!' then gave her a new set of powers because her problem is different now, and she's technically a new person.

Since she got the Aura last time, I somewhat wonder if she might get a version of it as a more main power. Then have her old ones as the secondary abilities.

 

[Izicata]

A second trigger is basically the shard pulling whatever spare information it can and pumping it into a mod for itself instead of a bud of a new power like it normally is supposed to. Despite this seeming contradicting canon with Taylor, it actually doesn't; we know that as a trigger event happens the shard burns out and locks away any other parts of itself not relevant to the resulting power the trigger event and the host parameters determines. A double trigger would basically be grabbing at some of that burned/locked out information due to the situation not changing; the trigger event still continuing despite the power being granted. Granted, this is just a theory formed from looking at various WoG and canon, but I personally feel that it's the most fitting.

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No, pretty sure it's right. Second triggers eat the buds to remove restrictions. Taylor got a double trigger, which is a different kettle of fish.

Oh look, new messages. And they cover this. Neat.

An alternate explanation for double triggers is that the initial trigger is so stressful that it provides the shard with enough data to near instantly bud. This is supported by canon: Brandish trigger followed by Lady Photon getting her bud a few seconds/minutes later.

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Taylor has had a second trigger event, by WoG, when discussing what happened to turn Skitter into Kephri. There's no evidence to suggest that "double triggers" are any different from regular second triggers, besides happening immediately after the first trigger.

[Taylor]'s not aiming for a second trigger event, but to emulate the effects of one. Since she's already had one, removing caps on her power, she's aiming to target any limits that are left.

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However, it does seem that shards bud through stress, not actual power usage, which is sort of weird. Why the entities care about hosts experiencing emotional turmoil, I don't know, but apparently it gives them more useful data than the hosts actually using their powers. For Taylor's second trigger to happen, QA would have to have budded in less than 3 hours, during which Taylor wasn't using her powers in any sort of purposeful way at all. Brandish's shard apparently budded in minutes, she was experiencing so much stress.

Which begs the question, if shards generate more data through humans being tortured than through humans using the shard's power, why didn't the Entities plan to turn Earth Bet into a literal Hell instead of planning to farm conflict?

 

[Deltawaves1]

If she got a bud off Lisa. Then lisaxvictoria OTP? they can share each others dirty little secrets while snuggling.

 

[evildice]

If she got a bud off Lisa. Then lisaxvictoria OTP? they can share each others dirty little secrets while staring at each other blankly, barely moving, every slight movement whispering their secrets to each other.

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Fix'd.

Yeah sounds romantic as hell, until they both get a splitting Thinker headache.

 

[dasstan]

Taylor has had a second trigger event, by WoG, when discussing what happened to turn Skitter into Kephri. There's no evidence to suggest that "double triggers" are any different from regular second triggers, besides happening immediately after the first trigger.

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Point conceded.

Which begs the question, if shards generate more data through humans being tortured than through humans using the shard's power, why didn't the Entities plan to turn Earth Bet into a literal Hell instead of planning to farm conflict?

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Well, the original plan, before Eden failed a perception check on an entire planet, was to keep the world in a constant state of war, so... maybe a certain kind of Hell would have been the result?

I have a pet theory that double triggers result in less powerful capes, though, so events that end up with double trigger capes also provide less useable data in the long run. Compare Taylor's quick triggers and the Carol/Sarah combo to a second trigger like Narwhal, who can make super sharp forcefields in people, has fought a variety of endbringers, and hunts S-Class threats for fun and profit; and Brian, who is "whoever is trapped in his darkness field" - 1 or 2.

Presumably the buds that Narwhal and Brian's shard cannibalized for their second trigger were much more mature, thus leading to the radical increase in power.

edit: We're going off topic at this point.

 

[Volkogluk]

Also, the inevitable second trigger as she proceeds to gain insight about Bonesaw, aboutTattletale, and about Amy's former crush.

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Oh, crap... This is going to suck balls...

 

[EnderofWorlds]

Taylor has had a second trigger event, by WoG, when discussing what happened to turn Skitter into Kephri. There's no evidence to suggest that "double triggers" are any different from regular second triggers, besides happening immediately after the first trigger.

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I was never debating that; I even said how a double trigger still fits the method of how a regular second trigger works, by accessing the software rendered unavailable due to the hardware burnout of the trigger event and adapting that for further power refinement as normal second trigger works. Shards 'burn out' everything irrelevant to the determined power it chooses to give to the host with the factors it has to work with, but obviously don't delete all the data and information associated to those parts; otherwise the whole cycle would be stupid and pointless as all fuck.

A shard sees a trigger event happening with it's potential host, so it burns out the necessary parts to form the connection fully and shuts out everything unnecessary to the power it's determined to both fit the situation the host is in along with the one that fits the host's personality best. In the Brandish/Lady Photon scenario, it's likely the shard bounced between the two of them on-and-off sorta like how QA moved from Danny to Taylor because the latter had more conflict potential. Then, when shit went down for the two sisters, the shard saw that both could produce interesting data after the first sister triggered and so it diverted a bud filled with some of the different potential powers it could grant to the other one.

In Taylor's situation, after she had her first trigger event; circumstances clearly didn't get better, the situation if anything probably devolved and got worse, and the problem that led to the trigger event wasn't solved. Faced with that, the QA shard probably dug into it's crippled, maimed formed and dug up whatever data it had available that could be patched onto the already determined powers and ran with it. It's a fair assumption that the patch was basically the multitasking, emotional shunting, and more in-depth minuate of Taylor's powers; which fits with the idea of QA digging through it's own capabilities to find a fix for the bug in the powers.

These shards have been doing their thing for a real long time; they more than likely have a lot of data in their memory, but it's usually locked out in order for them to gather new data from the latest cycle without earlier cycles' data contaminating the experiment. It makes sense that, in the absence of new information in the current cycle to work on, the shard pulls on whatever past data it has to work with that it can adapt for a quick-fix when necessary. Or when it thinks that it can gain more information from the cycle in doing so, without invalidating the purpose of the cycle to begin with.

This is all just speculation, of course. But frankly, given what we know of how entities function and how the cycle is supposed to work, it really fits.

 

[Spetz N9ne]

Amelia, Ch 185- Victoria

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Goddamnit, Tana. Just once, can I make a prediction without you turning around and immediately doing the exact opposite?

I thought Emma would be a natural trigger, you made her a Cauldron cape.
I thought Vicky would be a Cauldron cape, you made her a natural.
I thought the Endbringer would be Fenrir, you made it a Barghest instead.

Why must you steal away all of my joy!?

 

[Inverness]

Let us look at statistics. Usually only one of five people having potential to trigger do so. All kids from New Wave have powers. So it's 0,16% chance for 4 normal triggers at most. So second generation triggers can be proved statistically (and it was said in canon).

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You seem to be forgetting that the cycle was designed by Entities that can see the future. If they want a whole family to trigger or be capable of triggering then they can decide as much. Shard distribution is not random.

 

[dasstan]

I thought the Endbringer would be Fenrir, you made it a Barghest instead.

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Pretty sure its name is Deathmachine Fred.

 

[EnderofWorlds]

You seem to be forgetting that the cycle was designed by Entities that can see the future. If they want a whole family to trigger or be capable of triggering then they can decide as much. Shard distribution is not random.

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It kinda is actually, Scion noted how the intended host for QA (Danny) wasn't the person who actually ended up with the shard (Taylor). Granted, that's probably more because it's simply not worth micromanaging distribution via their rather costly precog powers, but that still means that the distribution does have some random factor in it.

 

[Nigel Burnelli Isaacs]

Uncle Niel was always my favorite.

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Shouldn't that be uncle Neil ?

Now very nice updates, I like how you showed us what is going in Victoria's head and how she copes(or does not)with her circumstances and how she sees her family. Also the interaction with Zach was nice, especially the bit where Victoria thinks about his birthday and all or how she is playing matchmaker in her head...Yet another member of the Pantheon that needs to get laid .(might not take that long in her case, well that depends on Zach of course but still)

The new power she has developped(well the aspect we were shown of said power) somehow reminds me a bit of Gallant and is a nice touch as here instead of influencing others by her power she gets to see how they feel(well it can be used to influence people by using this knowledge but still)

 

[dasstan]

The new power she has dvelopped(well the aspect we were shown of said power) somehow reminds me a bit of Gallant and is a nice touch as here instead of influencing others by her power she gets to see how they feel(well it can be used to influence people by using this knowledge but still)

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... I think we read two very different powers.

 

[GorgonEyed]

Goddamnit, Tana. Just once, can I make a prediction without you turning around and immediately doing the exact opposite?
Why must you steal away all of my joy!?

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If you didn't want him to drink your tears, why did you make them so delicious?

 

[Nigel Burnelli Isaacs]

... I think we read two very different powers.

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Well what I read is that she is able to see how the others feel physically, a health scan of sorts(more or less a version of what Amelia does when she touches someone) which allows her to deduce stuff, and by exploiting those informations she might be able to influence people, playing on their tiredness and such. As for why I compared it to Gallant is because she "sees"it the way Gallant saw emotions.(and because I wanted to make a reference to Gallant)

 

[Inverness]

It kinda is actually, Scion noted how the intended host for QA (Danny) wasn't the person who actually ended up with the shard (Taylor). Granted, that's probably more because it's simply not worth micromanaging distribution via their rather costly precog powers, but that still means that the distribution does have some random factor in it.

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I think it's more likely that Taylor got the power because Eden's death caused butterflies.

 

[Grell23]

To be fair to Vicky, not only is she a teenager, but it's Worm: It would be easier to list the people who didn't use Wisdom as a dump stat.

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Oh true enough I've used the insult in regards to other characters and it's not as if some of them don't wise up eventually.

On the other hand you've got folks like say Krouse. Yea pretty much the only development I look
forward to from him involves gardening.


G23

'Bone meal? oh yea it's great for the tomatoes."

 

[EnderofWorlds]

I think it's more likely that Taylor got the power because Eden's death caused butterflies.

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And yet all the parahumans in Eden's vision all got the exact same powers that they did in canon? I don't buy it, especially not when Wildbow gives another example of shard jumping when going into detail on how trigger events influence powers. The shards work with what they got, so when something better comes along they take it. No entity precog involved.

 

[Ichypa]

The smuggening! Oh, the smuggening!

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Smuggening is my new word for 2015.

Well, the original plan, before Eden failed a perception check on an entire planet, was to keep the world in a constant state of war, so... maybe a certain kind of Hell would have been the result?

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Wouldn't it be more like she failed her Reflex save?

 

[evildice]

Yeah I feel like the Entities use some crude precog to try to put their Shards near good hosts, but then the reality on the ground often doesn't match the Entity's precog vision so the Shard does whatever it must do in order to get a good host.

If the entire Cycle could be correctly and efficiently predicted, then there would be no need to actually go through with the Cycle. Their whole deal is that they need more information than they have. If their mission to gather more info is sane, then perfectly accurate predictions are inherently impossible.

 

[Inverness]

And yet all the parahumans in Eden's vision all got the exact same powers that they did in canon? I don't buy it, especially not when Wildbow gives another example of shard jumping when going into detail on how trigger events influence powers. The shards work with what they got, so when something better comes along they take it. No entity precog involved.

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I never suggested everyone got the powers that Eden intended, just that the cycle was designed and hosts chosen long beforehand, and people getting the right power for their situation happened in most cases. Eden is quite capable of planning for changes in the timeline too you know. Well, up to a point considering she got whacked by a little girl.

 

[TanaNari]

Hmm. Based on the flashback we can kinda see where her old emotion powers come from. Kind of a way to fight against her fathers depression.

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I really don't deserve the credit.

http://forums.spacebattles.com/thre...ssion-thread-40.311933/page-487#post-15894424

Other than the poster forgetting that Vicky is a *Shaker*, not a *Brute*... it was a wonderful inspiration for me to get into her head.

Did the chapter get away from you? Or do you just enjoy drawing it out?

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Yes.

Fun times. Also, digging the Victoriach vibe. It's nice to read a version of her that jokes around and has more personality type than "Cheerleader Smash!"

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Needs a better name. And, hey, anyone who was taking college classes in highschool is of at least reasonable intelligence. I like to think Victoria does an awful lot of overcompensating.

Now I'm wondering what Dinah's trigger event was. Did canon cover that?

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Something to do with a relative's (seems to probably be implied to be her father's) long term health issues.

EDIT: Oh look, a chapter. So it's a thinker power? Anyway, this was a trigger event right in front of her whole family.

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Pity they won't remember.

Could be a thinker expression of Riley's shard. Her inference powers seem to be focused on the body/health.

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Could be.

I'm guessing some form of diagnostic vision, likely a ping/bud off of Amy. The glow...I'm not so sure of. However, if Vicky actually thought she was 'worthless' that self-loathing might mean a Changer power...

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Could also be.

*squints* did she get a bud off Lisa?

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Could ALSO also be.

Also, the inevitable second trigger as she proceeds to gain insight about Bonesaw, aboutTattletale, and about Amy's former crush.

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And Victoria Dallon goes down in the record books as the only known Fourth Trigger. She immediately walks up to Scion and rips out his soul. I know they don't exist in the setting- but now they do- that is how hard she Triggered.

I would be insanely amused if her shard, a bud from one of the people in the room, just realized 'oh shit, my human is right there!' then gave her a new set of powers because her problem is different now, and she's technically a new person.

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Considering Victoria got her shard from her uncle? I would be impressed.

I mean... I don't *know* what they did with his body, but I'd be awful surprised to learn Carol kept it in her living room.

Goddamnit, Tana. Just once, can I make a prediction without you turning around and immediately doing the exact opposite?

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Get better at guessing.

And yet all the parahumans in Eden's vision all got the exact same powers that they did in canon?

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Keep in mind, however, that all the parahumans that Eden saw were old. Amongst the first handful to come into the scene. So their powers would be the same, because they got them before timelines started to diverge.

 

[powerofvoid]

Other than the poster forgetting that Vicky is a *Shaker*, not a *Brute*...

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She's both.

And a Mover and a Master too.

 

[EnderofWorlds]

Keep in mind, however, that all the parahumans that Eden saw were old. Amongst the first handful to come into the scene. So their powers would be the same, because they got them before timelines started to diverge.

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But Eden died before even Scion appeared IIRC, meaning that none of those people triggered before Eden died since Scion is the first parahuman to the public eye.

Yeah I feel like the Entities use some crude precog to try to put their Shards near good hosts, but then the reality on the ground often doesn't match the Entity's precog vision so the Shard does whatever it must do in order to get a good host.

If the entire Cycle could be correctly and efficiently predicted, then there would be no need to actually go through with the Cycle. Their whole deal is that they need more information than they have. If their mission to gather more info is sane, then perfectly accurate predictions are inherently impossible.

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Basically this, when Wildbow was asked about precog and why the entities didn't just use that to model everything, the answer was that it was to power intensive and costed way too much energy to be viable. Going by that logic, that means that choosing hosts is done with broad strokes and the shards themselves carry out the rest of the details.

 

[Pyro Hawk]

I suspect that Victoria still had her pollentia, or whatever the part that means a Shard has connected, but not triggered yet... It's just her circumstances meant for some reason that she didn't get the gemma as well...

So now, she's effectively retriggered from the same shard/bud but with new powers, pinging of new powers and more...

I think the way the pinging works is it pings off nearby parahumans, but it also pings of parahumans that have direct influence in that persons life... this allows for the influence Lisa/Amy/Taylor/etc might have, whilst also mainly relying on those nearby to direct the power's formation...

 

[dasstan]

Needs a better name.

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Zachoria? Glory-O's? Ship Name: I Got Better?