1. Due to issues with external spam filters, QQ is currently unable to send any mail to Microsoft E-mail addresses. This includes any account at live.com, hotmail.com or msn.com. Signing up to the forum with one of these addresses will result in your verification E-mail never arriving. For best results, please use a different E-mail provider for your QQ address.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. For prospective new members, a word of warning: don't use common names like Dennis, Simon, or Kenny if you decide to create an account. Spammers have used them all before you and gotten those names flagged in the anti-spam databases. Your account registration will be rejected because of it.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Since it has happened MULTIPLE times now, I want to be very clear about this. You do not get to abandon an account and create a new one. You do not get to pass an account to someone else and create a new one. If you do so anyway, you will be banned for creating sockpuppets.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. If you wish to change your username, please ask via conversation to tehelgee instead of asking via my profile. I'd like to not clutter it up with such requests.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Due to the actions of particularly persistent spammers and trolls, we will be banning disposable email addresses from today onward.
    Dismiss Notice
  6. A note about the current Ukraine situation: Discussion of it is still prohibited as per Rule 8
    Dismiss Notice
  7. The rules regarding NSFW links have been updated. See here for details.
    Dismiss Notice
  8. The testbed for the QQ XF2 transition is now publicly available. Please see more information here.
    Dismiss Notice

Coronavirus COVID-19 Pandemic

Discussion in 'General' started by Biigoh, Mar 16, 2020.

Loading...
  1. mishie

    mishie Experienced.

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    2,716
    Likes Received:
    4,308
    See here's the core issue right. You're saying that we cannot make any assumptions about the future of covid whatsoever because we have so few cases that are exactly as lomg as you want. The thing that you're kinda ignoring is the fact that pneumonia isn't exactly a new thing, doctors and scientists have been studying all the weird and wonderful ways in which the human body, and lungs in particular can get fucked up, so even though the data for the long term effects of Covid19 is limited, there's an incredible amount known about how lungs work, how they recover after infection, and the different ways they can be damaged and how that effects tbat patient long term.

    So yes, it is very much so reasonable to discus the long term effects in general of Covid19 at this stage, because unless it suddenly mutates and acts very differently, it is hilariously simple to assess a patients lungs via a routine chest xray, or if you're feeling fancy a HRCT chest, and to then use that information to plan ahead.
     
  2. OverMaster

    OverMaster Well worn.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,674
    Likes Received:
    27,679
    This isn't like any old pneumonia so your whole point is moot.

    This is like profiling a serial killer based on a prior pocket-picker who just happened to operate in the same general area before.
     
  3. mishie

    mishie Experienced.

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    2,716
    Likes Received:
    4,308
    Here's the thing right, you're kinda making it very clear that you have absolutely no medical knowledge or experience outside of what you've seen on wikipedia or the news. And as such all the shit you're saying is basically just completely useless opinions.

    But if you actually knew anything at all about how this shit works, you might be aware of the fact that diseases don't just do random shit and have totally unpredictable effects on the human body. Hell, almost every single factor of the response to Covid19 was built upon previous knowledge, because we know how these types of diseases effect the lungs in general, thus allowing medical professionals who have training beyond looking up random news articles to make predictions based on the evidence that they have.

    And right now the evidence that they have to work with is countless imaging studies and biopsies of both current and recovered patients of Covid19, as well as about a centuries worth of comparison studies from other diseases that target the lungs.

    So yes, it is in fact possible to predict the long term effects of Covid19.
     
  4. Xicree

    Xicree Destroy and Rejoice!

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2013
    Messages:
    22,312
    Likes Received:
    56,277
    Literally THIS.

    The main thing is that while we can't predict ALL of the long-term effects of Covid 19... we know more than enough about how diseases which affect the lungs work to understand those Specific long term effects.

    ... this really isn't that mysterious.
     
  5. OverMaster

    OverMaster Well worn.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,674
    Likes Received:
    27,679
    I bow to your superior medical knowledge, Dr. House.

    Edit: "Countless", though? Fucking really? 'Countless'? Of the current virus? Please. We are just starting with this shit.
     
  6. mishie

    mishie Experienced.

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    2,716
    Likes Received:
    4,308
    Oh in that case, please point me towards a study done which shows a nice count up of every single investigation into a confirmed positive Covid19 patient. Because I really don't think you understand how fucking routine some of those are. Because I'd feel pretty confident in saying that almost every single patient that went to a hospital that was even SUSPECTED of having Covid19 got at the very least a chest xray, because holy fuck do doctors just love requesting those instead of having to think for themselves, and that's only a single type of investigation that will show a hell of a lot of information about lung condition.
     
  7. Cmdr_Anax

    Cmdr_Anax Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2015
    Messages:
    451
    Likes Received:
    221
    so regarding the damage covid-19 can do... and the data we have right now... medical researchers are speaking more and more of a "multi-organ-virus"

    attacks the hormonal system:
    https://academic.oup.com/jes/article/doi/10.1210/jendso/bvaa082/5863314

    is especially dangerous if you are diabetic, but can also cause diabetes in young ppl:
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32339533/

    attacks kidneys(study with 5500 covid patients):
    https://www.kidney-international.org/article/S0085-2538(20)30532-9/pdf

    can cause inflammatory syndrome in young children/adults:
    https://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMe2023158?articleTools=true

    can attack the brain(stroke):
    https://media.jamanetwork.com/news-...tients-with-covid-19-compared-with-influenza/

    can wander through the nerves of the nose into the brain:
    https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaotolaryngology/article-abstract/2767781
    which can also damage your sense of smell and taste

    most of this info is lifted from an article here:
    https://www.faz.net/aktuell/gesells...chen-narben-der-corona-pandemie-16843184.html

    it's in german... good concise writeup though
     
  8. OverMaster

    OverMaster Well worn.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,674
    Likes Received:
    27,679
    Then there's no salvation.
     
  9. TotalAbsolutism

    TotalAbsolutism Magnificent Bastard Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2014
    Messages:
    3,653
    Likes Received:
    36,338
    Would you just fucking stop with the doomer shite?
     
  10. MadGreenSon

    MadGreenSon Verified Devil Tiger, The Childish Yandere

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2014
    Messages:
    38,837
    Likes Received:
    437,315
  11. bryanfran36

    bryanfran36 Experienced.

    Joined:
    May 10, 2015
    Messages:
    3,045
    Likes Received:
    21,724
    You know, I thought that the things you see in a Marvel/DC comics were the stuff of writers getting their edge and political boners.

    Or that some of the farfetched ideas and concepts were just that, farfetched ideas and concepts.

    Looking at the six months of 2020, I feel like fiction was playing catch-up to the present reality which is unreal at the moment.
     
  12. LurkingInTheDeceit

    LurkingInTheDeceit “Brave” explorer treading “New” land

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2019
    Messages:
    3,028
    Likes Received:
    11,181
  13. OverReactionGuy

    OverReactionGuy The only Sane one left

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2014
    Messages:
    25,287
    Likes Received:
    150,505
    Kinda looks like my area beat the curve by actually staying home for like a month so far. Was bright at first but went to low purple at the end.

    That's good news.
     
    Xicree and Vorian like this.
  14. G4R5vb5r3H

    G4R5vb5r3H Bellicose and Armed. (With bad literature.)

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2019
    Messages:
    789
    Likes Received:
    12,445
    So, according to local rumor, a nurse - of the 'care for old people sort' - just returned from Austria where she works/worked on the down low and decided to slip home despite being tested positively, and now over half the population of my hometown (and current residence) are lambasting the mayor for letting such an atrocity happen. Because of a single, unconfirmed case. They're criticising a person who had no knowledge of the event, nor any power to alter it.

    At risk of sounding like an infectee: *WHEEZE*

    In other news, I have started eating fried human skin - don't worry, it's my own - and have broken my daily *cough*self-gratification*cough* record at 39 times a day, so I'm handling it reasonably well, while also discovering why people bought so much toilet paper.
     
  15. litaispe

    litaispe -

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2018
    Messages:
    912
    Likes Received:
    6,270
    There is a lot of uncertainty of how Covid-19 does things, but the health consequences are relatively straight forward (and how it affects individuals can be complex). What they are is horrifying.

    One of the more troubling consequences is Covid-19 victims suffer from reduced oxygen absorption while retaining CO2 exhaling functionality. This is the "happy hypoxia" which is reasonably well documented now.

    These low blood-oxygen levels, that if left untreated, results in systematic organ damage. Not to mention it appears to be clotting related so strokes in young apparently health individuals has been recorded.

    Yes, not everyone is affected. Not everyone is impacted to a noticeable extent. But at the same time you can measure a 20% swing in violent crime before/after leaded fuel was introduced and abandoned with a ~26 year lead-time. We will be living with the consequences no matter how well or poorly it goes.

    A vaccine can't come soon enough, or the 'new normal' of vastly reduced travel will be here to stay.

    Viral pneumonia is generally nasty stuff. +6 month recovery times are not uncommon.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  16. OverMaster

    OverMaster Well worn.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,674
    Likes Received:
    27,679
    Ayyyyyy, now Bolsonaro has it.
     
  17. Valikdu

    Valikdu Not too sore, are you?

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2020
    Messages:
    282
    Likes Received:
    2,242
    Comic Con Russia 2021 (would have been at Oct 1-4) is off.

    /play Limp_Bizkit_Break_Stuff.mp3
     
  18. Aleh

    Aleh Destroyer of Faith in Humanity

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2014
    Messages:
    5,619
    Likes Received:
    42,431
    There's some evidence (from autopsies) that this may be related to blood clots -- lots of little blood clots.

    If that hypothesis is true, that would basically mean that people are dealing with rapid-fire mini-strokes, only throughout their bodies. Fun, isn't it?

    And then there's the possibility of COVID acting like, say, chicken pox and pulling a shingles on us... in our brains.
     
    Dakkaface, daimahou and me-meboi like this.
  19. alethiophile

    alethiophile Shadowed Philosopher Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2013
    Messages:
    7,569
    Likes Received:
    52,859
    It's worth keeping in mind, re: long term consequences, that the highly visible anecdotes of people with multi-month recovery times are still low-probability events. The majority of people who catch it are still asymptomatic or have non-life-threatening illness that resolves over several weeks. (At least, going off the information we have so far, which is still too limited to make high-certainty assertions.)

    It's a bad disease by modern standards, but one shouldn't lose perspective.
     
    Vaermina, Imabot and TanaNari like this.
  20. litaispe

    litaispe -

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2018
    Messages:
    912
    Likes Received:
    6,270
    With Covid-19, what most people call "asymptomatic" isn't really the medical definition of an asymptomatic carrier. Even for supposedly mild cases, there is clinical reduction in lung function which has a detectable change in quality of life. People might be discharged after weeks, but full recovery can take significantly longer

    No (obvious) symptoms, no problems is a profoundly dangerous way to look at a disease.
     
    xThomas3 likes this.
  21. ForestDweller

    ForestDweller Versed in the lewd.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2020
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    15,914


    Wow, this is scary.
     
    evildice likes this.
  22. evildice

    evildice (emotionally stable clown posse)

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2015
    Messages:
    18,385
    Likes Received:
    295,606
    We're going to see a lot more like him in the USA, unfortunately, and for pretty much the same reasons.

    Except they won't be receiving care in Serbia, so they'll be half-dead and also bankrupt if they survive.
     
    me-meboi likes this.
  23. Ragnarok

    Ragnarok Well worn.

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2013
    Messages:
    7,592
    Likes Received:
    61,168
  24. ATP

    ATP Experienced.

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2020
    Messages:
    3,781
    Likes Received:
    6,579
    I live in Poland.Our goverment stop almost everything for a few weeks,and even now people still must do not made some things, but ,as a result,till now in 2020 died less people then in the same time in 2019.So,at least in Poland, Corona is not that dangerous,just some kind of worst flu.
    P.S Sweden did practically nothing - and they are doing fine,too.
     
  25. evildice

    evildice (emotionally stable clown posse)

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2015
    Messages:
    18,385
    Likes Received:
    295,606
    They weren't doing fine a few weeks ago.

    What changed? How did they recover?
     
  26. LurkingInTheDeceit

    LurkingInTheDeceit “Brave” explorer treading “New” land

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2019
    Messages:
    3,028
    Likes Received:
    11,181
    Genie *sage nod*
     
  27. mishie

    mishie Experienced.

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    2,716
    Likes Received:
    4,308
    Yknow it's funny when people bring up Sweden they never mention the part about how they did actually shut things down as well, but generally relied on a culture of responsibility to allow people to choose how much to distance for their own safety.

    And then they ended up with something like double the cases and deaths compared to surrounding countries who did go into lockdown. And to really rub it in, they ended up with the same economic impact because yeah no shit people aren't going out even if they're allowed to because they don't want to kill granny.

    Meanwhile in Australia, thanks to the fact that we shut down early and actually did it properly instead of bitching about it, almost all states are sitting at 0 new cases a day, with the major outlier being Victoria, which has been having huge spikes lately in their second wave of an entire 300 cases per day. Luckily thanks to the time given to prepare, we have extensive contract tracing in place, so instead of having to shut down the entire country or state, we have it narrowed down to a city/suburb level, and even to the point of specific buildings.

    So what that means for me, is that right now the state that I'm in is in the final stages of reopening. So that means in the past week I've been able to travel to different cities to visit family, gone out to restaurants on dates, go to the gym, and basically just be back to normal.

    Which is all kind of a shame, because I kind of miss how nice and peaceful things were back in the days of covid lockdown, it made for some really cruise workdays.
     
  28. Aleh

    Aleh Destroyer of Faith in Humanity

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2014
    Messages:
    5,619
    Likes Received:
    42,431
    I'm honestly surprised it's not New South Wales. The less said about some of the crap I've heard out of Northern Rivers, the better.
     
    NoFunposter and mishie like this.
  29. NoFunposter

    NoFunposter Can't sleep, Salt will eat me.

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2016
    Messages:
    8,337
    Likes Received:
    75,963
    Yeah, turns out that the security Victoria had on the quarantine hotels were literally the cheapest possible option and that they used fresh, untrained recruits to save money.

    Apparently the security industry has a huge problem with doing this sort of thing, but people are only just giving it the attention now that things have been bungled so catastrophically.

    I'm getting the feeling that our initial success has left many a bit overconfident.
     
  30. Aleh

    Aleh Destroyer of Faith in Humanity

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2014
    Messages:
    5,619
    Likes Received:
    42,431
    Aaaaand my appointment got nixed again, this time due to insurance issues. As in, they no longer take it. This followed quite a bit of miscommunication, leading to me needing to drive an hour to a hospital, dodge people on my way to the penthouse office my (former) cardiologist is in, and then find out that they'd cancelled my appointment and given it to someone else after two months of me trying to get in (yes, there were phone calls involved -- I expected to have to pay out of network fees; they didn't take my insurance even then, and I had to leave to avoid possible other problems), and I still haven't had so much as an EKG.

    Walking into a hospital building during this, however, was eerie as fuck. I avoided the ER, but pretty much everything had been diverted there. The place is usually pretty bustling, but now...
     
    me-meboi likes this.
Loading...