Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

Venerable Ro · Monday at 8:03 AM

des-pair-2 said:
I just noticed the name of the expedition.

I have a peculiar feeling that the book will be connected to the sister alicorns. Just to make us feel bad never learning what is in it if we give it away.

Well that should be a given. All level 6 books will have important information, to say nothing of teaching useful little skills. This whole business wouldn't mean anything if it weren't a sacrifice.

Pittauro · Monday at 9:33 AM

OurLadyOfWires said:
They do not know the concept of war. They do not accept the idea of famine. And even the most vicious among their numbers is relatively tame, when compared to what a sapient being is capable of.

true, but I'll say that accepting the idea of famine when a full third of the population has supernatural abilities related to farming...

but yeah, even the very worst ponies are not really THAT bad when compared to other races (or humans, really). Even Starlight Glimmer in her "equality" phase can't be compared to ACTUAL dictators and tyrants. She didn't even kill anyone!

when ponies go evil, they mostly ruin things out of ignorance. See Starlight and her time travel shenanigans. I suppose the very worst we ever see is Cozy Glow.

OurLadyOfWires said:
Very few creatures know about this. And fewer less creatures remember it. But ponykind has a rich story. And they are a species that has a convoluted past. A tempestuous past.

A bellicose past.

that's also true. Ponies were, I suppose, domesticated by their princesses in a way.

I imagine this is about EDGE Velvet meeting Edge Comet?

OurLadyOfWires said:
Today, a pony is marching to war.

eh, war might be a bit much.

unless Comet is actually attacking us? That would count.

OurLadyOfWires said:
Ponies might try to pretend that is not the case. They might try to argue that their great civilization has reached its current point thanks to cooperation and camaraderie. But ultimately, even the most vocal of scholars knows (even if only in the privacy of their thoughts) that it is the Princesses who guarantee the continuity of Equestria.

Controlling the Sun is a hell of a power move, yeah.

OurLadyOfWires said:
She makes her way towards the bridge, and she stops at the farthest edge of the timid construction. Because the two ponies understand the meaning of that small, wood-wrought passage.

Both of them know that, if either of them moves to cross that bridge, they will do so in order to kill each other.

it should NOT come to that, hopefully.

OurLadyOfWires said:
"Velvet Covers."

"Comet Feet."
"Have you come here to fight me?"

"I have come here to talk."
"Is there a difference?"

"No."

well... at least they're speaking the same language?

OurLadyOfWires said:
The stallion is covered in a rousing air. In preparation for this day.

Tier 2 influence. That means that, IF IT COMES TO A FIGHT, we have only a +10 over him... but he also likely prepared some AotL, which means he likely would have more than us for the first few rolls, and after that he STILL has 4 health to our 2.

In other words, we might STILL very well lose a fight.

OurLadyOfWires said:
"The Master is dead."

First point to Velvet! this must hit hard!

OurLadyOfWires said:
"I am here to ensure your piece falls in the correct place."

our place?

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] "I see you my enemy."
-Velvet Covers will use this opportunity to attempt to attain her personal Edge Sacrament.
-Velvet Covers and Comet Feet will fight to the death, without interruption.
-If she succeeds, Velvet Covers will do her best to hide this from Fluttershy. But it is impossible to guarantee she will not find out.

no.

just no.

I very much did NOT come here to do this, It's not an option for me.

I think we ALL fully understand why Comet did what he did, and I actually somewhat respect it. What else could he have done?

but now there's no more reasons for him to stand AGAINST us. He wants to keep Fluttershy safe, and as long as we don't threaten that goal cooperation IS possible.

Also as a side note we COULD lose. We have a higher bonus (+10 over him I think), but he has 4 health to our 2, and presumably more AotL ready.

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] Assassination.
-Biedde is here… somewhere. Give him the signal.
-Biedde will engage in combat with Comet Feet. Comet Feet is not expected to survive.
-Velvet Covers will do her best to hide this from Fluttershy. But it is impossible to guarantee she will not find out.

same as above, except it's less risky but also less rewarding.

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] Conscription.
-Velvet Covers will bring Comet Feet into her service.
-Comet Feet will become a separate Confidante from Fluttershy, and he will be forced to accept any orders that he is given. As long as they do not harm Fluttershy, and as long as they are not clearly suicidal.
-This arrangement will continue as long as ONE of the following is in effect:
--(1) as long as Biedde remains summoned; or
--(2) as long as Velvet Covers is under the effect of "A Resolution" Edge Influence.
-Comet Feet will do his best to hide this arrangement from Fluttershy.
-Should Comet Feet "break free" by any means, he will immediately become an enemy. If that ever happens, it is impossible to know if he would attack you immediately, or if he would disappear to plan a more careful revenge. You also cannot predict what Fluttershy would do.

We hopefully will NEVER lose control of Biedde, but it COULD happen. Say we fight Daybreaker or Sombra and Biedde "dies". We then need multiple turns before we can resummon him.

Also it's still too antagonistic for my taste.

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] Status Quo.
-Nothing will change. And the next time you have this conversation, it might not be just with words.
-Your relationship with Comet Feet will remain the same. There will be no limitations on what you may ask Fluttershy to do, but some of your actions/requests towards her will steadily increase his ire.

This feels pointless. Nothing changes, then why did we even come here?

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] Negotiation.
-Velvet Covers and Comet Feet will engage in combat. Until one of them falls down to one health point.
-The winner will impose their terms upon the loser, and the loser will accept them.

...I kinda like this, but then again we only have 2 health and he has 4. We're the most likely to LOSE here, as he just need to do us one damage while we need to do 3.

Ironically we're more likely to win a fight to the death than a fight to first blood.

OurLadyOfWires said:
[] Compromise.
-Velvet Covers and Comet Feet will reach an agreement.
-Velvet Covers will be prohibited from teaching anything about the Lores to Fluttershy. It will no longer be acceptable to level Fluttershy up, ask her to perform rituals, or do other Lore-related actions.
-Comet Feet will no longer grow his hatred towards you every time you ask him for a favor.
-Comet Feet and Fluttershy will remain a "single" Confidante, together. But rather than having to "ask Comet for a favor", he will take over Fluttershy's actions and perform them, if he is better suited for it. (Asking Fluttershy to go on an Expedition, or perform a ritual, will have Comet Feet to do it instead, for example).

Question: What if it is FLUTTERSHY that asks us? I mean, she's already Winter 1, what if she WANTS to learn more? And I don't mean "we tease her about it", I mean literally if she asks us after a while of us not offering, are we supposed to tell her no AND keep it secret that it's Copper that forbade us?

That said I'm... actually fine with this?

I suppose he MIGHT change his mind about Fluttershy learning the lores eventually, but even if he doesn't, Comet is just more valuable to us than Fluttershy, and being able to ask things of him without having to worry about him getting too angry would be nice.

Stormchaser changed his mind about "ritual on Selene", so it's not out of the question Stormchaser might change his mind about Winter lessons. But I imagine it would have to come out of a conversation between him and Fluttershy, and we'd have to NOT be the one to trigger it...

angelsadvocate666 said:
Well, pretty much all the violent options are terrible, and Conscription… could work, since we would be stupid to ever let Biedde go, but it's also a really shitty thing to do to our friend's boyfriend. Status Quo is entirely possible but also kind of meh, and compromise… did we even want Fluttershy to learn more Lore stuff anyways?

it's also still really risky.

if Biedde is EVER lost, be it from combat, triggering expedition traps, or anything else, than we immediately gain a dangerous enemy. and if Velvet is vulnerable it would be in his best interest to attack us immediately before we can resummon him.

I DID want to teach her more winter, but it's not a big loss. Right now she's kinda useless for lore stuff, she MIGHT have become more useful later, but...

well, we'd never want to ask her to perform EiB for us I think, she's too kind for that, same for summoning Windigoes. We don't know what her Realization would be about, but Comet is still far more valuable anyway.

Greymere said:
So just for first impressions... I'm perfectly fine w/ this option, tbh? Winter is, unfortunately, not really used for any rituals besides EiB, and we wouldn't want to be risking Fluttershy by sending her on expeditions in the first place. Having an Edge 4 Confidant with 4 Health, otoh, lends itself very well to sending on expeditions or if we need more muscle (or just muscle in more than one spot). If we eventually get a high enough level Heart artifact, we could even ask Comet to do IotHs

Also you know, we could still eventually make him Edge 5 and/or develop his secondary lore. Comet has just more potential than Fluttershy in lore terms.

Also we're not forbidden from asking Fluttershy favors, just from them being eldritch ones. which... I mean, thus far we asked her to clean Jade's house, and to learn winter? I think that's it.

angelsadvocate666 said:
Guys, no, Negotiation is a terrible idea. Even if all of our friends wouldn't be really pissed about it, we can't really afford to even risk an injury when we're about to go on a Mansus expedition.

He's got +58 minimum for every roll. +79 for however many AotLs he has. That is not very overwhelmed by our +69/+90, and he has two more health. We would have to hurt him three times before he hurts us once. The math does not add up.

yep, very much this (though I think it's +59).

his base combat is +39, from the "I see you my enemy" update. add +20 (or maybe +21) from AotL on an unknown number of rolls (I'm assuming as many as he had against Shining at least, which was... 2), and then +20 from his influence.

We have an advantage once we're both out of AotLs, but not when they're both up or we're down and he's up.

MAYBE we could risk it if we had already removed the scar... but even then, we'd have to hurt him 3 times to his 2. Still risky, but at least doable.

We also don't know what his terms would be if we lost. I imagine something like "never talk to Fluttershy again".

Venerable Ro said:
Well it looks like it's going to have to be Compromise then, everything else is various shades of suicide, ruining Fluttershy's life, or procrastination. Not to mention the option that is just begging for The Lionsmith to stick his oar in.

Shame about Negotiation, with just one more wound on us it'd be a lot more palatable but we're just too delicate and not quite adept enough to try for the no-hit.

True. If we had that extra health point I'd actually be willing to consider it.

I suppose there IS an argument for Status Quo: we could come back in a few turns, after we're Edge 5 and Health 3.

THEN we'd have the advantage in a "Negotiation".

DelightedOne said:
Fuck no. What the fuck, we are not playing the Colonel's game and that is not even mentioning the need to keep Biedde all the time(or else) and there is also the issue of making him our slave(yes, that is what he would be, Biedde being involved makes it clear it will be the same situation he is in with the Colonel)

worse even. Biedde might not even be against his own situation, he doesn't seem to hate it at least. Comet definitely WOULD.

DelightedOne said:
We did not use a whole action to just let things rot.

Status Quo makes sense if we wanted to do more prep. Go to Health 3 Edge 5 and we COULD have a better shot next time... I still don't like it much, but it's theoretically doable.

Greymere said:
If you, for some reason, want to choose status quo, then yeah I guess. But there is no real reason for us to pick status quo when compromise is right there and is... basically an objective upgrade to the current relationship. Because let's be honest, we weren't going to really be doing anything Lore-related w/ Fluttershy anyway. The only reason we ever befriended her was to keep Comet off the "Enemies" list, and compromise gets us Comet actions without building resentment.

Status Quo is an option if Velvet comes back to "negotiate" once she's Edge 5 health 3. Probably not worth it though.

jason1stlegion said:
We're not winning this. We have 2 health to his 4, he only needs to win one round to defeat us.

well, to accumulate 50 more than us in roll clashes, but yeah, it's near certain loss as we are right now.

Sveta08 said:
Hmm.
There are several options, but reading people and how things have run before... There are only two options.

Negotiation and Compromise.

wrong. Negotiation is near certain loss, so honestly it would be better read as "giving in to his terms". We're just THAT unlikely to win.

There's only two real options: Compromise, and Status Quo (assuming we're willing to come back once we're at Health 3 Edge 5, at which point we WOULD likely win a negotiation).

Venerable Ro said:
This would mean that Comet asks us to cut Fluttershy out of all of our eldritch dealings. No tutoring, no expeditions, no rituals, no mucking about with odd artifacts or what have you. Mundane social stuff like helping us with our paperwork is fine, but nothing occult.

Admittedly we haven't been doing anything like that anyway, so it's not that much of a loss, but it still limits her endgame potential. Not to mention the hypothetical wrinkle of her disagreeing with Comet making such a decision for her. But that's what having Cadance on speed dial is for, no?

If Fluttershy stands up to him, that's not on us... probably.

Comet might not see it that way, but not much we can do about it except trying not to provoke such a conflict.

as of right now FLuttershy is the kind of person we'd likely keep on "Cover your bases" duty, so we're really not losing anything...

posting this, catching up to the rest in a bit...

Pittauro · Monday at 10:05 AM

DelightedOne said:
Did anyone else catch this:

I feel like we focused so much on Comet and Velvet's "fight" that we missed this.

The sun has changed... THE SUN HAS CHANGED.

It is not the one of the past, so it must be a new one. So Harmony really is a new sun...

If we go with the "Forge and SiS" became Harmony theory it makes sense if the Solar Hours also became part of the Sun-in-Splendor that explains why there are two Alicorns for the sun and the moon(because the Meniscate is the moon and the sun's night-self).

It also fits the 5 come together to form 1 whole that Harmony has:
Honesty, Loyalty, Kindness, Generosity and Laughter allow Magic to exist.

The Sun-in-Splendour, The Forge of Days, The Madrugad, The Sun-in-Rags and The Meniscate allowed Harmony to be made.

well, duh. It's not new.

Sun in Splendour is, presumably, dead, or maaaaaybe behind the Tricuspid.

Sun-in-Rags is very much dead, and we know his resting place is in the Garden of Mirrors in the Blank Plains.

so yes, obviously the sun is "different". In the same way in which the sun under the sun-in-splendor's rule was presumably different from the Egg-Unhatching.

Jame said:
For sake of argument and nothing else, there is one thing to be said for negotiation, it is a very clean way to resolve things that won't end with anyone dead

so is Compromise, of course.

We just need to be aware that we can't "win" the negotiation. picking it is basically deciding we're going to lose, unless we get REALLY lucky. We're far more likely to lose the "Negotiation" there than winning it, so we should consider the option accordingly.

OurLadyOfWires said:
-30 bits have been removed from your inventory for Jade's ritual (and you had already given Jade the SH reagent prior to that.)
-Expedition added to expedition list.
-Personal Forge Sacrament added to your Sacraments list.

The Grave on the Hill

Location: There is a grave, somewhere on the northern plains of Equestria, where a particular item lies buried. The map you have shows you precisely where that grave is. The only problem is that the map is approximately seven hundred years out of date. You acquired this map in a dream, you see, and dreams do not follow the same rules of the Wake.

Expected duration: SHORT

Base cost: 5 bits (you must have at least 25 bits per creature sent)

Expected dangers: UNKNOWN (expedition not scouted)

Mareinette, Axe, maybe even Baldomare, could do this on their own. I expect finding the grave would include Lantern of SH challenges, the question is if there might be combat, possibly with wild animals. so sending Baldomare alone is probably a bad idea.

I suppose in order the best options for this expeditions would be, not counting the very busy Velvet

1)Biedde OR Selene + Baldomare
2)Axe
3)Mareinette

25 to 50 bits is definitely something we can afford. I don't think we need to scry more or be overly cautious.

FORGE
Actions of your own: "The next logical step is to make reagents that are capable of changing something else: that delicate and fragile engine that ponies refer to as their bodies. You never fancied yourself as a potion maker. But then again, you will not be making mere potions."
-Perform the action "Experiment, Craft, Create" until you finish its progress.
-The action "Experiment, Craft, Create" costs 50 bits to be performed each time you do it. You apply your Magic, Forge Level, and you may use any Forge Reagents you have at your disposal.
-This action requires you to reach a cumulative "progress" of 300 points, and may be repeated as many times as needed (though you will pay the cost in bits each time separately).
-Velvet Covers must have at least 2/4 scraps of Forge before she performs this action.

Interesting. presumably we'll have a chance of earning Forge Scraps from this, so once we're at 2/4 scraps we could get the last two from it I imagine. Or at least 1.

Magic: 12+1 (forge)
Forge: lvl 4, so +20 (or +40 if knowledge bonus)
Reagents: If we find some in expeditions that helps

and potentially we can use influences.

Assuming we don't get to use Forge Knowledge, this should be... 1d100+13+20 (+21 from another AotL?) = 1d100 +54 minimum if we're using AotL (or Knowledge bonus applies.

@OurLadyOfWires can you tell us if it uses Forge Knowledge or Application bonus? Also if influence would apply, I imagine it does.

This should be on average 3 rolls, basically. Maybe less if we got a Forge Influence.

we probably can't afford it for now, as we need to keep the bits for expeditions, Biedde Maintenance and maybe even Mares-in-the-Light summoning. But later on it's doable.

Sacrament Power... if we're making potions, maybe it's the ability to make potions that grant the reagent bonus to non-ritual actions? Like an Edge 4 potion giving +40 to an edge roll, for example, no matter what it's about. That's a fairly useful power, if likely an expensive one.

OurLadyOfWires said:
-One charge of Edge Attention of the Laws (henceforth "AotL") lasts for one "turn". So, it will apply to two dice rolls of a character, and then it is over.

Oh. I didn't know that.

So Comet only had one AotL when he went to fight Shining? Weird he didn't prepare more.

Shaper47 said:
A shame, but all this talk of hatred brewing in his heart.

I suspect our sons could do some interesting things if we pick Status Quo.

well, you just gave us one good argument to NOT pick Status Quo then!

angelsadvocate666 said:
Well it's nice that it's short. Probably not that hard, either, since the difficulty seems to be more about finding the grave and navigating what is probably a town around it.

I'm kinda considering sending Selene, potentially + Baldomare (but ideally Baldomare should be on Outsider duties instead, considering she rolls +80 there).

Selene has enough health that she can afford some wounds, narratively speaking she can teleport and fly and investigate through dreams...

Also using one of her actions would slow down her training, which is... actually partially a good thing when we're still not ready to do the "with family" training?

That said, Mareinette on her own would also work. or Axe, if we're not doing Frangiclave immediately.

angelsadvocate666 said:
How are the money calcs looking? Since even with good rolls that Sacrament costs an absolute shitton.

Like, our magic stat is thirteen, so not counting any potential reagents, that's a +53 total. With two rolls minimum it would till cost 100 bits and we would have to roll... 97 twice, I think? Probably not happening.

We might be in a better position to consider it if we get lucky and get either a Forge Influence or forge reagents from Mansus or expeditions.

angelsadvocate666 said:
I mean, we have the Malleary right there, and hit looks like we have to at least visit it to reach the Glory Ending. If anywhere would give us two Forge scraps, it's gonna be that place, and I expect it to be our free exploration next turn.

or an influence, really. With Influences being "the personal attention of the Hours", what else could give one other than the Malleary?

Venerable Ro · Monday at 10:08 AM

Pittauro said:
or an influence, really. With Influences being "the personal attention of the Hours", what else could give one other than the Malleary?

On the other hand, once we start poking around there and possibly/probably find the Forge Name to recruit that'll be a whole new round of summoning-related expenses.

Greymere · Monday at 10:19 AM

Pittauro said:
or Axe, if we're not doing Frangiclave immediately.

If we're not doing Frangiclave next turn (which I think is highly likely to be the case), DoA needs to be on making Wrong Keys during T20. Because we really do not want to let our ritual defenses lapse while Copper still has the mega-EiB button ready (aka Neighnia).

Iustus Vitea · Monday at 10:31 AM

Soooooooo the Influence did nothing for us other than making the 1st and 5th options possible if, frankly speaking, terrible ideas.

…if the Red Church Part 2 turns out to have no rolls we couldn't have completed with another Lore with pretty good odds of success then we've wasted Biedde's action and put off dealing with Copper for another turn for…nothing really.

Great. Just, great.

Pittauro · Monday at 11:27 AM

Iustus Vitea said:
Soooooooo the Influence did nothing for us other than making the 1st and 5th options possible if, frankly speaking, terrible ideas.

…if the Red Church Part 2 turns out to have no rolls we couldn't have completed with another Lore with pretty good odds of success then we've wasted Biedde's action and put off dealing with Copper for another turn for…nothing really.

Great. Just, great.

eh, it's not that big of a deal. We could not have known for sure what was going to happen with Comet, and we still got more options. It's just a shame the turns didn't line up so we could be healed first to get a shot at negotiate.

Beside the Church there's also still the possibility of us being attacked by Copper, and even if the action was "wasted" I'd still be fine with it, the narrative of Edge Velvet with both Comet and the Bureau were entertaining enough to make up for the lost biedde action to me

Venerable Ro · Monday at 11:35 AM

Pittauro said:
eh, it's not that big of a deal. We could not have known for sure what was going to happen with Comet, and we still got more options. It's just a shame the turns didn't line up so we could be healed first to get a shot at negotiate.

Beside the Church there's also still the possibility of us being attacked by Copper, and even if the action was "wasted" I'd still be fine with it, the narrative of Edge Velvet with both Comet and the Bureau were entertaining enough to make up for the lost biedde action to me

Personally it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that our Influence is how we got such favorable terms on [Compromise], or at perhaps that we auto-succeeded the Edge roll that would have been needed to bring him to the table.

Bakkasama · Monday at 12:27 PM

Pittauro said:
I'm kinda considering sending Selene, potentially + Baldomare (but ideally Baldomare should be on Outsider duties instead, considering she rolls +80 there).

Or we could send Jade with the SH artifact.

Speaking of which, are we sure that sending DoA on the fangiclave expedition would be a good idea? It seems counterintuitive that the most powerful artifact of the lore of opening paths that opens all it touches would be behind obstacles that needs opening a path. And while Axe has a good general bonus, she also has reason to just nab the artifact right there if she finds it regardless of whether we would want it or not and regardless of whether Axe knows that or not.

Pittauro · Monday at 12:35 PM

Bakkasama said:
Or we could send Jade with the SH artifact.

we could very well send a Mare in the Light with the SH artifact, if we summoned one. They'd have higher general bonuses.

or Selene. We could send her twice, even, letting her only train with the bonus action.

Baldomare + Twice Selene would probably be enough to find the Outsider.

Or we could keep Baldomare on SH influence duty to instead unlock our own SH sacrament instead, and send someone else (Double Selene + Comet maybe?)

Bakkasama said:
Speaking of which, are we sure that sending DoA on the fangiclave expedition would be a good idea? It seems counterintuitive that the most powerful artifact of the lore of opening paths that opens all it touches would be behind obstacles that needs opening a path. And while Axe has a good general bonus, she also has reason to just nab the artifact right there if she finds it regardless of whether we would want it or not and regardless of whether Axe knows that or not.

eh, unless we're keeping it a secret from her, and if we tell her the expedition is about freeing her, I don't think there's an issue? And if we're not bringing Axe on it that kinda only leaves Mareinette for the highest General bonuses...

Unless we want to do something like Selene + Velvet instead? or Selene + Velvet + Baldomare?

First we should see what information we can find on it, maybe we'll be told a bit about the obstacles if we roll high.

Iustus Vitea · Monday at 1:44 PM

Venerable Ro said:
Personally it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that our Influence is how we got such favorable terms on [Compromise], or at perhaps that we auto-succeeded the Edge roll that would have been needed to bring him to the table.

If there's a roll Bird always shows it unless it's going to cause salt.

Bakkasama said:
she also has reason to just nab the artifact right there if she finds it regardless of whether we would want it or not and regardless of whether Axe knows that or not.

Personally I think it's fine if she grabs it and uses it to get free and then can't give it back for one reason or another, we can just get another one.

Bakkasama · Monday at 1:51 PM

Pittauro said:
we could very well send a Mare in the Light with the SH artifact, if we summoned one. They'd have higher general bonuses.

or Selene. We could send her twice, even, letting her only train with the bonus action.

Baldomare + Twice Selene would probably be enough to find the Outsider.

Or we could keep Baldomare on SH influence duty to instead unlock our own SH sacrament instead, and send someone else (Double Selene + Comet maybe?)

I meant for the Grave on a Hill expedition. Instead of Baldomare+ somepony else, Jade + somepony else. That way Baldomare can do something else.

OurLadyOfWires · Monday at 2:58 PM

spiderhellian said:
… @OurLadyOfWires is that knife we're wearing going to mess us up if we Compromise?

No. No short term traps. Only long term implications.

Options do what they say they do.

Pittauro said:
@OurLadyOfWires can you tell us if it uses Forge Knowledge or Application bonus? Also if influence would apply, I imagine it does.

Knowledge bonus (so +40 for level 4). Influences apply.

influences, reagents, whatever you have. Just throw as much Forge in it as you can.

Or dont. Its your bits.

Pittauro · Monday at 3:28 PM

I'm leaning towards doing the same as I hope to do with the SH Sacrament.

Namely, we get the Forge Name, we get the tier 4 influence from them, then we do two actions in the same turn rolling +13+40+40=+93 (reagents excluded)

but we'll see how it goes. We still need those other 2 scraps (though we'd get them from the Forge Influence itself, so it's doable IF we find the Forge Name.

If we're lucky next turn we'll remove the scar and HOPEFULLY the grail/moth sacraments will change to reflect Velvet's personal growth... or at least we'll take a step along that path, if it is at all possible.

So many things we could do next turn...

book 6 expedition
frangiclave expedition
potentially act against copper
SH sacrament
Outsider
More Mansus
remove scar
potentially get Edge Sacrament

lots of possibilities

DelightedOne · Monday at 3:46 PM

I think all of the Sacraments would change if removing the scar changes Velvet that deeply.

Mixing the Edge Sacrament with the healing of the scar would be nice but there is still no guarantee we will get it even then.

Wait, would getting An Imminence(max Heart Influence) from Mareinette help with that since Heart is used to "resist things that would harm your body"? It also would help with All-4 progress and we don't have anything that we need her to do next turn.

Greymere · Monday at 3:59 PM

Pittauro said:
If we're lucky next turn we'll remove the scar and HOPEFULLY the grail/moth sacraments will change to reflect Velvet's personal growth... or at least we'll take a step along that path, if it is at all possible.

Still on that copium, huh?

Pittauro · Monday at 4:12 PM

DelightedOne said:
I think all of the Sacraments would change if removing the scar changes Velvet that deeply.

Mixing the Edge Sacrament with the healing of the scar would be nice but there is still no guarantee we will get it even then.

Wait, would getting An Imminence(max Heart Influence) from Mareinette help with that since Heart is used to "resist things that would harm your body"? It also would help with All-4 progress and we don't have anything that we need her to do next turn.

not really? by reading all the sacraments, the only ones that seem tied to Velvet's trauma are Moth (You have never really liked yourself), Grail (You have always been terrified that they would leave you), and maaaaaaaaybe Winter (You will only ever stop being afraid of it when you truly understand it)

The other ones are more about things Velvet is good at, about her powers, that about her personality. Why would potionmaking be affected by her trauma for example?

Greymere said:
Still on that copium, huh?

Eh, I explicitly asked once, and the answer was basically "it's possible, I'm not promising anything though". Considering we're FINALLY doing it anyway next turn, I'll be proved right or wrong very soon anyway, so what's the harm in hoping?

Talon Tiger Dino · Monday at 4:15 PM

All I know
Is that we need money
So much money
Our wallet cries every time
New expeditions? Money.
New summons? Money.
New reagents? Money.
New Sacraments? MONEY.
The poor wallet is so hurt by new things.

Pittauro · Monday at 4:20 PM

Talon Tiger Dino said:
All I know
Is that we need money
So much money
Our wallet cries every time
New expeditions? Money.
New summons? Money.
New reagents? Money.
New Sacraments? MONEY.
The poor wallet is so hurt by new things.

we get

160 bits from our job
40 to 60 bits from Rarity (presumably on the higher side)
100+ from commissions when we do them (we might want to do a second commission next turn MAYBE)

...I really hope Cadance starts helping us...

angelsadvocate666 · Monday at 4:22 PM

Talon Tiger Dino said:
All I know
Is that we need money
So much money
Our wallet cries every time
New expeditions? Money.
New summons? Money.
New reagents? Money.
New Sacraments? MONEY.
The poor wallet is so hurt by new things.

Th wallet can suffer. What has it ever done for us anyways?

Greymere · Monday at 4:24 PM

Pittauro said:
Eh, I explicitly asked once, and the answer was basically "it's possible, I'm not promising anything though". Considering we're FINALLY doing it anyway next turn, I'll be proved right or wrong very soon anyway, so what's the harm in hoping?

Well technically, what you asked was if Velvet stopped hating herself if the Moth Sacrament would change, and all Bird said was, literally, just "maybe". Not about healing the scar.

Pittauro · Monday at 4:43 PM

Greymere said:
Well technically, what you asked was if Velvet stopped hating herself if the Moth Sacrament would change, and all Bird said was, literally, just "maybe". Not about healing the scar.

fair. but the first step to solving a trauma is knowing what the trauma is.

Look, just let me have this!

Greymere · Monday at 5:27 PM

Pittauro said:
fair. but the first step to solving a trauma is knowing what the trauma is.

Look, just let me have this!

I just don't want people getting the wrong idea about how likely our Sacraments changing actually is, that's all

Pittauro · Monday at 6:00 PM

Greymere said:
I just don't want people getting the wrong idea about how likely our Sacraments changing actually is, that's all

fair enough:

Here I'll state it: I'm HOPING that removing the scar will help Velvet mentally, and that THAT will result in the Sacraments that narratively seem to most rely on her character flaws (mainly fear of abandonment and self-hatred) to change requirements.

QM didn't deny the possibility, but also didn't confirm it. I'm mostly hoping, because our Moth and ESPECIALLY Grail Sacrament options all suck.

BritBiscuit · Monday at 6:10 PM

Im up for compromise.

Considering that currently both Comet and Velvet are under such an Edge influence that they understand fighting and conversation as the same thing, does accepting a draw in the conflict of words and opinions make this similar to a Edge Dyad where two Adepts can't truely triumph over the over without also ending themselves (as Comet would likely eventually be killed by a princess if we die and we'll likely lose a confidant and suffer an emotional blow if he dies). I don't mean that this is an Edge dyad, Hours no, im just saying that there is a bit of poetry in the relationship with the Edge Councillor being resolved by us striving against each other only for neither to truely triumph over the other.

Also considering that Velvet has known Comet for a year at this point, I wonder what impacts personally killing someone that she has had conversations with and tried to befriend back in the day would be, I don't think it'd do anything, she already accepted the possibility when she first fired a ritual at Copper and she wouldn't have come with an Edge influence if she didn't expect death to be on the table, but it'd probably be a really cool scene for Birb to write, of Comet Feet the Enforcer, the most threatening pony most people would meet, a troubled soul bleeding from countless wounds as he lies motionless on the floor with his one final resolution being to ask his killer to please not hurt Fluttershy as he fades away. It'd be neat but we'd likely never see such a scene in practice due to the way opinion and practicallity is going. She'd be hurt mentally but resolute in her path and decisions.

Honestly I wonder if considering that compromise means that Comet automatically gets the Lore jobs, would that mean he has to sit at our tea parties, listen to gossip next to Fluttershy and whenever we mention anything to do with the Lores he just quickly puts his hooves over Fluttershy's ears and shoots us a dirty look because that'd be hilarious.

Final thoughts, good update I had duel of the fates in my head in the buildup to their meeting.

Gyldir · Monday at 6:28 PM

OurLadyOfWires said:
And please ask questions if there is anything I can clarify!

Does status quo mean status quo is accepted period, no changing until narrative evolved enough to give a new fleeting opportunity, or could we go status quo for now, heal our scar, do other preparations and then try again with our better preparations (risking that Comet equally might have made better preparations/been more lucky on his influence roll, and being careful to not boil the pressure cooker to my by asking Flutters for things)?

OurLadyOfWires said:
Finally, a small recap on how combat works:
-When combat starts the combatants roll the dice TWICE. And their two dice rolls (added up to all combat bonuses) are compared to the enemy's combat rolls.
-These two dice rolls are, so to speak, one "combat turn".
-After the dice rolls are compared, the "difference" between the two dice (the greater value minus the lower value) is added to the loser's "overflow". A character accumulates "overflow" until they reach a certain threshold (usually 50), and then they lose one health.
-At the end of a combat turn, characters may try (depending on the narrative) to perform a Martial-roll action to do something else. Most of the times that will be a roll to try to escape, if the character is afraid of death and feel they will lose.

Is combat always straight edge?
Or can there be things like end of turn Velvet trying to out moth the opponents Lantern+Edge, to get a better attack against an enemy that lost track of her?
(Better: dunno, maybe a bonus, maybe a "only take damage if opponent wins by more than x", etc)

Solace2117 · Monday at 6:31 PM

There's no guarantee that healing the scar will change some of Velvet's Sacraments. From a mechanical perspective, I understand why Ourladyofwires wouldn't do so. On the other hand we've seen moments like this that have the potential to change other characters lores, such as Jade and her decision to burn or not burn her house down.
We do know this will have an effect on her if she does it herself. If another character does it the memories are just forgotten and left in the past as we saw with the ritual to heal frightened. If Velvet succeeds though it allows her to confront what happened and move past it.
Obviously this won't change her lores, she's good at all of them and already branded. If anything we know of could change her sacraments it would be this. Even if it doesn't I could see it having some sort of benefit beyond just healing her scar.

angelsadvocate666 · 2024-10-15T00:19:20+0100

[X] Compromise.

Sooo… the Moratorium should have ended over an hour ago. Unless the QM said something when I was ignoring the thread?

DelightedOne · 2024-10-15T00:26:10+0100

[X] Compromise.

Decided to Compromise, there will most definitely be drama down the line but Fluttershy would (hopefully)understand and not be too mad Comet and Velvet decided this behind her back. This is the very lesser evil.

angelsadvocate666 said:
Sooo… the Moratorium should have ended over an hour ago. Unless the QM said something when I was ignoring the thread?

Nah, you are just the first.

OurLadyOfWires · 2024-10-15T00:33:29+0100

Gyldir said:
Does status quo mean status quo is accepted period, no changing until narrative evolved enough to give a new fleeting opportunity, or could we go status quo for now, heal our scar, do other preparations and then try again with our better preparations (risking that Comet equally might have made better preparations/been more lucky on his influence roll, and being careful to not boil the pressure cooker to my by asking Flutters for things)?

Status quo is accepting, period.

Not performing this action would already have Velvet deciding "not to poke the tiger". But picking Status Quo now is literally the two of you looking into each other's eyes, and agreeing that "we will both keep doing what we want to do". Even if you both know there is a chance your paths will clash later on.

Gyldir said:
Is combat always straight edge?
Or can there be things like end of turn Velvet trying to out moth the opponents Lantern+Edge, to get a better attack against an enemy that lost track of her?
(Better: dunno, maybe a bonus, maybe a "only take damage if opponent wins by more than x", etc)

Yes. Edge is combat. Its niche is that it is used in combat, to the point that it doesn't even allow for certain commodities like ritual re-rolls.

If you want to kill someone with Lantern, summon a mare-in-the-light or develop a ritual to that end. But if you are in a fight, in person and face to face, you are using Edge.

angelsadvocate666 said:
Sooo… the Moratorium should have ended over an hour ago. Unless the QM said something when I was ignoring the thread?

Yeah, definitely. Voting is open.

But we all know it'll stay open until thursday/friday, so even if people are available to vote right now, I don't see any problem with people taking their time. It's all good.

And we had a longer-than-usual moratorium and whatnot.

Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

Mystagogue of ever-rippling stories

Versed in the lewd.

Versed in the lewd.

Mystagogue of ever-rippling stories

In hell we live, lament

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Versed in the lewd.

Mystagogue of ever-rippling stories

Versed in the lewd.

Versed in the lewd.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Versed in the lewd.

Uh-oh, better hide those FOALS!

Versed in the lewd.

Not too sore, are you?

In hell we live, lament

Versed in the lewd.

From the best dinosaur fighting game

Versed in the lewd.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

In hell we live, lament

Versed in the lewd.

In hell we live, lament

Versed in the lewd.

Getting sticky.

Studying the hidden Lores

Know what you're doing yet?

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Not too sore, are you?

Uh-oh, better hide those FOALS!

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