Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Shaper47]

1)Search for juicer: YES
2) 4 or 5 actions on Sacrament, Selene training, Friends and Family FOs....
3) Forge Reagent: make it lvl 4, we can't afford to fail it.
4)I'd still do the Forge ritual next turn though, but I CAN be convinced to do it now.

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Why am I not seeing personal SH Sacrament there when we have an SH influence?

 

[spiderhellian]

Can't say I'm a fan of not keeping it simple but I'd probably toss an approval vote because I do like strengthening Luna a TON + narrative impacts.

[] Plan KISSS (Keep it Snake + Selene, Stupid)
-[] (AotL) Lantern
-[] (Forge) Forge 3 reagent
-[] (Knock) Explore the Summit
-[] (Winter) Summon a Risen
-[] FO Family
-[] (Social) FO Friends
-[] DoA Sacrament x5
-[] Teach Selene

[] Plan KISS (Keep it Snake, Stupid)
-[] (AotL) Lantern
-[] (Forge) Forge 3 reagent
-[] (Knock) Explore the Summit
-[] (Winter) Summon a Risen
-[] FO Family
-[] (Social) FO Friends
-[] DoA Sacrament x6

 

[Flaregamer82253]

Actually, thinking of Ash, our chosen prey for active hunting was Copper and she's dead now. @OurLadyOfWires is this something that we'd have to deliberately visit Ash to make a new choice on or is this a choice that should be given without an action?

 

[Pittauro]

Why am I not seeing personal SH Sacrament there when we have an SH influence?

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Because I expect us to use the leftover actions from Axe Sacrament for it.

 

[Shaper47]

Because I expect us to use the leftover actions from Axe Sacrament for it.

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Hubris comes before the fall.

Look I agree that Selene is important and should be prioritized for leftover actions but I really don't want to have to spend another Baldomare action to get us our personal SH Sacrament.

I want our lantern Sacrament Turn 23 damn it!

 

[spiderhellian]

I can't help but feel like Spider opened up a different flavor of arguing here.

OurLadyOfWires: Ok I'll refund you on every action for the DoA sacrament you didn't nee-

Questers: We'll take six.

OurLadyOfWires: Pardon?

Questers: I mean this is something we can all agree on!

OurLadyOfWires: ...Well, okay-

Questers: NO WAIT 5 and SH- NO 5 and Teach Sele- NO DO ASH- SUMMIT- DO-

OurLadyOfWires: ...

If this turn was an episode of the show the moral would be that pushing all of your important decisions off until later is cool as long as it makes friends.

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Thinking about it, not finishing the Sacrament is pretty awful.

We've invested all these actions without payoff, and we won't be able to even get that payoff next turn because DoA is gone.

We should go all in, probably have excess, and then have another fight later on (able to eg see if we've used our AotL or SH reroll)

 

[Shaper47]

Thinking about it, not finishing the Sacrament is pretty awful.

We've invested all these actions without payoff, and we won't be able to even get that payoff next turn because DoA is gone.

We should go all in, probably have excess, and then have another fight later on (able to eg see if we've used our AotL or SH reroll)

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Your completely right.

I do still want to do one SH Sacrament action though. If there's a bad roll and the reroll gets used that could influence doing a second SH Sacrament action.

 

[Alan975]

1)Search for juicer: YES
2) 4 or 5 actions on Sacrament, Selene training, Friends and Family FOs....
3) Forge Reagent: make it lvl 4, we can't afford to fail it.
4)I'd still do the Forge ritual next turn though, but I CAN be convinced to do it now.

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Look I agree that Selene is important and should be prioritized for leftover actions but I really don't want to have to spend another Baldomare action to get us our personal SH Sacrament.

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Thinking about it, not finishing the Sacrament is pretty awful.

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We're getting unspent actions back, why not go all in on Snake, then SH and then pick out the best parts from Pittauro's?

 

[Shaper47]

We're getting unspent actions back, why not go all in on Snake, then SH and then pick out the best parts from Pittauro's?

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Yeah, that's probably the best thing to do.

 

[Maer]

@OurLadyOfWires how does subversion work with Scraps? Can we turn a scrap of Grail into an equivalent scrap of Moth, for example? If so, how can we do that? I imagine that a large number of us would be very excited for that to be an option, if you have, or can set up, something to accomplish that.

 

[Alan975]

Two things jump to mind.

Say that we end up doing two personal SH, would the benefits from level 5 kick in this turn or next?

And for something less relevent, In regards to our Esoteric trait,

LANTERN: You may read three books per turn, or study two artifacts, and you will generate slightly less suspicion towards the family head. You now can (try to?) learn (learn... what?) from objects you can touch (Level 3);

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Is this even relevant anymore?

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

Aye, let me catch up.

A question @OurLadyOfWires. If we credit Jade's action, can we also credit next turn's free reagent-making action to make a reagent for said RotT or no?

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No.

Because reagent making takes place on Velvet's turn.

I am allowing action-credit because the plan from the Follower's phase didn't account for information I think was important. But you can adequate Velvet's phase for any scrying you wish to action-credit for.

And while true that it would be more comfortable to do certain rituals with reagents, I don't want to end up crediting half of next turn because "one more thing".

since we know from exploring the Blank Plains that if we get twice the DC of the area, we find two locations at once (can you confirm @OurLadyOfWires?).

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No promises are made.

@OurLadyOfWires would you allow us to drop the last SH sacrament action IF we had used the reroll during the first one? Or would we be committed by then?

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Sigh...

Here's the thing. SH Sacrament is already labeled as a dangerous action to begin with. And I don't like plans with conditionals that hinge on things as minute as whether a certain reroll was used. I really, really prefer you guys to think "What I want to try to do and damn the dangers".

Still, this is the mechanical problem, and a vote, so we need a clear guideline.

No conditionals. If you want to try two SH sacrament actions, vote for that. If you are too afraid and want to try one, try one.
Finally, if you try for two SH sacraments, and you fail one, I will open a vote of "try the second time" or "change your action to something else".

Oh wait. @OurLadyOfWires is there a difference between explore the Summit and look for the Outsider juicer?

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None.

We all know what the juicer is. And we all know what's at the summit. Going to the summit is looking for the juicer.

AotL SH affects neither FR nor Selene, and it does not apply to our Sacrament either. I'd rather we cover our Lore bases than stack SH even higher.

Or am I misremembering and it can be used on our SH Sacrament, @OurLadyOfWires ?

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From what I recall, SH Sacrament attempt and rituals are both Knowledge Lore use, so neither benefit from AotL.

@OurLadyOfWires is the wording on the reagent action legal? I figured it'd be best to wait until after DoA's Sacrament, since we don't know if e.g. we'd want to make a Forge reagent for FR or a Lantern reagent to boost the Level 7 book RotT or something else entirely, depending on how many leftover actions we have.

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Sure. It's easier if you just don't add Reagent-creation on your plan. That way it's still in Velvet's pockets as "actions for this turn" if (IF) we have optoins after DoA sacrament attempt.

OurLadyOfWires Does Velvet Covers think lantern or SH would be best for the mansus exploration to the Summit to find out how to get the Blood of the Outsider trait?

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No comments on this. She has no strong idea one way or the other.

And on another note, why is your ping... different? I have no idea how to do that one.

I can't help but feel like Spider opened up a different flavor of arguing here.

OurLadyOfWires: Ok I'll refund you on every action for the DoA sacrament you didn't nee-

Questers: We'll take six.

OurLadyOfWires: Pardon?

Questers: I mean this is something we can all agree on!

OurLadyOfWires: ...Well, okay-

Questers: NO WAIT 5 and SH- NO 5 and Teach Sele- NO DO ASH- SUMMIT- DO-

OurLadyOfWires: ...

If this turn was an episode of the show the moral would be that pushing all of your important decisions off until later is cool as long as it makes friends.

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I love it. And technically speaking, this is perfectly legal.

But not picking your family's FleetOp ont he base plan will give you a malus

Actually, thinking of Ash, our chosen prey for active hunting was Copper and she's dead now. @OurLadyOfWires is this something that we'd have to deliberately visit Ash to make a new choice on or is this a choice that should be given without an action?

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Ah, thank you.

Target-changing Ash requires a Mansus action to visit him. I will add that option on your Mansus exploration options (it can be done with your free Mansus action, although doing it too often would make me punish Velvet for trying to "cheese" her need to explore the Mansus).

@OurLadyOfWires how does subversion work with Scraps? Can we turn a scrap of Grail into an equivalent scrap of Moth, for example? If so, how can we do that? I imagine that a large number of us would be very excited for that to be an option, if you have, or can set up, something to accomplish that.

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Unfortunately, this quest wasn't designed with that in mind, so it's just not a thing.

So no scrap subversion here, and I won't try to cook up a new system for something that is not yet a problem. My apologies.

Maybe if you had all Lores on a high level, and a single one that was lagging behind, I might have Velvet work on a solution. But as it stands, no need to change things.

Is this even relevant anymore?

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Not really, to be honest.

But to be clear, I am not afraid of creating skills that are either useless, or that fall out of favor.



Right, I think these are all the pings. Kindly let me know if I missed any questions.

And I hope you are all doing well!

 

[Greymere]

Sure. It's easier if you just don't add Reagent-creation on your plan. That way it's still in Velvet's pockets as "actions for this turn" if (IF) we have optoins after DoA sacrament attempt.

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I wanted to explicitly mention that it's being reserved to decide on later rather than not used at all, to prevent misunderstandings (from the players, not you)

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

So, as looking for the Juicer is the same as exploring the Summit, and the higher you go in the Mansus the more dangerous it is, I really do think we should do the Forge's Redemption if we're going to poke around up there. We really don't want to traumatize our family a second time.

And since we don't know if finding the juicer is more Lantern or SH, it is best to AotL Lantern just in case.

 

[Venerable Ro]

Personally I was hoping to find a way to rope Cadance in on the Forge's Redemption business.

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

Personally I was hoping to find a way to rope Cadance in on the Forge's Redemption business.

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Yeah, I have Caddy-Lore on my radar as well. Because Velvet obviously does too.

But two problems still stop me, for now. The first is-

-It is important to understand that you are still "under the weather" this turn. Mechanically, you are at maximum health with no debuffs. But narratively, you will still be a bit beaten, and slowly improving, to the point that you will be perfectly healthy at the end of this month.

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-basically this. This turn is still your narrative convalescence period.

And second, the issue of "Celestia can detect Lore levels now" and Caddy isn't really a Moth mare.

If you had a studied Moth 4 artifact sitting around, I could consider an alternative. But for now, I am waiting to see where certain chips will fall.

 

[Bakkasama]

I just had a stupid thought. Is Celestia exploring the Mansus or is she just learning second hoof from Eclipse? And if she is exploring the Mansus, what happens if we target her with Ash?

Edit: Just to be clear, I am not saying that we should comit treason by attacking our monarch but if we did, nobody knows we control Ash and they cant prove anything.

 

[Shaper47]

So, as looking for the Juicer is the same as exploring the Summit, and the higher you go in the Mansus the more dangerous it is, I really do think we should do the Forge's Redemption if we're going to poke around up there. We really don't want to traumatize our family a second time.

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Let's just focus on our SH Sacrament and stay safe by searching the Wastes for cool stuff.

A bunch of people here want to train Selene and we probably can't do that and Forge's Redemption without cutting into our Sacrament actions.

Let's see how many actions we have leftover from doing DoA's Sacrament first.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

I just had a stupid thought. Is Celestia exploring the Mansus or is she just learning second hoof from Eclipse? And if she is exploring the Mansus, what happens if we target her with Ash?

Edit: Just to be clear, I am not saying that we should comit treason by attacking our monarch but if we did, nobody knows we control Ash and they cant prove anything.

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We are not attacking Velvet's Daughter's Sister with Velvet's Unfortunate Sun.

1. Because the transitive property clearly makes Celestia Velvet's daughter, she just doesn't know it yet.

2. Because it's fucked up.

And 3. Because I am 95% sure Ash will see Daybreaker, declare, "MOOD KINDRED!" and then technically dispose of Celestia by bringing out Daybreaker.

 

[Shaper47]

And 3. Because I am 95% sure Ash will see Daybreaker, declare, "MOOD KINDRED!" and then technically dispose of Celestia by bringing out Daybreaker.

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Couldn't Ash be ordered to target Daybreaker specifically?

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Couldn't Ash be ordered to target Daybreaker specifically?

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But then he decides the best way to do that is to get through the taste outer shell, and we are still down Selene's sister. There's no good way of going about this.

 

[Alan975]

stay safe by searching the Wastes

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Were safe from our son. Not everything drenshed in blood I think.

Ash will see Daybreaker, declare, "MOOD KINDRED!"

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....
What is Daybreaker?
Was running with the asumption of a stress/trauma indused split personlaity with a sprinkeling of not-god bulshit.
...And in the show, Daybreaker and Nightmare Moon are not of the same make, but are they here?

 

[Shaper47]

Were safe from our son. Not everything drenshed in blood I think.

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The Hunting Grounds show from precedent that it includes everything.

 

[Flaregamer82253]

I just had a stupid thought. Is Celestia exploring the Mansus or is she just learning second hoof from Eclipse? And if she is exploring the Mansus, what happens if we target her with Ash?

Edit: Just to be clear, I am not saying that we should comit treason by attacking our monarch but if we did, nobody knows we control Ash and they cant prove anything.

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We could also go for Midday Dew and just try to slow him (and thus Eclipse) down.

Would make for a literal definition of Gaslight, Gatekeep, and Girlboss.

 

[Alan975]

We could also go for Midday Dew and just try to slow him (and thus Eclipse) down.

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...Thoughts on sending Mareinette to seduce Dew away from the Light/educate them on the pleasures of Grail?

Celestia can't advance in lantern if they're not feeding her lantern.

Might make them feed her babies instead, but I'm almost a-okay with that.

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

Celestia can't advance in lantern if they're not feeding her lantern.

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Celestia has gotten basic lore knowledge, and the path into the mansus sorted. Those are the only requirement for anyone to get unlimited lore knowledge, espically easy to get Lateran where an unlimited source exists right in the Blank planes. Celestia if she put all her actions into it could be Lateran 4 in just 2 turns.

 

[Alan975]

Celestia if she put all her actions into it could be Lateran 4 in just 2 turns.

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Not if Mareinette refines her palate she won't.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Celestia has gotten basic lore knowledge, and the path into the mansus sorted. Those are the only requirement for anyone to get unlimited lore knowledge, espically easy to get Lateran where an unlimited source exists right in the Blank planes. Celestia if she put all her actions into it could be Lateran 4 in just 2 turns.

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Those are a lot of assumptions you are making there. Firstly, OurLadyofWires has been very clear that NPCs do not follow the same progression mechanics we do. Secondly, the Mansus is heavily biased against Outsiders, and there are no guarantees that its inhabitants will spill forth all their knowledge to Celestia. Thirdly, she told Eclipse to look into it. They're the ones working on this while she instead indulges in sadistic changeling burning.

Now back to the important thing; knife-fighting over how many AP we're going to pour into DoA Sacrament.

I think 5 is a good healthy number that lets us have room to do an FR to gain a Wound to more comfortably explore the Summit for the area we require to achieve the Glory Victory.

Putzing around Ash is just going to reveal more things we'll never really want to use and make Velvet feel bad.

 

[Shaper47]

Now back to the important thing; knife-fighting over how many AP we're going to pour into DoA Sacrament.

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6 AP or 5 AP and a SH Sacrament action or 4 AP and 2 SH Sacrament actions.

Should probably go with 6 AP to be safe.

I think 5 is a good healthy number that lets us have room to do an FR to gain a Wound to more comfortably explore the Summit for the area we require to achieve the Glory Victory.

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We don't know what dangers and what lore is needed for the Summit.

So we should probably go somewhere we know for sure SH will be useful. Somewhere safe like the Wastes.

People can fight over FR or Selene or study but they come after the SH Sacrament.

Putzing around Ash is just going to reveal more things we'll never really want to use and make Velvet feel bad.

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It could give scraps, exploration in the Mansus often does.

There also might be first come first served wolf goodies. Would you rather those go to Windy?

 

[Limabot]

It could give scraps, exploration in the Mansus often does.

There also might be first come first served wolf goodies. Would you rather those go to Windy?

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While we may get scraps, I don't think we are particularly lacking in Winter or Edge scraps (the main ones we'd most likely get from the Ashlands.