Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Shaper47]

Just wondering, if we do have to go all out on Smiles next turn, can we fit the Lantern sacrament in? I guess it's DoA+anyone, not that pricy.

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Well it does only take one Baldomare ap so it should be possible. No follower ap required.

I kinda want to finally get a SH Sacrament though.

Maybe just spend an ap to study Baldomare's Beacon with Aotl and visit Baldomare in the hopes of getting a Lantern scrap.

Only problem with this(aside from the questionable math) is that we don't have 2 Mareinette actions next turn.

Just one, that will only be 2 if we befriend her by taking her Sacrament first. Like, the turn before, so we only have 2 Mareinette actions on turn 24.

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The Befriending as part of the rebinding happens at the end of turn 22 so we'd go into turn 23 with her befriended.

So I'm pretty sure we have 2 Mareinette actions on turn 23.

 

[ses]

Is the +1 follower AP next turn really worth it when we were explicitly flagged as having garnered suspicion due to grave robbing this turn?

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Yes. I'm not even close to considering suspicion to be an issue. The Wolf Cult got voted to gain political power after all, and we control the Bureau, and we're very likely to be going All In soon. Plus the Name general bonus would be getting used. Using Name AP stings a little but not getting a flow of Risen is just a mistake when it translates cleanly into Velvet AP and therefore Smiles progress.

 

[DelightedOne]

The Befriending as part of the rebinding happens at the end of turn 22 so we'd go into turn 23 with her befriended.

So I'm pretty sure we have 2 Mareinette actions on turn 23.

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Huh, really? Could have sworn that was just a promise/guarantee.

In that case, I guess your plan works. I would prefer sending her to Mayor Mare to make sure we don't Wolf Ponyville by inaction.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Why are we assuming Mareinette is worth 2 Velvet AP? We don't know what form of help Cadance is asking for.

 

[Alan975]

Why are we assuming Mareinette is worth 2 Velvet AP?

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She is, like, twice Velvets size. Or at least has twice as many bones.


The general vibe seems to be that this will be a social thing, probs with some Winter thrown in for flavor.
Now, her Grail bonus on paper may not be >double Velvets, but If there ever was a moment made for Mareinette to truly shine, then I'd assume that it's this.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Given that it is described as an ongoing nuclear meltdown, I don't think this is as social as others are assuming.

 

[Shaper47]

Why are we assuming Mareinette is worth 2 Velvet AP? We don't know what form of help Cadance is asking for.

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Mareinette has absolutely massive bonuses.

Even if it's say just running Equestria for Cadence so she can focus on Celestia, Mareinette can step into their hooves for the time.

Given that it is described as an ongoing nuclear meltdown, I don't think this is as social as others are assuming.

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Well somepony has to run the country if Cadence isn't available and the best person for that job is clearly our Lady of Wires.

So even if it's not some social assistance to the meltdown directly Mareinette would free up Cadence to spend a lot more ap on the meltdown.

 

[ses]

Higher level reagents may have unforeseen/unknown narrative or mechanical effects.

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Um. I dont think this line used to be in our reagents tab.

 

[spiderhellian]

Oh that reminds me, do our personal guards get Edge levels? @OurLadyOfWires

Wanted to do some math on how many rounds they last against Biedde

 

[spiderhellian]

Shedding Heat Like Skin

You can feel the heat from here.

You are Velvet Covers, and you have not even crossed the threshold into Canterlot Castle, and you can feel. The heat. From here.

When Selene had collapsed into your forelegs, her tears spent, you had been concerned. When Cadance had sent you an urgent message, with few words conveying an ocean of need, you had been worried.

Now? As you feel oddly warm, and feel sweat prickle your back, and cross into the castle all the same? Now, you feel scared.

---

Ever since the day you strolled into a search camp and took it over, you've signed up for the hard jobs. Coordinating the search was just the start. Teaching a cult, and then betraying it. Climbing a mountain almost no one could climb, and opening a gate truly no one could open, because it was your daughters needed to be safe.

Today, your best friend in Equestria has the hard job, and you wish you could do more to help.

You can calm Cadance when the stress feels unbearable. Help her muster the strength or will to keep going, and venture back into the furnace that half the castle has become. Talk to her, and try to untangle the mess that seems one spark short of a firestorm.

You just wish you could do more. You remember the moment when, only a few floors away, it felt like the entire castle — the entire country — orbited around you. You've gained so many tools since then, but none seem to fit this intractable lock.

Except…

Except perhaps one.

The scorching heat makes every one of Cadance's forays all-too-short and all-too-risky. Her mane is growing increasingly singed each time, the poor dear. She is formidable -- you would be incinerated a dozen times over -- but it's never quite enough.

It might be something about being back in Canterlot. It might be feeling like you're doing your utmost, and it's nowhere close to enough. Whatever it is, your mind is going back to school. Not university, but elementary school. You liked when they taught about animals, even though you knew that stuff didn't matter, not really. Not like magic did.

Still, you remember a few things. That bunnies like carrots. That raccoons like garbage. That snakes don't like it when it's too hot.

Truly, that's about it. You're not sure why they can't handle too much heat, but they certainly couldn't. The scorching sun would send them to some hiding spot, or any other way to cool down.

Snakes have caused you problems -- or, more precisely, or one snake in particular has caused you a myriad of problems. Even if she's been more helpful, recently. You chide yourself for a moment -- would you rather Silky not have her Cutie Mark!? -- but old habits die hard.

Still, perhaps this time, they can do you a favour.

The next time you send Cadance off, again, you trail (many steps) behind her. You see heat shimmers surround her, and feel the temperature like a weight on your hooves. Like they've been placed into a fire -- or, after you take a few more steps -- dipped into lava.

It hurts.

But you had a lesson, once, in taking excruciating pain and using it to form a passage. Transmuting something that ate at you, and burned you, into a form of key.

!​

A Silver Key.

!!​

So you take the heat in your hands, and you reach out, and you twist--

!!!​

You will never be sure what, precisely, you did. You definitely can't fully comprehend it, Baldomare would only tease you, and it will be a hot day in Tartarus before Axe volunteered the information.

You might have carved a tunnel through the heat that was slowly melting rock. You might have bent that radiance in a circle, so the fires chased themselves instead of gnawing at Cadance like hungry wolves. You might have done something much, much, stranger -- you wouldn't put anything past those ancient snakes.

But you have done something. And it did make a difference.

...And you think you will go lie down now, and wait for Cadance's return.

Spoiler: AN

To be continued, in the histories where this doesn't happen:

* Velvet seeking close-ups of Mareinette's cooking, like she's doing an impression of an Iron Chef cameraman.
* Velvet pestering Selene to send her skyward, because "Those stars are silvery!"
* Velvet taking altogether much too interest when Silky mentions her friend Silver Spoon.

...Can you tell that I'm getting desperate?

This is just to say that knowing our Edge Sacrament has only made me even more curious the impact our Knock Sacrament had. Or will have. To the point I've started to return to that other habit the Snake plagued me with, weird-theory-omakes But c'mon, tell me Axe wouldn't rather warp space than move if she was getting a little too warm while sunning on a rock!

 

[Shaper47]

Right, I'll do a bit of plan brainstorming since we have a majority of the information.

Turn 23: 508 bits

Sell cursed Winter 4 artifact
Minimize Cherenkolt (Grail secondary) and add him to Smiles and Axe expeditions.

Smiles on consult Bureau
Investigators "Analyse your options regarding the Changeling Colony" (Edge Name helps)
Constables on Choked City (Smiles picks up forge reagent)

Axe - The Quarry of Yuxtabei (150 bits)
-- Cherenkolt artifact

Servants + leashed minion Cover your bases

Mareinette - Celestia issue

Velvet free social - Celestia issue

Torn Risen 1 - corpse collecting
Rarity - work focus
Jade - study moth 3 artifact

Selene - Soothe the night
- scry moth 5 book x 2 (60 bits)

Velvet (4 + 1) 5 ap

Moth Sacrament

Total 210 bits spent

---

Right so above is the basics that should probably be a staple of every plan.

Velvet 4ap
Fluttershy 1 ap
Baldomare 1 ap
Smile free short expedition or assault
Free reagent creation

298 bits

So some basic options:

Plan - Moth Mastery Turn 25

Velvet- scry moth 5 books x 4 (120 bits)
Baldomare - lantern lesson

Fluttershy - Is it free real-estate expedition with Axe (50 bits)
Smile free short expedition or assault - Visiting a Competitor or Debt Collection (with Mareinette) (50 bits)

Create forge 2 reagent (20 bits)

Total 58 bits remaining

Plan - Smiles Befriending

Velvet - Smiles Befriending x 3 (16/40)

Velvet - Beyond the Map's Edge expedition (Baldomare SH Sacrament) (40 bits)
Baldomare - Beyond the Map's Edge

Fluttershy - Is it free real-estate expedition with Axe (50 bits)
Smile free short expedition or assault - Visiting a Competitor or Debt Collection (with Mareinette) (50 bits)

Create forge 2 reagent (20 bits)

Total 138 bits remaining

Plan - Winter Heirloom will save Celestia!

Create Winter 4 reagent (80 bits)
Velvet- Influence Winter with reagent (30 bits)
Velvet free mansus - RA Wolf Winter Sacrament
Velvet Mansus - Grave of the Sun and Stalk the Ashen Wastes with moth Aotl

Velvet - Beyond the Map's Edge expedition (Baldomare SH Sacrament) (40 bits)
Baldomare - Beyond the Map's Edge

Velvet - scry Windy (30 bits)
Smile free short expedition or assault - assault Windy with Mareinette, Axe and Selene (100 bits)

Fluttershy- Ponyville book search

Total 18 bits left

 

[Pittauro]

A little more picking around the edges…


Is the +1 follower AP next turn really worth it when we were explicitly flagged as having garnered suspicion due to grave robbing this turn?


Just wondering, if we do have to go all out on Smiles next turn, can we fit the Lantern sacrament in? I guess it's DoA+anyone, not that pricy.

Oh wait it doesn't even cost the followers actions. Huh. Nvm.

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THat's most of what I wanted to point out, yeah.

IF we're actually doing Lantern expedition, we should probably fit in the Lantern Sacrament. Though do keep in mind there's a RISK to the ones we send, so worst case they get unsummoned or hurt and can't do their other actions... though I think we can have it done "last" in the turn, to remove that risk?

Same with Risen, though I'm at the point that I don't care that much about the "risk of rumors", it's just a question of if it's worth it or not. The only ones with the authority to investigate us are going to be Eclipse anyway, and the Wolf Cult is about to gain influence in Ponyville as well, and I doubt they'd care about graverobbing or "weird occult stuff found in a farm barn".

and if our brother were to say something, well, have Axe cover for us. Maybe it's her hobby or traditional magical practice!

(it's not even a complete lie ! )

She is, like, twice Velvets size. Or at least has twice as many bones.


The general vibe seems to be that this will be a social thing, probs with some Winter thrown in for flavor.
Now, her Grail bonus on paper may not be >double Velvets, but If there ever was a moment made for Mareinette to truly shine, then I'd assume that it's this.

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Unless we're misunderstanding this.

Maybe it's more that we cover Cadance, in the sense we take on some of her duties, giving HER more time to try and defuse Celestia?

In that case it would make sense our Grail doesn't apply, and Mareinette or Velvet wouldn't make that much of a difference to the effort.

Sell cursed Winter 4 artifact

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I don't think that's quite a given, really.

Rarity - work focus

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Didn't she do it this turn already? I think we want Commission.

- scry moth 5 book x 2 (60 bits)

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Velvet- scry moth 5 books x 4 (120 bits)

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I think it's too late for that.

We have to assume the worst case with Celestia, and that's that each lore level is one extra turn of safety. It COULD and maybe is even LIKELY to be more, but we don't know how the rules work for her. For all we know she gets a single roll each turn which results in "+1 or not" levels if she passes a DC.

Reminder she's not a normal pony, she's an Alicorn Outsider possibly under something comparable to Fascination. A massive raise in lore levels until she basically self-destructs is not impossible.

We'd need to scry for 6 books, then do 6 expeditions for them. And it's unlikely they'll all be short, which makes it problematic. and right now she's on track for, worst case scenario, Lantern 5 by turn 25 beginning, meaning we don't GET to play turn 25 before going on All In.

Maybe Selene will buy us time, or Celestia will fail a roll, but we can't bet on that. I think we should rather invest on the lower-hanging fruits.

SH Sacraments (velvet and Baldomare), Lantern Sacrament, Moth Sacrament, Mareinette Friendship, Smiles Friendship, Cherenkolt Friendship.

The expeditions we have unlocked, as source of books and artifacts to hopefully push some other lore to lvl 5 (Grail, Heart to 4, Forge, Winter if we decide to go for it...)

 

[DelightedOne]

Unless we're misunderstanding this.

Maybe it's more that we cover Cadance, in the sense we take on some of her duties, giving HER more time to try and defuse Celestia?

In that case it would make sense our Grail doesn't apply, and Mareinette or Velvet wouldn't make that much of a difference to the effort.

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Wait a sec. People have been thinking we would be talking to Celestia?

I just assumed we would be supporting Cadance in general.

Reminder she's not a normal pony, she's an Alicorn Outsider possibly under something comparable to Fascination. A massive raise in lore levels until she basically self-destructs is not impossible.

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Daybreaker is something way worse than Fascination. Not only that but at least Fascination only kills the affected person for sure, Daybreaker is going to slaughter quite a few ponies(if we are befriending Smiles that is a given, rebels+tyrant=death).

I still think the issue is the excessive focus on Lantern, if we want to help with that we could send the husk to Eclipse. They have a Lantern 6 Artifact so maybe that can help.

Winter if we decide to go for it...)

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Forge is already a bit too much, Winter is just wasteful.

Besides, that is an excuse to look for Neighnia and we have basically none of those.

 

[Greymere]

SH Sacraments (velvet and Baldomare), Lantern Sacrament, Moth Sacrament, Mareinette Friendship, Smiles Friendship, Cherenkolt Friendship.

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No way we're going to have enough time to do our personal SH Sacrament unless the doom clock gets defused outright. Even if All In gets delayed to the end of T25, we have more productive uses of our AP to prepare for All In with than getting Sacrament in a Lore we'd already be at Level 5 in.

 

[Shaper47]

Reminder she's not a normal pony, she's an Alicorn Outsider possibly under something comparable to Fascination. A massive raise in lore levels until she basically self-destructs is not impossible.

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Egh, I think your overestimating her.

Higher levels of lore are soft capped by sources anyways.

Besides she going by herself blind here, that's got to slow her down.

The odds are in favour of Selene managing to slow her down anyways for at least one turn and the higher she gets the harder and thus longer it will take to raise.

We'd need to scry for 6 books, then do 6 expeditions for them. And it's unlikely they'll all be short, which makes it problematic. and right now she's on track for, worst case scenario, Lantern 5 by turn 25 beginning, meaning we don't GET to play turn 25 before going on All In.

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It's easily possible to do scying them all turn 23, 2 Selene ap + 4 Velvet ap and 180 bits.

For the expeditions.

Bureau covers the cost of one of them, presumably the longest. Will probably take Smiles as he's not befriended.

So 5 Expeditions and we'd presumably have 3 Velvet ap, 2 Selene ap, 2 Mareinette ap, 2 Axe ap, 1 free short expedition for Smiles, 1 Fluttershy ap,1 Jade ap and 1 Risen ap for expeditions.

Presuming we'd have at least one short expedition things have a pretty comfortable margin for success.

Fluttershy, Jade and Risen lead while Axe and Mareinette are added as needed.

 

[Pittauro]

Forge is already a bit too much, Winter is just wasteful.

Besides, that is an excuse to look for Neighnia and we have basically none of those.

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Forge needs an influence (2 scraps) from cherenkolt, then 1 more scrap (lesson or get lucky with expeditions), and then to take either 2-3 velvet actions for personal. Or 1+1 velvet +cherenkolt hot his.

It's doable, if we get at least an extra turn of time I think.

Winter there's personal (3 actions, 90 bits, influence for 2 scraps needed), or we might get lucky with Neighnia.

No way we're going to have enough time to do our personal SH Sacrament unless the doom clock gets defused outright. Even if All In gets delayed to the end of T25, we have more productive uses of our AP to prepare for All In with than getting Sacrament in a Lore we'd already be at Level 5 in.

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Well,I disagree, not much more to say to that. It depends on what we have available though, SH personal sacrament would only take 2 velvet actions and one Baldomare for influence. It's acceptable at that point I think.

Egh, I think your overestimating her.

Higher levels of lore are soft capped by sources anyways.

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That's how it works for US. You don't know if it's like that for her.

We already have the library that can potentially level up someone to 4 with just lots of lvl 1 books, if you want an example.

Rules for Velvet are not necessarily rules for everyone.

 

[Shaper47]

We already have the library that can potentially level up someone to 4 with just lots of lvl 1 books, if you want an example.

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I'm very sure that's not how the library works.

It requires higher level books or manuscripts to reach higher lore levels.

The only thing a bunch of level 1 books would result in is allowing somepony to reach level 1 in a lore, not 4.

 

[Pittauro]

I'm very sure that's not how the library works.

It requires higher level books or manuscripts to reach higher lore levels.

The only thing a bunch of level 1 books would result in is allowing somepony to reach level 1 in a lore, not 4.

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explicitly wrong

The members of the Outer Circle obey the "Scrap of Lore" mechanic, so they all start at Level 0 (thanks to the Master's presence) and need the required amount of scraps of Lore to advance on levels.
But in their case, all books, regardless of level, are helpful, in the following way:
A book will give the amount of scraps that is equal to "(THE BOOK'S LEVEL / THE LEVEL THEY ARE AIMING FOR)". And books will "rearrange" their bonuses in order to always give out the greatest bonus possible.

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you basically need 1 level worth of books for lore level 1, 4 levels for lvl 2, 9 levels for lvl 3... and so on.

Which is why we once had someone (forget who) write an omake about a Velvet that's stuck at lvl 3 or 4 everything, but someone manages to bring the Cult to level 7,8,9... as an obvious parody of how weird it is.

again, Rules for Velvet are not necessarily rules for everyone, and ESPECIALLY they're not the rules for An Alicorn Outsider going kind of mad and in possession of a lvl 7 artifact (probably THE strongest Lantern Artifact in the world) that, for all we know, has as effect "the owner gains scraps/levels each turn".

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

I am adamant that we should put 4 AP into Cadance, not 2 or 3. Also selling the cursed Winter Artifact is a waste; that's 4 levels of Winter right there! Have a Name use it during All-In and the curse won't even matter! Or just have them do things that don't require a Roll, like teaching Velvet Lore Scraps, on any turn following their use of the Artifact.

 

[Pittauro]

I am adamant that we should put 4 AP into Cadance, not 2 or 3. Also selling the cursed Winter Artifact is a waste; that's 4 levels of Winter right there! Have a Name use it during All-In and the curse won't even matter! Or just have them do things that don't require a Roll, like teaching Velvet Lore Scraps, on any turn following their use of the Artifact.

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or, you know, give it to a summon that would expire the following turn, like an MitL.

I'm fine selling artifacts, but that's only if we really need the bits. Between wage, Rarity commission, and the expected refund on the long expeditions, I don't think we currently do.

 

[Greymere]

Well,I disagree, not much more to say to that. It depends on what we have available though, SH personal sacrament would only take 2 velvet actions and one Baldomare for influence. It's acceptable at that point I think.

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You say only 2 Velvet AP and 1 Baldomare AP as that is not a pretty significant amount of AP to spend on a single thing within the timeframe we're talking about, actually. Like, personal SH Sacrament will straight up not be possible if Selene doesn't manage to extend our deadline out to Turn 25+. And even if we do stretch the deadline out to T25, two Velvet AP is still a third or more of our total AP budget for the turn... which we could be instead putting toward leveling up other Lores to Level 5 or studying any artifacts we happen to pick up or summoning more spirits (or, Hours forbid, putting out another Celestia-related fire) instead of double dipping on a Sacrament we'll probably not even get the chance to use.

Besides, aren't you always going on about how maybe the game doesn't end after we reach Glory? Why then try and shove our personal Sacrament in an already very tight schedule, especially when said Sacrament is dangerous and therefore not something we want to be poking right before we try and tackle the Final Dungeon?

 

[DelightedOne]

Why then try and shove our personal Sacrament in an already very tight schedule, especially when said Sacrament is dangerous and therefore not something we want to be poking right before we try and tackle the Final Dungeon?

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About this. Should we do the Ruined Church 2 turns before All In so we can recover from anything that happens there or are we doing it the turn before All In?

I am asking this because of the possibility of us receiving the Knock AP malus. Which I'm pretty sure will be Restlessness.

You must pick a single action. You will suffer a malus if there are no new locations to explore.
Using this action to change Ash's focus risks aforementioned malus.

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So are we exploring lower and risking it with Ash or are we taking the other type of risk?

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Velvet's Personal Sacrament is cool and if Celestia gets handled then I would very much wish to pursue it.

 

[Greymere]

I am asking this because of the possibility of us receiving the Knock AP malus. Which I'm pretty sure will be Restlessness.
So are we exploring lower and risking it with Ash or are we taking the other type of risk?

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I'm pretty sure we still have a Wastes location and a Stairways location (which should have multiple 'steps') before we're out of Mansus spots to explore? And once we hit SH5 we can add the Tower to that.

 

[Wise Wolf]

About this. Should we do the Ruined Church 2 turns before All In so we can recover from anything that happens there or are we doing it the turn before All In?

I am asking this because of the possibility of us receiving the Knock AP malus. Which I'm pretty sure will be Restlessness.

So are we exploring lower and risking it with Ash or are we taking the other type of risk?

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Given that we may be doing All-In in two turns, we would need to be doing Ruined Church next turn to have that buffer.

 

[ses]

I very much want to explore the Ruined Church and am sad that Turn 24 all in plans can't do so, but I think the knock malus is the least of our concerns.

If we roll a celestia delay on Turn 23, we can afford to spend Mareinette AP on things that aren't Smiles, so we might consider doing Heart Influence and Ruined Church on turn 24.

I admit I'm kind of just assuming we'll heal our wound with zero AP or bits spent. The Heartifact is really really strong at that exact purpose. It's like an 85% chance I think with heartifact? But yeah Ruined Church is our only realistic route to getting enough scraps for Grail 5, as Mareinette's AP is never going to get far down enough the priority list to do multiple grail lessons.