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Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

Reader mode
OurLadyOfWires said:
"I don't like it" is an important indicator to receive from readers. But it's not really something I can act upon. So, and I really mean it, I would be delighted if you could elaborate on it.
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I was talking entirely about the last 30~ich pages of reader discussion, the story continues to be a delight as always... except that I want more Cadanse or more daughters or a two-in-one.

Entirely seriously, there's nothing distinctly wrong right now. All the things that come to mind would either be petty of me to bring up or just boil down to "but why hasn't my character the protagonist curb-stomped everyone already!"

angelsadvocate666 said:
…Does Velvet even qualify as Cunning? I mean, she's in a kinda disgustingly high position of power with very useful connections, but that honestly happened mostly by accident. :V
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???
Step one: Joins subterfuge-Chaos cult

Step two: secretly plots against cult unbeknows to everyone

Step three: stumble into power and connections during the chaos you (helped) cause.

Step four: ???

Step five: profit Glory

All acording to Keikaku

angelsadvocate666 said:
After all, it's always good to remember that Velvet is straight up a mafia princess who just never realized it.
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...
You're more on the money than you realize. Consider how she reacted to Shining's words.

She is the head of a (recently) authoritative regimes spooky scarry privileged national security, and she was surprised that ponies would be anxious around her.
 
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Alan975 said:
???
Step one: Joins subterfuge-Chaos cult

Step two: secretly plots against cult unbeknows to everyone

Step three: stumble into power and connections during the chaos you (helped) cause.

Step four: ???

Step five: profit Glory

All acording to Keikaku
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The problem is more that it's mostly accidental. I mean, sure, she definitely meant some of it, but contrary to outward appearances, Velvet isn't actually a masterful planner. Even the few times she tried to do something on purpose—like direct the Cult at the Changelings—the outcome was far outside of her expectations. It honestly kinda caused more problems than it solved.
Alan975 said:
You're more on the money than you realize. Consider how she reacted to Spinning's words.

She is the head of a (recently) authoritative regimes spooky scarry privileged national security, and she was surprised that ponies would be anxious around her.
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Oh no, I am extremely aware of how accurate that is. Especially when you remember that her Dad and Uncle are literally mafia bosses. In fact, Velvet's entire noble bloodline is basically famed for being the knives in the dark that keep Celestia's regime running and generally slimy assholes. Steppes has the nickname the Facilitator, and "The Good Velvet" is an actual trait on our character sheet. That comment was not in any way a joke.

As for Velvet's obliviousness to both that fact and similar reputations she has, that has long been a meme in the thread. She was similarly unaware of how a good chunk of the Cult outright believes she was a Mansus spirit, or that Velvet Covers was just a patsy for the real Loremaster.
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
As for Velvet's obliviousness to both that fact and similar reputations she has, that has long been a meme in the thread. She was similarly unaware of how a good chunk of the Cult outright believes she was a Mansus spirit, or that Velvet Covers was just a patsy for the real Loremaster.
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Ever since she freestyled the Master's original summoning solo without using the sacrifices provided because she was just that good.

Kind of set the tone for the whole quest really, Velvet has made a career out of sailing through Lore checks she had no business passing.
 
Venerable Ro said:
Ever since she freestyled the Master's original summoning solo without using the sacrifices provided because she was just that good.

Kind of set the tone for the whole quest really, Velvet has made a career out of sailing through Lore checks she had no business passing.
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No, no. I believe Bird said the first thing that convinced them was the Luna ritual, when we first got the two-circle ritual and did a PtN. The Master threw a max Moth Influence at Velvet immediately after we crossed the Blank Door and she went all creepy Moth mode to get to the Cult meeting place and draw it. But since it was unregulated and Velvet's personal power was a lot smaller back then, it made Comet's Edge overload look cute.

The Master summoning just made that impression worse.
 
You know, I'm having a thought here. Assuming things don't completely go to pot this turn I've thought of something we could have our constables do, maybe even get Shining in on it.

We really ought to get a plan in place for our household in case of a mundane physical attack, the servants, our brother, ect. Basically something we (the readership) would recognize as an active shooter or evacuation drill translated into Renaissance-era pony. You know, so that Pon Pon or some other innocent bystander doesn't get "Spiked" by a dice roll and our tendency to ignore the social periphery.

It even dovetails with our "bring your family to work" brainwave as a personal inspiration and as a motivator for the Bureau as a whole. We can be the testbed as the most (apparently) vulnerable target, iron out all the potential problems in such a program, and then duplicate it for other Buerau VIPs and personnel.

A morale boost for our minionsemployees, a safety measure for ponies who might get in the crossfire due to association with us, and a bit of peace of mind knowing that random panic/surprise hopefully won't be as much of a factor in a potential attack.

Edit: @OurLadyOfWires, is that a thing we could potentially do, especially since it's largely built off of a thing (the take your kid/family to work day) that's already happening?
 
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The "Bring your family to work" day also reminded me of something: Flurry Heart.

Since canon is derailed and Equestria is a worse place would Harmony speed up the timetable and make Flurry Heart be born earlier?

It wouldn't fit with the "Two came from the outside, two ascended by their own means and one was born" pattern that we saw in the Alicorns but, you know, desperate times and all that. I looked it up and ponies have 11 months before they are born so if Twilight gets better it could happen but it would be a close one.
 
DelightedOne said:
The "Bring your family to work" day also reminded me of something: Flurry Heart.

Since canon is derailed and Equestria is a worse place would Harmony speed up the timetable and make Flurry Heart be born earlier?

It wouldn't fit with the "Two came from the outside, two ascended by their own means and one was born" pattern that we saw in the Alicorns but, you know, desperate times and all that. I looked it up and ponies have 11 months before they are born so if Twilight gets better it could happen but it would be a close one.
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I already suggested getting involved in the delivery and stealing the afterbirth to use for the "blood of an outsider", but Bird said neither Cadence nor her daughter count in that respect.

We should still totally do it though, creepy or not that's going to be an incredibly powerful Grail/Heart artifact and/or reagent.
 
Venerable Ro said:
I already suggested getting involved in the delivery and stealing the afterbirth to use for the "blood of an outsider", but Bird said neither Cadence nor her daughter count in that respect.

We should still totally do it though, creepy or not that's going to be an incredibly powerful Grail/Heart artifact and/or reagent.
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It makes sense they wouldn't count. Cadance was born in Equestria and then became an Alicorn and Flurry Heart will be born an Alicorn, no Outsiders involved at all.

I mean... If Cadance gives birth without knowing about the lores I will assume Velvet is dead so there is the question if she will want to keep it for her own goals.

That actually made me imagine Velvet as the midwife(because Grail 4).

Now I'm also wondering if we get Cadance super strong in the lores(especially Grail) what will happen to Flurry? Will her birth have a bonus to be super special(aside from being the first Alicorn born in the world, of course), would she get a trait, would Cadance?
 
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Well, that's something that's going to curse my search engine forever.
"How long are horses pregnant"

Short answer, 10-12 months, most settling in on the upper range of 11 months.
So, regardless of ifs whens or hows ... We got time.
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
…Man, now I'm feeling nostalgic for that old omake about a world where the Lores were public knowledge. I always love seeing cultures shaped by weird magical phenomena and how different they end up from IRL.
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Agreed! I loved the snippet of history we got with the Tribal door for what it depicted of that Lore infused culture and community.

Which Omake are you referring to?
 
DelightedOne said:
Okay so I re-watched "The Cutie Map" and had a rush of memories related to the Tree of Harmony, the Elements, Twilight's castle and of course the Map itself, that kinda make me realize something obvious: Harmony may not exactly be in Equestria yet.

No, no. Hear me out first. The first confirmed sign of Harmony we have is the Tree, it was planted by the Pillars and a while after their disappearance Celestia and Luna found the Elements in their first forms and used them to defeat Discord.

When Celestia sealed Nightmare Moon the Elements became inert, while the battle against the Pony of Shadows gives an explanation(the Elements being used to banish instead of purifying) I think it may be a little deeper than that, after all an Alicorn got corrupted and removed from the planet, that could have blocked Harmony from interacting with the world properly since Luna(who was connected to half of the Elements) was out of the game. While that may be reaching a bit, most if not all of Harmony's feats were done by those connected to the Elements and since they only work when used together it would be impossible for them to be of any use, so Harmony decided that for the next 1000 years it would work on something else.

That is when the Mane 6 appear, they were the new bearers(and also incarnations) of the Elements and coincidentally meet as a group the very same day Nightmare Moon breaks out of her prison.

Go forward a little till Twilight finds out about the Tree of Harmony and the Chest is opened, giving them enough strength to overpower Tirek(who had the magic of 4 Alicorns and most, if not all, of Equestria). That is the moment I believe Harmony arrived in Equestria, because what else could contest that much power?

The Map is another proof of Harmony being present in the world in a different way since it now guides the Elements directly by calling them to solve problems across Equestria and it expanding to cover places outside Equestria and calling other ponies and even Spike makes it seem like it is closer than it was in the past.

Of course everything I said can also be seen as "Harmony got stronger so it became capable of just doing more" but it trying to reach the Wake to fully become a part of it feels like a nice plot point to me and it also explains why the Dreamlands didn't overtake the Mansus. Because if the Mansus and the Wake are one why isn't Harmony a part of the Mansus since it is part of the Wake?
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Just noticed I didn't finish this. :V

All of that also makes me think... If the Harmony Victory is supposed to be done by reaching Harmony, does that mean it will reach us too? A bridge has two sides after all(totally did not steal this from Frozen 2) and all the other Victories seem to change the world by granting power to someone, Velvet for Glory, the Hours for Moon... and the Wolf for the Mother of Wolves so the Harmony Victory could be a speedrun of Canon in some ways.
 
DelightedOne said:
All of that also makes me think... If the Harmony Victory is supposed to be done by reaching Harmony, does that mean it will reach us too? A bridge has two sides after all(totally did not steal this from Frozen 2) and all the other Victories seem to change the world by granting power to someone, Velvet for Glory, the Hours for Moon... and the Wolf for the Mother of Wolves so the Harmony Victory could be a speedrun of Canon in some ways.
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From what I remember Ourladyofwires saying, I don't think it's as positive as you think it is. It sounded more like a dimming of the lights. Right now Harmony shines brightly attracting the Worms. Velvet needs to find a way to make it stop doing that, whether it's getting Harmony to do less or finding a way the cover it.
I think Glory is probably the best "good" ending in a vacuum though it all depends. A Glory ending where Velvet has 5 stains upon her soul will be a little worse then one where she has 3. A Glory ending where she has Celestia on her side is better then one where they were forced to kill Daybreaker. Doesn't mean we'll have time for Velvet to go on all the side quests we want to, but it does mean that our decisions matter.
Ultimately reaching Glory is the most important thing, but if Velvet can leave the world more harmonious when she ascends then all the better.
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
Actually dimming the lights is the Wolf ending. Harmony ending, as far as we've been told, was characterized specifically by hiding, not by making Harmony actually lesser. It wouldn't be much of a Harmony ending if Harmony got weaker.
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It's also worth noting that "teaching Harmony to hide" was the Master's idea of a Harmony victory. The Master was, notably, a Moth Name. So there maaaaay have been a bit of bias involved :V
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
I mean, fair, but I still don't think we would be actually weakening Harmony.
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Ah yeah, I don't think it would involve weakening Harmony. It just might entail that there are other ways to Worm-proof the world via Harmony besides just straight up hiding its light, and the Master went with "hide it" because... Moth.
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
Actually dimming the lights is the Wolf ending. Harmony ending, as far as we've been told, was characterized specifically by hiding, not by making Harmony actually lesser. It wouldn't be much of a Harmony ending if Harmony got weaker.
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Fair enough, I don't remember for sure, though I don't know that it doesn't amount to something similar. It may not make it "weaker" but it also doesn't necessarily mean it's better. I think it's more about forming a connection with Harmony versus the ending being Harmonious. We don't know for sure, but I just doubt it's inherently "good" considering the nature of the Worms and their attraction to it.
 
I mean, dealing with the Worm's attraction is the third point. Of all three endings, actually. Making them no longer a problem, or at least a manageable problem, is the goal. Each victory is just a different way of doing that.
 
...I just had a funny idea.

So we've talked a bit before about replanting the Woods, right?

What if we replant it in the Dreamlands? A new Woods would certainly hide all that Harmony-light. That's what it does/did for the Glory after all :V
 
Greymere said:
...I just had a funny idea.

So we've talked a bit before about replanting the Woods, right?

What if we replant it in the Dreamlands :V
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What, in the place that's already swarming with Worms? Even ignoring the problems that could cause, I don't think Velvet's willing to go in long enough to plant the seeds, let alone return often enough to tend them.
 
angelsadvocate666 said:
What, in the place that's already swarming with Worms? Even ignoring the problems that could cause, I don't think Velvet's willing to go in long enough to plant the seeds, let alone return often enough to tend them.
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Nah, just have Selene do it. She's presumably going to be patrolling the Dreamlands for Worms again at some point anyway.
 
Solace2117 said:
From what I remember Ourladyofwires saying, I don't think it's as positive as you think it is. It sounded more like a dimming of the lights. Right now Harmony shines brightly attracting the Worms. Velvet needs to find a way to make it stop doing that, whether it's getting Harmony to do less or finding a way the cover it.
I think Glory is probably the best "good" ending in a vacuum though it all depends. A Glory ending where Velvet has 5 stains upon her soul will be a little worse then one where she has 3. A Glory ending where she has Celestia on her side is better then one where they were forced to kill Daybreaker. Doesn't mean we'll have time for Velvet to go on all the side quests we want to, but it does mean that our decisions matter.
Ultimately reaching Glory is the most important thing, but if Velvet can leave the world more harmonious when she ascends then all the better.
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I think that mostly came from the Master, considering he was a Moth Name(and the Woods) that could be just how he choose to treat the Harmony Victory, the Hours had wards against the Worms that worked and Harmony can kill them with ease so that Victory could just mean having a harmonious version of them.

While Glory isn't the worst Victory(Mother of Wolves says hi) it still leaves a bitter taste in my mouth because it means re-establishing the regime of the Hours and the cycle starting anew. Harmony feels like the happy ending to a fairytale and I crave it like The Moth does Glory(ha, the irony in this statement).

Greymere said:
Nah, just have Selene do it. She's presumably going to be patrolling the Dreamlands for Worms again at some point anyway.
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Velvet: "I have a fun activity for you Selene, gardening."
 
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