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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

27th July 2013
10:24 GMT -7


"Ah, Grayven?" Starlight looks up at me in surprise as I trot into her office. "I didn't know you were visiting today?" She smiles awkwardly, but less awkwardly than she used to so I'm calling that progress. "Is this a surprise inspection?"
Looking in on Starlight Glimmer, eh? Her little 'crusade' against Cutie Mark fetishism/enslavement amongst ponykind. Wonder what progress she's made into removing Equestria's reliance on them...

"Oh, no, I just…" Uh. "Are you aware that Sunset Shimmer has been taking Twilight Sparkle to cult survivor-" Starlight flinches. "-meetings? Was that a 'yes'?"

"No… But… How does that work, exactly? The.. cult thing, I mean."
She should understand pony cults, that's for sure. She led one, after all. Or at least what sure seemed like a cult, albeit one enforced by the removal of Cutie Marks...

"Well, humans aren't herd animals in quite the same way that ponies are, but they can be… Ah, 'brainwashed' into herd-like obedience by people who know how to manipulate certain instinctive behavioural patterns. But it's not unbreakable, and if people who are heading in that direction can talk it through with other people who've been in the same position, it… Helps."
Human psychology is weird, sometimes. As much the rational wise ape as the instinct-driven foolish one.

"Huh." Starlight looks thoughtful. "I didn't know Princess Twilight was interested in human psychology. Do you.. think they'd mind if I tagged along?"

"Ah-. Probably not? But Sunset was taking Twilight because she feels that Twilight has a cultist-like reverence for Celestia that's not healthy for her, so she's encouraging her to meet people who've been in a similar position. I don't think Twilight's.. really picking up on that, but it.. gets Sunset out of the house and socialising and that's the main thing."
And any interaction between them may well lead to other things. Remember that 7-point Harmony strike in Equestria Girls 2? That was significant, I just know it.

"I've never been a cult member before-. But I suppose the entire pony species' obsession with special talents is pretty similar."

"Not exactly, because there's no charismatic leader-. But we're getting away from the point. I went to Twilight to talk to her about it, and we got onto the topic of her opening a school-."
Ah, yes, her poorly-thought out plan. Honestly, I could see this Twilight's ideas resulting in the G5 Equestria, if the Renegade hadn't poked his hoof in.

"Like Sunset's magic school in the human world?"

"No, it was some sort of friendship theology school. Point is, it came up that she never formally graduated from Celestia's school, so-."
Amazed Starlight didn't start laughing at that, but she's hardly the sort to display that level of schadenfreude openly.

Poof!

I turn my head, immediately spotting the somewhat-frazzled Twilight, the flash of her teleportation fading as she jerks her head maniacally around. I raise my right forehoof in her direction.
...Has she set up some sort of alert when someone mentions that, or is there something else going on? 😅

"Twilight-!"

Poof!

And she's gone again.
That doesn't seem optimal...

Hurr.

"So she's gotten a bit scatty, and I thought I'd be here so that Celestia can shout at me without having to travel to Ponyville. But in the meantime, I thought that I'd check up on you."
How thoughtful of him. I'm sure his future sister-in-law will appreciate the consideration.

She nods. "So you do want a status update on my projects."

"No, I mean… Heh, if anyone should be aware of the folly of treating someone as being purely a repository for their special talent, it's you. I respect the work you've been doing, but I don't want to chain you to your laboratory."
Consider it an informal update. A friend asking how things are going.

She frowns. "But I like my laboratory. I'm making progress fixing things here."

"You mean…. You're exercising your special talent and doing nothing else."
Ironically, the very thing she was railing against, isn't it? 😏

She draws herself up, takes a deep breath, and then sags slightly. "I… Guess..? But until I can fix… Whatever it is that stops ponies learning things after their special talent gets removed, I can't just get rid of it."

Oh dear. "Troubleshoes still struggling to pick up new skills?"
Huh. That seems an interesting complication. Hope Mr comically-unlucky has been doing well, though.

She sighs. "Yes! I should have known it wouldn't be so easy, but the moment I saw his cutie marks removed and he started being able to walk across a room without destroying it, I thought I'd… Arrived, you know? And then I started doing the cognition testing-. Just as you suggested, and it's virtually impossible for him to learn new skills. And I'm comparing to how he learned things while he still had his mark. We even gave it back to him to make sure it hadn't damaged his brain, and he immediately went back to being able to learn normally. And yet, unmarked foals can learn new skills without cutie marks just fine."
Peculiar. Maybe it's something about the manner of removal? After all, foals sort-of do have their Cutie Marks, merely unexpressed at first, don't they?

I nod sympathetically. "I didn't think you'd be able to solve the problem in a few months. I assume that it's not just him?"

"No, I was able to replicate my findings with my other volunteers. I'd.. like to find out what it feels like for myself, but I can't take the risk of losing my special talent in magic. It's just so-. Frustrating."

"Oh? Do you want to get rid of your special talent? I didn't think it came with a downside."
Definitely a concern. If her mark-manipulating talent can't be replicated, then in the end, this is mostly just poking stuff with a stick and watching the twitches. 😏 So, basic early science.

She sighs. "I know it will make using magic harder, but I'd feel like I'd earned it, not just been given it by… Chance, or-" She waves her right forehoof. "-however it works. And I don't know what having this special talent is preventing me from doing. Just because it's not as overt as Troubleshoe's sabotage, that doesn't mean it's not happening. And I wouldn't even know about it."
To be fair, most people are content in that state. The comfort of knowing what you're best at in life... It's reassuring. So you can see why most wouldn't look the horse gift in the mouth.

I nod. "I suppose that if the reversals so far haven't had any adverse effects, you could just increase your staff."

She slumps against her desk. "I wish. Do you know how rare pure magic special talents are?"

"Given that there's a whole school for gifted unicorns, reasonably common?"
I don't know. There's probably a difference between 'talent for specific magic' like most Unicorns, and 'extreme generalist' or 'Thaumaturgical Sciences prodigy'.

She shakes her head. "Most students have a magic-related talent. Having somepony have a talent in all forms of magic is really rare. Unheard of, actually." I frown. "Twilight only actually knows less than a dozen spells. Most of her most impressive feats are using really strong thaumokinesis, magic blasts or the Elements of Harmony. I'm a technically better spell caster, but I struggle a lot with research and theory. My special talent wants me to learn by doing, which is fine for me but doesn't let me explain what I'm doing to other people, and… Can result in me just repeating other ponies' work without realising it."
Admittedly, a lot of Twilight's stuff is just ad-hoc improvised castings. Or magical accidents. Or maybe just having a sense for 'Where can I find a spell to do this thing?' that leads her by the nose to her goal.

"What about Sunset?"

Starlight nods. "She's the closest I can think of to a theoretical 'pure' magic talent. I haven't noticed any weaknesses, and she sure hasn't mentioned having any. But does that mean that she actually doesn't, or just that she isn't noticing it?"
If anything, Sunset is more 'Can dig into the mechanics of magic and break it down to create new things.' If anything, them working together would be interesting: Starlight and Twilight creating new spell applications off-the-hoof, and Sunset analysing their actions to reverse-engineer it into a form anyone can learn.

"Alright. So how about getting someone who can cover your weakness." She winces, averting her gaze. "Problem?"

She loosens her muscles, breathing in slowly, holding, and then breathing out again. "You.. said that ponies are herd animals. Do you know what pony herd structures are actually like?"
Loosely, families with strong male and/or female leaders, right? Hence why Celestia is instinctively followed. She's so like a 'big mummy pony' that others reflexively do what she asks them to.

"I know what primitive pony herd structures are like on Earth."

"It's.. probably the same thing. And you're… Research shows that ponies instinctively see the Princesses as a cross between 'mom' and 'lead mare', and I'm pretty sure that I'm instinctively seeing you as 'herd stallion'."
I suspect it's more than the size difference, of course. Or things like the Renegade's Conquest Godname.

"Ah, no offence intended, but I consider my relationship with Luna-."

She blushes, recoiling. "I don't mean like that. I mean, I instinctively feel safe around you-"
Admittedly, he has been getting into less dangerous situations, at least on-screen. Semi-retired, wasn't it?

I shrug. "I'm glad-."

"-which is irrational, but-." She huffs. "When I was a filly, I used to do research with a guy called Sunburst. He was way better at theory than me. And then… Some things happened, and I haven't seen him for a while."
'Old boyfriend' embarrassment, or something more hostile?

"I learned from Sunset that I should enquire what 'some things' are in advance."

"What? Oh, I got angry about him getting accepted into…" She looks around. "This school, when I didn't. That was when I started realising that there was something wrong with cutie marks."
Okay, that's the sort of thing that can be overcome just by, you know, talking to him. 😏

"But… You're a magic talent. Why didn't you get accepted?"

"You can't apply before you get your cutie mark. He got his before me. And I… Probably could have applied a few months later when I got mine, but at that point I was too focused on overcoming the system to want to."
Heh, the joy of traumatic childhood experiences shaping a lifetime of bad decisions. Fortunately she's starting to overcome that.

"Alright. Write a letter to him and offer him a job. The worst that can happen is that he could say 'no'."

"It's just… I haven't spoken to him since… Which, okay, wasn't the most sensible thing to do. It wasn't his fault that he got his mark when he did. And the orphanage staff probably didn't even ask him before they sent the application in. It's just… It's a bit awkward."
Ah, worried he'll take one look and slam the door in your face? Awkward, but not impossible to overcome.

"Do you want me to come with you and hold your hoof?"

She opens her mouth to reply, then closes it again, looking thoughtful.

"Maybe a little?"
If nothing else, his presence will lend matters a little formal weight.

Perhaps one thing Starlight can work on is reproducing the spell effect which lets her manipulate and remove or reapply Cutie Marks? Once a few ponies can do it as flawlessly as she can, things can get a bit more scientific about it. Perhaps this guy can help with that. Something to consider... 🤔
 
Huh… are pony harems a thing in this version of the universe? That seems to be part of what she's implying.
 
Huh… are pony harems a thing in this version of the universe? That seems to be part of what she's implying.
No herd marriages were shown in the series. In this story, Luna asked Grayven about it when he spend centuries in the far future with Artemis.

Ancient ponies had the same structure as real ponies. Martial herds have one stallion, the mares and their foals. Bachelor herds have mareless stallions. Herd stallions who lost a fight go die on their own. I imagine that started changing as they gained the ability to use harmony magic, which would work against their instinctive competitiveness.

It wouldn't surprise me if herd marriages were technically legal in Equestria, in much the same way that cousin marriage is technically legal in England. You can do it, but English people don't. Fuck you King Henry VIII.
 
"-which is irrational, but-." She huffs. "When I was a filly, I used to do research with a guy called Sunburst. He was way better at theory than me. And then… Some things happened, and I haven't seen him for a while."

Very amusing that she phrased in a way where if it was humans you would assume it was romantic troubles, but it's ponies so of course it was a friendship fight.
 
It's really funny that Grayven's dad energy is so strong it crosses species and universes.

Speaking of troubled young adults, I wonder when this timeline's EradiKara plotline comes to a head.
 
Speaking of troubled young adults, I wonder when this timeline's EradiKara plotline comes to a head.
Not particular soon. The program knows that it can't rebuild krypton with children, and is happy enough to accept alien servants. This issues will start to come once the clones reach adulthood.
 
I have to tell you this:

In Young Justice in the Phantom Zone Dru-Zod had under his control each Kryptonian who was sent to the Phantom Zone and Kal-El knows nothing of any Kryptonian who was sent to the Phantom Zone, he knows nothing of them, until Dru and his followers escape from the Phantom Zone during season 4 of Young Justice
I just realised, this bit is actually fine. Original timeline Superman didn't have Har-Zod's records.
 
I don't think it's really fair to equate human mentality on a species of sentient ponies. To them having a herd mentality makes sense, because it's probably engrained in their instincts.
 
The Maori look different from English-descended New Zealanders.
So do Hispanic people. Almost all of which have mestizo ancestry, especially since it's self-identified and those without ancestry generally choose not to identify. Some aren't visibly distinguishable to most Anglos, because it's one native out of sixteen great-great-grandparents or because white people frequently can't distinguish 'black' and 'black-mestizo mixed-race', but they do look different.

There are some weird cases where a white guy who's lived among, married to, and the father of Hispanics chooses to self-identify as Hispanic* but that's like 0.01%; Hispanic is overwhelmingly a cluster of ethnicities.


*Not hypothetical. Details are politics.
 
Not particular soon. The program knows that it can't rebuild krypton with children, and is happy enough to accept alien servants. This issues will start to come once the clones reach adulthood.
Surprisingly pragmatic for a krypto-supremacist bot. Is it Kara's influence over the program or was his maker in-universe just more rational than the Council at the time?
 
Surprisingly pragmatic for a krypto-supremacist bot. Is it Kara's influence over the program or was his maker in-universe just more rational than the Council at the time?
Not really. In the comics, when the Eradicator program took over Superman, it was happy to try and maintain his Clark Kent identity until it got annoyed with humans being stupid. And even then it didn't try and wipe humans out, it just accepted being fired and focused on being Superman full time. Why would it attack Tamaranean servants when they're being servants to glorious krypton?
 

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