Vaermina
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Congradulations Paul, unless you stop this you're about to be responsible for the deaths of billions of innocent people.
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- Tags
- self insert young justice
Darko
Connoisseur.
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With her new power she may be able to win.
Even is she loses it could still benefit Paul, since then her expansionist empire is gone and the Thanagarians may have suffered enough damage that their expansionist ambitions will be slowed down.
Rebu
hey, little Anna, you're the one
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GhostKing 666
Know what you're doing yet?
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Well, it's a good thing Thanagar has had a massive increase in their Nth metal production lately. To say nothing of their own Orange Lantern support. Honestly, as much as Queen Hyathis might prefer otherwise, it would probably either turn into a cold war or both would wreck each other in the process.
Lord Ernest
At the End...
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It's like the universe loves to remind the Illustres that what he does can and generally will have consequences. But then he's like "Nah, that isn't my fault".
Ngamer11
Experienced.
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It's not that he doesn't take responsibility for his actions. It's that he's aware that what he does can have knock on effects, but he can't be held responsible for everything that happens as a result of what he does. That would be like holding the Guardians responsible for everything Krona and the Manhunters did, the way Atrocitus does.
You can blame him for starting the process, but Hyathis is the one who decided to press her advantage. Besides, is this any worse than whatever the Thanagarian High Council could be planning or have done?
Lord Ernest
At the End...
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I mean, not for Krona, but are the guardians not responsible for what the Manhunters did? Were they not the ones that messed up whatever programming the Manhunters had and failed to eatch over them? And then they hid the consequences of their actions i.e. Sector 666. So yes, I would hold the Guardians responsible for that, would be weirder if we didn't. Krona was not precisely enabled by the other Guardians, as far as I recall, he did what he did under their noses, yes, but they're not supposed to be babysitters for other Maltusians anyway, so I don't hold them responsible for that.
And you are right, the Illustres is not completely responsible, but were his actions not partly the catalyst for it? I believe he was aware of who he was dealing with. But then his reaction to the consequences of said actions are kinda underwhelming and pretty laissez-faire.
WereDragon
Bookwyrm
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Consequences, your actions have them.
Probably good that someone is going to win that war. Some short term unpleasantness is better than more generations of grinding slaughter.
Don't think Lantern Dul is quite up to fighting a plant god. Be interesting if she calls for help or decides it is an internal political thing and thus Not Her Problem.
Mr Zoat
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Lantern Dul is busy fighting the Reach. That thing before was a leave of absence because she hadn't been home for a long time. The local Green Lanterns will be more involved in any war between Alstair and Hyathis than she will.
The situation with the Manhunters is different because the Manhunters don't have free will. Everyone in Antares does.
WereDragon
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Lucky escape for her. She gets to keep fighting her righteous crusade against the blatantly evil rather than be involved in a very uncivil war.
Oh he is perfectly willing to accept that it is a result of his actions. He just doesn't feel the need to 'fix' those results if they don't impact his own interests or objectives.
The sovereignty of Thanagar, and those three warmongering planets neighbouring Alstair, are not his concern.
Steelplaza
Custom Title
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Of course he also provided Thanagar with a method of increasing their Nth metal production.
Do this a few more cycles, providing both sides of a war with means to fight with more powerful weapons, and they might just declare him an honorary Weaponeer.
Do this a few more cycles, providing both sides of a war with means to fight with more powerful weapons, and they might just declare him an honorary Weaponeer.
Ngamer11
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I was rereading the story part where Paul talked about the history of Thanagar to the Team, and it makes me very interested in seeing where this confrontation between Alstair and Thanagar will lead. Maybe we could see how Vulcan is enjoying his time on Thanagar too.
Stsword
Versed in the lewd.
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Hyathis is a queen of a planet of plant elementals. I believe in the comics they also have fungus elementals but I don't think Zoat has mentioned them.
Despite all having plant elemental powers they are as a rule no Swamp Thing, but apparently with the plant biocomputer she's uplifted herself so she might be the Swamp Thing's ballpark now.
She's in perpetual war with the rulers of three other planets in the solar system.
For about five minutes she was the Empress of Thanagar, she's apparently still salty about that.
Mr Zoat
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You see, the game provides you with the option of reinforcing either side so that the eventual winner of their confrontation will be in your debt. Simultaneously backing both sides doesn't really make any sense, unless you're purely in it for EXP farming and want to do all of the missions.
I think I gave one a single line, where the SI was mildly surprised that they exist.
NightmareWarden
Versed in the lewd.
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He brought up the gods- something like "saner gods than your sealed monsters,"- but they reached out to Vulcan themselves.
I'm curious if anything good will come of the cannibalism spider empire getting locked down, forced to shift to non-sapient foods. I can imagine the Indigo corps grabbing a few more Lanterns once the Greens and Oranges give them a window to sneak in.
Someguy Somewhere
The Critical Fumbler
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Going to be Interesting when she meets Vulcan over with the angy birbs.
RoninSword
Sky God
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Leaving the thaumosphere of her home planet should greatly reduce her power output. The plant technology should be fine but actual magic should weaken considerably.
Ardy
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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Ya know, I've never heard them called that but wow is that appropriate and how they should be referred to in all future discussions
Darko
Connoisseur.
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To expand on this, apparently in the past Thanagar was infected with a virus that robbed them of will and drive, and an alien came down and took over.
Hyathis came later, killed the alien overlord and devised a cure in exchange for fealty.
When she left the Thanagarians rebelled and they've been in a cold war ever since.
Mr Zoat
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Nearly. Part of the population rebelled after she took most of her most ardent followers back to Antares and the administrators she left didn't have much protection. Most thanagarians were still recovering and would have been satisfied either way.
Coast to Coast (part 10)
Mr Zoat
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5th December 2282
14:00 GMT
The Archbishop's face falls slightly as he gives me the bad news which, now that I think about it, I should have expected.
Getting a meeting with The Most Reverend Primate Calvin Robinson merely took a few surveillance pictures of French dockyards and a promise to relay a letter to any Anglicans in NCR territory in America. As expected, he's a ghoul, and also the man responsible for keeping the Church of England together during the Resource Wars and the post-apocalypse period. He was an old man when he turned into 'one of the Gentry', and…
"I think it speaks well of your character that you're prepared to have your marriage solemnised before God, but if you are not a Christian then I cannot perform the ceremony. And nor can I allow any of the priests in the Church of England to perform it in my stead."
"Yeah. No, that makes sense, actually."
He frowns in puzzlement. "Then why did you ask me?"
"Because my fiancée is a Christian, and a Church of England vicar would be a compromise between her denomination and my.. own preferences."
"You could accept baptism yourself. That would remove the obstacle."
"Yes, but I don't believe in God. I like the Anglican Church. I believe that Christianity has been a good and civilising influence on the world. I even met a demon once, and it was revolting. But when you get right down to it I'm not a man of faith and I have yet to see definitive evidence of God's presence in the world, so… Getting a baptism would involve lying about converting."
He nods, frowning faintly. "Which denomination does she belong to? They might be willing to modify their ceremony to accommodate you."
"She's a Mormon. Her whole tribe-."
He shakes his head. "Mormons aren't Christians."
"Are you-?" Heh. "Sorry, I just realised I was about to ask the Archbishop of Canterbury if he was sure what a Christian is. But… They sound fairly Christian? I'm not sure why you're making the distinction."
"The Old Testament is essentially the Jewish Torah. That doesn't make Christians Jewish, or Jews Christians. There is overlap of course, but the Mormons have altered both the beliefs essential to Christianity and the books of their version of the Bible too much to still be considered part of Christianity."
"Oh. Ah, alright. Well." I lean forwards, about to rise from my chair. "Thank you for your time. Oh, just.. one thing. What's the Church's view on magic?"
"Magic?" He sounds sceptical.
"Yes, magic. As I said, I've encountered a demon, as well as various.. strange phenomena. And pre-War America was experimenting with psychic abilities."
"That's not a question I've spent a great deal of time considering." He thinks for a moment as I sit back. "Attempting to communicate with demons is forbidden, for obvious reasons. Demons exist to tempt men to sin against God. Bargaining with them for any reason is completely incompatible with Christian morality. Similarly, there are no gods but God, if you'll forgive the Mohammadian phrasing. Attempting to communicate with 'spirits' is also forbidden, because they don't exist and the person doing it would either simply be wasting their time or in reality be communicating with a demon. As for things which are merely strange, well." He gestures to himself with his right hand. "I don't believe that Adam ever looked like this. And I haven't ever encountered 'psychic' phenomena that weren't simply confidence tricks."
I reach out with my right hand and telekinetically pull a book off his bookshelf.
"Ah." He blinks four times in rapid succession, his mouth opening slightly and then closing again. "Lord Harold didn't mention that."
I shrug as I return the book. "I didn't tell him."
"Is this ability natural to you?"
I-. I don't nod. "It's induced. There's a machine they built before the war, based on alien technology."
"But it's part of your body now."
"Yes."
"And it's purely physical?"
"As far as I understand it, yes."
He smiles faintly. "Then that's perfectly alright. Performing magic by using demons is a sin because it involves negotiating with demons, not because it lets you do something that men can't normally do. That doctrine comes from the early Church, when they had no way of distinguishing between 'magic' and chemistry, or other profane methods. Would you like me to put that in writing?"
Would I?
"You know what? Yes. I'll frame it and put it on the wall as a conversation starter."
"In that case, perhaps I could make something a little more artistic." His smile broadens. "How long will you be in Britain?"
"A few days more, unless my tribe needs me to return sooner. Lord Harold has asked me to help with tracking the whale pods, and the rest of the… Gentry?" He nods. "Are discussing how to handle foreign ambassadors. I'm told that there's a chance I might even get to meet Her Majesty."
"Yes." His smile fades slightly. "I suppose that would be appropriate. I will draft a Bull which lays out the theological case fully, with references to the writings of the founders of the Church and its greatest theologians. It should be an interesting challenge."
"Is there.. a problem? With the Queen?"
"The Queen…" He sighs. "I was one of the first people in Britain to change, like this." He briefly glances at a wall-mounted mirror. "I was working in London when the first missiles fell. I believed that it was the death knell of civilisation on Earth and I wanted to serve God and my community once more before the end, ministering to the sick and dying. When my hair fell out I assumed that I had radiation sickness and would soon be meeting my Creator. Instead, I kept going. When it became clear that the radiation wouldn't kill me, I went out into the most radioactive parts of the city to see if there was anyone I could rescue whom the emergency services couldn't reach. It was a grim time."
He frowns faintly at the recollection. "What disturbed me most was not the dead and dying, or the… People who looked like me but still possessed their wits. There were…"
"Ferals."
"Ferals?" He thinks for a moment. "That's not a bad name for them, I suppose."
"It's what they're called in America. Ardens who have lost their minds, either due to brain damage or due to their… Situation."
"I thought that they were in shock. They followed me willingly enough. It wasn't until we reached the aid station that… Their bestial nature revealed itself. You won't hear many of the Gentry making mention of them today."
I nod. "As I understand it, you've got an ardens aristocracy."
"Our pre-War leaders still remember when Britain was a nation. Outside of Cornwall, there haven't been any efforts to create new countries, but they're the people most strongly motivated to bring us all together. Our pre-War scientists are the best educated people in the nation." He shrugs. "Trinity College isn't what it was. And a soldier with two hundred years of experience is a very good soldier."
"And the mental decay?"
"Some… Some start to show the signs. I think that's why they haven't tried incorporating the Church into their organisation directly. I assign chaplains to make themselves available to any who need counselling. None of them want to admit to needing their help to keep going. None of them want to put someone with blackmail material in position to be their rival rather than their priest."
I nod. "Jolly decent of you."
"But the Queen…" He sighs. "She changed late. I'm not sure exactly what happened. I had already been sent to Canterbury to take control of what was left of the Church, and I've only spoken to her in person a few times since then. Mostly she was entirely lucid, but… Sometimes…"
"I… See. My abilities extend to probing minds. I usually don't look deeply, but if it's for her health, then…"
He nods emphatically. "Please do. She is a good monarch and a good woman and no one deserves to have that happen to them."
14:00 GMT
The Archbishop's face falls slightly as he gives me the bad news which, now that I think about it, I should have expected.
Getting a meeting with The Most Reverend Primate Calvin Robinson merely took a few surveillance pictures of French dockyards and a promise to relay a letter to any Anglicans in NCR territory in America. As expected, he's a ghoul, and also the man responsible for keeping the Church of England together during the Resource Wars and the post-apocalypse period. He was an old man when he turned into 'one of the Gentry', and…
"I think it speaks well of your character that you're prepared to have your marriage solemnised before God, but if you are not a Christian then I cannot perform the ceremony. And nor can I allow any of the priests in the Church of England to perform it in my stead."
"Yeah. No, that makes sense, actually."
He frowns in puzzlement. "Then why did you ask me?"
"Because my fiancée is a Christian, and a Church of England vicar would be a compromise between her denomination and my.. own preferences."
"You could accept baptism yourself. That would remove the obstacle."
"Yes, but I don't believe in God. I like the Anglican Church. I believe that Christianity has been a good and civilising influence on the world. I even met a demon once, and it was revolting. But when you get right down to it I'm not a man of faith and I have yet to see definitive evidence of God's presence in the world, so… Getting a baptism would involve lying about converting."
He nods, frowning faintly. "Which denomination does she belong to? They might be willing to modify their ceremony to accommodate you."
"She's a Mormon. Her whole tribe-."
He shakes his head. "Mormons aren't Christians."
"Are you-?" Heh. "Sorry, I just realised I was about to ask the Archbishop of Canterbury if he was sure what a Christian is. But… They sound fairly Christian? I'm not sure why you're making the distinction."
"The Old Testament is essentially the Jewish Torah. That doesn't make Christians Jewish, or Jews Christians. There is overlap of course, but the Mormons have altered both the beliefs essential to Christianity and the books of their version of the Bible too much to still be considered part of Christianity."
"Oh. Ah, alright. Well." I lean forwards, about to rise from my chair. "Thank you for your time. Oh, just.. one thing. What's the Church's view on magic?"
"Magic?" He sounds sceptical.
"Yes, magic. As I said, I've encountered a demon, as well as various.. strange phenomena. And pre-War America was experimenting with psychic abilities."
"That's not a question I've spent a great deal of time considering." He thinks for a moment as I sit back. "Attempting to communicate with demons is forbidden, for obvious reasons. Demons exist to tempt men to sin against God. Bargaining with them for any reason is completely incompatible with Christian morality. Similarly, there are no gods but God, if you'll forgive the Mohammadian phrasing. Attempting to communicate with 'spirits' is also forbidden, because they don't exist and the person doing it would either simply be wasting their time or in reality be communicating with a demon. As for things which are merely strange, well." He gestures to himself with his right hand. "I don't believe that Adam ever looked like this. And I haven't ever encountered 'psychic' phenomena that weren't simply confidence tricks."
I reach out with my right hand and telekinetically pull a book off his bookshelf.
"Ah." He blinks four times in rapid succession, his mouth opening slightly and then closing again. "Lord Harold didn't mention that."
I shrug as I return the book. "I didn't tell him."
"Is this ability natural to you?"
I-. I don't nod. "It's induced. There's a machine they built before the war, based on alien technology."
"But it's part of your body now."
"Yes."
"And it's purely physical?"
"As far as I understand it, yes."
He smiles faintly. "Then that's perfectly alright. Performing magic by using demons is a sin because it involves negotiating with demons, not because it lets you do something that men can't normally do. That doctrine comes from the early Church, when they had no way of distinguishing between 'magic' and chemistry, or other profane methods. Would you like me to put that in writing?"
Would I?
"You know what? Yes. I'll frame it and put it on the wall as a conversation starter."
"In that case, perhaps I could make something a little more artistic." His smile broadens. "How long will you be in Britain?"
"A few days more, unless my tribe needs me to return sooner. Lord Harold has asked me to help with tracking the whale pods, and the rest of the… Gentry?" He nods. "Are discussing how to handle foreign ambassadors. I'm told that there's a chance I might even get to meet Her Majesty."
"Yes." His smile fades slightly. "I suppose that would be appropriate. I will draft a Bull which lays out the theological case fully, with references to the writings of the founders of the Church and its greatest theologians. It should be an interesting challenge."
"Is there.. a problem? With the Queen?"
"The Queen…" He sighs. "I was one of the first people in Britain to change, like this." He briefly glances at a wall-mounted mirror. "I was working in London when the first missiles fell. I believed that it was the death knell of civilisation on Earth and I wanted to serve God and my community once more before the end, ministering to the sick and dying. When my hair fell out I assumed that I had radiation sickness and would soon be meeting my Creator. Instead, I kept going. When it became clear that the radiation wouldn't kill me, I went out into the most radioactive parts of the city to see if there was anyone I could rescue whom the emergency services couldn't reach. It was a grim time."
He frowns faintly at the recollection. "What disturbed me most was not the dead and dying, or the… People who looked like me but still possessed their wits. There were…"
"Ferals."
"Ferals?" He thinks for a moment. "That's not a bad name for them, I suppose."
"It's what they're called in America. Ardens who have lost their minds, either due to brain damage or due to their… Situation."
"I thought that they were in shock. They followed me willingly enough. It wasn't until we reached the aid station that… Their bestial nature revealed itself. You won't hear many of the Gentry making mention of them today."
I nod. "As I understand it, you've got an ardens aristocracy."
"Our pre-War leaders still remember when Britain was a nation. Outside of Cornwall, there haven't been any efforts to create new countries, but they're the people most strongly motivated to bring us all together. Our pre-War scientists are the best educated people in the nation." He shrugs. "Trinity College isn't what it was. And a soldier with two hundred years of experience is a very good soldier."
"And the mental decay?"
"Some… Some start to show the signs. I think that's why they haven't tried incorporating the Church into their organisation directly. I assign chaplains to make themselves available to any who need counselling. None of them want to admit to needing their help to keep going. None of them want to put someone with blackmail material in position to be their rival rather than their priest."
I nod. "Jolly decent of you."
"But the Queen…" He sighs. "She changed late. I'm not sure exactly what happened. I had already been sent to Canterbury to take control of what was left of the Church, and I've only spoken to her in person a few times since then. Mostly she was entirely lucid, but… Sometimes…"
"I… See. My abilities extend to probing minds. I usually don't look deeply, but if it's for her health, then…"
He nods emphatically. "Please do. She is a good monarch and a good woman and no one deserves to have that happen to them."
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AmericanNumbers
Not too sore, are you?
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Paul save the Queen
Chojin Patriarch
Veteran Lurker
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So, the right man in the right place at the right time. And lucky enough to survive the whole process. I have the feeling he has points he can't be reasonable about, though. That seems to be something of a theme with the Ardens of England.
At least he's being reasonable about that. No frothing denouncements or the like.
I suppose a priest of her denomination should suffice, then.
Which isn't the best start to have with a deity.
So... that's a no, I guess?
I mean, it could have been worse. Her tribe could have been scientologists or something.
Ironically, the question of 'are we still Jews or not?' was a big point of contention back in the early days. Among other things like the exact ratio of human to divine in Jesus' nature...
And, well... Things happen in the wasteland that cannot be explained by science, sometimes.
A surprisingly reasonable approach to matters. But...
...Sometimes, you simply haven't seen everything.
That's actually a reasonable question too. I suppose the answer decides how he rules on the matter.
Wonder if it works on Ardens. Honestly, surprised Krono hasn't been more outgoing about the spreading of psionics.
Since science still has a long way to go before it understands it completely.
Well, that'll make one heck of a souvenir, if nothing else.
A nice little bonus for the trip.
To be fair, when your nearest neighbour hates your guts and wants you all dead, diplomacy gets a bit rusty.
Hopefully not one that would require her abdication. That would raise all manner of legal issues, I suspect.
A damn fine man. He certainly earned whatever reward he gets...
Sounds like a bad time.
A process that's more or less irreversible, I guess. I doubt anyone's tried to give them therapy, though...
Ah. I can guess their response to the matter, yes...
Heh. Beware the old man in a profession where most die young, eh?
Well, that's a bit of a downer.
Ooh, sounds awkward.
Well, that's a heck of a sidequest.
So, Krono's wedding just a got a bit trickier to arrange. And now he has a chance to get in good with the British leadership. A whole trip full of ups and downs, it seems. Let's hope he can do something for Her Majesty, since I suspect the last thing anyone wants is a messy succession crisis due to a mad queen...
Cuchulin
Versed in the lewd.
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- Jan 25, 2019
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- 2,417
Cohen the Barberian and his Silver Horde are a perfect example of this.
Also I wouldn't be surprised if Fallout England had a Ghoul Lawyer that went by Mr Slant.
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Vaermina
Well worn.
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- Oct 16, 2015
- Messages
- 6,923
That's nice, Todd Howard doesn't believe in you either.
All signs point to the degeneration being caused by continued radiation exposure given what the Nuka World DLC showed us.
Rebu
hey, little Anna, you're the one
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Paul, save the Queen
moralrelativity
Recovering pendant.
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Bull -> Bill ?
NightmareWarden
Versed in the lewd.
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Okay, but after her mental health is fixed- is Paul going to tell her that the Gentry are fertile? Because if any of Scandinavia's monarchs survived, there are non-French options for the royal bloodline.
I'm mostly suggesting this because "ghoul princess of the irradiated hellscape called Europe" sounds like a wonderful story premise.
I'm mostly suggesting this because "ghoul princess of the irradiated hellscape called Europe" sounds like a wonderful story premise.
Cuchulin
Versed in the lewd.
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Bull is likely accurate, look up Papal Bull.