Just a Phase [Worm]

[Ronmr]

However the judge, while sympathetic to Taylor, must make his decisions based on the law and evidence, in that order. Unless he finds a superior of both Piggot and Amstrong giving orders about Phase that are explicit enough to be considered a conspiracy he must consider each different regional PRT/Protectorate office as different organizations.

In the case of the ENE Wards he contacted the local District Attourney, first to check in how advanced was the case against Hess and Barnes and then when he discovered that there was no open investigation he gave the local DA the evidence Taylor and the Boston office had gathered as well as hints that if they didn't want the Department of Justice to go looking for people to smack down they would stop treating it in-house and start acting like cops instead of covering their asses. That's about as much as he can do without getting into a fight with a completely different jurisdiction, and in practice is probable that Sophia had her parole revoked and Emma, who did show remorse, cooperated with the investigation and was kinda crazy would get on probation herself; and of course Piggot would have to at least fire a few more administrative and legal drones at the same time her paperwork for warrants triples to calm down the DA.

On her being forced into the Wards with a serious conflict of interests the fact is that Danny wasn't lied about it with the PRT just mentioning that the matter was 'under investigation' and still signed her off to a different state and regional office. And even Taylor and Young Guard has to admit that the Boston Office acts well within both the letter and the spirit of the laws and regulations regarding Wards so legally speaking she cannot complain of her treatment, not even of the tour incident counts since even the most basic forms of Loco Parentis guardianship does allow schools to force children to interact with others through either community service, extracurricular and curricular classes as well as other events, and at the same time schools are allowed to restrict the Right of Expression within school grounds and hours, plus Taylor didn't even receive a punishment so arguing any kind of abuse of authority would be hard and ambiguous.

Ironically enough the one incident that a canny lawyer could use to demostrate incompetence from the Boston Office is the fact that Taylor was able to put herself in harms way as a vigilante without proper supervision from the PRT/Protectorate and their own regulations prevented them from doing anything about it even when having her in front of them. That said the judge, being a responsible adult himself would be just as angry with Taylor and would slap a number of restrictions and punishments, so using this tactic would be pyrrhic at best.

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Would the judge be in right if that Taylor was going as a Vigilante came to light to set it so that she goes to a mandated psychiatrist? Because it would show that she isn't acting against the PRT/Protectorate to not go out as a cape, but rather go out independently outside of PRT/Protectorate oversight.

 

[BF110C4]

Would the judge be in right if that Taylor was going as a Vigilante came to light to set it so that she goes to a mandated psychiatrist? Because it would show that she isn't acting against the PRT/Protectorate to not go out as a cape, but rather go out independently outside of PRT/Protectorate oversight.

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Theorically as part of the Wards she is already going to a mandated therapist, which the judge would rather not touch one way or another because Taylor is stubborn as a mule and she makes things harder the more she is forced into a situation.

As for the reasons why he would oppose Taylor going as a vigilante, the first one is obvious, Taylor is looking for crimes to stop without supervision, training, protective gear or the possibility of back-up when she is already in a program that offers all that, even if she dislikes her coworkers and the system. Risking life and limb out of spite is the kind of mistake that adults are obligated to stop even if the child in question hates you for it (and goes double for teens).

Then one of the reasons Taylor gives from not getting tested and not joining the Wards is that she doesn't wish to go in a costume to fight for love and justice. She going as a vigilante means that she was not sincere about all her reasons not to take the test. In one episode of Law & Order the judge decides against forcing someone into a biopsy on the grounds that there is a possibility that anesthesia would be harmful, but the moment the person consent to a voluntary medical procedure the order to prevent the biopsy is considered null because the risk is already happening. I can see a judge worried about Taylor killing herself accepting that interpretation of the law and proceed with the testing on the grounds that she is already exploring her powers and risking herself, therefore is safer if those things are done by experts with appropiate equipment and experience.

Finally the judge was so harsh against Jim Reed because he believed that using loopholes in laws and regulations to go against the spirit of the law is wrong, and to act as a vigilante Taylor is twisting into a pretzel Young Guard regulations that prevent the PRT/Protectorate from interfering with their right to privacy (which as teens under the Protectorate care is more like a priviledge) and the common hero courtesy of not delving too deep into the secret identity of heroes who are not breaking the law, he might not be able to punish her for it but he sure as hell reduce the amount of leeway he already gave her.

Also as an option I actually contemplated adding to the omake that in case director Amstrong grows desperate enough he can actually break the YG regulations, follow Taylor through conventional means including Boston's CCTV and catch her in the middle of her actions as a vigilante. There is a good chance that if he explains his reasons to Jim and Jim's superior he would get off with comparatively light punishments since those regulations are for protecting the children, and they playing cape crusader in their free time is even less safe than most Wards activities including patrols. The other way Boston can end Taylor's career as a vigilante is for them to record the voice of her alter-ego which they obtained as part of the legitimate investigation of a violent clash between parahumans, explain to a judge their concerns about a minor under their guardianship risking her life with reckless actions and request a warrant to compare the voice of the vigilante with, and oly with, a legaly obtained voice sample of Taylor Hebert and then using that to ground her with the full support of YG who are not going to be amused themselves in having to rewrite their rules and regulations to close such a dangerous loophole nationwide before another teen decides to go to the streets looking for trouble (outside working hours).

 

[tarrangar]

Then one of the reasons Taylor gives from not getting tested and not joining the Wards is that she doesn't wish to go in a costume to fight for love and justice. She going as a vigilante means that she was not sincere about all her reasons not to take the test. In one episode of Law & Order the judge decides against forcing someone into a biopsy on the grounds that there is a possibility that anesthesia would be harmful, but the moment the person consent to a voluntary medical procedure the order to prevent the biopsy is considered null because the risk is already happening. I can see a judge worried about Taylor killing herself accepting that interpretation of the law and proceed with the testing on the grounds that she is already exploring her powers and risking herself, therefore is safer if those things are done by experts with appropiate equipment and experience.

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It's not that she don't want to join the Wards, because she don't want to fight for love and justice, she don't want to join the Wards, because she don't want to work for the organisation that enabled a murder attempt on her, that's a fully legitimate opinion, it's just as legitimate to dislike an employer, as it is to dislike a job, and Taylor has good reasons, to not want to work for the Wards.

Opposing Taylor going out as a vigilante, is rooted in the idea, that even though the Wards enabled her murder attempt, it's still inherently better for her to be a hero in their employ, than for her to be an independent hero, or a hero working for someone else.

Actually that would be a fun alternate timeline omake for this, one where Taylor approach a corporate hero team, and get an agreement that they will hire her if she get emancipated, or get permission from her guardian to work for them, then use the fact that she has this job lined up, to argue that she should be able to get emancipated and leave the Wards.

 

[Ronmr]

It's not that she don't want to join the Wards, because she don't want to fight for love and justice, she don't want to join the Wards, because she don't want to work for the organisation that enabled a murder attempt on her, that's a fully legitimate opinion, it's just as legitimate to dislike an employer, as it is to dislike a job, and Taylor has good reasons, to not want to work for the Wards.

Opposing Taylor going out as a vigilante, is rooted in the idea, that even though the Wards enabled her murder attempt, it's still inherently better for her to be a hero in their employ, than for her to be an independent hero, or a hero working for someone else.

Actually that would be a fun alternate timeline omake for this, one where Taylor approach a corporate hero team, and get an agreement that they will hire her if she get emancipated, or get permission from her guardian to work for them, then use the fact that she has this job lined up, to argue that she should be able to get emancipated and leave the Wards.

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Oooh, that is a good idea, get emancipated, and work for a corpo team, heck she could after that unmask herself for all she care and go and sue PRT/Protectorate for the trigger event.

 

[BF110C4]

Oooh, that is a good idea, get emancipated, and work for a corpo team, heck she could after that unmask herself for all she care and go and sue PRT/Protectorate for the trigger event.

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That said I can think of a lot of things that a well funded corporate parahuman team would want with a person that can go through walls, got a top tier danger sense and is inmune to targeted Thinker and Master powers, and few of those things are good or legal.

Taylor having an internal debate between being free from the PRT/Protectorate or becoming a criminal would make for an interesting plot, particularly if the crime she commits are primarily corporate espionage with victims with literal millions to spare.

 

[tarrangar]

That said I can think of a lot of things that a well funded corporate parahuman team would want with a person that can go through walls, got a top tier danger sense and is inmune to targeted Thinker and Master powers, and few of those things are good or legal.

Taylor having an internal debate between being free from the PRT/Protectorate or becoming a criminal would make for an interesting plot, particularly if the crime she commits are primarily corporate espionage with victims with literal millions to spare.

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Eh while that's what they would pay the most for, she's also valuable as a hero advertizing their products, and there's ebough corporate teams, that she could find one that wouldn't force her to commit crimes.

A cape with no criminal record can pretty much always find a job, as if nothing else, any place that employ security guards, will be glad to hire them, though depending on their power, how much more pay than a normal security guard they will get varies.

 

[Keiran Halcyon]

With all this legal speak about Taylor's situation. I recall that a IRL lawyer from Massachusetts (or was it New York) , who's also a Worm fan, drew up a fully legal lawsuit doc in pdf regarding what charges Emma, Sophia and Madison would've faced and the School and the PRT, if the setting ran on IRL law. But I've lost the link and I think it was posted on SB somewhere.

Anyone remember / read that?

 

[Ronmr]

With all this legal speak about Taylor's situation. I recall that a IRL lawyer from Massachusetts (or was it New York) , who's also a Worm fan, drew up a fully legal lawsuit doc in pdf regarding what charges Emma, Sophia and Madison would've faced and the School and the PRT, if the setting ran on IRL law. But I've lost the link and I think it was posted on SB somewhere.

Anyone remember / read that?

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I've unfortunately never seen that, would love to know though. Hope someone knows.

 

[Big Lurker]

What I'm waiting to see is Accord's reaction to a Thinker nullifying parahuman in his city. Hopefully he's smart enough to not murder them, but applying pressure to get them transferred to a different region could be amusing. Possibly giving them 'an offer they can't refuse', not realizing that she's gotten to the point of digging her heels in with pretty much every body...

 

[Rymu]

What I'm waiting to see is Accord's reaction to a Thinker nullifying parahuman in his city. Hopefully he's smart enough to not murder them, but applying pressure to get them transferred to a different region could be amusing. Possibly giving them 'an offer they can't refuse', not realizing that she's gotten to the point of digging her heels in with pretty much every body...

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Taylor's power only works on targeted effects against herself. Accord's power only boosts his own intelligence last I checked. So a loophole like in the Tyranid Taylor fic is probable here.

 

[BF110C4]

Taylor's power only works on targeted effects against herself. Accord's power only boosts his own intelligence last I checked. So a loophole like in the Tyranid Taylor fic is probable here.

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In fact that plus her obvious dislike of the PRT/Protectorate makes Taylor an excellent choice for recruiting as either a spy against the heroes or as a operative working directly or for a commission for Accord.

 

[apeljohn]

Unless he finds a superior of both Piggot and Amstrong giving orders about Phase that are explicit enough to be considered a conspiracy he must consider each different regional PRT/Protectorate office as different organizations.

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1) Would a centrally-drafted media communications policy count? They'd almost certainly have one, and I suspect it'd include wording to the effect of "communications with journalists need to go through us". For most people this would be harmless boilerplate, but in Taylor's case it would start to look more like a code of omerta.

The general problem here seems to be that the PRT are attempting to have their cake and eat it vis-à-vis being both Taylor's guardian and her employer. That seems like the sort of situation that'd generate lots of inappropriately-scoped policies and similar legally-exploitable screw-ups, with the above being just one possible example.

2) Wouldn't the fact that Piggot referred Danny to the Boston PRT cast shade on the idea that these are truly independent organisations? Clearly she doesn't think they are, or she would also have given him the details of a bunch of corporate teams.

3) In the context of Armstrong's complaints about pressure from above, that bit about "a superior ... giving orders" sounds like a bit of a plot hook. If Costa-Brown or someone told Armstrong "ye gods please make that girl stop talking", would that be sufficient to meet the criteria for conspiracy?

and at the same time schools are allowed to restrict the Right of Expression within school grounds and hours

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My (vague, non-lawyerly) understanding is that this is only possible because those grounds/hours are very clearly bounded. Something something prior restraint?

If the PRT told her "you can't say bad things about the Wards during the tours," is she then in a position to demand to know when she can say those things?

plus Taylor didn't even receive a punishment so arguing any kind of abuse of authority would be hard and ambiguous

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A smart (?) thing for Taylor to do would be to make the argument anyway in the hope that the judge would include this exact counter in his ruling. Then, if anyone does try to punish her for disparaging the Wards Program in future, she can point at the wording of the ruling and say "you sure you want to do that, mate?".

 

[SlickRCBD]

My (vague, non-lawyerly) understanding is that this is only possible because those grounds/hours are very clearly bounded. Something something prior restraint?

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Oh, the schools have this lovely thing called the "Co-curricular code" where you can be punished at school for things done out of school. Mostly restricted to losing extra-curricular activities (including the school taking away your right to work an out-of-school job if you are under 18, or taking away your driver's license if you are under 18. Yes, the politicians gave both the school and the parents the ability to take those things away, or they did in the mid-'90s in Illinois ), but if you say or do something that can embarrass the school or damage it's reputation, true or not, you can be punished even if you aren't in any extra curricular activities. It's part of your responsibilities as a student.
So Taylor going to the press and blowing the whistle on the hostile environment at Winslow and say showing a video of Sophia pushing her down the stairs and the nurse claiming the injury was self-inflicted when Taylor reports Sophia, Emma pouring milk or juice on her school books or ripping them up and Blackwell blaming Taylor saying to stop blaming other students and that the books were Taylor's responsibility, and Madison leading a bunch of girls to corner Taylor with Gladly walking away and doing nothing.
Taylor would be open to retaliation for ruining the school's reputation and respectability.

 

[BF110C4]

1) Would a centrally-drafted media communications policy count? They'd almost certainly have one, and I suspect it'd include wording to the effect of "communications with journalists need to go through us". For most people this would be harmless boilerplate, but in Taylor's case it would start to look more like a code of omerta.

The general problem here seems to be that the PRT are attempting to have their cake and eat it vis-à-vis being both Taylor's guardian and her employer. That seems like the sort of situation that'd generate lots of inappropriately-scoped policies and similar legally-exploitable screw-ups, with the above being just one possible example.

2) Wouldn't the fact that Piggot referred Danny to the Boston PRT cast shade on the idea that these are truly independent organisations? Clearly she doesn't think they are, or she would also have given him the details of a bunch of corporate teams.

3) In the context of Armstrong's complaints about pressure from above, that bit about "a superior ... giving orders" sounds like a bit of a plot hook. If Costa-Brown or someone told Armstrong "ye gods please make that girl stop talking", would that be sufficient to meet the criteria for conspiracy?

A smart (?) thing for Taylor to do would be to make the argument anyway in the hope that the judge would include this exact counter in his ruling. Then, if anyone does try to punish her for disparaging the Wards Program in future, she can point at the wording of the ruling and say "you sure you want to do that, mate?".

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1) Thing is that having common policies and being part of the chain of command does not make them being patners in a criminal endeavour. And at least this fic does a good job showing that the leadership of the Boston office of the PRT/Protectorate is following the letter of the law to the point that the director is not worried at all about actions of the Young Guard against his command while Piggot was hit with a flood of complains and restrictions for her own Ward program so while she can make the claim of conspiracy she got no way to prove it and to be fair the reason is that is because the Boston office is actually innocent of what happen to Taylor in BB and after.

2) Frankly she was thinking less about Boston cooperating with the conspiracy of silence and more about getting one of the three persons involved in a very nasty conflict out of the city before something tragic (like Taylor ripping the heart of her former best friend in an act of justified fury) happened, and Taylor was easier to move away than two already unveiled wards with access to a lawyer.

3) Conspiracy needs to be very specific in what the people involved are doing and why. If Costa-Brown uses the wording of "ye gods please make that girl stop talking" then its not since there are plenty of legal ways of doing so without it being illegal, such as paying her money for her silence, scouring the book for legal punishments or firing her from the Wards after she signs an NDA. If the Director decided against it and tried to threaten her with harm Costa-Brown would still be off the hook since its unreasonable that a high ranked law enforcement officer would interpretate her orders as permission to break the law.

As for forcing a judge to clarify rules and regulations of what it is a law enforcement agency in which Taylor's previous legal guardian signed a very detailed series of contracts, authorizations and NDAs would probably not end with the desired outcome. Weld was very careful in how he dealt with Phase's comentaries in order to not make things worse, I doubt that a judge forced to make a precedent would be as gentle and permissive.

Oh, the schools have this lovely thing called the "Co-curricular code" where you can be punished at school for things done out of school. Mostly restricted to losing extra-curricular activities (including the school taking away your right to work an out-of-school job if you are under 16, or taking away your driver's license if you are under 18. Yes, the politicians gave both the school and the parents the ability to take those things away, or they did in the mid-'90s in Illinois ), but if you say or do something that can embarrass the school or damage it's reputation, true or not, you can be punished even if you aren't in any extra curricular activities. It's part of your responsibilities as a student.
So Taylor going to the press and blowing the whistle on the hostile environment at Winslow and say showing a video of Sophia pushing her down the stairs and the nurse claiming the injury was self-inflicted when Taylor reports Sophia, Emma pouring milk or juice on her school books or ripping them up and Blackwell blaming Taylor saying to stop blaming other students and that the books were Taylor's responsibility, and Madison leading a bunch of girls to corner Taylor with Gladly walking away and doing nothing.
Taylor would be open to retaliation for ruining the school's responsibility.

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Yeah, bullying, school's limits on Right of Speech, state laws regarding privacy in public and private spaces (and the exact definition of each) got a thorny and painful history, although in most cases those are over once there is a clear cut case of assault or worse, which the locker was. That Emma and Sophia are Wards shouldn't be that much of an actual protection from prosecution since they cannot benefit from the legal protections most LEOs got since they commited their crimes on their own time for reasons completely uninvolved with crime fighting, with only their secret identities and the fact that the Protectorate took care of the investigation saving them from inmediate arrest, and considering that there is enough evidence, including the statement of Emma and her willingness to confess to fill chrages at this point I'm sure the ENE PRT/Protectorate are breaking at least a few laws by stalling.

Right now what is saving the school and the Wards from no less than three different scandals are the NDA's signed when Taylor was forced into the Wards, laws protecting the identity and privacy of minors which curtails the ability of newspapers from investigating the scandal, the distance from BB preventing Taylor from simply walking to a reporter and give him a story that would at least keep people asking questions and of course the lack of a lawyer of her own (which is the reason why I made the omake).

 

[Prince Charon]

NDAs are not binding to people who haven't turned eighteen, yet.

 

[Scranj]

NDAs are not binding to people who haven't turned eighteen, yet.

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...Unless signed by the parents for the child, whether thr child wanted to or not. And we already know Danny got played by the PRT with what he signed so there's no doubt they'd get him to sign the most important thing for covering their own asses while convincing him it's all for Taylor.

 

[tarrangar]

...Unless signed by the parents for the child, whether thr child wanted to or not. And we already know Danny got played by the PRT with what he signed so there's no doubt they'd get him to sign the most important thing for covering their own asses while convincing him it's all for Taylor.

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Is it actually covering for the child still? Or do it only allow you to punish the parent for the child breaking it, because I don't think Taylor care too much about keeping Danny out of legal trouble in this fic.

 

[mattsaber]

lookin forward to the trainwreck coming their way. You want to look away but cant and at some point you realize you don't want to.

 

[BF110C4]

Is it actually covering for the child still? Or do it only allow you to punish the parent for the child breaking it, because I don't think Taylor care too much about keeping Danny out of legal trouble in this fic.

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We need to assume that any NDA is legitimate and binding for children part of the Wards, particularly in the case of probatory ones or wards of the state.

They need to be considering the real risk members of the Wards and Protectorate have of kidnapping or murder if their identities or operational details of missions and patrols are leaked, which means that carelessly and intentionally releasing information can be treated as a penal matter.

 

[tarrangar]

We need to assume that any NDA is legitimate and binding for children part of the Wards, particularly in the case of probatory ones or wards of the state.

They need to be considering the real risk members of the Wards and Protectorate have of kidnapping or murder if their identities or operational details of missions and patrols are leaked, which means that carelessly and intentionally releasing information can be treated as a penal matter.

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Wonder how the NDAs work when they turn 18, because after you stop being a minor, you certainly can't be held liable for what your parents signed on your behalf, so if Taylor refuse to sign any NDA after turning 18, what can they do?

 

[BF110C4]

Wonder how the NDAs work when they turn 18, because after you stop being a minor, you certainly can't be held liable for what your parents signed on your behalf, so if Taylor refuse to sign any NDA after turning 18, what can they do?

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Probably created new laws to treat revealing details of Ward and Protectorate identities as crimes. It would be an imperfect law and very open to abuse, but it would not be the first time it happens.

Alternatively the Protectorate might just simply treat all intentional leaks from former wards as criminal negligence at best and attempted murder at worst and make damn sure graduating Wards understand that even if they win a trial after years of appeals and obstructionism from the government they will be dealing with the legal and financial consequences for decades while banned from any legal employment and hunted like animals if they go villain. Not particularly legal, but good enough for government work.

 

[tarrangar]

Probably created new laws to treat revealing details of Ward and Protectorate identities as crimes. It would be an imperfect law and very open to abuse, but it would not be the first time it happens.

Alternatively the Protectorate might just simply treat all intentional leaks from former wards as criminal negligence at best and attempted murder at worst and make damn sure graduating Wards understand that even if they win a trial after years of appeals and obstructionism from the government they will be dealing with the legal and financial consequences for decades while banned from any legal employment and hunted like animals if they go villain. Not particularly legal, but good enough for government work.

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That would be for things that don't need NDAs though, if information is inherently illegal to disclose, then an NDA isn't needed, a NDA is needed, when something would be legal to disclose, but an organization don't want it disclosed, so they tell you they will only give you the information if you sign a contract, stating that you specifically are barred from disclosing this information.

Taylor is barred to disclose more than a civilian would be barred from disclosing, a civilian who found out a Wards identity and published it, could be punished because it's a crime to disclose that information, what the NDAs are for, is things like Taylor talking about how the Wards pressganged her, or Taylor disclosing details about how the probation program work.

Or for another example, there's no need for an NDA, to prevent you from telling someone that Assaults secret identity is Ethan, because that's already classified information, but there might be a need for an NDA, to prevent you from telling that Assault used to be Madcap, because it's not illegal to connect a post-rebrand Parahuman, with their pre-rebrand Cape name.

So the question is, if Taylor refuse to sign any NDAs after turning 18, is there anything preventing her from publishing all information she have, that it would be legal for a civilian to publish?

 

[SlickRCBD]

Right now what is saving the school and the Wards from no less than three different scandals are the NDA's signed when Taylor was forced into the Wards, laws protecting the identity and privacy of minors which curtails the ability of newspapers from investigating the scandal, the distance from BB preventing Taylor from simply walking to a reporter and give him a story that would at least keep people asking questions and of course the lack of a lawyer of her own (which is the reason why I made the omake).

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What would happen to Taylor legally if she flagrantly violated the NDA signed by Danny, who is no longer her guardian and Taylor's current guardian has a clear conflict of interest when it comes to that contract? Say she wrote a letter with any proof she has detailing exactly what happened to her and sent it to all the newspaper, magazine, television and news radio stations in Brockton Bay?
Taylor never signed those NDAs and in fact refused the contracts. They were signed by others on her behalf over her objections.

Wonder how the NDAs work when they turn 18, because after you stop being a minor, you certainly can't be held liable for what your parents signed on your behalf, so if Taylor refuse to sign any NDA after turning 18, what can they do?

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They can try to say "She went along with the contract up to this point and got benefits from it (the Wards' pay) she clearly accepted it."

 

[tarrangar]

They can try to say "She went along with the contract up to this point and got benefits from it (the Wards' pay) she clearly accepted it."

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Thing is she did that while underage, where she's legally obligated to do that, if she stayed in the Protectorate for a couple years first they would have a point, but a job really can't use that argument, when the employee in question, were there only because their parent signed a contract, and they quit the moment they turned 18, because then your argument is basically, she didn't break the law to get out of the contract, therefore she clearly accepted it.

 

[Qaw]

Skimming the current discussion, this all feels like a "Here is what you will get threatened with in order to cow you into submission, because we don't want to negotiate with you on an even playing field" than a "Here is a realistic legal scenario."

Not only is the law in Worm a hydrogen-filled soccer ball when it comes to Parahumans, but Taylor also has a very effective power against all forms of non-torturous containment.

Then there's the NDAs, which are themselves an intimidation stick most effective against those that can't afford a lawyer. Even more so with the school speech laws which will probably be declared unconstitutional sooner rather than later.

News Flash: Anything can be used as a legal argument so long as the judge lets them get away with it and your counsel is sleeping.
Let me rephrase: All of the legal points raised in this thread for and against are a matter for the appeals court. Which will take their sweet time even when you have a clear case of abuse of power.

Which assuming that the Judge is going to be favorable to the PRT, and he will be favorable to the PRT, you're looking at a lengthy and expensive headache that will overshadow whatever damages the PRT may be looking to collect even if you win.

And to cap it any legal minutiae will almost certainly be overshadowed by the media circus.

So...I am still not sure what the point of all of this was, but I guess some people love their legal arguments. Phase sure doesn't have to care, because they won't really factor into her life.


PS: What I guess I was trying to say and never properly formulated, is that the right and wrong of the legal arguments raised before my post is only of moderate relevance compared to the lawyers that raise them and the judge (and the jury if this is a jury trial).
And to add to that the court itself is only of moderate relevance compared to the media and the realpolitiks of parahuman diplomacy.

 

[SlickRCBD]

Which is kind of why I asked what would happen in this case if Taylor flagrantly disregarded the NDA and the contract signed by Danny. Normally the parents/guardian whose name is on the contract is held accountable for the teen's misbehavior, but Taylor wouldn't care if her PRT guardian is hurt by her violating the NDA. She might care about Danny Hebert, but not her guardian.
Attempts to confine her would mean she could attempt to escape and goto the press about "wrongful imprisonment" by the PRT and cite the conflict of interest if they say they are acting as her parents and grounding her, rather than as law enforcement, just to make a media storm.

I know, it would never fly with a teen defying adults, especially ones with Authority, hence why I'm asking what would actually happen.

 

[Qaw]

When you're asking the question of "What can [Government Authority] do to Taylor for [X reason]" it has already been discussed in some detail that the PRT is playing a prolonged game of 'Pressure the Boiler'. Put too much pressure, the boiler explodes Taylor goes off on her own. Don't put enough pressure, you get pressure from above asking why the child soldier isn't fighting yet. The PRTs attempts, or rather their lack of ability to actually do anything aside from getting Taylor into a meeting room and making frowny faces at her is a good part of the hilarity. Although I will note that the Youth Guard is the PRT's biggest savior in this story because they stop them from exploding the boiler putting the foot in their mouth too much.

Whether the current piece that upsets the PRT is Taylor violating the NDA or her taking extra chicken nuggets from the cafeteria or doing Vigilante work doesn't change the equation.
Though her doing the former will probably lead to enough pressure on Armstrong to break the balance and explode the boiler due to loss of face. But again, this continues to be court harem politics where the letters of the law are at most a useful tool all of the involved parties can and will go around with whenever they become too inconvenient. The involved parties here including Taylor, Armstrong, Armstong's superiors, the public, wards, villains, and the media, with the possible exception of the Youth Guard.

 

[GFFerrari]

As far as I understand about NDAs for minors, they can't be signed for them, they can have a parent co-sign to give it validity, and I believe in some cases the minor by themselves can do it and it applies, but it is not guaranteed. Also if they sign as a minor but turn 18 it might be enforceable, all those things are complex and may depend on the courts, but the most important thing is that they can't have someone sign for them. In this case I doubt Taylor signed anything and by no means her father can sign an NDA that applies to her without her co-signing, so there is that.

I see all this as another reason for the PRT to thread carefully, if it turns into a legal fight they have very little they can pin on Taylor, unless she unmasks Sophia and Emma, which is a crime, but they can't gag her about anything else she knows about the PRT crimes and such.

 

[Highlord]

NDAs are not binding to people who haven't turned eighteen, yet.

Click to shrink...

They also can't be used to cover up illegal activity. The PRT is talking out it's ass and thinking it can get by via intimidation tactics. It worked on Danny because they jumped him at an weaker time than he was in beforehand, when as an experienced and trusted Union negotiator he should have seen it coming. But he caved.

Which is why I hope Taylor just goes nuclear and blows the doors off everything. She owes the PRT nothing, and will never see justice unless she takes it herself.

Damages the PRT's precious image? Well, the fuckers should have thought of that before, shouldn't they?

 

[Prince Charon]

Damages the PRT's precious image? Well, the fuckers should have thought of that before, shouldn't they?

Click to shrink...

'A group that can be destroyed by the true must be destroyed by the truth.'