With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[BlueMangoAdea]

While I still think it's a very bad idea to make black rings at all, I can sorta understand why Paul would be more willing than I am. After all, he's seen his own alternate run around with a black ring without being overly disastrous(though that part where Zaul starts praying to Nekron for a midbattle powerup was worrying, but Paul isn't aware of that). Frankly, my biggest issue is trusting Kalmin, who is omnicodal, with the creation of black ring. If it's made by Hinon, I suppose that might be relatively safer? Still a terrible idea.

 

[Darko]

The Black Ring thing is interesting. On the one hand we've seen him slap down Necron and Hades has significantly leveled up and by extension Melinoe

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Paul hasn't slapped down Nekron before.

Hades also hasn't gained more power.

When those souls were given to him he actually gave up some of his power to make them more alive.

 

[Darko]

No, OL. No Black Rings! Have you forgotten what that means? Maybe you could convince him to develop an Orange ring suitable for use by an Earth Deity, that'd be a good challenge.

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He did want to recruit those two goddesses, so this would actually be a good idea.

Like, say, his companions? OL's put quite a lot of work into making a good impression on Hades. Getting his little girl killed out here might put a dampener on that.

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After her kidnapping, Hades may be very protective of her.

And that's without mentioning Persephone.

 

[Old Knife]

To get a usable Black Lantern, you'll need to replace Necron with someone less..... Interested in the heat death of the universe.

 

[Bud-E]

Does anyone remember what Melione looks like?

 

[Mr Zoat]

'at the'
'A sweep'

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Mr Zoat, the new threadmark has a comma: Threadmarks: Sungate, (part 24).

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Thank you, corrected.

Just to confirm, the Godspeech was from an AI, like the ones found in the Sphere, Motherboxes, and Fatherboxes?

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The SI doesn't know.

Does anyone remember what Melione looks like?

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There was a description when she first appeared.

 

[Rockinalice]

Are... Are you a complete idiot?

You want to feed a minor god of death to freaking Nekron!?

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I mean necron isnt the only being that can run the black lantern corp if your willing to take the risk you could ask Death of the Endless since she supersede him in the hierarchy. Hades could probably use the ring fine and not have to many problems but i dont know about his daughter.

But yeah your right its a terrible idea, if you dont have the backing of someone either more powerful then him or equal that can replace him or protect you from his influence

 

[The Unaligned Player]

If I remember correctly Nekron is Silence, not Death so creating a Corps with Hades or everyone's favorite Goth wouldn't really affect the crotchety skeleton.

 

[Bud-E]

If I remember correctly Nekron is Silence, not Death so creating a Corps with Hades or everyone's favorite Goth wouldn't really affect the crotchety skeleton.

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It's true there's a distinction between Nekron and Death, but Nekron can and has hijacked the Black Lantern corps to power himself up feeding off the "death" he causes.

 

[Mr Zoat]

I mean necron isnt the only being that can run the black lantern corp if your willing to take the risk you could ask Death of the Endless since she supersede him in the hierarchy. Hades could probably use the ring fine and not have to many problems but i dont know about his daughter.

But yeah your right its a terrible idea, if you dont have the backing of someone either more powerful then him or equal that can replace him or protect you from his influence

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A necron couldn't run a Black Lantern Corps. Nekron could, though.

I'd like to point out that you haven't seen this continuety's version of Nekron yet. If the SI's lucky, you won't.

 

[Lord Ernest]

So that means we will see him. Nice.

 

[rkyeun]

Augh, no, you idot-ball-carrying... You get the GODDESS OF NIGHTMARES a yellow ring.

 

[Coda]

Augh, no, you idot-ball-carrying... You get the GODDESS OF NIGHTMARES a yellow ring.

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She's enlightened. Yes, she could probably operate a yellow ring, but black would respond to her better.

 

[Vaermina]

I mean necron isnt the only being that can run the black lantern corp if your willing to take the risk you could ask Death of the Endless since she supersede him in the hierarchy. Hades could probably use the ring fine and not have to many problems but i dont know about his daughter.

But yeah your right its a terrible idea, if you dont have the backing of someone either more powerful then him or equal that can replace him or protect you from his influence

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Nekron is the Black Entity...

Also no, Nekron is the equal of Death of the Endless.

To wit, Death of the Endless is part of a trinity of equal beings with the Black Racer and Nekron.

Death of Endless is the Compassionate Release of Death, the Black Racer is the Inevitable Ending of Death, while Nekron is the Cosmic Certainty of Death.*

*Captain Atom #42

 

[Rockinalice]

Nekron is the Black Entity...

Also no, Nekron is the equal of Death of the Endless.

To wit, Death of the Endless is part of a trinity of equal beings with the Black Racer and Nekron.

Death of Endless is the Compassionate Release of Death, the Black Racer is the Inevitable Ending of Death, while Nekron is the Cosmic Certainty of Death.*

*Captain Atom #42

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This right here made by the creator of the characters Neil Gaimen himself saying that the endless are not an Aspect of their Idea they are the very CONCEPT itself and its opposite so Death of the Endless is both DEATH/LIFE
The captain adam comic you are talking about was made from another author and neil gaiman counters this in sandman #20 but this video by comic drake explains it better then me

 

[Vaermina]

This right here made by the creator of the characters Neil Gaimen himself saying that the endless are not an Aspect of their Idea they are the very CONCEPT itself and its opposite so Death of the Endless is both DEATH/LIFE
The captain adam comic you are talking about was made from another author and neil gaiman counters this in sandman #20 but this video by comic drake explains it better then me

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That comic page doesn't actually say what you seem to think it does...

Also "Second parties theorizing" < "First party explaining things.".

Because the comic above was Death of the Endless directly explaining how it works.

 

[Rockinalice]

That comic page doesn't actually say what you seem to think it does...

Also "Second parties theorizing" < "First party explaining things.".

Because the comic above was Death of the Endless directly explaining how it works.

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And what I'm saying is that the creator has said different to what captain atom 41 stated and Comic Drake was taking direct statements from both authors about the situation that came about from this comic that was ment to clear up the issue.and then neil gaimen went and Clarified this in Sandman #20 Façade I suggest reading the whole thing but this is the best image that describes her

This was made by Neil Gaimen after the captain atom comic to Is clarify what the Endless are when he made them that she is DEATH itself not an aspect but the very CONCEPT

 

[Vaermina]

And what I'm saying is that the creator has said different to what captain atom 41 stated and Comic Drake was taking direct statements from both authors about the situation that came about from this comic that was ment to clear up the issue.and then neil gaimen went and Clarified this in Sandman #20 Façade I suggest reading the whole thing but this is the best image that describes her

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Creators can say what ever they want, but unless it's in print as part of the main continuity with the understanding and permission of the license holders it has no bearing on things.

This was made by Neil Gaimen after the captain atom comic to Is clarify what the Endless are when he made them that she is DEATH itself not an aspect but the very CONCEPT

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Yes, but that doesn't actually contradict the facts stated in Captain Atom.

 

[Rockinalice]

Yes, but that doesn't actually contradict the facts stated in Captain Atom.

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Yes it does because in that image it shows her saying shes there at Every death that happens not just the ones that captain atom comics says she would be if she only represents Compassionate Release shes their for the one that aren't under this aspect as well

I say lest just ask Mr.Zoat what Interpretation of the Endless hes doing for his story because it doent look like we are making much headspace in this.

 

[Stsword]

This argument is silly.

Vertigo and New Earth were never in the same continuity, Flashpoint merging the Vertigo, Wildstorm, and New Earth universes makes that abundantly clear.

In Vertigo the Endless are very special conceptual embodiments.

In New Earth the New Gods are conceptual embodiments, which means the Endless couldn't be special, because there are two planets worth of conceptual embodiments running around.

In Vertigo Death of the Endless is the very special embodiment of death. In New Earth, The Black Racer as a New God is the universal embodiment of Death too, so Death of the Endless by definition can't be special.

If that bugs Gaiman, well who cares? Certainly not the folks at DC comics, and it's their opinion that decides what make it to the page.

And I say that as someone who thinks making the New Gods conceptual embodiments stupid puffery DC resorted to instead of actually making the New Gods important or powerful.

 

[Lord Ernest]

She's enlightened. Yes, she could probably operate a yellow ring, but black would respond to her better.

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I don't believe she's enlightened. The black quotes seem to represent the special connection and empowerment that she has with Erebos because of her father, not because she has an special understanding of Death or whatever. I can't quote where Mr. Zoat said it, but I'm fairly certain he mentioned something of the like. Somebody correct me if I'm mistaken, however.

 

[Radix]

This argument is silly.

Vertigo and New Earth were never in the same continuity, Flashpoint merging the Vertigo, Wildstorm, and New Earth universes makes that abundantly clear.

In Vertigo the Endless are very special conceptual embodiments.

In New Earth the New Gods are conceptual embodiments, which means the Endless couldn't be special, because there are two planets worth of conceptual embodiments running around.

In Vertigo Death of the Endless is the very special embodiment of death. In New Earth, The Black Racer as a New God is the universal embodiment of Death too, so Death of the Endless by definition can't be special.

If that bugs Gaiman, well who cares? Certainly not the folks at DC comics, and it's their opinion that decides what make it to the page.

And I say that as someone who thinks making the New Gods conceptual embodiments stupid puffery DC resorted to instead of actually making the New Gods important or powerful.

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I agree. Part of the whole conceipt is that the universe transcends a single author. By definition there is no real final authority. New writers will show up with new perspectives. Canon will shift. Even what the publisher says will change over time.

And very much agree with the New Gods. I prefer them just as modern gods. Classical mythology with modern concepts and Kirby scifi aesthetic.

The idea of them being multiversal constants or embodiements of ideals seems silly to me. To me Darkseid isnt the embodiement of despotism as some metaphyiscal aspect, he just is a godly dictator who fulfills it. He is thw god of turannt because that is how the narrative is built around him. Of course there is mythology built around him, tyranny is his most defining aspect.

 

[Prince Charon]

Problem in an older post:

The orchards appear to extend for miles in all directions, punctuated in places by narrow, gravel covered roads. The palace itself glows brightly at the far edge as the orchard gives way to sheds and barns which in turn yield to the palace proper.

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The link just gets a result of 'application is unavailable' for me.

 

[Mr Zoat]

11th September 2012
20:14 GMT

Spear wreathed in an orange glow, I head after the kamikaze cruiser, taking a few seconds to dodge behind assault craft where reasonably practical. The spear point can cut though their shields and armour easily enough, but as they start veering away from me I elect not to chase them down. The defenders are capable of dealing with them without me, but that battleship-

It turns one of its medium batteries in our direction and fires, shields flickering over New Cronus before a small breach appears and a building patterned after the Acropolis gets pulverised.

-isn't going to destroy itself.

I can't detect any communication between the battleship and my suborned cruiser, but my ability to detect New God communication isn't exactly reliable. Alright, this… Seems to be my maximum speed. What else can I do to sell this?

I form a beam singularity projector, then take a moment to contemplate the likely results of firing that in the vicinity of a moon with its own artificial gravity system when I'm not exactly sure how my orange light manipulation abilities are being altered by the change in local physics.

Best not.

Instead, I form a laser cannon construct and take a few shots at what look like they might be vulnerable points on the cruiser's surface. I mean, if I can see it then lasers should be able to hit its hull, right? Naturally its Apokoliptian technology shielding… Or wards? It could be a separate system. Whichever, they protect it.

Sparta isn't mocking me. Was that… Some sort of hallucination that I only experienced because I was touching the souls of people in her network?

I know I'm doing it again, but until the cruiser gets a bit closer there's not much else I can do.

The battleship isn't targeting the cruiser, and neither are any of the other cruisers. I'm starting to attract a little more fire, but it's nothing that I can't evade. Should I be worried? Sparta appears to have better things to do with her time than fight me. Would she know who or what I am? Rhea might have heard of the Green Lantern Corps, but it's unlikely that she'd heard of Larfleeze. The Karrakanians appear to be assuming that I'm another god, so possibly they haven't heard of Lanterns ei… Ther.

Wait. If Sparta is using Phoebe's seed to create an area effect, shouldn't I be able to connect directly to that?

I've got another minute and forty seconds before the cruiser hits the battleship so I may as well give it a try.

Orange tendrils reach out, not really reaching for anything in particular. I unfocus my soul, trying to see the interface between the Honden and the material universe. It can't be cut off -and not just because of the power requirements- because people wouldn't be able to have desires. And I wouldn't be able to use my rings. Still can't feel the Ophidian, which is… Weird… But I can still feel the conflicting desires of-

Things go dark, and blinking feels wrong and damp-. My eyeballs just exploded. Clean that up and grow a new pair.

Compliance.

And there's the univerohdear. Yes, someone noticed that and they're making a real effort to shoot me! I abandon efforts to interfere with whoever clearly has the mystical realm firmly in their grasp and instead focus on dodging-. Oh, yes, yes, that was a shot from the battleship and it didn't miss by much. In a way, it's nice to see that the Karrakanians don't share the New Gods' reticence when it comes to just shooting each other rather than brawling, but it's-.

Agh! Looks like they have lasers as well! I track the source and swoop left, because while the laser will hit me near-instantly at this range they still have to keep it on me-. Yes, it's following but not instantly. Coming from that ship, so if I fly-. Yes, they've lost the lock. I refresh my shield bubble and change it to 'reflective' mode, on the grounds that I don't think the bubble would stop a direct hit from their big guns anyway.

Cruiser is still on course even without me worrying it. Though… Why not combine the two? I fly out of cover and go back to normal evasiveness, and the laser locks onto me almost immediately, hitting dead centre and having about ninety seven percent of its energy directed right back at the cruiser I'm chasing. It-. Oh, it actually does damage their New God shields. Doesn't appear to be doing much, but it's doing something and that's probably what prompts their gunnery officer to stop using it.

The cruiser is on its final-

OhgoshIdon'tlikeseeingprimaryweaponfirefromthesideatthatdistance.

-approach, and I think someone's spotted that things are-. Yes, yes they're firing. And its shields aren't blocking any of it; it's hitting the hull directly but no one's on the bridge. Can they communicate with the engine room or drive? They're not sending over a boarding team to speak to them directly, and the cruiser is out of the arcs of fire of the battleship's main weapons. The smaller guns on the other hand-. They're shooting the.. hull? No, they're trying to shoot through to the empty bridge-. Though that might just be because they're not in a position to shoot the drives.

New Cronus' gun batteries on the far side of the battleship are still inert. That's a shame, because to quote Ghenghiz Cohen, if this doesn't work it's going to take ages to kill them all.

Okay, get into position. The fire coming at me is slackening off slightly as the ships don't have an angle that doesn't threaten each other or their ground troops. I'm taking hits, but unless they get a lot more accurate in the next few-.

The battleship stops shooting and the cruiser starts to slow and turn. Oh no you don't. I bend space-.
Remain As I Command You To Be.
Ah. I can do it, but it's far more effort than usual.
Impudence!
Right, bend space around me and around the ship. Create a corridor and shorten the distance, I want to get close enough to shove it into the battleship myself if necessary.
Destroy The Usurper!
And the cruisers have stopped worrying about-.

Gah!

About shooting each other! A dozen hits across my bubble shield and about a hundred that miss me and hit each other! The bubble shield collapses as the battleship starts trying to shoot the cruiser that's on a collision course but it's too late! I get up close to the rear of its hull and generate massive construct thrusters surrounded by construct armour. Immediately they stop shooting me and try shooting my construct, but even as they eat through the armour both of my construct and the cruiser the engines activate and accelerate! Closer, closer!

The cruiser's nothing like big enough to destroy the battleship at this sort of relative speed, but my rings show me escape pods being launched from the sections that will be closest to the site of impact because that doesn't mean that there won't be a lot of local destruction.

Would their shield block it? I.. don't know. Even if it prevented a direct impact, the kinetic force should push the battleship into the path of those guns… That don't appear to be ready yet.

Damn it. Okay.

I fly around the cruiser, taking all… Three disc launchers out of subspace and setting them to fire until dry. Then I fire fat cables of orange light at the battleship-. Yes, shield is still up. Connect that to my metaphysique-

And it occurs to me that my tattoos are designed to feed on local sources of magic, and the change in my behaviour could well be explained by the fact that Phoebe's seed is the largest local source of magic rather than anything deliberate.

-and Feed Me!

Red lightning dances through space as the discs start hitting the shield and doing their best to make an inanimate energy field feel pain. But my tethers are achieving something more, not only causing the ward shield to visibly fail in places but…
I think…
I can actually… I'm getting glimpses of the battleship: how the systems and New Gods on board interact with each other. It's fascinat-.

My right arm comes up and clumsily slaps me in the face.

The heck-? Soul back-hacking? Okay, clever dick, let's see if you can handle being consumed!

Another slap, then I feel something shudder and my arm is back under my control. I dive off the cruiser as the battleship fills the horizon and my engine construct falls apart under the bombardment but it's too late!

The cruiser smashes through what's left of the shield and into the outside of the battleship's flight deck.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Problem in an older post:

The link just gets a result of 'application is unavailable' for me.

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I'll have a look, but I suspect that that image is gone for good.

 

[Ngamer11]

And it occurs to me that my tattoos are designed to feed on local sources of magic, and the change in my behaviour could well be explained by the fact that the Phoebe's seed is the largest local source of magic rather than anything deliberate.

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Paul really needs to get that flaw fixed. Maybe this will push him to try harder in finding Constantine.

My right arm comes up and clumsily slaps me in the face.

The heck-? Soul back-hacking? Okay, clever dick, let's see if you can handle being consumed!

Another slap, then I feel something shudder and my arm is back under my control.

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That seems interesting. I kinda want to see Paul eat a soul that way, just to see what'll happen.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

More spaceship Godspeech:

Spoiler: Be Revealed!

The battleship stops shooting and the cruiser starts to slow and turn. Oh no you don't. I bend space-.
Remain As I Command You To Be.
Ah. I can do it, but it's far more effort than usual.
Impudence!
Right, bend space around me and around the ship. Create a corridor and shorten the distance, I want to get close enough to shove it into the battleship myself if necessary.
Destroy The Usurper!
And the cruisers have stopped worrying about-.

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Red lightning dances through space as the discs start hitting and shield and doing their best to make an inanimate energy field feel pain. But my tethers are achieving something more, not only causing the ward shield to visibly fail in places but…
I think…
I can actually… I'm getting glimpses of the battleship; how the systems and New Gods on board interact with each other. It's fascinat-.

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[Handlewithcare]

Damn, he is really struggeling with this one.

Bodes badly for any future Apokolips engagement.

But Sparta fights smart. I could see her and Paul at least respect each other as enemies.

 

[Darko]

Naturally its Apokoliptian technology shielding… Or wards?

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Or both, seeing as New God tech is basically magi-tech.

I've got another minutes and forty seconds

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'minute'

Things go dark, and blinking feels wrong and damp-. My eyeballs just exploded. Clean that up and grow a new pair.

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You've really gotten used to losing body parts.

In a way, it's nice to see that the Karrakanians don't share the New Gods' reticence when it comes to just shooting each other rather than brawling, but it's-.

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Ahh, Paul.

Even when they're trying to kill you you can't help but be impressed that they're doing it in a rational manner.

The battleship stops shooting and the cruiser starts to slow and turn. Oh no you don't. I bend space-.
Remain As I Command You To Be.

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More god speech.

dozen hits across by bubble shield and about a hundred that miss me and

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'my bubble'

My right arm comes up and clumsily slaps me in the face.

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Why are you hitting yourself.

Okay, clever dick

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Not sure if this is a British thing but if it isn't then it should be 'clever trick'.

 

[doug89]

I imagined bagpipes playing in the end of the chapter.