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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Thank you so much for that link. I did not know that this was the father of Alex Luthor, father to the Infinite Crisis. It explains so much, and makes me excited and apprehensive for what's about to happen.

"Before you go. I was wondering why a man of your intelligence never joined the CSA just to moderate their actions. Given how often Ultraman did-."

"Because I have moral principles." Lex is glaring at her. "I wouldn't expect you to understand."

"Does a desire to do good that doesn't translate into good outcomes actually matter?"

Lex's expression hardens. "And now you've proven that you don't. And I don't think I could explain it to you so that you would understand. Good day."

Amazing, this gives me chills. Absolute 'Good' without flexibility or mercy leads to things like Sodam and Gomorrah.
 
I look around, but there's no sign of Luthor. No oddly muffled sounds that would tell me there was a hologram or illusion, no radiation from a teleporter or exotic monitoring device and no bald man in a business suit. I'm definitely where he wanted me to be-.
Magic? Or maybe just technology developed to be invisible to kryptonians, since he certainly had the incentive to build something like that.

Not sure if this has already come up at some point, but I am wondering how religion works in antimatter universes. Are demons nice, and therefore most people end up in a good afterlife instead of an awful one? Or are sins good deeds now, so hardly anyone goes to hell?
Are the members of old pantheons like the Hellenic, Norse or Aztec mostly nice instead of mostly assholes, and they left the mortal world out of disgust or something?
Do people even do religion, since they probably find it hard to have faith in something like that? Though I guess if the material benefits were known people might be super-religious.
 
Magic? Or maybe just technology developed to be invisible to kryptonians, since he certainly had the incentive to build something like that.

Not sure if this has already come up at some point, but I am wondering how religion works in antimatter universes. Are demons nice, and therefore most people end up in a good afterlife instead of an awful one? Or are sins good deeds now, so hardly anyone goes to hell?
Are the members of old pantheons like the Hellenic, Norse or Aztec mostly nice instead of mostly assholes, and they left the mortal world out of disgust or something?
Do people even do religion, since they probably find it hard to have faith in something like that? Though I guess if the material benefits were known people might be super-religious.
Just at a guess: your slot in the afterlife is based on how evil you were. Evil people get to spend their afterlives tormenting good-hearted fools. The more evil you did, the better your slot in the dog-eat-dog hierarchy.
 
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Amazing, this gives me chills. Absolute 'Good' without flexibility or mercy leads to things like Sodam and Gomorrah.
... you have an interesting definition of 'good.' (Yes, there are certainly others who share it, or something similar, but it's not a version that I subscribe to.)
 
... you have an interesting definition of 'good.' (Yes, there are certainly others who share it, or something similar, but it's not a version that I subscribe to.)
Now i'm thinking of that bit in Dragonlance where they say Elves are genocidal racists because they're "pure Good", and then act like that's some deep philosophical point and not utter gibberish.
 
Now i'm thinking of that bit in Dragonlance where they say Elves are genocidal racists because they're "pure Good", and then act like that's some deep philosophical point and not utter gibberish.
Reminds me of something I read recently. At one point one of the protagonists gives some money to some people who helped him because it feels like the right thing to do, and as he does it he offhandedly thinks about how it's a selfish act, since there were more utilitarian ways that he could've used the money. I thought it was a pretty neat microcosm of how being truly Good is often not what our instincts tell us is Good (for certain definitions of Good, anyway).
 
Interesting that now both Luthor have referred to a Superman clone as "my boy." Something from his (their?) upbringing I guess. Perhaps this Luthor's parents were more like Clark's parents.

Someone remind me, was Ultrawoman sent to this Earth as a young adult or older? I'm wondering if she was a clone which was grown in a pod, rather than a genetically engineered baby. I doubt evil Krypton did her any favors, but if she started life after being grown past her toddler years... Weird weird weird.
 
Someone remind me, was Ultrawoman sent to this Earth as a young adult or older? I'm wondering if she was a clone which was grown in a pod, rather than a genetically engineered baby. I doubt evil Krypton did her any favors, but if she started life after being grown past her toddler years... Weird weird weird.

Neither, she was sent to -14 New Genesis as a child infiltrator, only to eventually be outed and exiled after Godfather Izaya destroyed -14 Krypton. She came to -14 Earth much later, as a middle aged woman.

Porque no los dos? She was apparently also engineered...

And I didn't grit my teeth once saying that. My parents designed me well.
 
Home Field (part 19)
6th February 2013
21:42 GMT -5


"So, ah, Malone?" The guy who did Dick's interview sidles up to him. "How'd it go?"

"Ah… I think you'll get your bonus."

He doesn't even bother looking at Lex-. Alex. I'd pay attention if a hostile guy in power armor showed up. Is that a Parallel Universe of Evil thing, a… Idiot thing, a there's-a-reason-why-this-guy-didn't-get-promoted thing..?

"Neat." The guy looks us over and then walks to the front of the truck. "I'll be taking you back to one of the other sites. After that, it's your problem."

Alexander waves a hand towards the patch of air where the portal is.

"Oh. I see. Simple enough."

Dick looks up at him. "Feel like teleporting yourself?"

"No, I'd need half an hour to build the core device myself and I see no reason to wait. I've set one of my factory units to do just that, just in case."

Okay, but he's a Luthor, so either he can't make it or he's already made it and doesn't want anyone to know. Whichever it is, he just kinda floats up into the back of the truck as the rest of us climb up. Still the same kinda truck we came here in, only now there's a few crates with food labels on them in the back with us. I pull one over to sit on, while Mitchell and Dick take the floor again. Alex takes a quick look at the crates and then turns around to face the exit, floating in the middle of the rear compartment.

Someone pounds on the tailgate, then the truck starts up. I make eye contact with Dick and Mitchell for a moment, and we're all bracing for-.

Everything I've made of myself won't matter when the Anti-Life is all.

For that. Damn! I'd kinda gotten used to it, but being completely free for a few hours just makes it hit harder!

"Uh." Alex looks stunned for an instant, then his expression goes back to normal. He didn't move from the exact centre of the trailer when it accelerated, and he's still there now. "That was unpleasant."

Dick tilts his head to the side. "Get used to it. It gets worse."

Alex moves his hands like he's typing on an invisible keyboard. "I'll cope. Adjusting the parameters will only take a moment."

"You're using some sort of cybernetic implant, right?"

"Yes, of course."

"Isn't that risky?"

"Compared to what? I've been exposed to dozens of types of mind altering effect over the years, and my current generation implant makes me immune or at least highly resistant to most of them. The degree of risk it adds is substantially less than the degree of risk it removes, a truth which is disturbingly pertinent to our situation."

The truck stops, and after a moment interviewer guy pulls the rear door open.

"Okay, they're not expecting us yet, but if you want to get out in secret you should move now."

I just jump right out the back, Dick right behind me. Mitchell and Alex fly out a moment later. Oh, and now he pays Alex some attention.

"You gunna go out in the city looking like that?"

Alex looks at Dick, who shrugs.

"We've got costumes, but they're a bit less noticeable than what you're wearing."

Alex clears his throat, and-. His armour vanishes in some sort of hologram. When it stabilises, his clothes make him look like an unusually clean bum.

Dick nods. "That'll do." He leads the way out of the Gotham-side warehouse, checking who's around before heading out into the street. "We can take you to a safe house while we-."

"I know Owlman's name." Alex looks around, though he's clearly not too worried. I'm worried, and I was born in this city. "According to your Earth's records he was never born here, but his younger brother is still alive. Which means I assume that his place of residence is your primary headquarters in this city, as well as the best place for me to make contact with him."

"I dunno. He's been running himself ragged lately."

"I know the feeling. Ah, zeta radiation. Your transportation network?"

"Ah, yeah?" Dick's off-kilter. Alexander is picking stuff up fast. I've never met Lex Luthor, but I'm going to remember that this is probably how smart he is. "But you're not in system, and I can't add you."

"It's not a problem. I can track the zeta beam back to its destination."

"Our headquarters is shielded against intrusion. And it has a lot of counter-intrusion measures set up."

Alex nods. "Which you can't turn off, because that would defeat the entire purpose. Very well, I will await your return."

"Thanks. It's not that we don't trust you. It's-."

"You can't trust yourselves. Believe me, I understand. I've had to spend a similar amount of time proofing my own technology against myself in case I was ever subverted. Would you like me to stand guard?"

"No, that would just attract attention. But I can give you access to-."

"I've already connected my systems to your Earth's data networks. I'll take the time to acclimatise myself with the locale. Don't worry about contacting me when you're ready; I've already accessed your zeta tube network."



Huh.

Alexander looks around, checking lines of slight. And then-. I stare up as he shoots into the sky.

Dick's looking up, too. "You think they'd let us trade Luthors?"

"I think he'd probably wanna stick with his Earth."

"Yeah." We check around us again, then start walking towards the zeta tube as fast as we can without drawing attention to ourselves. "Check in with Canis?"

"I should." He taps his communicator twice. "Because-."

"Ah…" Mitchell is looking south. "So, if Canis charged towards Blackgate and bulldozed everything in his way-?"

Dick taps his communicator again. "Then I need to get a hold of him urgently."

"You want me to fly there?"

"No, he might actually have a plan." He taps his communicator with a little more force. "I mean, I doubt it, but-. Canis, where are y-?"

BOOM!

Brut walks through the boom tube. Canis is sitting on his back, looking pleased with himself.

"Comrades!"

Dick steps towards him. "Canis, do I need to explain the whole 'secrecy' thing to you again?"

"I understand secrecy. I love the dramatic reveal! But it seemed to me that it was slow and ineffective at achieving our actual goal. So I decided to try things my way. And now that you have returned, we can formulate a plan for dealing with Charity Auction Darkseid."

"The plan was to covertly monitor Mistress."

"Wouldn't it be easier if I just cooperated?"

And then the walls closed in and crushed us.
 
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I'm wondering if that 'the walls closed in and crushed us' bit was metaphorical. On account of how she didn't say anything that seemed intended as an attack.
 
I just remembered that the Spear of Destiny is a thing that taps into all humans on Earth. It could be used as a vector to purge or shield humanity from the Anti-Life. Like if Scott Free pushed his freedom mojo into it or Dr. Mist did that with his life enlightenment.
 
6th February 2013
21:42 GMT -5


"So, ah, Malone?" The guy who did Dick's interview sidles up to him. "How'd it go?"

"Ah… I think you'll get your bonus."
Ech, this guy. You'd think he'd figure things are a little off, given that the three super-powered kids came back with company. Or maybe he's just assuming that they've signed on. Either way...

He doesn't even bother looking at Lex-. Alex. I'd pay attention if a hostile guy in power armor showed up. Is that a Parallel Universe of Evil thing, a… Idiot thing, a there's-a-reason-why-this-guy-didn't-get-promoted thing..?

"Neat." The guy looks us over and then walks to the front of the truck. "I'll be taking you back to one of the other sites. After that, it's your problem."
...He's just an idiot. Though Alexander may well have some manner of perception filter stealth system that works best on the dim-witted. :p

Alexander waves a hand towards the patch of air where the portal is.

"Oh. I see. Simple enough."
Or the guy really is that dumb. You'd think he'd recognise a guy who's constantly interfering with the Syndicate's plans.

Dick looks up at him. "Feel like teleporting yourself?"

"No, I'd need half an hour to build the core device myself and I see no reason to wait. I've set one of my factory units to do just that, just in case."
...Because of course he's already scanned, understood and improved on the portal generator's design. Joy of a tenth-level intellect.

Okay, but he's a Luthor, so either he can't make it or he's already made it and doesn't want anyone to know. Whichever it is, he just kinda floats up into the back of the truck as the rest of us climb up. Still the same kinda truck were came her in, only now there's a few crates with food labels on the in the back with us. I pull one over to sit on, while Mitchell and Dick take the floor again. Alex takes a quick look at the crates and then turns around to face the exit, floating in the middle of the rear compartment.
Well, at least they're not going back empty-handed. :p

Someone pounds on the tailgate, then the truck starts up. I make eye contact with Dick and Mitchell for a moment, and we're all bracing for-.

Everything I've made of myself won't matter when the Anti-Life is all.
And hello Anti-Life. No, you weren't missed at all.

For that. Damn! I'd kinda gotten used to it, but being completely free for a few hours just makes it hit harder!

"Uh." Alex looks stunned for an instant, then his expression goes back to normal. He didn't move from the exact centre of the trailer when it accelerated, and he's still there now. "That was unpleasant."
Interesting. His neural filter adjusting itself, eh?

Dick tilts his head to the side. "Get used to it. It gets worse."

Alex moves his hands like he's typing on an invisible keyboard. "I'll cope. Adjusting the parameters will only take a moment."
...Typing? How prosaic. I guess he prefers the innate distinction it allows him in terms of interface control, though.

"You're using some sort of cybernetic implant, right?"

"Yes, of course."
A distinction needed because why risk having something that could respond to subconscious thoughts?

"Isn't that risky?"

"Compared to what? I've been exposed to dozens of types of mind altering effect over the years, and my current generation implant makes me immune or at least highly resistant to most of them. The degree of risk it adds is substantially less than the degree of risk it adds, a truth which is disturbingly pertinent to our situation."
...He's probably not kidding, either. Think of all the superheroes, supervillains and alien threats with potential mind-affecting powers. Now imagine the former using them without any moral restrictions to get what they want.

The truck stops, and after a moment interviewer guy pulls the rear door open.

"Okay, they're not expecting us yet, but if you want to get out in secret you should move now."
...Huh, guy's not as dumb as he looks. Must be book-dumb, street smart.

I just jump right out the back, Dick right behind me. Mitchell and Alex fly out a moment later. Oh, and now he pays Alex some attention.

"You gunna go out in the city looking like that?"
As opposed to what? A hat and trenchcoat? :D

Alex looks at Dick, who shrugs.

"We've got costumes, but they're a bit less noticeable than what you're wearing."
Especially in stealth mode.

Alex clears his throat, and-. His armour vanishes in some sort of hologram. When it stabilises, his clothes make him look like an unusually clean bum.

Dick nods. "That'll do." He leads the way out of the Gotham-side warehouse, checking who's around before heading out into the street. "We can take you to a safe house while we-."
...Huh, guess he is wearing some variant of a hat and trenchcoat now. Or at least a warm jacket and beanie. :p

"I know Owlman's name." Alex looks around, though he's clearly not too worried. I'm worried, and I was born in this city. "According to your Earth's records he was never born here, but his younger brother is still alive. Which means I assume that his place of residence is your primary headquarters in this city, as well as the best place for me to make contact with him."

"I dunno. He's been running himself ragged lately."
...And you found out that much in what, thirty seconds? A little concerning. They may need to give him the 'secret identity' talk. :oops:

"I know the feeling. Ah, zeta radiation. Your transportation network?"

"Ah, yeah?" Dick's off-kilter. Alexander is picking stuff up fast. I've never met Lex Luthor, but I'm going to remember that this is probably how smart he is. "But you're not in system, and I can't add you."
...And Positive Lex isn't distracted by anything but Superman and his erstwhile co-conspirators in the Light. Let that sink in, and let the worry increase.

"It's not a problem. I can track the zeta beam back to its destination."

"Our headquarters is shielded against intrusion. And it has a lot of counter-intrusion measures set up."
Including stuff recommended by OL, I hope. Which Alexander might have some difficulties with, even if he knows how to fight magic-users of his world.

Alex nods. "Which you can't turn off, because that would defeat the entire purpose. Very well, I will await your return."

"Thanks. It's not that we don't trust you. It's-."
Though there probably is some undercurrent of distrust. Reversed morality or not, he is Luthor.

"You can't trust yourselves. Believe me, I understand. I've had to spend a similar amount of time proofing my own technology against myself in case I was ever subverted. Would you like me to stand guard?"

"No, that would just attract attention. But I can give you access to-."
I wonder just how many countermeasures he has set up for such a scenario.

"I've already connected my systems to your Earth's data networks. I'll take the time to acclimatise myself with the locale. Don't worry about contacting me when you're ready; I've already accessed your zeta tube network."

Geez, it's like he's trying to speed-run saving the world. :p

Huh.

Alexander looks around, checking lines of slight. And then-. I stare up as he shoots into the sky.
...That always seems more reassuring when it's Superman doing it. Must be the cape.

Dick's looking up, too. "You think they'd let us trade Luthors?"

"I think he'd probably wanna stick with his Earth."
And do you want Positive Lex to be set loose on an entire planet of jackasses? He'll be running the place in no time.

"Yeah." We check around us again, then start walking towards the zeta tube as fast as we can without drawing attention to ourselves. "Check in with Canis?"

"I should." He taps his communicator twice. "Because-."
Canis gonna Canis.

"Ah…" Mitchell is looking south. "So, if Canis charged towards Blackgate and bulldozed everything in his way-?"

Dick taps his communicator again. "Then I need to get a hold of him urgently."
And Canis did Canis. He Canis'd very much. :D

"You want me to fly there?"

"No, he might actually have a plan." He taps his communicator with a little more force. "I mean, I doubt it, but-. Canis, where are y-?"
Well, now we get to see how his side of matters turned out.

BOOM!

Brut walks through the book tube. Canis is sitting on his back, looking pleased with himself.
...He's alive. But is he un-dominated?

"Comrades!"

Dick steps towards him. "Canis, do I need to explain the whole 'secrecy' thing to you again?"
A large man in fancy armour riding a giant dog isn't exactly covert, Robin...

"I understand secrecy. I love the dramatic reveal! But it seemed to me that it was slow and ineffective at achieving our actual goal. So I decided to try things my way. And now that you have returned, we can formulate a plan for dealing with Charity Auction Darkseid."

"The plan was to covertly monitor Mistress."
The only reason Robin's not face-palming right now is that he need both hands free to chocke Canis. :D

"Wouldn't it be easier if I just cooperated?"

And then the walls closed in and crushed us.
...I hope that's just metaphorical, based on proximity to a large node of Anti-Life...

Oh, boy. I get the feeling they're getting a face-full of the full-strength emissions around Mistress. Which can't be healthy for the unsuspecting heroes. Hopefully she can pull it back so that they aren't reduced to drooling lumps, and they can have a proper discussion. ...Once Robin gets done strangling Canis, anyway, for not warning them about this. :V
 
Still the same kinda truck were came her in, only now there's a few crates with food labels on the in the back with us. I pull one over to sit on, while Mitchell and Dick take the floor again.
'we came here in'
Extraneous 'on the'
"You think they'd let us trade Luthors?"
This makes me wonder what the native Luthor is actually doing right now.
Brut walks through the book tube.
'boom'
 
I suspect Ultrawoman's too canny to swap out like that, but imagine if they had this Lex for even a year working in cooperation with Kal-El.

...an experience I imagine both heroes would find more than a little unsettling.
Yeah...The funny thing is, I feel like, if the prime Luthor really did make a full face-turn, use his intellect for good...Supes would be the first to welcome it with open arms. He's, ya know, The Best Guy.
 
Yeah...The funny thing is, I feel like, if the prime Luthor really did make a full face-turn, use his intellect for good...Supes would be the first to welcome it with open arms. He's, ya know, The Best Guy.
Depends on the version. The Justice League Unlimited episode with Lexor City, and Superman fighting Captain Marvel, showed Superman still being incredibly distrustful of a Lex that was apparently trying to do good. Of course it turned out that Lex was hoping Superman would wreck his humanitarian attempt, but it really was a self sufficient, low income housing project (so even if Superman didn't bite it would still be a PR boost for Lex). Given that Young Justice Superman was generally more of a dick than JLU Superman (see: interactions with Superboy), I don't see him remotely trusting an apparent face-turn.
 
He's just an idiot. Though Alexander may well have some manner of perception filter stealth system that works best on the dim-witted. :p

Or he's smart enough to know that dealing with Luthor is way, way out of his pay grade and is hoping that ignoring him will somehow save his skin.
 
Doesn't Alex's mind reinforcement system being an intelligent system that has to learn your mind first mean it can't be used on Earth 16 right now? It can't learn to block the Anti-Life as foreign influence if it doesn't know how their mind was in the first place, no?
 
Home Field (part 20)
6th February 2013
21:42 GMT -5


Imprisoned!

Surrounded!

Trapped!

Threats!

Tapping on my-.

I'm swallowing the capsule before I really think of anything, and I know Bruce isn't going to be happy about that. Alexander said he's got some sort of cybernetic implant to stop him feeling the Anti-Life, and that's basically what Mr. Atom uses. But between Joker, Scarecrow, Poison Ivy…

Bruce came up with a pharmaceutical solution.

And it kicks in real quick. Funny thing is, it's not even illegal, just really unhealthy if you take it more than about once a month. But just like that, the buildings aren't trying to grab me or trap me, and the shadows are just shadows or at worst hiding places, rather than pits of evil and doom. The people around me aren't madmen with guns-.

Okay, Gotham, but not more than normal.

Gotta love those post-hypnotic suggestions!

Mistress is smiling at me. And with-. Okay, I'm high, but she doesn't exactly look like an Apostle of Darkseid. She's gotten a fitted suit from somewhere, but other than that, Karon Chase still looks like Karon Chase.

Except the dark glowing pits she has instead of eyes.

And Holly being basically stuck to her side like she's on a boat in a storm and Karon's the only thing keeping her from going overboard.

"You mind turning the doom and gloom down a little?"


"Doom and-? Oh!"

She actually smiles, somehow, and-. Meadows and fluffy bunnies and it's a good job Wayne Pharmaceuticals isn't in the legal highs market. Tap tap, antidote, down the hatch! And don't make any major life choices or financial decisions for the next couple of minutes.

Artemis stops cringing quite so bad, and… I didn't even spot Match leave.

"You forgot?"


"I don't feel it. To me, what you saw is-."

"Normal, yeah, yeah, I heard it from your lowlies."

"The fact that it's normal doesn't mean that it's not terrible."

Canis grins.

"Is it not a marvellous duality! Despite the Anti-Life, she retains a degree of her personality! I cannot imagine Great Darkseid ever saying anything like that-"

I don't-.

"-like it's a bad thing!"

"You didn't grow up in Gotham, did you Robin?"

"No."

"I did."

She uses her right hand to stroke Holly's hair, while her left gestures to the buildings around us.

And I'm not in the meadow any more.


"This isn't a dark fantasy or a tearing away of the veil. This is Gotham, as most people lived it. From the mobs to the supervillains, nothing really got better. The way it manifested changed… But so what?"

"You mean you always felt like this?"

"It was always lurking in the background. It's not new for me."

"But Holly's…" Oh, coming down. The streets still look worse than they really are-. At least, worse than I hope they really are. But now I've had a chance to get into the right headspace, it's something I can cope with. Just about. "Still with you. What does that-? I mean, do you still love her?"

"I like to think so. But I don't know. Everything feels so different, now. But I will protect her anyway."

"But-. Why?"

"Because if nothing matters, why not protect the one I decided to protect? The one thing that nearly makes me feel something rather than nothing? Why not do the thing that I decided to do?"

"And the evacuations?"

"The illusion is beautiful. I was happier. Why not let them believe for a little longer?"

Okay, that's… Good. Most city bosses are pretty contemptuous of everyone not like them.

"But do you see how it emphasises the hopelessness!"

And Canis is… Really too happy about this.

But the thing is…

"Yeah. I can."

And he smiles, not because he's being… A dick, but because that makes him genuinely happy.

"I will pray to the Source for your enlightenment to continue."

"I don't need that kind of enlightenment. Karon, what do you know about Bruno Mannheim?"

"I know him. In my dreams the truth wears his face. He will take this world and crush it as we cheer."

"He's coming here. Do you know why?"

"Me. I don't fit in. The Anti-Life in me is a counterpoint to the themes he is impressing on the soul of humanity."

"So… Why doesn't he just send his killer robot after you? Or, y'know, his army?"

Canis looks at me like I've said something stupid-.

"Because it's not artistic enough? Seriously?"

"It's how our power works, Robin! How the might of our souls clash and wrestle for dominance! This is no contest of peasants thrashing one another with pig-sticks! Did you think I invested myself in art for mere aestheticism?"

Yes, Canis, we all thought you were just weird about painting. That's literally-.

Oh no. I'm going to have to get Zatanna to go over every piece of art he's made since he got here, just so I can be sure he's not doing something to us.

"So he's coming here to fight you?"

"To demonstrate the superiority of his outlook."

"Like a..?" Artemis looks like she's mostly recovered. "Like a debate?"

"Conducted with our souls."

"And what happens if you win?"

"I will control Mannheim's perspective. His Justified. In effect, the world."

I nod. "Then we need to do some practice sessions."
 
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