With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Darko · 2025-12-13T08:35:32+0000

Mr Zoat said:
rather than materials necessary to make them or a power source that can fuel them."

Maybe "or even the materials"

Mr Zoat · 2025-12-13T08:41:37+0000

Lord Ernest said:
I seem to recall that he had to learn to control his enormous anger because he had no way to properly act on it. He hated the government and knew that the corruption was deeply ingrained, but the only thing he could do was some violent act that wouldn't accomplish anything or wait and bid his time while he investigated. Fortunately, Grayven found him and gave him the opportunity that he had been waiting on for years.

There might be some more nuance to it, maybe some moment or a day of deep introspection while he waited that helped him reach Enlightenment, but I don't know if it was fully explained in the story.

No, not control. Channel. He learned how to channel all his hate and anger into a long term plan that gave him the best chance at revenge, rather than just charging into Downing Street with a cricket bat.

Z000 said:
so is this girl some old comic character or something ?

What, Ursa? Actually, no. She was created for the original Superman film because for some reason they didn't want to use Faora Hu-Ul. She only turned up in the comics relatively recently.

Darko said:
Maybe "or even the materials"

Thank you, corrected.

BlueMangoAdea · 2025-12-13T08:45:47+0000

Hmmmmm. I mean, artificial wombs should do the trick, so she will probably be still executed, unless the defense manages to argue keeping her alive for the baby's well being successfully.

B00ki5h · 2025-12-13T08:46:09+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"Congratulations. You're pregnant."

Huh, will this go the way of Anne Bonnie and Mary Read twisted together? Execution put off due to pregnancy and then confined indefinitely.

Signaller · 2025-12-13T08:49:36+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"I grew up during isolationism. The idea of an alien knowing a kryptonian well enough to refer to them as a friend seem strange. I suppose it was common in earlier times."

Seems.

néocorvinus · 2025-12-13T08:53:47+0000

Z000 said:
so is this girl some old comic character or something ?

The Ursa of canon Young Justice was also pregnant during her Phantom Zone imprisonment.

Chojin Patriarch · 2025-12-13T09:06:00+0000

Mr Zoat said:
12th August 2013
16:22 GMT

"Aren't you going to ask anything?"

"No."

I'm sitting cross-legged on the floor outside of Ursa Dou-Ka's cell. She's sitting cross-legged next on the floor inside of Ursa Dou-Ka's cell, and she had been ignoring me.

Ah, good, moving the prisoners separately for security reasons. This also give OL a good chance to take measure of her character without Zod present to colour or inhibit her responses. That may be important later.

"Then why are you here?"

"I was going to wait for you to finish, then ask you some things."

But if the mediation is comforting to her, better to let her finish and be in a good mood.

"Go ahead."

"You're sure? I don't want to interrupt. Torquasm-Vo?"

Presumably she's not really focusing on it. Merely using it as a calming measure.

"You know it?"

"I'm not a practitioner, but I'm friends with a few kryptonians who are. Telepathy is one of an empowered kryptonian's few weaknesses, and the theta wave state is an obvious way of countering that."

And once Clark manages to master it, he'll be that bit more well-defended.

"A little less spiritual than how my former instructor would have put it, but substantially true. Hm."

"Mm?"

For all that he works with supernatural entities and outright cosmic powers, OL just isn't that spiritualistic. Comes form that foundation of atheism and rationality, I suppose.

"I grew up during isolationism. The idea of an alien knowing a kryptonian well enough to refer to them as a friend seem strange. I suppose it was common in earlier times."

"I rather got the impression that it wasn't common, but I suspect that it happened."

"What do we seem like to you?"

Like supermodels and star athletes for the most part, I imagine. I've hardly ever seen an unattractive Kryptonian in any media, outside of comedic over-eating resulting in temporary obesity. Hooray for designer genetics.

I shrug. "You're so physically similar to us that I don't usually think of you as being something different. Kal-El has spent almost his entire life on Earth, so for the one kryptonian everyone on Earth knows there isn't much of a cultural difference either. And despite his powers, there's nothing that he can do that some rare superhuman can't do nearly as well."

Heck, I'm sure there are people who are stronger in some individual aspect of his powerset, such as a fighter who can punch through a mountain or a flyer capable of hypersonic flight.

"I would have thought that it would have made more of an impact. I didn't think your world was advanced enough to have warriors enhanced to our level."

"Our… Species produces a small number of exceptional geniuses who can create things centuries in advance of our technological mainstream. And a bunch of other weird things happen that just randomly give people those abilities. Did you see the young man in black with the yellow lightning bolt on his chest?"

Earth Bullshit™ is just that insane, yo.

"Yes. He fought Lar-On. Excellent reactions, though I'm surprised that he survived the experience."

"He's as strong and as powerful as a kryptonian under a yellow sun due to being blessed by a group of our gods. That's actually the sort of fight that he prefers."

Probably because anyone less durable would tend to turn into red smears, and that's not really that exciting. More gross, really.

"Is that common?"

"There are about three top tier superhumans per billion humans. Kal-El easily makes it into that bracket."

Though that doesn't begin to cover lesser tiers. People with abilities of modest potential, or even those with insignificant but still exceptional talents, or those who can apply said weak power well.

"How will that change with the other prisoners? Aren't you worried that they'll take over your world?"

"They're being helped to establish a colony elsewhere. No yellow sun. And while empowered kryptonians can fly in space, they can't fly faster than light and need to breathe eventually. They're not much of a threat if they're not in the same system."

The trick will be if anyone turns up poking around the suddenly active planet. Though if they're lightly empowered, they can handle most intruders fairly well.

"And I suppose there weren't any scientists in the phantom zone."

"Well, Jax-Ur, but we're not letting him out. And most technology relies on having a civilisation's worth of infrastructure to support it. Knowing how to program crystals doesn't help if you don't have the machines required to create those crystals, or rather than materials necessary to make them or a power source that can fuel them."

True enough. The first few years will probably involve acquiring enough resources to advance to at least the late medieval period, with subsistence farming and comparatively simple mechanisms. After that, they can work on moving through to industrial stuff using the tool they'd have already made...

"It's a prison."

"An open prison. I imagine that they'll like it better than the phantom zone."

No madness-inducing psychological torture conditions, for example. And the ability to sense time passing.

"I know I would. It's strange. I always thought that my death would be quicker than this."

"Why?"

"I thought that one of the Kryptonian Empire's enemies would come for us. If an enemy abandons their weapons and territory, surely finishing them off is the sensible thing to do."

Only if the enemy is able to give pursuit. Sometimes they're so battered that they're more willing to let them flee and lick their wounds than give blind chase.

"The human political philosopher Machiavelli held that while a ruler should seek to be both loved and feared, he should choose fear if forced to choose between them, but only if he could cause fear without causing hatred to arise. If I had to guess why people never came for the heir of the Kryptonian Empire, it was because even those who disliked or feared it never really hated it; or at least didn't in sufficient strength to want to poke the sleeping bear."

That's another good reason. A retaliatory strike against an enemy who had already decided not to fight would more than likely provoke a fiercer response than one in wartime.

"That's even more disappointing."

"Oh?"

I know, it seems amazing, but you never know how someone is going to react to sudden changes of circumstance.

"Not only did we rule a vast swath of space, those we ruled over apparently liked it. Why did those idiots ever give it up?"

"'Those idiots' in this case being not the Science Council, but the vast preponderance of the kryptonian species?"

True, the Science Council's foolishness is well-established already.

"Yes."

"I-." Oh. "Huh. I don't know, but if I went to the Rao System and meditated, I could probably find out. The best guess I have now is the lack of integration."

A simple case of 'out of sight, out of mind.'

"Meaning… Most kryptonians never saw an alien. We didn't need them as labourers, or to provide us with resources. And because they never interacted with them, they saw no need for anyone to interact with them." I nod. "Is that it? We all died because most of us never left the cradle?"

It's saddening and maddening in equal amounts, I know. Such is the perils of becoming so advanced that no-one needs to actually struggle.

"That's my best guess. If most kryptonians saw aliens being around as normal, then they wouldn't want to change things. As it was, only the military really-."

"That's-!" She stands, fists balled, unable to entirely contain her anger. "Of all the stupid-!" She closes her eyes, forcing herself to relax. "Will you make certain that the new colony does not repeat that mistake?"

They're almost certainly going to be in contact with aliens, especially if there's a regular Lantern presence keeping eyes on things. Green, orange or any other colours.

"I… Think that Karsta Wor-Ul will, but I'll keep an eye on them. I do need to talk to you about that, actually."

"I don't see how it concerns me. I'm not going to be acquitted."

So she's pretty much accepting that she will die soon. It makes sense, I suppose. She knows what she and Zod did was unforgivable, and there would be punishments for it...

"No, but… The kryptonian inclination towards criminality appears to confirm to the patterns it has in humans. That is to say that criminals are overwhelmingly male."

"You think you can get me a stay of execution for breeding purposes?"

Ah, she caught that one quick.

"No. I was going to ask if you'd mind donating a few eggs." I shrug. "Even if we end up using an exo-womb, it's still additional genetic variety."

"Then I suppose it's my last duty. Does the Doomsday have an infirmary?"

Logical enough. She did love her people enough to go along with Zod's plans.

"No, but I can extract them by ring here. You won't feel a thing."

"Oh. Very well then, get on with it."

I know, it's almost anti-climactic.

"Alright, I-."

Ohhhhh… Heck.

Ah. I see canon has rung true, then.

"Ah… Or maybe not. Um."

"What? Why?"

"Congratulations. You're pregnant."

More than likely this universe's equivalent of Lor-Zod. I wonder if the child was conceived before their imprisonment, or after and what effects the latter case may have on the child...

So, then, a difficult quandary rises. Will Timaronian law demand her death even while with child, or will someone convince the court to allow a plea of mercy, at least until she gives birth (to avoid slaying an innocent, basically.) I can foresee Clark and others having a big moral issue with the whole matter now that an unborn child is in the mix.

BR549 · 2025-12-13T09:24:18+0000

Chojin Patriarch said:
Heck, I'm sure there are people who are stronger in some individual aspect of his powerset, such as a fighter who can punch through a mountain or a flyer capable of hypersonic flight.

Really, Superman is an excellent all-rounder, barring magic. I'd say there's many heroes who, in individual abilities, would exceed him, but he's the whole package, alongside Captain Marvel, who doesn't have the magic "weakness" but lacks Clark's maturity and experience...

...and then there's Martian Manhunter. In a lot of ways J'onn could almost be seen as making Superman redundant, because he has nearly the same set of "flying brick" powers, plus shapeshifting, intangibility, and telepathy.
The downside, of course, is that to defeat him all you need is a penny for a book of matches.

Duke Long · 2025-12-13T09:50:45+0000

Mr Zoat said:
I'm sitting cross-legged on the floor outside of Ursa Dou-Ka's cell. She's sitting cross-legged next on the floor inside of Ursa Dou-Ka's cell, and she had been ignoring me.

Extraneous 'next'?

Mr Zoat said:
"No, but… The kryptonian inclination towards criminality appears to confirm to the patterns it has in humans. That is to say that criminals are overwhelmingly male."

'conform'

Mr Zoat · 2025-12-13T10:20:03+0000

Signaller said:
Seems.

Duke Long said:
Extraneous 'next'?
'conform'

Thank you, corrected.

Bud-E · 2025-12-13T13:46:47+0000

"Congratulations, it's a dickhead just like its father."Paul Probably

Mr Zoat · 2025-12-13T14:01:04+0000

Bud-E said:
"Congratulations, it's a dickhead just like its father."Paul Probably

Actually, I remember Chris Kent as being a pleasant boy.

jasonh23761 · 2025-12-13T14:04:07+0000

Mr Zoat said:
It might be a transatlantic thing, but in the U.K., 'Red X' would only be used to refer to a Communist.

It definitely still is in the states, though broadly in a more joking or sarcastic way?

Mr Zoat said:
America just uses the colours backwards. The rest of the world is shaking its heads at them

Story of our lives right there. Such is life.

Mquz said:
In America, the Republican Party has tried to rehabilitate the color red into a "blood and soil" meaning to go with the election map color scheme of red vs blue (introduced in 2000).

I'm like 90% certain they used to switch every election cycle. Then, the events of the 2000 Presidential Election cycle, with constantly referenced electoral maps in the news cycle that had relatively recently gone 24 hours, caused those colors to be seared into the zeitgeist.

Edit: A link to an NPR article on the topic from 2014.

Steelplaza · 2025-12-13T15:35:42+0000

BR549 said:
...and then there's Martian Manhunter. In a lot of ways J'onn could almost be seen as making Superman redundant, because he has nearly the same set of "flying brick" powers, plus shapeshifting, intangibility, and telepathy.
The downside, of course, is that to defeat him all you need is a penny for a book of matches.

While different continuities have different takes, in Young Justice and modern takes martian physical abilities are generally inferior to kryptonian physical abilities. From the perspective of your average human it doesn't make much difference if the guy you're fighting can lift ten tons or 100 tons... they outmuscle you so much either way it's not a contest. If they fight each other, then that's a different matter.

Lord Ernest · 2025-12-13T15:57:11+0000

I was already expecting the discovery, but it's funny that the Illustres found out because he was asking for her eggs. I would have thought he scanned Dru and Ursa when they came out of the Phantom Zone.

I imagine this will be an issue especially with Supes, but I don't think it should be. Just get the baby out and into an exo-womb and let Clark and Lois adopt the future Chris Kent, as it usually happens, right?

Ardy · 2025-12-13T16:13:06+0000

Lord Ernest said:
I was already expecting the discovery, but it's funny that the Illustres found out because he was asking for her eggs. I would have thought he scanned Dru and Ursa when they came out of the Phantom Zone.

I imagine this will be an issue especially with Supes, but I don't think it should be. Just get the baby out and into an exo-womb and let Clark and Lois adopt the future Chris Kent, as it usually happens, right?

His track record of new kids popping out of nowhere is mixed, so who knows.

Also, I love imagining him telling Lois:

"So Lois, I know you're mad about the justice league taking over the world and not talking about it despite being a reporter, but I have good news! We're having another baby! No, of course you're not pregnant, don't be silly, I got these war criminal Kryptonians out of the phantom zone and one of them is pregnant, so we're going to be raising basically Kryptonian Hitler junior! Isn't that great!"

CrazyNoVa · 2025-12-13T16:42:20+0000

Mr Zoat said:
They're being helped to establish a colony elsewhere. No yellow sun. And while empowered kryptonians can fly in space, they can't fly faster than light and need to breathe eventually. They're not much of a threat if they're not in the same system."

Unless you expose them to blue sunlight.

Mr Zoat said:
No, not control. Channel. He learned how to channel all his hate and anger into a long term plan that gave him the best chance at revenge, rather than just charging into Downing Street with a cricket bat.

So, he has a natural connection and affinity to the red light, much like how Hal has a natural connection and affinity to the green light. And when he gained his hate and anger for the british government, it gave him a medium to reach enlightenment?

Mr Zoat said:
Actually, I remember Chris Kent as being a pleasant boy.

Sure, he was…until they made him evil in Rebirth. Thanks a lot, DC!

Ardy said:
"So Lois, I know you're mad about the justice league taking over the world and not talking about it despite being a reporter, but I have good news! We're having another baby! No, of course you're not pregnant, don't be silly, I got these war criminal Kryptonians out of the phantom zone and one of them is pregnant, so we're going to be raising basically Kryptonian Hitler junior! Isn't that great!"

Eh, more like Kryptonian Megatron. And in turn, his followers are more like Kryptonian Decepticons.

Darko · 2025-12-13T16:57:44+0000

Mr Zoat said:
says it. "He has no tolerance for pain at all. We barely even need to threaten him

Link is broken.

Vaermina · 2025-12-13T16:58:04+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"Ah… Or maybe not. Um."

"What? Why?"

"Congratulations. You're pregnant."

Congratulations, now so long as she's not an idiot she can delay her execution for at least nine months.

Darko · 2025-12-13T17:23:40+0000

Vaermina said:
Congratulations, now so long as she's not an idiot she can delay her execution for at least nine months.

Assuming they don't just decide to put the baby in an artificial womb.

Heck, she may actually ask them to do that since as far as she knows no one is going to rescue her and she may not want to delay the inevitable.

Yockranon · 2025-12-13T18:11:07+0000

Mr Zoat said:
Actually, I remember Chris Kent as being a pleasant boy.

This is true. Chris was a very nice lad. That said there's a 'current' Lar-Zod that is a bit of a prick since DC is trying very hard to forget my boy ever existed.

Wheenesss · 2025-12-13T18:41:29+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"You think you can get me a stay of execution for breeding purposes?"

"No. I was going to ask if you'd mind donating a few eggs." I shrug. "Even if we end up using an exo-womb, it's still additional genetic variety."

"Then I suppose it's my last duty. Does the Doomsday have an infirmary?"

"No, but I can extract them by ring here. You won't feel a thing."

"Oh. Very well then, get on with it."

"Alright, I-."

Ohhhhh… Heck.

"Ah… Or maybe not. Um."

"What? Why?"

"Congratulations. You're pregnant."

Huh. So you are keeping that part from Young Justice Season 3. I hope Lor-Zod has a better upbringing than what he had in the show or in the comics.

NightmareWarden · 2025-12-13T19:09:39+0000

The phantom zone is accessible from anywhere in their universe, basically? I wonder if that dimension is artificial… or if it is natural, but has been co-opted by the kryptonians. Either way, it may have a purpose, or a cycle which will make it matter for future arcs. The fact that it preserves bodies so perfectly, their minds continuing unabated, there is something strange here.

Steelplaza · 2025-12-13T21:15:14+0000

Mr Zoat said:
"Meaning… Most kryptonians never saw an alien. We didn't need them as labourers, or to provide us with resources. And because they never interacted with them, they saw no need for anyone to interact with them." I nod. "Is that it? We all died because most of us never left the cradle?"

We've gotten a lot of comments in this story about the loss of the Kryptonian Empire from the viewpoint of the military caste. That made it pretty easy to accept their narrative that it was a great tragedy and a stupid decision on the part of the Science Council.

Then in one brief passage, Ursa manages to put a different light on the entire thing. Exactly what good was this Empire even doing for the average Kryptonian? It got them nothing; no resources they didn't already have at home, no labor they couldn't already do with robots, no culture they were interested in. Did they even get the equivalent of "Curry"? What were they even doing? What were they expending all these resources on other than ego? Suddenly it's the most obvious thing in the world that the people of Krypton would have voted out the Military Council that managed to have an empire that didn't even pay out.

In a way the fact that none of their former vassals came after them is pretty damning. No one hated them enough because the Kryptonian Empire wasn't even extracting significant tribute. But if they weren't getting anything out of it, why do it?

Mr Zoat said:
"Ah… Or maybe not. Um."

Hey now, her being pregnant doesn't mean he can't extract those eggs. She gave permission; go ahead and grab them!

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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