Rebu
hey, little Anna, you're the one
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Isn't that arguably taken by Connor and Match? Or was that in the other universe?
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- self insert young justice
Finagle007
[Verified Great Old One]
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Oh, I wouldn't say that. Facing off against the damn Anti-Life seems like the best possible time to achieve Enlightenment; best way I know - other than finding the Life Equation - to render yourself immune/more resistant to the damn thing.
Duke Long
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'Talk ta Tommy'?
Assblaster5000
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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I am aware of that, but Zoat was arguing that the writers would not be getting their jobs back at all which is the context I was making my argument in, and since no finagling by prompt engineers is enough that means someone had to edit the script for it to fall under copyright laws. That's something directors and producers are currently protesting about being forced to do because writers aren't getting hired beyond the first draft.
So if the actual writers won't do it because they aren't going to get hired anymore, the directors and producers won't do it because they're being overworked and refuse to, and prompt engineers can't do it by just getting the AI to try really hard, who is left to make the script fall under copyright? The actors? The camera crew? Some random executive?
Basically the only way to make this work I can see is to either hire writers again and use the AI to cut corners for cost reasons, which will probably lead to the protests continuing, or to just accept that the script isn't copyrightable, which I sincerely doubt would ever happen. It's a financially stupid move, even discounting the possibly that actually trying to do it results in a walk-out protest turning into a lawsuit from essentially trying to remove an entire profession from existence.
rkyeun
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Option D is that Current Year Hollywood simply fails and the world is better off for it.
Copyright and patents are the worst ideas ever invented anyways. I'd say followed by DRM, except that only exists because of copyright anyways.
Copyright and patents are the worst ideas ever invented anyways. I'd say followed by DRM, except that only exists because of copyright anyways.
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.
Whoever owns the copyright on the AI program, I assume.
Coda
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personal effects (... I may have to go back and see if perhaps I got that wrong when I was talking about it recently)
Hard disagree. They exist for a very good reason -- limited IP protection means that "inventor" is a meaningful job. Otherwise, you do all the hard work and then the moment you're successful someone else can come in, reverse-engineer your product, and undercut your prices without having to put in the R&D costs. It matters even more for "author" and "artist" as job titles, because at least reverse-engineering and manufacturing a replica product take work... duplicating a book has been nearly trivial for centuries, and duplicating 2D artwork has been trivial since good-quality photography became widely accessible.
The problem is in the overextension of the concepts of IP protection to turn it into a way to make money in and of itself, or to stifle competition for arbitrarily long amounts of time. Time-limited protection gives you the opportunity to benefit from your own work, but without limits it stops promoting innovation and starts suppressing it -- it means that creators can rest on their laurels with no motivation to make something new, and it prevents others from making something better.
This isn't even a modern concept. The US Constitution explicitly states "To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries." -- not even in an amendment, it was in the original drafting.
That's only true if the AI was built for the specific purpose at hand -- if there was specific creative work put into building the tool, and if the creative content of the output is derived from the creative content involved in its construction, then yes, the AI creator can claim the copyright. (A more concrete example of this is that you can own the copyright on aesthetically-rendered images of fractals even though it's just based on a simple mathematical formula, because the programmer made all of the creative choices that went into transforming that mathematical formula into a piece of art.)
Otherwise, it's considered to be in the public domain as something that simply isn't eligible to be copyrighted in the first place. (Analogously, while the Windows XP background wallpaper is copyrightable as an image in and of itself, someone else could go take a photo of the same hill and it wouldn't be copyright infringement, because the natural landscape isn't the product of human creativity.)
ForeverShogo
Not too sore, are you?
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With the Terror Twins showing up again, I decided to look them up to see if Young Justice did anything more with them. Holy shit on a stick. They look like someone took a branch from the ugly tree and beat the pretty out of them. Well, mostly Tommy. Not so much Tuppence. She mostly just looks more like a butch.
I guess it's lucky that in this story they're the result of the Danner Formula. Because apparently Weismann said in the cartoon they're actually mutants who will continue to mutate. Yep. They aren't even finished changing into whatever the hell their final appearance would be.
I guess it's lucky that in this story they're the result of the Danner Formula. Because apparently Weismann said in the cartoon they're actually mutants who will continue to mutate. Yep. They aren't even finished changing into whatever the hell their final appearance would be.
Mr Zoat
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As I understand it, that was a result of them volunteering for Reach augmentations.
Thank you, corrected.
NightmareWarden
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Renegade!Paul PoV. Did we ever get an answer on this, for non-New Gods at least?
If not, I think we might get another Grayven or Paul running around in the future. I doubt it will create a simple clone of of him... Perhaps a splinter of his soul, with some resemblance to the original Grayven? Dunno. I could also imagine a source-based blessing of Conquest aiding some people where a Grayven/Paul should have respawned, yet doesn't. The Sword of the Fallen isn't a toy, is what I'm getting at.
Prince Charon
Just zis guy, you know?
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Most likely, what the studios are aiming for is that the WGA gets broken (like, they don't even seem to be making it a secret that this is a goal), and they hire script editors to modify the scripts enough to make them copyrightable (or they get new laws written). The actors wouldn't be doing it, because they won't (in the future that the studio heads appear to want) be working either, having been replaced by AI-driven CGI characters.
Prep Time (part 3)
Mr Zoat
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15th February 2013
16:21 GMT -5
I try flexing my right arm, trying to test the range of motion. It's… It's actually about as good as my own power armour, but my armour wasn't designed to be something I could fight in. It was designed to be ablative. This is nothing like as tough. I suppose I should just be glad that the armour is flexible enough to cope with my size: most Dhorians are noticeably smaller than me.
The legs… Between their digitigrade legs and cloven feet, Dhorian leg armour isn't wearable by a human. And adapting them with a yellow ring is a lot harder than doing it with an orange ring would be. I've settled for bodging together shin guards and keeping my original boots.
And now the hard part.
"Orange Lantern to Abra Kadabra."
"Kadabra here."
"Do you have a moment? I'm about to take a look at my rings."
"I have tied the ship's computer to my implants, so it should be safe for-"
There's a quiet crackle and a slight breeze as he teleports to my location.
"-me to spend time away from the bridge."
"LexCorp not creating too much work?"
He hesitates for a moment. "Orange Lantern, I honestly believe that they are just glad to be away from the Anti-Life. Whatever Lex Luthor might want to do in other circumstances, I honestly believe that he's trying to help."
I look down. "Maybe."
"They were asking about bringing their families up here." He hesitates for a moment. "I know that you have a solution, but… They have children."
"And Mannheim's got a robot that can teleport up here whenever it wants to, and there aren't any child-sized space suits. Based on its demonstrated power, it could snap every one of these ships in half inside five minutes."
He nods slowly, right hand stroking his goatee. "Why has it not done so?"
"Mannheim might not know. He might not care. Or there might not be enough of Mannheim left to care."
"Darkseid does not care about Earth."
"We're mildly interesting, but he's conquered or razed worlds before. All he wants is to learn about the way we react to the Anti-Life." I sigh. "Which is the one problem with my plan, assuming that it works."
"We will become 'interesting'."
"I was always planning on killing Darkseid eventually. But we're nothing like ready yet. I.. don't even think we can distract him. But Earth can't survive like this, so… Just have to deal with it, I guess."
He nods, waving his wand at the area around me and creating a weak plasma field.
"I can monitor your brainwaves. I can detect signs of the Anti-Life in most people. But… Your thoughts are unusual."
"Oh. Um, while I've got you alone… How are you handling it?"
He smiles faintly. "There is little that the Anti-Life can use to get into me. I have almost everything I want, and after this? I will have everything that I want. All it accuses me of doing is trying to justify my criminal behavior."
"You sure? Because if there's anything you want to talk about, I'm right here."
"It… Ah. Also has some observations about my life before I returned to this era. It may be true, but as far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter."
I nod approvingly.
Alright.
Visual inspection. I use my fear of losing my rings to float them out of my pouch and put them down on a workbench. Other than a slight dimming of their orange glow I can't see anything off about them.
Alright, you. Show me-.
External Motivation = External Control
Quieter than before. Though that might just be because I'm not wearing them.
"Could you hear that?"
Kadabra shakes his head. "What does it say?"
"External motivation equals external control. It actually relates to the concept of eudemonia, where even Aristotle had to accept that even a virtuous person might have their life wrecked by bad luck."
"And for a man who wants to change the universe, someone might unleash the Anti-Life on his homeworld."
"I'd get it if I'd acted against Apokolips, but this genuinely isn't my fault."
"Perhaps." He narrows his eyes thoughtfully. "But I don't remember anything about Apokolips showing an interest in Earth during this part of its history."
"Did the Reach have dealings with Apokolips?"
"The records I have show that they thought of Apokolips as an enemy. But…" He shrugs. "I don't know if that was how the record always was. But if it was not you and it was not me, why would Nylor Truggs involve Apokolips?"
"I wouldn't assume that we're the only time travellers. And it might have been some sort of convoluted series of knock-on factors. An-anyway, there are two basic ways to neutralise this. Accept it, or contradict it. Accepting it would mean accepting that we live in networks of causation constantly acting on one another and that things outside me do control me about as much as I control them. The Apokoliptan risk there is Darkseid-. Or Mannheim just saying 'and now that control is mine'. To refute it, I would need to believe that I control what I want, and therefore can disregard the external whenever I want. The problem there is that it implies I have no fixed character and so neutralises the 'I'."
"And would allow Darkseid to tell you to become something else, since you accept that possibility."
"Yep."
"Are there no alternatives?"
"My solution will cleanse my rings, as long as they're close enough to Earth. But I need either another Orange Lantern or an Indigo Lantern, because I assumed that I would be providing the orange. I could try having the Ophidian eat the Anti-Life infection, but that sounds like a bad idea."
"It sounds like the most sensible thing to do would be to dispatch one of these ships to Vega or the Alignment and reach an Orange Lantern from there. They could communicate with Maltus or come here themselves when you need them."
"Assuming that just having an Anti-Life infection in my rings isn't messing something significant up, yes."
External Motivation = External Control
"Or I could use the yellow ring to fly there myself. Which would mean that I didn't have to rely on LexCorp. But. There are two other clones I made myself, and Mannheim could have made more still. I need to learn how to deal with successful Anti-Life infections or I'm going to have to bench myself for the rest of the campaign."
External Motivation = External Control
I slide the yellow ring off my finger and reach for my rings.
"So what?"
16:21 GMT -5
I try flexing my right arm, trying to test the range of motion. It's… It's actually about as good as my own power armour, but my armour wasn't designed to be something I could fight in. It was designed to be ablative. This is nothing like as tough. I suppose I should just be glad that the armour is flexible enough to cope with my size: most Dhorians are noticeably smaller than me.
The legs… Between their digitigrade legs and cloven feet, Dhorian leg armour isn't wearable by a human. And adapting them with a yellow ring is a lot harder than doing it with an orange ring would be. I've settled for bodging together shin guards and keeping my original boots.
And now the hard part.
"Orange Lantern to Abra Kadabra."
"Kadabra here."
"Do you have a moment? I'm about to take a look at my rings."
"I have tied the ship's computer to my implants, so it should be safe for-"
There's a quiet crackle and a slight breeze as he teleports to my location.
"-me to spend time away from the bridge."
"LexCorp not creating too much work?"
He hesitates for a moment. "Orange Lantern, I honestly believe that they are just glad to be away from the Anti-Life. Whatever Lex Luthor might want to do in other circumstances, I honestly believe that he's trying to help."
I look down. "Maybe."
"They were asking about bringing their families up here." He hesitates for a moment. "I know that you have a solution, but… They have children."
"And Mannheim's got a robot that can teleport up here whenever it wants to, and there aren't any child-sized space suits. Based on its demonstrated power, it could snap every one of these ships in half inside five minutes."
He nods slowly, right hand stroking his goatee. "Why has it not done so?"
"Mannheim might not know. He might not care. Or there might not be enough of Mannheim left to care."
"Darkseid does not care about Earth."
"We're mildly interesting, but he's conquered or razed worlds before. All he wants is to learn about the way we react to the Anti-Life." I sigh. "Which is the one problem with my plan, assuming that it works."
"We will become 'interesting'."
"I was always planning on killing Darkseid eventually. But we're nothing like ready yet. I.. don't even think we can distract him. But Earth can't survive like this, so… Just have to deal with it, I guess."
He nods, waving his wand at the area around me and creating a weak plasma field.
"I can monitor your brainwaves. I can detect signs of the Anti-Life in most people. But… Your thoughts are unusual."
"Oh. Um, while I've got you alone… How are you handling it?"
He smiles faintly. "There is little that the Anti-Life can use to get into me. I have almost everything I want, and after this? I will have everything that I want. All it accuses me of doing is trying to justify my criminal behavior."
"You sure? Because if there's anything you want to talk about, I'm right here."
"It… Ah. Also has some observations about my life before I returned to this era. It may be true, but as far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter."
I nod approvingly.
Alright.
Visual inspection. I use my fear of losing my rings to float them out of my pouch and put them down on a workbench. Other than a slight dimming of their orange glow I can't see anything off about them.
Alright, you. Show me-.
External Motivation = External Control
Quieter than before. Though that might just be because I'm not wearing them.
"Could you hear that?"
Kadabra shakes his head. "What does it say?"
"External motivation equals external control. It actually relates to the concept of eudemonia, where even Aristotle had to accept that even a virtuous person might have their life wrecked by bad luck."
"And for a man who wants to change the universe, someone might unleash the Anti-Life on his homeworld."
"I'd get it if I'd acted against Apokolips, but this genuinely isn't my fault."
"Perhaps." He narrows his eyes thoughtfully. "But I don't remember anything about Apokolips showing an interest in Earth during this part of its history."
"Did the Reach have dealings with Apokolips?"
"The records I have show that they thought of Apokolips as an enemy. But…" He shrugs. "I don't know if that was how the record always was. But if it was not you and it was not me, why would Nylor Truggs involve Apokolips?"
"I wouldn't assume that we're the only time travellers. And it might have been some sort of convoluted series of knock-on factors. An-anyway, there are two basic ways to neutralise this. Accept it, or contradict it. Accepting it would mean accepting that we live in networks of causation constantly acting on one another and that things outside me do control me about as much as I control them. The Apokoliptan risk there is Darkseid-. Or Mannheim just saying 'and now that control is mine'. To refute it, I would need to believe that I control what I want, and therefore can disregard the external whenever I want. The problem there is that it implies I have no fixed character and so neutralises the 'I'."
"And would allow Darkseid to tell you to become something else, since you accept that possibility."
"Yep."
"Are there no alternatives?"
"My solution will cleanse my rings, as long as they're close enough to Earth. But I need either another Orange Lantern or an Indigo Lantern, because I assumed that I would be providing the orange. I could try having the Ophidian eat the Anti-Life infection, but that sounds like a bad idea."
"It sounds like the most sensible thing to do would be to dispatch one of these ships to Vega or the Alignment and reach an Orange Lantern from there. They could communicate with Maltus or come here themselves when you need them."
"Assuming that just having an Anti-Life infection in my rings isn't messing something significant up, yes."
External Motivation = External Control
"Or I could use the yellow ring to fly there myself. Which would mean that I didn't have to rely on LexCorp. But. There are two other clones I made myself, and Mannheim could have made more still. I need to learn how to deal with successful Anti-Life infections or I'm going to have to bench myself for the rest of the campaign."
External Motivation = External Control
I slide the yellow ring off my finger and reach for my rings.
"So what?"
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Mr Zoat
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Who?
No, because that would require him to stab someone powerful without killing them.
Darko
Connoisseur.
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Captain Comet.
BlueMangoAdea
Alive. For now.
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Facing it head on it is.
Duke Long
Glomerulus
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'so it'
Thought this was a mistake, but no, turns out it's just a spelling I've never seen.
So by saying 'so what', is he accepting that he is indeed controlled externally? That's the impression I got, but I'm not sure.
Vaermina
Well worn.
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LePaul is firmly in de-nile.
That amuses me greatly.
This may be the dumbest thing LePaul has ever done.
Even if it works it's still the dumbest thing he's ever done, because the risk is absolutely not worth the reward.
Chojin Patriarch
Veteran Lurker
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Ah, averting the usual 'one size fits all' nature of space-age armour. Always a slight buggaboo of science fiction games with 'stock' NPC physiques. Like Mass Effect, where humans, Asari and Batarians all use the same armour styles despite variations in physiognomy. A minor niggle, but nice to see it avoided. Especially as OL needs better armour, his own still being locked in his Orange Subspace pocket.
Closest thing you have to anyone proficient in anything beyond punching and shooting. That you can trust, anyway.
Which also means that Luthor's people won't be able to access anything unless he allows them to. clever.
Of course, him being the only one able to allow access would mean that he'd have to be there the whole time to provide his approval.
Only so he can claim credit for aiding in humanitarian services during the crisis. His first thought will always be 'How do I benefit from this?'
Basically giving Truggs and Lex what they want: Humans offworld capable of setting up a colony. Albeit a limited one.
For all we now, Mannheim's sitting there chuckling at their petty efforts to subvert him.
And that is honestly a good thing, because...
...Being 'interesting' to Darkseid is not a favourable condition for anyone.
So, privacy, protection, or both? I doubt OL wants to fiddle with his Rings anywhere Truggs can see him.
That would be his Enlightenment, I suppose. Probably the general background noise of his desires running under everything like a mental tinnitus.
I mean, everyone has weaknesses, Abra. And Anti-Life can find ones you didn't even know existed.
...So it's best avenue of attack is just yelling 'Nerd!' at him repeatedly?
Careful, OL. You don't want to void your warranty by playing amateur Ring technician.
And there it is. Same thing again. Hopefully it's just limited to his rings, and not filtering into the full light.
If he could, I'm sure Abra would be a respectable candidate for Lanternhood...
Eudaimonia, for reference. It's a very complex subject...
In fact... Other than the whole Forever People thing and Big Bard and Scot Free being here, what would their first interaction with Apokalips be? Canis Minor turning up?
To be fair, to the Reach, anyone who isn't already in the process of being absorbed into their culture might qualify as an enemy...
Which leaves you a blank slate for someone else to write on. At least OL has an advantage in knowing if what he wants is what he wants and where that want comes from.
Which for someone like OL, is truly apocalyptic.
Yeah, I would not want to see the case of indigestion that would produce.
Which it could easily be, given the way Orange Light yields to its users' desires.
Which you can't afford to. Not if you want to get the 'By our Colours combined' achievement.
Ah, 'sink or swim' it is, eh? Let's hope you don't drown, OL...
Well, this is either going to break the Anti-Life infection, or break him. It's a hell of a risk at a critical time like this, but as he said, if he can't use the Orange Light, he's not much use and therefore a major risk to their operations. Hopefully Abra can keep things contained, and no certain idiots go poking at the Ring-slinger while he's on his vision quest...
AmericanNumbers
Not too sore, are you?
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If we take the clone cache Renegade found at face value then yes Paul, it's you Darkseid finds interesting.
This is a very Jordan solution. Basically "Get the fuck out of my light "
This is a very Jordan solution. Basically "Get the fuck out of my light "
BR549
This is filth! FILTH!!
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It's saying "that may be true, but it doesn't matter" - that's not accepting or refuting it, instead it's neutralizing any hold it might have.
Duke Long
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Yeah, that's what I meant. I just wasn't sure if he actually meant that or if 'so what' was just a generic sort of challenging phrase.
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.
Z000
If this is trash, then find me in the dumpster
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hey, it alway the solution to these thing
your head + target
repeat till the target is dead
rkyeun
Cabbitus Maximus
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In theory, you're correct. In the same way that in theory, communism works. In practice, your own quote ends up explaining why it's shit. Communism fails because you run out of other people's money, and then IP fails because you're censoring everyone else's minds and labor.
Instead, the government should provide grants to those who produce works of useful artistic merit and inventions useful to society as a reward, and then let all of society benefit from it so we can have free insulin instead of thousand dollar a vial insulin. Inventing a new thing that improves society creates economic wealth that did not exist before, and that value can be paid to the inventor without hamstringing the people.
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iamnuff
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About time.
Coming up with a clever counter-argument isn't how you fight an Anti-life infection.
Because the Anti-life is inherently stupid and valueless.
Its like trying to debate someone who keeps punching you on the face while insulting you.
It doesn't matter if you refute their points, they're still hitting you.
What you do, is you gird your loins and ball up your fists and you say "Fite me, bitch." and you just rawdog that shit.
Come and have a go, if you think you're 'ard enough.
Mr Zoat
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I would like to comment on this, but I think we've drifted far enough away from the story that it's an actual Rule 8 thing now.
DeathReaperZ
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Ah, I see. Thank you.
Must have been surprisingly easy for him to just become a god.
Thanks again dude, but how am I supposed to contact them? I don't want to disturb any of them just for this.
It's all about perspective. A man on a mountain would find that being on a hill would feel like being downhill.
Probably the best way to enforce that.
But assuming he wasn't Christian, he probably would become a New God.
You're welcome
I can't really see them being used for anything else, unless they still cut down trees and build dams on their home planet.
I expected more ballads? It's kind of the only music we know Paul likes, other than maybe jazz?
I believe you misread what I said, I want to change my name for this account without getting a new account.
DeathReaperZ
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Does a show with this name actually exist?
Sounds familiar.
I think it might have been better if you mentioned that Paul also transitioned the New Gods along with him too, as I, and at least one other person, thought that he just left them there.
Interesting that rubies are considered precious here too.
She finally figured to be empathetic.
If only all people were decent enough but still as financially motivated as those two. It would seriously speed up a lot.