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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Reader mode
Hmm. Kinda hope Zatanna only SAYS she is giving up. Funny thing would be her somehow contacting Ophidian and getting the best snek on her side. I have a feeling the Ophi would be of the opinion more is better.
 
Siskulous said:
Actually....poor Paul too. I'd hate to be in a position to have to do that to someone.
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Yeah, but Paul only got to this point by willfully blinding himself to what was going on.

Let me be clear: You don't have to give any reason to turn someone down. "I don't want to go out with you" or just "No" are completely and utterly acceptable.

But... if you are going to give a reason, giving a bullshit reason doesn't do anyone any favors. "We can't date because it wouldn't be appropriate" is all but saying that you want to date them, but they just have this obstacle they need to overcome, and his insistence on pretending to be a different age than he internally identifies as makes his reason seem even more bullshit to her than it does to him.

He has empathic vision. He could see that when, for example, he just wanted to help her relax... by going into her bedroom right before she went to sleep, sitting behind her to brush her hair to get her used to being touched by him, and then giving her a massage, that her acceptance of all of this was tinged with violet light.

I mean, he literally knows how the "you're too young for me, this is just a schoolgirl crush" storyline ends just with green light, and he basically just buried his head in the sand about any potential issues with her mainlining violet light.

So, yeah, really shitty position for Paul to be in, but--as with his not coming clean about what age he considers himself--it's a position that doesn't become better the later you have to bite the bullet.
 
Valint said:
Let me be clear: You don't have to give any reason to turn someone down. "I don't want to go out with you" or just "No" are completely and utterly acceptable.
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Technically true, but in practice, "completely and utterly acceptable" does not mean "will not cause hard feelings". It is inherently difficult to refuse to escalate a relationship without damaging the relationship which was already present.
 
Valint said:
Yeah, but Paul only got to this point by willfully blinding himself to what was going on.

Let me be clear: You don't have to give any reason to turn someone down. "I don't want to go out with you" or just "No" are completely and utterly acceptable.

But... if you are going to give a reason, giving a bullshit reason doesn't do anyone any favors. "We can't date because it wouldn't be appropriate" is all but saying that you want to date them, but they just have this obstacle they need to overcome, and his insistence on pretending to be a different age than he internally identifies as makes his reason seem even more bullshit to her than it does to him.

He has empathic vision. He could see that when, for example, he just wanted to help her relax... by going into her bedroom right before she went to sleep, sitting behind her to brush her hair to get her used to being touched by him, and then giving her a massage, that her acceptance of all of this was tinged with violet light.

I mean, he literally knows how the "you're too young for me, this is just a schoolgirl crush" storyline ends just with green light, and he basically just buried his head in the sand about any potential issues with her mainlining violet light.

So, yeah, really shitty position for Paul to be in, but--as with his not coming clean about what age he considers himself--it's a position that doesn't become better the later you have to bite the bullet.
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You're not wrong, about any of that. He was trying not to hurt her, so he had the best of intentions, but he utterly failed. And now the position he finds himself in is a pretty shitty one.

Technically true, but in practice, "completely and utterly acceptable" does not mean "will not cause hard feelings". It is inherently difficult to refuse to escalate a relationship without damaging the relationship which was already present.
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Being rejected hurts. Simple as that. Nothing changes it unless the person being rejected can fool themselves into thinking it's not REALLY a rejection, which seems to be what Zatanna has done. Granted Paul left that possibility open for her. And if you hurt someone, right or wrong, they're probably gonna be mad at you.
 
I honestly don't care about Zatanna having a crush or deep feelings or whatever. I didn't get the boy in Junior high, I didn't get the boy in High school, and I didn't get the other boy after graduation.

So she can get the fuck over it. No sympathy if she goes all weepy girl over being entitled to OL or whatever because girl reasons.

Beyond that, I'm saddened that she's probably about to lose her staff of powerup.
 
Pinklestia said:
Is hilarious how Grayven has become saner as Oh El has become crazier.
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well paul has become less human over time after initially trying to keep his humanity, as he cut out the more human parts of his life slowly (when was the last time he visited holly? or any 'normal' person), while grayven became more human over time as he didn't make any effort to keep his humanity initially but has clawed it back afterwards, as he accepted the more human parts of his life (his acceptance of his daughter, bringing his mother into his life, getting involved in that school and recovering from the anti-life)

Personally I find the reflection the paul and grayven are of each other to be the best part of both stories (while I find grayven more enjoyable I see how while grayven started out trying to be a cold blooded killer and became more human afterward as a necessity, paul started out trying to be human and became a cold blooded killer afterward out of the same necessity)
 
Valint said:
Yeah, but Paul only got to this point by willfully blinding himself to what was going on.

Let me be clear: You don't have to give any reason to turn someone down. "I don't want to go out with you" or just "No" are completely and utterly acceptable.

But... if you are going to give a reason, giving a bullshit reason doesn't do anyone any favors. "We can't date because it wouldn't be appropriate" is all but saying that you want to date them, but they just have this obstacle they need to overcome, and his insistence on pretending to be a different age than he internally identifies as makes his reason seem even more bullshit to her than it does to him.

He has empathic vision. He could see that when, for example, he just wanted to help her relax... by going into her bedroom right before she went to sleep, sitting behind her to brush her hair to get her used to being touched by him, and then giving her a massage, that her acceptance of all of this was tinged with violet light.

I mean, he literally knows how the "you're too young for me, this is just a schoolgirl crush" storyline ends just with green light, and he basically just buried his head in the sand about any potential issues with her mainlining violet light.

So, yeah, really shitty position for Paul to be in, but--as with his not coming clean about what age he considers himself--it's a position that doesn't become better the later you have to bite the bullet.
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or maybe he subconsciously recognized that zatanna would be stronger if she was in love with him thus increasing their chances against Nabu.

(sorry for the double post I don't know how to quote more than on person.)
 
DAT_NOOB said:
(sorry for the double post I don't know how to quote more than on person.)
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Just hit the reply button at the bottom of each post (or select the section to quote, then use that reply button). The forum will just stack the quoted sections, one after the other, and you can insert love breaks and type your responses between them.

There's also the multiquote option, but... I haven't had cause to figure out how to use that one.
 
Has Zatanna actually started to worship Aphrodite like she planned to? Because if she did then Paul should ask her for advice and if she could talk to Zatanna about it.
 
Aeess said:
Has Zatanna actually started to worship Aphrodite like she planned to? Because if she did then Paul should ask her for advice and if she could talk to Zatanna about it.
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But that might mean that the Silver city's massive dick move might have had some wider consequences for them.
 
DAT_NOOB said:
well paul has become less human over time after initially trying to keep his humanity, as he cut out the more human parts of his life slowly (when was the last time he visited holly? or any 'normal' person), while grayven became more human over time as he didn't make any effort to keep his humanity initially but has clawed it back afterwards, as he accepted the more human parts of his life (his acceptance of his daughter, bringing his mother into his life, getting involved in that school and recovering from the anti-life)

Personally I find the reflection the paul and grayven are of each other to be the best part of both stories (while I find grayven more enjoyable I see how while grayven started out trying to be a cold blooded killer and became more human afterward as a necessity, paul started out trying to be human and became a cold blooded killer afterward out of the same necessity)
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Sadly I keep liking Oh El less and less since he had the brilliant idea to revive people.

Is like he forgot how that would lead to trouble based on what he knew of DC.
 
CTrees said:
Just hit the reply button at the bottom of each post (or select the section to quote, then use that reply button). The forum will just stack the quoted sections, one after the other, and you can insert love breaks and type your responses between them.
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Multi-quote is actually easier than normal reply.

If you want to quote the whole post, click the "+ Quote" link between "Like" and "Reply". But I rarely want to quote the whole post, so to get just the part you want to reply to, highlight the text you want to quote and it'll pop open a little box that says "+ Quote | Reply". Click on "+ Quote" in there.

You can do this as many times as you want. If you've done this with at least one quote, an "Insert Quotes..." button will appear below the Quick Reply box at the bottom of the page. Click this button and it'll let you rearrange (by dragging) or remove (with the "Remove" link) anything you've quoted, and then you can click "Quote These Messages" to insert them into the quick reply box.
 
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So... the Star Saphire holds the Predator (Violet Entity)?
 
Hoard (part 23)
13th January
08:08 GMT -5

I walk up the path to Shadowcrest. If Zatanna's not up by-.

Incoming communication.

I take a holoprojector out of subspace. Answer.

Jade appears, dressed in a Darkstar exo-mantle. She looks calmly at me as I smile.

"Sorry, I'm not.. dragging you away from anything important, am I?"

That gets a minor eye-roll and a head-shake. "As strange as it sounds, I actually like hearing from you. What's going on?"

"Are you..? Getting on alright with the other recruits?"

She turns the camera at her end a little to the side, and a mauve-skinned humanoid in a Darkstar uniform performs a sort of double-fisted salute. I raise my right hand in a wave.

"We're tutoring each other."

"Not having any… Problems?"

"None I can't manage." Ah, how do I-? "A few have commented on my relationship with you, but they're mostly… Curious."

"Without wishing to intervene in your new career-."

"I survived Dad. I can survive a hazing." Her eyes narrow slightly. "What are you calling about?"

"There was an incident with Zatanna."

She blinks. "Someone mind controlled her into finally coming onto you."

"A dragon, yes. I wasn't-. To be clear, we weren't ever-."

"You weren't ever dating, you think she's too young for you and the only reason why you spent so much time with her was because of Nabu."

I nod.

"And it appears that the Star Sapphire was talking to her. I.. called you because.. I think this is the sort of thing I should keep you informed about."

"From what Artemis said, I should be more worried about you hitting on my Mom."

"Yes-." She smiles smugly. "By which I mean-."

"She's an adult, and Zatanna isn't. I don't actually think that you're going.. cougar-hunting."

I smile. "And I mean no disrespect to your mother when I say that. Because if I was-."

"I'm sure she'd be relieved to know that she was your first choice."

"If she doesn't know already. I mean, I go jogging with her and Artemis most mornings now, and her-."

Her face loses the air of humour. "Getting awkward."

"Sorry." One of the great things about communicating like this is that empathic vision doesn't work and I'm forced to respond to outward cues like a normal person. "So I'm going to go and tell a hero-besotted teenaged girl who's been under the influence of a mind control dragon and a mind control alien love crystal that it is never going to happen."

"Would you?"

I frown. "Would I what?"

"Before we got together. If she was older."

"If she was older, I doubt that she'd have become quite so dependent. But… Maybe?" I shake my head. "No, not while we were still working on Nabu. And the Star Sapphire would have made me uncomfortable about it. Maybe afterwards?" I frown. "Wwwwwwwhy?"

"Just curious."

"If you want to know about all of the women I struck out with before-."

"Like my ex-landlords?"

"I didn't 'strike out' with them. I politely declined." I shake my head. "Anyway, that was what I wanted to tell you. And that I miss you. And that I love you."

She smiles faintly, her head bowing slightly. "I love you too." She glances off to the side. "There's a rumour going around that Orange Lanterns aren't allowed to feel love."

"A rumour, or do I need to talk to Dox?"

"Just a rumour."

"Good, because it's stupid, but not so stupid that I couldn't see him doing it. Orange constructs are given strength by avarice. By want and need and desire. Intense impulses of love disrupt that, but I doubt that it would come up much in combat."

She raises her eyebrows, smiling faintly. "You're saying I make you weak?"

"It's not a problem for enlightened Lanterns, as I'm sure that you and Tora are glad to hear." I glance at the door. Nice as it would be to put that off, it needs to be done. "Jade, I need-."

She nods. "Go. I'll talk to you later."

I nod, and return the hologram projector to subspace. Then I sigh, and walk up the path to the front door. I raise my right hand and knock twice on the door. A few moments pass, then Giovanni opens it and then steps back.

"She's in the living room. I will leave you alone."

"Thank you."

He nods, and I head further into the house. Zatanna looks up as I walk into the living room and then looks away, her hands on her knees balling into fists as she sees me.

"Zatanna-."

"I'm-. I'm sorry I tried to mind control you." She's cringing. I hate seeing her like that. "And-."

"Zatanna." She looks up again, her eyes watering. "I don't care about that. But I do care about the fact that I haven't been clear enough, and it's having an adverse effect on you. You are my friend. I like you. I do not love you. I love Jade." She nods jerkily. "And that isn't. Going. To change. Am I being completely clear about this?"

"Y-yes."

It would be nice to apologise for being this hard on her. But at this point I can't risk saying anything that moderates the point I'm making.

"And I'm going to be avoiding you for a while. Not because I hate you, but because this isn't healthy for you. And the Star Sapphire is going in a very secure place."

Another jerky nod, her head remaining bowed as she sniffs.

And I turn around and leave the building.
 
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Mr Zoat said:
"Sorry, I'm not.. dragging you away from anything important, am I?"
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I'm guessing he left a message earlier for her to call him back.

"There was an incident with Zatanna."
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That's... understating it quite a bit. :)

She blinks. "Someone mind controlled her in to finally coming onto you."
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Wow, pretty genre-savvy.

I like you. I do no love you.
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I like you. I do not love you.


Ouch. Hopefully, she can deal with this. Hopefully her friends can commiserate over ice cream. Otherwise things might get awkward down the line...
 
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I still prefer the In Praise of Eros version of the Paul-Zatanna relationship denial, even though we haven't seen the total fallout from that yet, just because of the honesty. However, I think this works too, and hopefully her friends and family can help her gain her figurative and literal mojo back.
Besides the emotional fallout, she's down to regular levels of magic/mana expenditure now, so I'm curious if she's going to try securing an alternate, less dangerous magical power source at some point. I also wonder if we'll see if there's more to the talking Star Sapphire plot thread in the future (I'm curious about how it bypassed the bindings that a number of fairly skilled thaumaturgists and practitioners signed off on- usually magic trumps Glow-technology in this setting, not the other way around), possibly when he manages to successfully meet the Zamarons.
 
PrinceJonathan said:
I once saw a hentai where a guy was fucking a hot sexy spider monstergirl...she ended up eating him in the end.
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Ah fuck, I remember that one. Fun stuff.

Man, I wonder if they'll ever end up using the Star Sapphire again? It was a pretty good power-up for Zatanna, but I guess the downsides were too much to ignore. Hopefully it pops up again later in the story.
 
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