With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Gantradies]

Not sure why OL is pretending this is an internal national matter, when he knows full well that it isn't. He doesn't seem to stand to gain anything by lying.

Also, the justice league not doing anything would look real bad to america, given that america has it's own salty native population.
People aren't going to like the implication that if they managed to rustle up a super-army and declared war on the USA, the Justice League wouldn't do anything about it.



I mean, the obvious solution would be to put a physical line on it.
Plant a specific genus of trees along the borderline or something.

That said, I don't see Euanthe caring about treaties or limits, so she'd probably want to grow the rainforest to cover anything it can cover, with little regard for what the humans think.

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my read is he's attempting to de-escalate and minimize the chances of doing something stupid-
panicky politicians often...have a tendency to make regrettable/unwise decisions on impulse when under heavy stress/pressure- and to be fair, "doomsday Luddite cult announcing they intend to destroy the entire nations infrastructure and leave the population to starve/dehydrate/die of exposure, with the means to practically do so" is one HELL of a valid reason to panic....

offer them a hammer (the potential to request aid military/superhuman aid from the league against a massive, ethnically-motivated terrorist attack against multiple countries with a potential death toll in the millions/complete collapse of local society) and they might start panic-smashing anything that looks remotely nail-like..


.. and i mean, they...wouldn't be entirely in the wrong- the tribes STARTING offer was "let us force you out of where you've lived your entire lives, or we'll shut off your life support and let you starve/choke with your children/partners..after all, it'd be YOUR fault for not magically adapting to a lifestyle/living conditions you've never had any reason to expect!"

i hate moral playing calculus as much as anyone else, but.. a few hundred enhanciles with an UTTERLY warped perspective of their own importance/power on a global scale AND a complete lack of regard for causing civilian casualties as long as they can rationalize that they didn't literally get blood on their hands, so leaving kids to starve is fine-
push comes to shove, its an easy choice..

 

[SirKaid]

Not sure why OL is pretending this is an internal national matter, when he knows full well that it isn't. He doesn't seem to stand to gain anything by lying.

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If they know that the outbreak of open hostilities would result in the League coming down on them like a bag of hammers then they would never even consider negotiating. Nevermind that the tribe would inevitably kill hundreds of people at best, thousands or tens of thousands if they hit a city first, or that an army of Danner Enhanciles could very well kill some of the League, they would say "Fuck the natives, kill them all" and any hope for a peaceful resolution would be lost.

Plus, OL's been trying to get people to adopt transhumanism like Dannering since shortly after he arrived. The recipe is out there now, so if the natives are successful every oppressed minority with any long term planning ability at all will rush to have their new generation Dannered. Similarly, every oppressor will be seriously considering doing the same.

If this works then transhumanism won't be just theoretical, it'll be official government policy. That's one of OL's primary goals met, all for the cost of a moment of lies by omission.

 

[david]

And....OL seems okay with all of this?

OL, the guy who yelled at a hippy for being a hippy, is perfectly okay with progress being smashed back into jungledom?

And when the other nations of the world, ones with larger and more powerful militaries than Brazil take notice because have stakes in the global industries that Brazil takes part in and decide to carpet bomb the Danners to death? Because that's all I see happening.

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I don't know about OL, but if I was trying to deprogram a nazi kryptonian I'd probably avoid outright supporting colonial descendants in suppressing the indigenous population without having a better reason than "our idea of civilization is superior to theirs."

 

[jasonh23761]

Would they be terrorists if they only target military infrastructure and stuff? They're not, ya know, trying to terrify people. It's in the name.

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So I wanted to go look up the legal definition of Terrorism and was surprised that different parts of the US GOV have slightly different definitions. I did try to word this carefully to avoid running afoul of Rule 8.

However, from Wikipedia: "The U.S. Code of Federal Regulations defines terrorism as "the unlawful use of force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives" (28 C.F.R. Section 0.85)."

As for Brazil, also from the same Wikipedia article: "In 2016, Brazil passed a law that defines acts of terrorism and establishes punishment for committing, planning, enabling, sponsoring, inciting and participating in terrorist acts. The bill lists a series of acts that provoke social and general terror or endager people, property, infrastructure, or public peace, for reasons of xenophobia, discrimination or prejudice of race, color, ethnics and religion. Shortly after the creation of the law, Federal Police's Operation Hashtag arrested eleven suspects of planning a terrorist attack in the run-up to the Rio 2016 Olympics."

So with those definitions in mind, a case could be made that the various tribes are terrorists by threatening to conduct attacks on infrastructure and government property in pursuit of their political goals.

Edit: Eliminated a redundant sentence.

 

[iamnuff]

an army of Danner Enhanciles could very well kill some of the League.

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I dunno about that. Super-strength without any special resistances or flight is pretty ghetto, as far as powersets go.
Knockout gas is in common use by the baseline humans and anyone who can fly could just drag em into the sky where the air is thin, or toss them outright into space.
To say nothing of how flash could probably solo the entire tribe before they knew he was there.
Even in large numbers, their threat to people who are actually prepared to fight meta-humans is pretty limited

They could tear apart a city full of normal people though.
Ironically, anti-riot measures like teargas and pepper-spray would probably be more effective than a military response like firearms or tanks.

 

[Mastigos2]

"What would it take for the Orange Lantern Corps to assist us?"

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I mean, the one thing Paul CAN offer is something along the lines of "Each of you offers up a negotiator and I Brand both of them to negotiate honestly and in good faith with the intent to reach a solution both parties find acceptable" though whether or not they'd even AGREE to that is questionable

 

[GhostKing 666]

I echo some people's sentiments about cattle ranching and deforestation not being happy indicators of progress, and I believe even twenty years ago (in case this is a political issue rather than a factual economic report) that Brazil had one of the highest income inequality rates in the world, though I don't immediately know if that's a common trait with the other South American countries in the line of fire. I'm happy and ultimately rooting for a peaceful resolution to this crisis, but there needs to be active political will for decolonization processes, and sadly physical force is often the most common resort for groups that have been systematically ignored and marginalized for generations, even if isn't the most effective.

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To point out something that people seem to be missing, it isn't just jungle clearing, it's the slash and burn style agriculture that's being used. The Amazon rainforest has some of the poorest soil on the planet, it is seriously shit tier.

When people "clear the forest", the soil left behind can only support around two, maybe three growing seasons if they are lucky before the farmers have to start cutting down another section of rainforest, leaving basically desolate wasteland behind them where nothing can grow.

These people aren't opposed to agriculture, what they want is to put an end to the slash and burn style agriculture being used and replace it with the type of sustainable agriculture that their ancestors used to turn the rainforest into a literal garden.




Turns out, large parts of the Amazon jungle are straight up artificial. Man made and when exploited properly can support millions of people just like it did before Europeans brought small pox to the jungle and killed the civilization living there that built the jungle.

 

[Stsword]

As for Brazil, also from the same Wikipedia article: "In 2016, Brazil passed a law that defines acts of terrorism and establishes punishment for committing, planning, enabling, sponsoring, inciting and participating in terrorist acts. The bill lists a series of acts that provoke social and general terror or endager people, property, infrastructure, or public peace, for reasons of xenophobia, discrimination or prejudice of race, color, ethnics and religion. Shortly after the creation of the law, Federal Police's Operation Hashtag arrested eleven suspects of planning a terrorist attack in the run-up to the Rio 2016 Olympics."

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It's not 2016 in the story yet, so unless time cops show up, laws that don't exist aren't likely to be enforced.

 

[fluffy]

The Brazilian government at least seems willing to negotiate, rather than immediately calling the army and telling them to open up the war crimes cabinet and get the nerve gas out, so this has a decent chance of going well.

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Well that makes sense at least. The Brazilian government is quite a bit less tyrannical now than it was under Vargas or even Fuguieredo.

 

[rdfox]

Also. Fun fact. While almost every nation on the planet has signed a treaty promising to destroy their chemical weapons stockpiles, in most of the world the use of chemical weapons in a civil dispute technically isn't a war crime.

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Additional trivia note: The treaty does not require complete destruction of chemical weapons stockpiles, as nonlethal incapacitants (like CS "tear" gas, for example) used for law enforcement purposes are exempted, as are maintaining small stockpiles for purposes of training and experiments in chemical warfare defense (such as developing better gas masks, better ways of decontaminating equipment exposed to chemical warfare agents, and better treatments for chemical warfare agent exposure).

The treaty also does not require destruction of facilities used to produce chemical warfare agents, merely those used to weaponize them--you can keep all the chemical plants used to produce sarin that you want, for example, so long as you destroy the facilities used to fill artillery shells and bombs with it. This was a deliberate choice, as many chemical warfare agents, or at least precursors to them that can be used to make them facilities roughly comparable to a bathtub (if you're suicidal enough/have good enough protective equipment) are also common industrial chemicals and banning the ability to produce/handle/use those would be economically crippling to any industrialized culture. Hell, you, the reader, probably have one of the earlier chemical warfare agents in your home right now; chlorine was one of the primary chemical warfare agents used in World War One... and all it takes to get chlorine gas out of the bottle of chlorine bleach in your laundry room is enough heat to separate it from the water it's dissolved and diluted in. If you've got ammonia-based kitchen cleaner along with the bleach, then you can make mustard gas even more easily. Banning those sorts of agents just isn't feasible; only banning their weaponization could be done.

And if you've got effective chemical warfare protective equipment, and are willing to contaminate the living hell out of some location, then it's not exactly hard to rapidly stand up a new production line for filling the shells and bombs with the agents in question. The thing about treaties is that they're only enforceable to the degree that all other signatories are willing to enforce them; if you decide to violate them and everyone else either decides, "Yes, that's a good emergency reason for the violation, so long as it's only a temporary measure," or decides they don't want to object because, hey, they're not exactly playing by the rules either (like the "enforcement" of the Washington Naval Treaty), then you can pretty much ignore them. (In the US, it's a little harder, as treaties signed by the President and ratified by the Senate actually become part of US federal law, and thus you'd need an act of Congress to make ignoring them technically legal, but that's not too likely to be honored in an emergency; witness that the Second London Naval Treaty technically did not expire until 31 December 1942, but the US basically started ignoring it in mid-1940, as the only signatory to it that had not informed the other parties to it that it was "involved in war" and thus suspending its requirement to abide by the treaty limitations--technically, we couldn't start to legally violate it until 8 December 1941, but with everyone else involved having suspended it, FDR and Congress both considered it to have been well and truly abrogated and just went ahead and ignored it without ever actually striking it from the lawbooks.)

And....OL seems okay with all of this?

OL, the guy who yelled at a hippy for being a hippy, is perfectly okay with progress being smashed back into jungledom?

And when the other nations of the world, ones with larger and more powerful militaries than Brazil take notice because have stakes in the global industries that Brazil takes part in and decide to carpet bomb the Danners to death? Because that's all I see happening.

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I suspect that OL is taking the position of a Neutral Mediator specifically to avoid having it break out into open warfare. OL looked at the tribe's original offer and internally thought that it was insane, though he was careful not to let that slip to either side. He doesn't really see either extreme as a viable, sustainable option, but he doesn't want it to turn into the charnel house that would come from active hostilities between the two sides. You don't have to be "okay" with one side or the other to realize that, without someone helping negotiate a better settlement, it will turn into a bloodbath on both sides and probably genocide on one side or the other, and then offer to be that neutral third party trying to keep it from turning violent.

Remember, as von Clauswitz put it, "War is the continuation of Politics by alternate means," and, to use a phrase I've seen elsewhere but never gotten a source for, "Diplomacy is not the art of making everyone happy, it's the art of finding a solution all parties are equally unhappy with." OL's trying to find a solution that neither side will particularly like, but both sides can at least live with, to avoid seeing this turn into a particularly nasty insurrection that ends with many, many dead on both sides, and massive collateral damage to the Amazon rainforest ecosystem.

 

[Siskulous]

Not sure why OL is pretending this is an internal national matter, when he knows full well that it isn't. He doesn't seem to stand to gain anything by lying.

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I'm curious what your definition of an "internal nation matter" is if a group of people inside a nation making demands of that nation's government doesn't qualify. Granted the case could definitely be made for League intervention under the circumstances, but a much stronger case could be made for this being internal politics.

Now once they start wanting to talk to the other governments involved it's a different matter, but right now they're only talking to their own government.

 

[iamnuff]

I'm curious what your definition of an "internal nation matter" is if a group of people inside a nation making demands of that nation's government doesn't qualify. Granted the case could definitely be made for League intervention under the circumstances, but a much stronger case could be made for this being internal politics.

Now once they start wanting to talk to the other governments involved it's a different matter, but right now they're only talking to their own government.

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This part here.

And it's not just Brazil that's on the chopping block. There isn't going to be all that much left of Colombia, Ecuador, Bolivia or Peru, and Guyana, Suriname and French Guiana will cease to exist.

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Notice how there are other countries in that list after Brazil? That means that it's not a Brazilian civil war, because they're planning to attack outside of Brazil's borders.
There really isn't any room for interpretation here. They're basically demanding that they be given a good chunk of the continent, or they'll declare war on it.

Presumably in tomorrows chapter OL will be flying to Colombia, Ecuador, Bolivia and Peru to pass on their demands to them too.
If he really thinks that the tribes might attack at any moment, then he's got to warn everyone.

 

[Impartial Panic]

People aren't going to like the implication that if they managed to rustle up a super-army and declared war on the USA, the Justice League wouldn't do anything about it.

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The league as a whole no, thing is many league members Live in the US and operate independently when not on league business.

If anything this Plays right into Paul's plan to get the rest of the world to have members in the league.
Makes it a lot harder for the League to ignore shit if it's happening in their backyards.

as for sending in the Orange lanterns,
yeah that doesn't really work out too well since the orange light needs them to actually care about the problem.

as for Lex.

Ah yes I see your problem Mr President, have no fear Lex Corp has the Solution.
It just so happens I have a new line of power armor that I was just about to put on the market.
Also I have these wonderful Rifles my R&D team calls the Toastmaster.

of course we can have them shipped over immediately, oh no worries we can discuss payment after you handle this crisis.


Mercy It seems we won't need to worry about the Kaznia plan having to be put on hold
Brazil has a sudden need for The Power armor and Toastmasters I had Developed.

also make sure we send a nice gift basket to Orange Lantern.
This super human arms race he blundered the world into may well double my fortune.

 

[ForeverShogo]

Does it strictly need them to care about the problem? Maybe they'd want to do it because their Illustress asked them to?

You can do something you normally wouldn't want to do because you want to show off or otherwise look good to "the boss".

Maybe they wouldn't be as bullshit powerful as they otherwise would be when facing down a pet issue, but I wouldn't even begin to suggest they flat out couldn't do anything.

 

[jasonh23761]

It's not 2016 in the story yet, so unless time cops show up, laws that don't exist aren't likely to be enforced.

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A very good point! I forgot when the story takes place. I'll have to go see if I can find if they had any earlier legislation on the topic.

 

[PDV]

Why would they come in on the tribal side, if hypothetically the league doesn't help brazil claiming it's a civil war well... there are civil wars going on that use chemical weapons that the league don't involve themselves in. (IK napalm is different from chemical weapons but I don't really see the difference in this context)

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As mentioned, it would be, not just a war crime, but a global environmental catastrophe. Start burning Earth's Lungs and you're posing a serious, and fairly imminent, threat to the whole population. I'm not saying they'd support them in all their war goals, but...

 

[Jirachi]

I'm curious how well something like this would have gone in e.g. China or Russia. There resources are probably enough to at least fight back effectively in a way that the lacking metahuman presence in Brazil couldn't.
Ah, "Hope that it would all be over by christmas" is a classic.
I expect that they'll get a lot, but not that much.
There's also the possibility that alliances will force one of the countries with sufficient Metahuman power to intervene here (I imagine the US, Britain, Russia and China *could* theoretically be required to defend brazil in a war).
Hope you continue to give us info on these negotiations.

 

[GhostKing 666]

Also I have these wonderful Rifles my R&D team calls the Toastmaster.

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Considering that Lex has hired Snart, this makes me wonder if Snart brought along Mick Rory(aka Heatwave) with him. Rory's flamethrower is just as bullshit as Snart's cold gun. He's basically the fire to Snart's cold. Hot enough to melt walls and metals, counter Snark's cold gun, burn friction proof speeders(and projects a flame fast enough to catch them), raise ambient temperatures without fire(basically projecting a heat wave), trigger a volcanic eruption and even melt a black lantern ring. And while it does actually require fuel, the reloading system makes a mockery of conventional flamethrowers. Firefly's got nothing on Heat Wave(and is far more unstable as well). And just like Snart, the civilian applications pretty much as revolutionary as the military applications.

Between the two them and you basically make thermodynamics your bitch. Their tech(either alone or together) is as much of a license to print money as Mardon's(Weather Wizard) tech. Never underestimate how ridiculous the Central City Rogues are and how much they are wasted as petty crooks.

 

[PDV]

The difference is that Ra's wasn't trying to create his own nation and had little if any claim to sovereignty.

I also find the argument "it affects multiple countries = not a civil war / internal issue" very strange. The tribes occupy territories of a number of countries. From their perspective they are fighting for their independence.
Basically, would you call Poland resistance fighters fighting against both Soviet and German occupation "an international terrorist organization"? What about people agitating for reunification of Germany? Just because mutliple nations are involved does not make it not a civil war.

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We do actually have a real-world example; for at least 30 years, there has been a cross-border Kurdish independence movement. Most countries have consistently labeled the primary militant elements of that independence movement as terrorist groups, though arguably only for reasons of appeasing allies who were in direct conflict with them.

(I disagree with this as, historically, arming the Kurds is the only military intervention in the Middle East that hasn't gone terribly. But it's what has happened.)

EDIT: Caveat: If the PKK et al. existed in this universe and had the same shape of conflict with Turkey et al. that ours do, I am not at all sure that the Justice League would comply with their designation as a terrorist organization. They're a borderline case; if they didn't use suicide bombings and their nation-state opponents didn't use WMDs or commit war crimes, the JL might stay out of it.

 

[Impartial Panic]

Considering that Lex has hired Snart, this makes me wonder if Snart brought along Mick Rory(aka Heatwave) with him. Rory's flamethrower is just as bullshit as Snart's cold gun. He's basically the fire to Snart's cold. Hot enough to melt walls and metals, counter Snark's cold gun, burn friction proof speeders(and projects a flame fast enough to catch them), raise ambient temperatures without fire(basically projecting a heat wave), trigger a volcanic eruption and even melt a black lantern ring. And while it does actually require fuel, the reloading system makes a mockery of conventional flamethrowers. Firefly's got nothing on Heat Wave(and is far more unstable as well). And just like Snart, the civilian applications pretty much as revolutionary as the military applications.

Between the two them and you basically make thermodynamics your bitch. Their tech(either alone or together) is as much of a license to print money as Mardon's(Weather Wizard) tech. Never underestimate how ridiculous the Central City Rogues are and how much they are wasted as petty crooks.

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Yeah that's going to be even more bullshit than the Toastmasters John Henry Irons Developed.

 

[ForeverShogo]

Except supporting the creation of a Kurdish state wouldn't result in the destruction of multiple nations or the suffering of hundreds of millions of people. Like what would happen if you support these tribes trying to reduce most of South America back to being hunter-gatherers.

 

[GhostKing 666]

Except supporting the creation of a Kurdish state wouldn't result in the destruction of multiple nations or the suffering of hundreds of millions of people. Like what would happen if you support these tribes trying to reduce most of South America back to being hunter-gatherers.

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Looks at the surprisingly artificial nature of the amazon rainforest, the fact that the native tribes are actually the decedents of a agricultural civilization that numbered in the double digit millions and the fact that the current slash and burn style agricultural practices using in South America are rapidly turning said rainforest into an uninhabitable wasteland... yeah, they totally want to turn the Amazon basin back into being hunter gatherers. Right.

At worst they want to turn the Amazon basin back into what it was like before Europeans showed up(which was the center of a rather large agricultural civilization that liked to practice surprisingly wide scale environmental manipulation and cultivation). More likely this is just the opening demand and that they can be talked down to the government putting strong restrictions on current agricultural practices(which are unsustainable and environmentally destructive anyway) and support funding sustainable agricultural practices as well as funding reforestation projects(that could also be used to produce even more food, since the Amazon is already highly cultivated to support such things).

Look, the issue here isn't that these are a bunch of primitive tribesmen who hate technology or whatever. The issue is that the current agricultural practices used by Brazil and other countries in the Amazon basin are an environmental catastrophe and the natives are understandably pissed at their home being turned to wasteland.

If it was just a case of replacing rainforest with productive farmland that would be one thing. But the amazon soil is not productive, not for that type of farming and ranching, and as a result after the soil gets depleted the farmers and ranchers just move on and burn down a few hundred more acres of rainforest over and over again, leaving wasteland in their wake that will take decades before anything can grow there again.

This is honestly one of the biggest environmental problems in the world and if it was up to me, I'd use necromancy to summon up the spirits of some of the Pre-Columbian people that lived in the Amazon to find out how they made Terra Preta, and start mass producing that shit so that farmers and ranchers don't have to keep burning down more and more of the rainforest for more "productive" land. Then I'd employ Green druids(like Pamela) and Red shamans to restore the parts of the Amazon forest that would no longer be used for farming and ranching(while also making a point to follow ancient Amazonian practices when it comes to cultivating the new growth into useful trees for people for both lumber and food production).

 

[Mr Zoat]

Does it count as an Internal matter or a international matter if seven nations are on the chopping block? Has South America suddenly become a pan-continental nation? (jokes)

But seriously, and no offense intended, how can it be a internal matter when it involves one group throwing down the gauntlet to over half-a-dozen nations?

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Because -as I've stated- it isn't one group. Or rather, it isn't one tribe. The Accala have other tribes as allies.

 

[ForeverShogo]

Which would still make it an external affair.

It's not just a series of civil disputes but multiple groups interfering in the affairs of foreign nations as well as their own. The Accala still intend to throw down with non-Brazilians. That they have allies within them doesn't really change anything.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

So long as they were prepared to nuke friendly cities, that approach could certainly work.

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Well...if I put on my 'Murika hat for a moment......*endures the pain of that* Oh yeah, they'd totally be cool with it.

I don't know about OL, but if I was trying to deprogram a nazi kryptonian I'd probably avoid outright supporting colonial descendants in suppressing the indigenous population without having a better reason than "our idea of civilization is superior to theirs."

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I'm going to be over here not giving a single flying fuck about the god damn nazi bitch that'd I'd only just half forgotten was a still a thing and focus more on the hundreds of thousands of people currently threatened by what appears to be an army of super strong hippies.

Just thinking on it....once these people make their presence known to the wider world....that's going to kick the collective Super soldier programs of the world into overdrive.

Because they are either going to want a counter, or they are going to kill the ever living fuck out these people with as much overkill as they can manage. Because someone in power is going to ask the question. "If they can topple/threaten that government....what's to stop them from doing it to us?"

Reassurances aren't going to do much. Super Soldier Cold War ladies and gents.

Clearing the rainforests for more cattle ranches isn't progress.

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Which feed how many million people? Which generate how many billions of dollars in revenue for who? The loss of is going ruffle whose feathers? Feathers with millions of dollars of lobbying money in how many governments?

Killing people is one thing. Fucking with the bottom line is gonna bring all kinds of hell. The world ignores massacres all the time with nothing more then a hippy song, and a couple of Sally Struthers commercials. Global commerce is a whole 'nother beast.

Also, again, OL has already bitched out one "Back to the land" group.

 

[DbDRAKE]

I don't get all this talk about it being an "international matter"; that makes no sense.

It is dozens of individual tribes in a couple countries all rebelling at the same time; against governments that exist after a literal genocide and have policies that encourage the extermination or subsumption of the people who's ancestors they genocided. It is as clear cut a justified revolution along nationalist lines as you could even have these days.

And to the people talking about progress: What progress? I spent most of my early life in central/south america; and it is fucking PURE resource extraction from dusk till dawn. Nothing of permanent value is produced by the economy, and priceless biological diversity is routinely exterminated to grow... Fucking Cows. Like we don't have enough cows.

It's even worse than that though; we loose irreplaceable species monthly to INEFFICIENTLY get more cows and fucking sugarcane. It is disgustingly wasteful, and is one of the most salient arguments against globalism and capitalism in my mind.

To my mind, our Brazilian friends today are exactly the same as the poor fuckers who used to live on Manhattan: they are selling their future for a handful of beads and some liquor; so rich white people can have cheap beef and sugar.

In the long run, the Danner led revolution will be better for human progress, not worse.

 

[DAT_NOOB]

And....OL seems okay with all of this?

OL, the guy who yelled at a hippy for being a hippy, is perfectly okay with progress being smashed back into jungledom?

And when the other nations of the world, ones with larger and more powerful militaries than Brazil take notice because have stakes in the global industries that Brazil takes part in and decide to carpet bomb the Danners to death? Because that's all I see happening.

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It won't even get that far Over-girl is still in brazil I'm sure she'd be more than happy to show the dannered tribesmen that humans can still die of heat stroke

 

[Coda]

The senior general looks at me. "'Super strong' as in they all use something like venom, or is it more like Superman?"

"Like Hugo Danner. They're far stronger than someone using venom would be."

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Everywhere else you've ever used it in this fic, it's been "Venom".

the Accala's support

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Accalas'

abandon negotiates

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negotiations

That said, I don't see Euanthe caring about treaties or limits, so she'd probably want to grow the rainforest to cover anything it can cover, with little regard for what the humans think.

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Euanthe is at least a little more rational than this.

She would want to grow nature to cover everything it originally covered. That won't be rainforest for all of it. There would also be grasslands, shrublands, and (non-rain) forests.

Not that it makes a whole lot of difference to any civilization in the area.

Just thinking on it....once these people make their presence known to the wider world....that's going to kick the collective Super soldier programs of the world into overdrive.

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This is a really good point that hasn't seen enough exploration, especially given that we've already encountered some of the history of these programs in the fic.

Also, again, OL has already bitched out one "Back to the land" group.

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He did that because they claimed to be trying to bring about harmony with nature but were instead sitting around gardening without a care for anything else that was going on. This group is a much different situation, with a specific goal, a specific plan, the power to make things happen, and the will to follow through with it.

 

[Vaermina]

Easy solution.

Brazil rushes to the UN and cedes the Jungle to them as their own country. Then it's no longer an internal issue if they attack and the Justice League can step in and smack them down.

 

[DAT_NOOB]

Easy solution.

Brazil rushes to the UN and cedes the Jungle to them as their own country. Then it's no longer an internal issue if they attack and the Justice League can step in and smack them down.

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Cedes the jungle to the UN or to the tribesmen?