With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[CTrees]

"So what did it feel like to finally kill those fuckos?!"

Click to shrink...

Ooh, I can just hear Lori Petty delivering that line.

 

[hkim]

Sadly, being asexual makes it more, not less likely that you'll miss some nuances of attempted conversation. You just kick yourself a bit less afterward because you don't want one of the prizes you missed.

 

[RichardWhereat]

Want to engage in some public therapy?

Click to shrink...

Talk about the epic fails? That's less public therapy, more comedy.

 

[CrazyNoVa]

Sadly, being asexual makes it more, not less likely that you'll miss some nuances of attempted conversation. You just kick yourself a bit less afterward because you don't want one of the prizes you missed.

Click to shrink...

What do you mean, "asexual"? We've seen Pauls who have expressed sexual attraction before, and this one is in a relationship.

 

[Ardy]

Talk about the epic fails? That's less public therapy, more comedy.

Click to shrink...

God bless my college girlfriend for asking where the condoms were when I showed up in her dorm room for a private movie night.

 

[Darko]

Sadly, being asexual makes it more, not less likely that you'll miss some nuances of attempted conversation. You just kick yourself a bit less afterward because you don't want one of the prizes you missed.

Click to shrink...

Paul has mentioned that he's bisexual, not asexual.

He's just never been in a relationship before.

 

[Radix]

Paul has mentioned that he's bisexual, not asexual.

He's just never been in a relationship before.

Click to shrink...

Not to mention turning his hormones down for the first year or so after the whole poisoned lipstick incident. Actually, did he ever really undo that? I would assume he did given he got into a relationship.

 

[RoninSword]

Ah. "No, I…" Have I really..?

"In a way, it's… Kind of a relief."

"I'm not.. gay. I think… Okay, this is going to sound a bit odd. You know how I said orange light affects the mental state of its users?"

"It makes you take what you want." She frowns again. "But that would-."

"Yes. So I had the ring turn down my testosterone levels." I shrug. "Just in case. I hadn't really thought about it, but that could be why I've been missing.. you know… People.. being.. interested."

"Wouldn't doing that cause…" She looks me over. "Um."

"The rings maintain my body, and production goes back up to normal when I run out of power or take them off. I suppose.. now.. there's not really much risk if I turn it back up a little. It's just sort of nice not worrying about it."

She thinks for a moment and then nods slowly. "I think you probably should. If you're missing social cues then it's obviously having a serious effect on you."

"Alright, if you say so. Ring, normalise."

"Compliance."

I smile at her. "Now let's go and talk to John about his magic love crystal."

Click to shrink...

Found where that happened just for those curious.
Edit: The very next chapter, Clarice basically tears into him about how it was an incredibly stupid thing to do, forgot about that.

 

[Mr Zoat]

21st July 2013
11:15 GMT -5

"Ah."

Richard glances up from the computer terminal, smiling. "Surprised to see me?"

"I assumed that you'd be assisting Batwoman. Or doing homework."

"I was, then the Batcomputer noticed a whole lot of Batman-related files were being accessed." I think he's raising his eyebrows, but the mask makes it hard to tell. "Anything you wanna tell me?"

"I.. think it might put you in an awkward position if I did."

He turns back to his screen, his smile turning into a smirk. "Too late. Roy already squealed."

I shift my eyes in the direction of Roy, who looks mildly awkward for a moment before shrugging. "What? He can help. He's a better investigator than… Any of us."

I sigh quietly to myself. But the set of his shoulders suggests that Richard heard.

"Alright then. I take it that you've wiped the alert flags?"

"Yeah, obviously. Not that that will stop Batman getting them if he set his ring to report them."

"No, we should be alright there. The servers are warded, so unless he had a hard line connection he shouldn't be able to remote scan them."

"So because the League hardened their servers against you, it's also hardened against him."

"Against his ring. He could have another way to access it."

"I'm sure he has other ways to access it. But most of them mean he'd have to have someone staring at a screen the whole time to be sure they'd pick it up."

Donna raises her eyebrows interrogatively. "Did you get what you wanted from Captain Comet?"

I nod. "A complete plan, which a surface reading suggests is perfectly actionable. And another plan, where we let large chunks of the world collapse into barbarism."

Her brows morph into a frown. "Wouldn't that kill millions of people?"

"Yes, but unless there's a nuclear exchange that's it, and…"

She nods. "Right."

Roy looks up again. "Right?"

"You already gave away one secret today, I don't feel like trusting you-."

Richard looks up again. "The League's got a plan to destroy every nuclear warhead in the world if there's ever a nuclear war."

I sigh again. "Trusting you with another one."

"Does..? Ollie know about that?"

Donna looks at me. I bend slightly towards her, bowing my head and holding out both of my hands palms up.

She turns to Roy. "I.. don't actually know? I only ever saw people who could catch up with missiles or bombers on their own. And Batman."

He looks at me for a moment. "Jordan sends tracking updates to my ring each month. Other than the people who were there when I got read in on it, I don't know who else knows. Except Richard, obviously."

Roy smiles faintly. "So he probably doesn't know."

"I imagine he could intuit that the League has a plan-. I think we're getting off-topic." I look around. "What are Wallace and Artemis up to?"

Richard looks mildly pensive. "Batman's… Smart. But he's not a technological genius, especially not with alien tech. That.. throne thing you said he built? I couldn't work out how he could have built it. Unless Mannheim had it in D.C. the whole time and we just didn't see it."

"No, I… See where you're coming from. So… Do you think Sinestro found him someone?"

"Not my first guess, but it's possible. Artemis and Kid are talking to the people running the warehouses that are supposed to be holding the New God tech. And they've got magic and mental intrusion detectors, just in case."

I nod. "Good idea."

Justice League members and associates get scanned whenever they use a zeta tube, but contractors don't work under conditions anything like as restrictive. Our manpower needs have massively outstripped our facility for monitoring them. We can do background checks, initial screening and on-site security, but that's about it. Given that our initial screening includes telepathic screening, we could be fairly certain that they were on-mission and faithful at the start of their employment… I mean, everyone on Earth got a month long lesson on how malignant New God technology is. But that doesn't mean that they couldn't get subverted later. Or be given legitimate orders to do something that wasn't covered by their initial orders.

"How far have you got with everything else?"

Roy calls up… The League's file on Adam Blake. "I was looking into the guy you were going to see. I was… I was surprised that he had the psions bombarded into extinction. I still think it's out of character."

"Realpolitik-." Uh. "I'm sorry, but did you finish High School?"

"I know what Realpolitik is. You mean the Crown Imperium was gunna insist, so all he could really do was organize it." I nod, but keep looking at him-. "And… No, but I got a G.E.D.. Didn't really want to explain the clone thing."

I nod. High school isn't really set up to deal with things like that. He only missed… A year? But technically William only had a year, so that would force him to redo it if he wanted to graduate. And if they were just going to ask Batman to finagle the records for a qualification they weren't going to use… Why bother?

"And… I guess the psions didn't have anyone from the Crown Imperium, so they didn't see any reason to hold off once their fleet was available."

"And they didn't have a team that could reliably reach the surface, liberate prisoners and then evacuate. Even the Citadel was able to bring Mister Blake down eventually. The psions were far more clever."

I look over to Donna. "And you?"

"Checking up on known associates. Seeing if he's spending time with anyone different."

"Find anything?"

Richard winces. "Yeah, but… It's mostly because the people who used to do those jobs… Didn't make it."

"Ah." I nod. "Any of them stand out?"

"Maybe." He brings up a file of… I frown. Simon Leas? "You remember this guy?"

I nod. "Mister J'aarkn's lawyer. Dare I ask?"

"He's moved to WayneTech's entertainment division. I don't know much about what his actual job is, but I can't think why he'd need to meet Bruce Wayne… At all, really."

I nod. "Okay. I didn't really… Talk to him much the one time we met. But I can go and talk to Mister J'aarkn about him if that helps?"

Richard nods. "I'll get into WayneTech's servers and see if I can find out more about his job. It's probably nothing."

I nod back. "But it might not be."

 

[Ngamer11]

"Checking up on known associates. Seeing if he's spending time with anyone different."

"Find anything?"

Richard winces. "Yeah, but… It's mostly because the people who used to do those jobs… Didn't make it."

"Ah." I nod. "Any of them stand out?"

"Maybe." He brings up a file of… I frown. Simon Leas? "You remember this guy?"

I nod. "Mister J'aarkn's lawyer. Dare I ask?"

"He's moved to WayneTech's entertainment division. I don't know much about what his actual job is, but I can't think why he'd need to meet Bruce Wayne… At all, really."

I nod. "Okay. I didn't really… Talk to him much the one time we met. But I can go and talk to Mister J'aarkn about him if that helps?"

Richard nods. "I'll get into WayneTech's servers and see if I can find out more about his job. It's probably nothing."

I nod back. "But it might not be."

Click to shrink...

That's certainly unexpected. I can't wait to see how they'll react to learning the New God equivalent of a sex pervert got one over Batman.

 

[BlackCoat13]

"I was, then the Batcomputer notice a whole lot of Batman-related files were being accessed."

Click to shrink...

noticed

I nod. "Okay. I didn't really… Talk to him much the one time we met. But I can go and talk to Mister J'aarkn about him if that helps?"

Click to shrink...

The Martian porn actor...?

 

[Darko]

Richard glance up from the

Click to shrink...

"glances"

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

21st July 2013
11:15 GMT -5

"Ah."

Richard glance up from the computer terminal, smiling. "Surprised to see me?"

"I assumed that you'd be assisting Batwoman. Or doing homework."

Click to shrink...

Sounds like someone blabbed about OL's little investigation. One of the original sidekicks, no doubt. Still, he might be able to offer angles they hadn't though of because he knows Batman far better than them.

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

"I was, then the Batcomputer notice a whole lot of Batman-related files were being accessed." I think he's raising his eyebrows, but the mask makes it hard to tell. "Anything you wanna tell me?"

"I.. think it might put you in an awkward position if I did."

Click to shrink...

Ah. Well, not an original teammate, but still, if he noticed, then Batman probably did too.

He turns back to his screen, his smile turning into a smirk. "Too late. Roy already squealed."

I shift my eyes in the direction of Roy, who looks mildly awkward for a moment before shrugging. "What? He can help. He's a better investigator than… Any of us."

Click to shrink...

And Squire's probably too busy to call in to look over the details. Plus she might not have as much insight to offer here. Eh, a detective's a detective.

I sigh quietly to myself. But the set of his shoulders suggests that Richard heard.

"Alright then. I take it that you've wiped the alert flags?"

Click to shrink...

Hopefully he took it as 'Well, what's done is done.' sigh than anything else.

"Yeah, obviously. Not that that will stop Batman getting them if he set his ring to report them."

"No, we should be alright there. The servers are warded, so unless he had a hard line connection he shouldn't be able to remote scan them."

"So because the League hardened their servers against you, it's also hardened against him."

Click to shrink...

A rare moment of paranoid security sort-of backfiring.

"Against his ring. He could have another way to access it."

"I'm sure he has other ways to access it. But most of them mean he'd have to have someone staring at a screen the whole time to be sure they'd pick it up."

Click to shrink...

Or have a computer script watching it, and forward an alert to him. Doesn't even have to be a fully sentient machine Intelligence.

Donna raises her eyebrows interrogatively. "Did you get what you wanted from Captain Comet?"

I nod. "A complete plan, which a surface reading suggests is perfectly actionable. And another plan, where we let large chunks of the world collapse into barbarism."

Click to shrink...

Don't forget the 'rebuild things more sensibly afterwards' part. That's kind of important.

Her brows morph into a frown. "Wouldn't that kill millions of people?"

"Yes, but unless there's a nuclear exchange that's it, and…"

Click to shrink...

Sadly, you're talking to superheroes here, for whom millions of lives lost is largely unacceptable.

She nods. "Right."

Roy looks up again. "Right?"

Click to shrink...

Heh. Someone not in the know about something?

"You already gave away one secret today, I don't feel like trusting you-."

Richard looks up again. "The League's got a plan to destroy every nuclear warhead in the world if there's ever a nuclear war."

Click to shrink...

In flight or in their launchers? Because one thing can be done a lot quicker than the other, but the price of failure is a lot higher.

I sigh again. "Trusting you with another one."

"Does..? Ollie know about that?"

Donna looks at me. I bend slightly towards her, bowing my head and holding out both of my hands palms up.

Click to shrink...

Ah, the good old 'effed if I know?' pose.

She turns to Roy. "I.. don't actually know? I only ever saw people who could catch up with missiles or bombers on their own. And Batman."

He looks at me for a moment. "Jordan sends tracking updates to my ring each month. Other than the people who were there when I got read in on it, I don't know who else knows. Except Richard, obviously."

Click to shrink...

I expect it's a bit trickier keeping location data up-to-date when a lot of those missiles would be scry-warded these days.

Roy smiles faintly. "So he probably doesn't know."

"I imagine he could intuit that the League has a plan-. I think we're getting off-topic." I look around. "What are Wallace and Artemis up to?"

Click to shrink...

Right, the peril of natter and side-questing conversations for lore.

Richard looks mildly pensive. "Batman's… Smart. But he's not a technological genius, especially not with alien tech. That.. throne thing you said he built? I couldn't work out how he could have built it. Unless Mannheim had it in D.C. the whole time at we just didn't see it."

"No, I… See where you're coming from. So… Do you think Sinestro found him someone?"

Click to shrink...

Or he tracked down some very specific hypercognitives. Ones who could work with psuedo-magitech.

"Not my first guess, but it's possible. Artemis and Kid are talking to the people running the warehouses that are supposed to be holding the New God tech. And they've got magic and mental intrusion detectors, just in case."

I nod. "Good idea."

Click to shrink...

Because psychic manipulation or outright replacement of personnel is a risk, in this world.

Justice League members and associates get scanned whenever they use a zeta tube, but contractors don't work under conditions anything like as restrictive. Our manpower needs have massively outstripped our facility for monitoring them. We can do background checks, initial screening and on-site security, but that's about it. Given that our initial screening includes telepathic screening, we could be fairly certain that they were on-mission and faithful at the start of their employment… I mean, everyone on Earth got a month long lesson on how malignant New God technology is. But that doesn't mean that they couldn't get subverted later. Or be given legitimate orders to do something that wasn't covered by their initial orders.

Click to shrink...

Nor does that not rule out well-concealed secondary personalities, post-hiring manipulation or outright greed. Any one of which is possible.

"How far have you got with everything else?"

Roy calls up… The League's file on Adam Blake. "I was looking into the guy you were going to see. I was… I was surprised that he had the psions bombarded into extinction. I still think it's out of character."

Click to shrink...

To be fair, the last time Adam was on Earth, it wasn't that long after World War II. And last I looked, the Psions were a lot worse than the Nazis, especially in the 'cruel and unusual scientific experimentation' department.

"Realpolitik-." Uh. "I'm sorry, but did you finish High School?"

"I know what Realpolitik is. You mean the Crown Imperium was gunna insist, so all he could really do was organize it." I nod, but keep looking at him-. "And… No, but I got a G.E.D.. Didn't really want to explain the clone thing."

Click to shrink...

I suppose it would be a bit tricky. Especially if he didn't want to out his heroic identity.

I nod. High school isn't really set up to deal with things like that. He only missed… A year? But technically William only had a year, so that would force him to redo it if he wanted to graduate. And if they were just going to ask Batman to finagle the records for a qualification they weren't going to use… Why bother?

Click to shrink...

It's not like he planned to go to college or anything, instead of going into the hero life full-time.

"And… I guess the psions didn't have anyone from the Crown Imperium, so they didn't see any reason to hold off once their fleet was available."

"And they didn't have a team that could reliably reach the surface, liberate prisoners and then evacuate. Even the Citadel was able to bring Mister Blake down eventually. The psions were far more clever."

Click to shrink...

A rescue attempt would just put the Psions on guard, and with their level of technology, that would have made attacking them a very risky proposition.

I look over to Donna. "And you?"

"Checking up on known associates. Seeing if he's spending time with anyone different."

Click to shrink...

Given how much time Bats is spending on this project, I doubt he's been in contact with anyone he didn't need to be.

"Find anything?"

Richard winces. "Yeah, but… It's mostly because the people who used to do those jobs… Didn't make it."

"Ah." I nod. "Any of them stand out?"

Click to shrink...

Right, side-effect of a global catastrophe.

"Maybe." He brings up a file of… I frown. Simon Leas? "You remember this guy?"

I nod. "Mister J'aarkn's lawyer. Dare I ask?"

Click to shrink...

Talk about a paper-thin alias. He's probably getting off on people almost using his real name.

"He's moved to WayneTech's entertainment division. I don't know much about what his actual job is, but I can't think why he'd need to meet Bruce Wayne… At all, really."

I nod. "Okay. I didn't really… Talk to him much the one time we met. But I can go and talk to Mister J'aarkn about him if that helps?"

Click to shrink...

Better not to confront him directly, that's for sure. That usually doesn't end well if he's prepared. Given that his biggest claim to fame is 'capturing' Big Barda with her lost Mega-Rod and then basically pimping her out...
Edit: ...And Superman, too, but he had Barda longer.

Richard nods. "I'll get into WayneTech's servers and see if I can find out more about his job. It's probably nothing."

I nod back. "But it might not be."

Click to shrink...

I have no doubt they'll find something suspicious...

All right, it's almost certain that something will happen to out Sleez. With an alias that weak, just hearing his name the right way might jog OL's metaknowledge. The real question is whether all this is him making a play in the wake of the Anti-Life broadcast, or if Batman worked it out and simply paid him a lot of money to make the Throne device and the OMAC belts. Or simply terrified him into doing it, that's possible too...

 

[B00ki5h]

Richard nods. "I'll get into WayneTech's servers and see if I can find out more about his job. It's probably nothing."

I nod back. "But it might not be."

Click to shrink...

Sometime later.

Richard stares ahead with blank eyes. "So much PORN."

 

[Mr Zoat]

noticed

Click to shrink...

Thank you, corrected.

The Martian porn actor...?

Click to shrink...

And regular actor and teacher.

"glances"

Click to shrink...

Thank you, corrected.

Better not to confront him directly, that's for sure. That usually doesn't end well if he's prepared. Given that his biggest claim to fame is 'capturing' Big Barda with her lost Mega-Rod and then basically pimping her out...

Click to shrink...

And Superman.

 

[Duke Long]

Richard looks mildly pensive. "Batman's… Smart. But he's not a technological genius, especially not with alien tech. That.. throne thing you said he built? I couldn't work out how he could have built it. Unless Mannheim had it in D.C. the whole time at we just didn't see it."

Click to shrink...

'and'

So… will they have Batman over a barrel if they kidnap this guy? Is he doing maintenance on the New God tech? Or was he just a designer/supplier and his role is now much more limited?

 

[Mr Zoat]

'and'

Click to shrink...

Thank you, corrected.

So… will they have Batman over a barrel if they kidnap this guy? Is he doing maintenance on the New God tech? Or was he just a designer/supplier and his role is now much more limited?

Click to shrink...

If it is him, then not exactly. There isn't much preventing Batman ordering his release, though it would make the rest of the League a little more hostile to his whole project. New God technology is low maintenance, though without an expert repair and improvement would be impossible.

 

[LazySloth13]

I don't know if this brought up before but is Batman's throne something he created from New God tech or was it something Mannheim was using? Because I could see it belonging to Metron who is secretly nudging things to see how the planet and it's inhabitants fare after being exposed to the Anti-Life, with minor New Gods like Sleez either being under his employ or just so happen to use the situation as an opportunity for their own agendas.

 

[Huttj509]

I don't know if this brought up before but is Batman's throne something he created from New God tech or was it something Mannheim was using? Because I could see it belonging to Metron who is secretly nudging things to see how the planet and it's inhabitants fare after being exposed to the Anti-Life, with minor New Gods like Sleez either being under his employ or just so happen to use the situation as an opportunity for their own agendas.

Click to shrink...

That is, in fact, one of the central questions of today's update.

 

[Sordid Snake]

Across the booth Leslie Willis grins at me.

"So what did it feel like to finally kill those fuckos?!"

Click to shrink...

The classical version would be:

"So what did you feel when you finally killed those fuckos?!"

"Recoil."

But a power-ring has no recoil

 

[NightmareWarden]

https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Joshua_Saunders_(New_Earth)

https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Stayne_(New_Earth)

Darkseid has enough New God brutes. Perhaps he fashioned Stayne into an inventor of some sort, and she built the throne for Batman?

Paragon-Paul doesn't remember Young Justice's plot. But new superheroes and villains just… pop up. Just because a super-being is new to their powers or younger than Paul, doesn't mean they are weak or ignorant.

Darkseid's shadow was defeated before knowledge of the White Light could reach the main body during the climactic battle, but Darkseid should still have a month's worth of data. Therefore: Stayne.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Common Sense (part 17)

2nd October 2010
14:37 GMT -5

Maybe I… Should have asked Alan to make a few phone calls before agreeing to this.

I smile awkwardly. "I'm sorry that it's not very exciting, but it was mostly mild satisfaction at a job done well tinged with nervousness about the legal consequences."

"That's all?" She looks astonished, and mildly disgusted. "Really?"

"I didn't get into this because I like killing people, even ones who objectively have it coming, like… All of them did. I want to make the world a better place. It's just that sometimes that means showing people the door, so to speak."

"You kill anyone before?"

"No, I'm afraid not. This was the first time I've ever been in a situation with anyone quite that murderous."

She squints. "But you've been in fights before, right?"

"Oh yes. The bloodiest one was a fight between two South American drug cartels. They'd already been fighting for some time before I arrived, and there were… Quite a few bodies on the floor. The thing about being a superhero… I realise this sounds immodest-"

She rolls her eyes and makes a 'get on with it' hand motion.

"-is that I'm really powerful. If I'm in a fight with, say, a dozen men with AKs, they won't be able to hurt me, and I'll only cause them lasting harm-. Only if I'm distracted by something, because disarming, stunning and cuffing them is really easy for me."

"But the Injustice League weren't a couple of guys with AKs."

I nod. "Which meant that I couldn't afford to. However I felt about killing them. Quite aside from the risk to myself, they were actively killing innocent people… Rather than another drug gang."

"Because who cares about them?"

I huff with amusement. "If they're selling cocaine, most of Washington, I should think."

She splutters, suddenly looking at me with decidedly more interest. "Oh yeah? Something you know anything about?"

"I'm not saying that… At diplomatic parties I've been to as Ambassador Diana's escort, I've detected… Certain residues in certain bathrooms, but I would like to advertise that if the people of America ever want to mandate compulsory drug testing for their elected representatives, I can become available at very short notice."

"Are you saying you're dating..? Wonder Woman?"

"Oh, good heavens, no. She's one of my tutors, and she thought that it might be good training for me. Plus, when she had me there… I could run interference if required."

"Wonder Woman can bench a semi. What does she need you running interference for, her amazing double life as a cook at Taco Whiz?"

"Apparently, some diplomats struggle with the idea that a demigoddess from the island of warrior lesbians might not be into balding, paunchy, fifty year old men. Back in the forties she'd just throw them out of a window, but she's trying to cut down on that sort of thing."

Her smirk grows. "You think the coke helps with that confidence?"

"It would numb the pain if she did throw them out of the window. But I suspect that power is an even headier drug than Bolivian marching powder. Unfortunately for them, Diana has… Ethics. And standards."

"Heh. Well, I'd love to throw dirt at the government all day, but that's not why you're here." I shrug. "But you really didn't feel… Like, anything?"

"While I appreciate that the people of Gotham have good reason to celebrate Joker's death… He didn't ever do anything to me personally, or to anyone-. Ah, any civilians I know. I did take part in a raid on one of Ultra-Humanite's laboratories once, but he'd already left by the time I got there." I hold out my left fist, ring glowing. "Power rings are empathic tools. You have to be feeling the right thing to use them properly. If I'd been angry… And as… Horrific as what they were doing was, at the time it was too abstract and… Big, for me to get that angry about, then my ability to fight would have been reduced."

"So what'd'ya need to feel to you're an orange ring?"

"Avarice. I had to want to live in a world without such people in it, because a world like that is better."

She shrugs. "Hey, I think the same thing. All a' Gotham thinks the same thing. Only question is, why doesn't Batman?"

"Because it's not his job. If a policeman arrests a shoplifter, a jury lets them go and they go and rob another shop, it's not the policeman's fault for not breaking their legs the first time. It's the jury's fault, or the judge's, or maybe the law's the problem. The policeman did his job."

"Didn't know the police were hiring furries."

"Batman's costume does not contain fur. And if that's the worst a Gotham policeman does in his off-hours then the city's gotten off lightly. I mean, you pick: a guy bought by the Falcones, an extortionist, or a guy who dresses up like a football mascot. Which is the most dangerous?"

"You try'n' to admit to something there?"

"No, but… We've got this thing in Britain called Morris Dancing, and the mascot of the troupe where I grew up was a guy with a wooden fox head…" She gives me a funny look. "Folk dancing doesn't do well outside of its cultural context. There's a reason we don't have cheerleaders in Britain."

"I don't think a bunch of hot girls shaking their pompoms is the same as a guy dressing up as a fox, but… You do you. But okay, it's not Batman's job. Whose job is it?"

"Ah… Murder is a state crime, so that would be your state Senate and House of Representatives in the case of Joker and Poison Ivy."

"They're both not guilty of anything 'cause they're crazy. Were crazy."

"No, I don't think so."

She looks baffled. "He murders people dressed like a clown, she murders people dressed like a plant. How is that not crazy?"

"No, it is crazy. I'm just not convinced that it meets the legal definition of 'insane'."

"Huh?"

"Let's say you've got a person who… Constantly hears a voice which he identifies as coming from a giant invisible rabbit called Reginald. Crazy, clearly. But not legally insane. Legal insanity requires that a person be unable to tell right from wrong. Reginald might have an opinion, but that doesn't stop the person hallucinating having their own morals."

"Ah… Still think the murder-clown's c-. Insane." I raise my eyebrows. "Didn't he fall in a vat of Smilex or something?"

"Sure, and that's a super-antidepressant that makes everything seem like a great idea. But that's… Everything, equally. If he was actually insane then… Sometimes he'd open a pop-up barber's shop or… Actually tell a funny joke, just at random, because the mood took him and the Smilex made him think it was a good idea. But he never did. He was all-evil, all the time. And if that's true, then it was a conscious choice. And if it's a conscious choice, then he knew the difference between right and wrong."

She nods slowly. "I get it. What about Ivy? Doesn't she hate humans for destroying plants?"

"In Britain, we used to have environmental protesters who would tear up fields of genetically modified crops in the belief that they were polluting the natural world. Using violence to further a political end doesn't make you incapable of distinguishing the difference between right and wrong. She just weighed things differently than most people. But the point is that she was weighing things. Plenty of people weigh things different to, say… Me. I don't think that makes them insane. But…"

I shrug, waving my right hand.

"That's the legal side of things. There's also the political side. Let's say that they are legally insane. For a… Stereotypical violent schizophrenic -and I should be clear that while people like that do exist, they represent a tiny proportion of the schizophrenic population- once they're in a straitjacket in a secure hospital, that's about it. There's very little they can do to hurt anyone. How contained was Poison Ivy?"

She shrugs languidly. "Didn't look very contained to me."

"Right. She wasn't. So even if she was insane… Maybe the voters want to consider whether or not they want to leave people that dangerous alive."

She smiles smugly. "Don't know about the rest of them, but I sure don't." She glances at her producer, who nods. "Okay, we're going to commercials right now, but we'll be back for the phone-in segment after these messages."

 

[Profipfreely]

furies

Click to shrink...

Missing an r

 

[Darko]

"Okay, we're going to commercials right now, but we'll be back for the phone-in segment after these messages

Click to shrink...

For some reason I'm thinking that this is going to be chaotic and I'm hoping we see it.

 

[RichardWhereat]

Common Sense (part 17)

2nd October 2010
14:37 GMT -5

Maybe I… Should have asked Alan to make a few phone calls before agreeing to this.

I smile awkwardly. "I'm sorry that it's not very exciting, but it was mostly mild satisfaction at a job done well tinged with nervousness about the legal consequences."

"That's all?" She looks astonished, and mildly disgusted. "Really?"

"I didn't get into this because I like killing people, even ones who objectively have it coming, like… All of them did. I want to make the world a better place. It's just that sometimes that means showing people the door, so to speak."

"You kill anyone before?"

"No, I'm afraid not. This was the first time I've ever been in a situation with anyone quite that murderous."

She squints. "But you've been in fights before, right?"

"Oh yes. The bloodiest one was a fight between two South American drug cartels. They'd already been fighting for some time before I arrived, and there were… Quite a few bodies on the floor. The thing about being a superhero… I realise this sounds immodest-"

She rolls her eyes and makes a 'get on with it' hand motion.

"-is that I'm really powerful. If I'm in a fight with, say, a dozen men with AKs, they won't be able to hurt me, and I'll only cause them lasting harm-. Only if I'm distracted by something, because disarming, stunning and cuffing them is really easy for me."

"But the Injustice League weren't a couple of guys with AKs."

I nod. "Which meant that I couldn't afford to. However I felt about killing them. Quite aside from the risk to myself, they were actively killing innocent people… Rather than another drug gang."

"Because who cares about them?"

I huff with amusement. "If they're selling cocaine, most of Washington, I should think."

She splutters, suddenly looking at me with decidedly more interest. "Oh yeah? Something you know anything about?"

"I'm not saying that… At diplomatic parties I've been to as Ambassador Diana's escort, I've detected… Certain residues in certain bathrooms, but I would like to advertise that if the people of America ever want to mandate compulsory drug testing for their elected representatives, I can become available at very short notice."

"Are you saying you're dating..? Wonder Woman?"

"Oh, good heavens, no. She's one of my tutors, and she thought that it might be good training for me. Plus, when she had me there… I could run interference if required."

"Wonder Woman can bench a semi. What does she need you running interference for, her amazing double life as a cook at Taco Whiz?"

"Apparently, some diplomats struggle with the idea that a demigoddess from the island of warrior lesbians might not be into balding, paunchy, fifty year old men. Back in the forties she'd just throw them out of a window, but she's trying to cut down on that sort of thing."

Her smirk grows. "You think the coke helps with that confidence?"

"It would numb the pain if she did throw them out of the window. But I suspect that power is an even headier drug than Bolivian marching powder. Unfortunately for them, Diana has… Ethics. And standards."

"Heh. Well, I'd love to throw dirt at the government all day, but that's not why you're here." I shrug. "But you really didn't feel… Like, anything?"

"While I appreciate that the people of Gotham have good reason to celebrate Joker's death… He didn't ever do anything to me personally, or to anyone-. Ah, any civilians I know. I did take part in a raid on one of Ultra-Humanite's laboratories once, but he'd already left by the time I got there." I hold out my left fist, ring glowing. "Power rings are empathic tools. You have to be feeling the right thing to use them properly. If I'd been angry… And as… Horrific as what they were doing was, at the time it was too abstract and… Big, for me to get that angry about, then my ability to fight would have been reduced."

"So what'd'ya need to feel to you're an orange ring?"

"Avarice. I had to want to live in a world without such people in it, because a world like that is better."

She shrugs. "Hey, I think the same thing. All a' Gotham thinks the same thing. Only question is, why doesn't Batman?"

"Because it's not his job. If a policeman arrests a shoplifter, a jury lets them go and they go and rob another shop, it's not the policeman's fault for not breaking their legs the first time. It's the jury's fault, or the judge's, or maybe the law's the problem. The policeman did his job."

"Didn't know the police were hiring furies."

"Batman's costume does not contain fur. And if that's the worst a Gotham policeman does in his off-hours then the city's gotten off lightly. I mean, you pick: a guy bought by the Falcones, an extortionist, or a guy who dresses up like a football mascot. Which is the most dangerous?"

"You try'n' to admit to something there?"

"No, but… We've got this thing in Britain called Morris Dancing, and the mascot of the troupe where I grew up was a guy with a wooden fox head…" She gives me a funny look. "Folk dancing doesn't do well outside of its cultural context. There's a reason we don't have cheerleaders in Britain."

"I don't think a bunch of hot girls shaking their pompoms is the same as a guy dressing up as a fox, but… You do you. But okay, it's not Batman's job. Whose job is it?"

"Ah… Murder is a state crime, so that would be your state Senate and House of Representatives in the case of Joker and Poison Ivy."

"They're both not guilty of anything 'cause they're crazy. Were crazy."

"No, I don't think so."

She looks baffled. "He murders people dressed like a clown, she murders people dressed like a plant. How is that not crazy?"

"No, it is crazy. I'm just not convinced that it meets the legal definition of 'insane'."

"Huh?"

"Let's say you've got a person who… Constantly hears a voice which he identifies as coming from a giant invisible rabbit called Reginald. Crazy, clearly. But not legally insane. Legal insanity requires that a person be unable to tell right from wrong. Reginald might have an opinion, but that doesn't stop the person hallucinating having their own morals."

"Ah… Still think the murder-clown's c-. Insane." I raise my eyebrows. "Didn't he fall in a vat of Smilex or something?"

"Sure, and that's a super-antidepressant that makes everything seem like a great idea. But that's… Everything, equally. If he was actually insane then… Sometimes he'd open a pop-up barber's shop or… Actually tell a funny joke, just at random, because the mood took him and the Smilex made him think it was a good idea. But he never did. He was all-evil, all the time. And if that's true, then it was a conscious choice. And if it's a conscious choice, then he knew the difference between right and wrong."

She nods slowly. "I get it. What about Ivy? Doesn't she hate humans for destroying plants?"

"In Britain, we used to have environmental protesters who would tear up fields of genetically modified crops in the belief that they were polluting the natural world. Using violence to further a political end doesn't make you incapable of distinguishing the difference between right and wrong. She just weighed things differently than most people. But the point is that she was weighing things. Plenty of people weigh things different to, say… Me. I don't think that makes them insane. But…"

I shrug, waving my right hand.

"That's the legal side of things. There's also the political side. Let's say that they are legally insane. For a… Stereotypical violent schizophrenic -and I should be clear that while people like that do exist, they represent a tiny proportion of the schizophrenic population- once they're in a straitjacket in a secure hospital, that's about it. There's very little they can do to hurt anyone. How contained was Poison Ivy?"

She shrugs languidly. "Didn't look very contained to me."

"Right. She wasn't. So even if she was insane… Maybe the voters want to consider whether or not they want to leave people that dangerous alive."

She smiles smugly. "Don't know about the rest of them, but I sure don't." She glances at her producer, who nods. "Okay, we're going to commercials right now, but we'll be back for the phone-in segment after these messages."

Click to shrink...

Saving the fuck out of this. This is essentially my argument for Batman not killing Joker, expressed more eloquently.

Except I think he's actually insane, using the POV comic from Gotham Knights where he thinks everyone's trying to kill him

 

[Ardy]

Saving the fuck out of this. This is essentially my argument for Batman not killing Joker, expressed more eloquently.

Except I think he's actually insane, using the POV comic from Gotham Knights where he thinks everyone's trying to kill him

Click to shrink...

If he thought everyone was trying to kill him, he wouldn't be able to have philosophical conversations with Batman and take hostages and "jokes" and stuff. Not that I disagree with the rest of your point

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

Common Sense (part 17)

2nd October 2010
14:37 GMT -5

Maybe I… Should have asked Alan to make a few phone calls before agreeing to this.

I smile awkwardly. "I'm sorry that it's not very exciting, but it was mostly mild satisfaction at a job done well tinged with nervousness about the legal consequences."

Click to shrink...

Exactly what I thought he'd say. This was very much a case of 'want the end, want the means' and that meant turning some bad people into chunky salsa in the name of bettering society. Can't wait to see her bait him into all manner of social gaffes...

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

"That's all?" She looks astonished, and mildly disgusted. "Really?"

"I didn't get into this because I like killing people, even ones who objectively have it coming, like… All of them did. I want to make the world a better place. It's just that sometimes that means showing people the door, so to speak."

Click to shrink...

Technically, you got into this because you woke up in space with a Power Ring powered by want on your finger. The superheroing thing is mostly so you could keep that Ring running.

"You kill anyone before?"

"No, I'm afraid not. This was the first time I've ever been in a situation with anyone quite that murderous."

Click to shrink...

Honestly, with a Power Ring, killing people would take a conscious effort, given he can literally disarm and handcuff people before they even realise he's there if he wanted to.

She squints. "But you've been in fights before, right?"

"Oh yes. The bloodiest one was a fight between two South American drug cartels. They'd already been fighting for some time before I arrived, and there were… Quite a few bodies on the floor. The thing about being a superhero… I realise this sounds immodest-"

Click to shrink...

Ah, the Santa Prisca incident, right? Bit of a pooch screw, that one.

She rolls her eyes and makes a 'get on with it' hand motion.

"-is that I'm really powerful. If I'm in a fight with, say, a dozen men with AKs, they won't be able to hurt me, and I'll only cause them lasting harm-. Only if I'm distracted by something, because disarming, stunning and cuffing them is really easy for me."

Click to shrink...

Yup. An environmental shield fuelled by not wanting to get hurt makes him bulletproof. Filament constructs can pocket the guns and replace them with handcuffs in a split-second. Stunning would be optional, but recommended to prevent them running blindly in an attempt to escape... And that's something basically any Lantern could do if they wanted to.

"But the Injustice League weren't a couple of guys with AKs."

I nod. "Which meant that I couldn't afford to. However I felt about killing them. Quite aside from the risk to myself, they were actively killing innocent people… Rather than another drug gang."

"Because who cares about them?"

Click to shrink...

Hey, they're still human beings, with families and mothers. Mothers who might disapprove of their line of work, but hey, they make good money and they treat momma right.

I huff with amusement. "If they're selling cocaine, most of Washington, I should think."

She splutters, suddenly looking at me with decidedly more interest. "Oh yeah? Something you know anything about?"

Click to shrink...

Careful there, CS!OL. Some folks might not like that 'accusation. Although if you make it sound like an extended joke, you can probably get away with it.

"I'm not saying that… At diplomatic parties I've been to as Ambassador Diana's escort, I've detected… Certain residues in certain bathrooms, but I would like to advertise that if the people of America ever want to mandate compulsory drug testing for their elected representatives, I can become available at very short notice."

Click to shrink...

And why do I see that becoming a popular minor issue for people to fixate on at some point? ...The testing, not having a superhero do it.

"Are you saying you're dating..? Wonder Woman?"

"Oh, good heavens, no. She's one of my tutors, and she thought that it might be good training for me. Plus, when she had me there… I could run interference if required."

Click to shrink...

Yes, he's far too young for her. Perhaps a more dignified gentleman. Like Alan.

"Wonder Woman can bench a semi. What does she need you running interference for, her amazing double life as a cook at Taco Whiz?"

"Apparently, some diplomats struggle with the idea that a demigoddess from the island of warrior lesbians might not be into balding, paunchy, fifty year old men. Back in the forties she'd just throw them out of a window, but she's trying to cut down on that sort of thing."

Click to shrink...

And I can just imagine them thinking 'I bet she hasn't had a real man show her a good time yet. I'm in!'

Her smirk grows. "You think the coke helps with that confidence?"

"It would numb the pain if she did throw them out of the window. But I suspect that power is an even headier drug than Bolivian marching powder. Unfortunately for them, Diana has… Ethics. And standards."

"Heh. Well, I'd love to throw dirt at the government all day, but that's not why you're here." I shrug. "But you really didn't feel… Like, anything?"

Click to shrink...

Oh, she is going to get so much mileage out of that digression later.

"While I appreciate that the people of Gotham have good reason to celebrate Joker's death… He didn't ever do anything to me personally, or to anyone-. Ah, any civilians I know. I did take part in a raid on one of Ultra-Humanite's laboratories once, but he'd already left by the time I got there." I hold out my left fist, ring glowing. "Power rings are empathic tools. You have to be feeling the right thing to use them properly. If I'd been angry… And as… Horrific as what they were doing was, at the time it was too abstract and… Big, for me to get that angry about, then my ability to fight would have been reduced."

Click to shrink...

Bit of giving away a weakness, but There's probably not many people well-placed or equipped to exploit that.

"So what'd'ya need to feel to you're an orange ring?"

"Avarice. I had to want to live in a world without such people in it, because a world like that is better."

She shrugs. "Hey, I think the same thing. All a' Gotham thinks the same thing. Only question is, why doesn't Batman?"

Click to shrink...

I wouldn't say Batman isn't glad Joker's gone, but he probably expects someone worse to replace him. Also the circumstances of it.

"Because it's not his job. If a policeman arrests a shoplifter, a jury lets them go and they go and rob another shop, it's not the policeman's fault for not breaking their legs the first time. It's the jury's fault, or the judge's, or maybe the law's the problem. The policeman did his job."

Click to shrink...

And sadly, the Joker was a middling talent with social manipulation. Enough to convince people not to give him the chair or a sleepy little prick.

"Didn't know the police were hiring furries."

"Batman's costume does not contain fur. And if that's the worst a Gotham policeman does in his off-hours then the city's gotten off lightly. I mean, you pick: a guy bought by the Falcones, an extortionist, or a guy who dresses up like a football mascot. Which is the most dangerous?"

Click to shrink...

...Put that way, the man dressed as a bat seems less dangerous, but that's dismissing stuff like 'trained ninja' and 'gadgets out the wazoo'.

"You try'n' to admit to something there?"

"No, but… We've got this thing in Britain called Morris Dancing, and the mascot of the troupe where I grew up was a guy with a wooden fox head…" She gives me a funny look. "Folk dancing doesn't do well outside of its cultural context. There's a reason we don't have cheerleaders in Britain."

Click to shrink...

One of those strange things England does. Every culture has their oddities.

"I don't think a bunch of hot girls shaking their pompoms is the same as a guy dressing up as a fox, but… You do you. But okay, it's not Batman's job. Whose job is it?"

"Ah… Murder is a state crime, so that would be your state Senate and House of Representatives in the case of Joker and Poison Ivy."

Click to shrink...

Which would be... New Jersey? Or one of the Northeastern US states in the vicinity of there...

"They're both not guilty of anything 'cause they're crazy. Were crazy."

"No, I don't think so."

Click to shrink...

I bet this part will get heavily debated in-universe.

She looks baffled. "He murders people dressed like a clown, she murders people dressed like a plant. How is that not crazy?"

"No, it is crazy. I'm just not convinced that it meets the legal definition of 'insane'."

"Huh?"

Click to shrink...

Ah, the difference between perception and legality, eh?

"Let's say you've got a person who… Constantly hears a voice which he identifies as coming from a giant invisible rabbit called Reginald. Crazy, clearly. But not legally insane. Legal insanity requires that a person be unable to tell right from wrong. Reginald might have an opinion, but that doesn't stop the person hallucinating having their own morals."

Click to shrink...

Now, if Reginald was telling him to hurt people... And he listened, then there'd be a problem.

"Ah… Still think the murder-clown's c-. Insane." I raise my eyebrows. "Didn't he fall in a vat of Smilex or something?"

"Sure, and that's a super-antidepressant that makes everything seem like a great idea. But that's… Everything, equally. If he was actually insane then… Sometimes he'd open a pop-up barber's shop or… Actually tell a funny joke, just at random, because the mood took him and the Smilex made him think it was a good idea. But he never did. He was all-evil, all the time. And if that's true, then it was a conscious choice. And if it's a conscious choice, then he knew the difference between right and wrong."

Click to shrink...

And that reminds me of the Silver Age, when Joker was more a wacky theme criminal than a madman trying to show society how stupid it is.

She nods slowly. "I get it. What about Ivy? Doesn't she hate humans for destroying plants?"

"In Britain, we used to have environmental protesters who would tear up fields of genetically modified crops in the belief that they were polluting the natural world. Using violence to further a political end doesn't make you incapable of distinguishing the difference between right and wrong. She just weighed things differently than most people. But the point is that she was weighing things. Plenty of people weigh things different to, say… Me. I don't think that makes them insane. But…"

Click to shrink...

Which is silly, because all crops are 'genetically modified'. It's called selective breeding, and farmers have done it almost as long as there have been farmers. But suggest it's being done by scientists in white coats in labs, and people lose their minds...

I shrug, waving my right hand.

"That's the legal side of things. There's also the political side. Let's say that they are legally insane. For a… Stereotypical violent schizophrenic -and I should be clear that while people like that do exist, they represent a tiny proportion of the schizophrenic population- once they're in a straitjacket in a secure hospital, that's about it. There's very little they can do to hurt anyone. How contained was Poison Ivy?"

Click to shrink...

And even then, guys like the Joker aren't not still dangerous, just because of 'headology'.

She shrugs languidly. "Didn't look very contained to me."

"Right. She wasn't. So even if she was insane… Maybe the voters want to consider whether or not they want to leave people that dangerous alive."

Click to shrink...

I wonder if this could lead to something like Worm's 'Kill orders', where people are judged to be 'too dangerous to live' and end up being declared okay to kill on sight...

She smiles smugly. "Don't know about the rest of them, but I sure don't." She glances at her producer, who nods. "Okay, we're going to commercials right now, but we'll be back for the phone-in segment after these messages."

Click to shrink...

Oh, that's gonna get the crazies out.

I foresee the phone-ins being a mix of 'thanks for killing the joker', 'You should kill <so&so minor villain>!' and people legitimately concerned by 'capes' taking the law into their own hands like that. Or rather, handing out death penalties. I can't imagine this won't have some people going 'do we want these people killing criminals?' and causing all manner of concerns...

 

[Cuchulin]

Saving the fuck out of this. This is essentially my argument for Batman not killing Joker, expressed more eloquently.

Except I think he's actually insane, using the POV comic from Gotham Knights where he thinks everyone's trying to kill him

Click to shrink...

Just because Batman shouldn't kill the Joker, doesn't mean he should save him.

 

[ForeverShogo]

Really, with how overwhelmingly corrupt we're told Gotham is supposed to be, the most unbelievable thing about the Joker is that he didn't fall down a flight of stairs. Or trip and fall onto several knives. Or mysteriously manage to shoot himself in the back 37 times.

The idea that not a single one of the cops would take matters into their own hands is pretty ridiculous.

That said, if all the people who should be dealing with Joker-tier villains are categorically refusing to do so . . . At some point I do feel like the responsibility should start to fall on those who regularly fight them and don't just go that extra step beyond merely beating them black and blue.

 

[Vaermina]

Saving the fuck out of this. This is essentially my argument for Batman not killing Joker, expressed more eloquently.

Except I think he's actually insane, using the POV comic from Gotham Knights where he thinks everyone's trying to kill him

Click to shrink...

My argument for not killing The Joker is that if you dont know the exact universe you're in that just risks making things worse by creating Hell Joker or something like that.