Mr Zoat
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
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timeForced
Getting out there.
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Being willing to go to extreme lengths to overthrow a government that is quite literally enforcing a suicide pact is just rational.
Someguy Somewhere
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Anyone else have a minor attack of the paranoids at this comment?
Non blocks the one person whom may know him, is of the same house and worked in the same fields. Someone whom could state things about his claims regarding his backstory.
Vaermina
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In canon he didn't have a list of all the people in the Zone, what they were in the zone for, and the length of their prison sentence.
CrazyNoVa
Not too sore, are you?
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Unless they turned out to be an insane murderhobo.
Prince Charon
Just zis guy, you know?
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Silver Age Krypton was pretty wild, and Zoat seems to be taking a lot of inspiration from that era for his Krypton (of course, we also got a lot more stories set on pre-Crisis Krypton than we did for much of post-Crisis Krypton, IIRC).
Stsword
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It was basically Kryptonian Karate in the comics, pre-crisis Lois Lane was the highest profile practitioner.
Negotiations (supplementary, Renegade option)
New
Mr Zoat
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8th August 2013
09:32 GMT +1
"…before he arrived." Richard shrugs. "He clearly didn't know anything about Earth."
Adom's eyes narrow. "If he had challenged the gods in Kahndaq, he would have answered to me for his impudence."
"I'm not sure that he meant 'gods' in that sense." Richard looks at me. "Are you sure he wasn't one of yours?"
Hm. I mean, he certainly sounds like a New God, but… "I didn't get close enough to feel him. Did you capture any of his equipment?"
"Your brother took his mace. He'll report back to the rest of us once he's had a look at it."
I nod. "Was he carrying anything else?"
"I didn't ask about his loincloth. He wasn't wearing anything else. I didn't see him use dimensionally exotic storage, so I suspect that was it."
"I need to phone Scott about that anyway. I'll nag him about it. But in any case, that means…" I get out of my chair and walk over to the 'Days Since a Member of the Justice League Died' blackboard, wipe the number and update it.
Richard snorts, chuckling to himself. "That will never stop being funny."
"Good work, Richard." I amble back to my seat. "Any other questions?"
Circe looks bemused. "Why didn't you accept his offer? If someone offered to give me my full power back at no cost to myself, I would do it."
"I didn't believe for a moment that there would be no cost."
She raises her eyebrows, turning her head towards me. "Grayven? Should I be worried?"
"Ah… Depends. I was essentially using my own soul as a catalyst when I performed your Awakening, which means that the process was influenced by my nature. But with my nature being what it is, having a verbal agreement with me in advance would just… Not bind you to that agreement exactly, but make it… Seem natural? But only to the thing you've already agreed to. And the significance of that would diminish as your own power grew."
"And if the Justice League had accepted Titus's offer?"
I adopt the Thinker pose. "Titus appeared to believe that his power made worship his due. I imagine that accepting his offer… Assuming that he could actually follow through, would cause them to view things in the same way. What exactly that would mean on the ground… I'm not sure."
Cranius pulls a face. More of a face. "I zhink it is best zhet we did not find out."
Clea leans towards Richard. "You weren't tempted at all?"
"What do you think happens if my connection to the Shadowlands is strengthened?"
Clea blinks, her expression blank as she tries to work it out. Coming up with nothing, she turns to Circe. Circe is frowning to herself, and shudders as she appears to reach a conclusion. "Nothing good."
"Quite. I'm as powerful as I'm comfortable being, and I don't need a cult-. Another cult, I should say. Or a 'title hike'. I'm quite content being as I am."
I smile. "And I'm sure that we're all happy to hear it."
I don't look at the screen, because I'm not sure what Lex is thinking now that he knows that Superman had a chance to become some sort of god. He's doing well in his therapy, but I'm not sure that he'll ever be doing that well.
"Okay, and… Cranius, you're last. What have you got for us?"
"Eh. No major breakzhroughs since our last meeting. None of zhe test sub-. Eh, recipients, have shown ill-effects… I hev… I hev begun work on eh… 'Plug-in' suit. A wearable second skin which would enhance strength unt endurance. Somezhing like my own Ottoman."
I raise my eyebrows. "Oh? That's a bit of a departure, isn't it?"
"Well… Some of zhe… Volunteers, zhey expressed an interest but did not want to fully commit. I zhought… Somezhing zhey could take off at zhe end of zhe day may be a eh more intriguing prospect. Unt zhey do not heff to take it off."
Clea's eyes light up. "Can you make a version with gills?"
"Yah, easily. But it is still un-tissue. Wizhout zhe first level injections, it would not do any good."
"If I remember correctly, those first level injections show… No outwards sign of a change?"
"If.. the subject is compatible, zhet is true."
"Then I may have a new avenue of volunteers for you."
"Ah? Zo many people wish to explore under zhe sea? Well, please forward zhe details of zhe interested parties, unt we will see what can be done."
I nod. "How far have you got with the meat suits?"
"Creating zhem is not hard. Zhe uncreation process is well understood at zhis point. It's, eh… Finding zhe subjects unt zhe use which zhey want."
"It doesn't need you personally?"
"No. My brozher could do it, unt Mister Fiendstein… Zhe ozher lab staff could do most of it."
"It might be worth creating some recreational models for demonstrations. I realise that you'd prefer functional to fun and self-expression to either, but until you get to the point-."
"Yah, yah, mass production, I know. I will put togezher some prototypes, zhe unterwater unt zhe frolicking unt see where we go."
I give him a moment, but that appears to be everything. "Okay, ah, matters arising?"
The Screen inclines slightly. "I have one which I believe is a matter of some concern."
I nod. "You have the floor."
"I was performing an analysis of The Light's records, including the recovered private records of Vandal Savage. A number of his disappearance contingencies have activated and been disarmed, but it seems that there was a plan in motion that I had not previously discovered."
Can't say I'm surprised. Members of The Light Mark I could pursue their own projects without informing the others. "And what might that be?"
"You recall that they intended to have Johnny Sorrow dispense with the Justice League, only for you to kill him and replace them?" I nod. "It seems that Vandal Savage intended to expand upon that principle. He was actively attempting to contact advanced alien civilizations and lure them here so that their technology could be studied."
"That… Sounds like an absolutely terrible idea. Speaking as an Apokoliptian."
"It gets better. Are you familiar with The Simpsons?"
"Y-es?"
"Are you familiar with the episode concerning invasive species? Where new species are introduced to kill the previous species introduced?"
Without me really thinking about it, my right hand begins its slow journey to my face, palm-first.
"Ah, you are. That appears to have been Vandal Savage's strategy for dealing with each alien species in turn. Invite a weaker species, then invite a stronger one and play them off against each other."
"Please tell me that didn't advance beyond the planning stage?"
"Without follow up contacts, his initial choices appears to have lost interest. But I am concerned that the messages he sent to his later choices may have gotten through. I have no way to check without initiating contact with them."
"Who? The Dominators?"
"A group called The Reach."
Oh… Fuck. Always a Bigger Fish
09:32 GMT +1
"…before he arrived." Richard shrugs. "He clearly didn't know anything about Earth."
Adom's eyes narrow. "If he had challenged the gods in Kahndaq, he would have answered to me for his impudence."
"I'm not sure that he meant 'gods' in that sense." Richard looks at me. "Are you sure he wasn't one of yours?"
Hm. I mean, he certainly sounds like a New God, but… "I didn't get close enough to feel him. Did you capture any of his equipment?"
"Your brother took his mace. He'll report back to the rest of us once he's had a look at it."
I nod. "Was he carrying anything else?"
"I didn't ask about his loincloth. He wasn't wearing anything else. I didn't see him use dimensionally exotic storage, so I suspect that was it."
"I need to phone Scott about that anyway. I'll nag him about it. But in any case, that means…" I get out of my chair and walk over to the 'Days Since a Member of the Justice League Died' blackboard, wipe the number and update it.
Richard snorts, chuckling to himself. "That will never stop being funny."
"Good work, Richard." I amble back to my seat. "Any other questions?"
Circe looks bemused. "Why didn't you accept his offer? If someone offered to give me my full power back at no cost to myself, I would do it."
"I didn't believe for a moment that there would be no cost."
She raises her eyebrows, turning her head towards me. "Grayven? Should I be worried?"
"Ah… Depends. I was essentially using my own soul as a catalyst when I performed your Awakening, which means that the process was influenced by my nature. But with my nature being what it is, having a verbal agreement with me in advance would just… Not bind you to that agreement exactly, but make it… Seem natural? But only to the thing you've already agreed to. And the significance of that would diminish as your own power grew."
"And if the Justice League had accepted Titus's offer?"
I adopt the Thinker pose. "Titus appeared to believe that his power made worship his due. I imagine that accepting his offer… Assuming that he could actually follow through, would cause them to view things in the same way. What exactly that would mean on the ground… I'm not sure."
Cranius pulls a face. More of a face. "I zhink it is best zhet we did not find out."
Clea leans towards Richard. "You weren't tempted at all?"
"What do you think happens if my connection to the Shadowlands is strengthened?"
Clea blinks, her expression blank as she tries to work it out. Coming up with nothing, she turns to Circe. Circe is frowning to herself, and shudders as she appears to reach a conclusion. "Nothing good."
"Quite. I'm as powerful as I'm comfortable being, and I don't need a cult-. Another cult, I should say. Or a 'title hike'. I'm quite content being as I am."
I smile. "And I'm sure that we're all happy to hear it."
I don't look at the screen, because I'm not sure what Lex is thinking now that he knows that Superman had a chance to become some sort of god. He's doing well in his therapy, but I'm not sure that he'll ever be doing that well.
"Okay, and… Cranius, you're last. What have you got for us?"
"Eh. No major breakzhroughs since our last meeting. None of zhe test sub-. Eh, recipients, have shown ill-effects… I hev… I hev begun work on eh… 'Plug-in' suit. A wearable second skin which would enhance strength unt endurance. Somezhing like my own Ottoman."
I raise my eyebrows. "Oh? That's a bit of a departure, isn't it?"
"Well… Some of zhe… Volunteers, zhey expressed an interest but did not want to fully commit. I zhought… Somezhing zhey could take off at zhe end of zhe day may be a eh more intriguing prospect. Unt zhey do not heff to take it off."
Clea's eyes light up. "Can you make a version with gills?"
"Yah, easily. But it is still un-tissue. Wizhout zhe first level injections, it would not do any good."
"If I remember correctly, those first level injections show… No outwards sign of a change?"
"If.. the subject is compatible, zhet is true."
"Then I may have a new avenue of volunteers for you."
"Ah? Zo many people wish to explore under zhe sea? Well, please forward zhe details of zhe interested parties, unt we will see what can be done."
I nod. "How far have you got with the meat suits?"
"Creating zhem is not hard. Zhe uncreation process is well understood at zhis point. It's, eh… Finding zhe subjects unt zhe use which zhey want."
"It doesn't need you personally?"
"No. My brozher could do it, unt Mister Fiendstein… Zhe ozher lab staff could do most of it."
"It might be worth creating some recreational models for demonstrations. I realise that you'd prefer functional to fun and self-expression to either, but until you get to the point-."
"Yah, yah, mass production, I know. I will put togezher some prototypes, zhe unterwater unt zhe frolicking unt see where we go."
I give him a moment, but that appears to be everything. "Okay, ah, matters arising?"
The Screen inclines slightly. "I have one which I believe is a matter of some concern."
I nod. "You have the floor."
"I was performing an analysis of The Light's records, including the recovered private records of Vandal Savage. A number of his disappearance contingencies have activated and been disarmed, but it seems that there was a plan in motion that I had not previously discovered."
Can't say I'm surprised. Members of The Light Mark I could pursue their own projects without informing the others. "And what might that be?"
"You recall that they intended to have Johnny Sorrow dispense with the Justice League, only for you to kill him and replace them?" I nod. "It seems that Vandal Savage intended to expand upon that principle. He was actively attempting to contact advanced alien civilizations and lure them here so that their technology could be studied."
"That… Sounds like an absolutely terrible idea. Speaking as an Apokoliptian."
"It gets better. Are you familiar with The Simpsons?"
"Y-es?"
"Are you familiar with the episode concerning invasive species? Where new species are introduced to kill the previous species introduced?"
Without me really thinking about it, my right hand begins its slow journey to my face, palm-first.
"Ah, you are. That appears to have been Vandal Savage's strategy for dealing with each alien species in turn. Invite a weaker species, then invite a stronger one and play them off against each other."
"Please tell me that didn't advance beyond the planning stage?"
"Without follow up contacts, his initial choices appears to have lost interest. But I am concerned that the messages he sent to his later choices may have gotten through. I have no way to check without initiating contact with them."
"Who? The Dominators?"
"A group called The Reach."
Oh… Fuck. Always a Bigger Fish
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Darko
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What was his plan if the weaker species just decided to fuck off, or if the stronger one effortlessly destroyed the weaker one and didn't suffer losses on their end?
I'm guessing he was just going to wing it.
Yeah, the Dominators are difficult, but you could probably handle them by yourself.
The Reach on the other hand are basically a peer to godlike aliens, so dealing with them is a very long-term project.
Mr Zoat
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He didn't kill any member of the League. The number went up, because more time has passed.
CrazyNoVa
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Question about Red Lantern Paul: Since he lives on Teen Titans 2003 Earth, has he already dealt with the local version of Slade? It's been a while, so I don't remember if he has or not.
Furthermore, what about the H.I.V.E. 5, Terra and Ravager? What happened to them? In canon, I remember that Jinx dated Kid Flash, Terra became a normal student, and Ravager showed up in the tie-in comic where the Teen Titans convinced her to become a good guy, but did any of that happen with Raul around?
Furthermore, what about the H.I.V.E. 5, Terra and Ravager? What happened to them? In canon, I remember that Jinx dated Kid Flash, Terra became a normal student, and Ravager showed up in the tie-in comic where the Teen Titans convinced her to become a good guy, but did any of that happen with Raul around?
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Signaller
Not too sore, are you?
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"with"
Also, for the godspeech at the end - does Lex's godspeech-detector work remotely?
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Chojin Patriarch
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Not a villain I'm familiar with. But the context is simple enough. Amusing to see someone run head-first into Earth Bullshit™ and lose. Good to see the Renegade touching base with his New Light. This should be illuminating.
I expect when he got a look close-up, it'd be obvious one way or the other.
Ah, good enough. Anything the League learns will end up in their hands soon enough.
It'll be a grim day when it resets to 0.
Shade doing work, then, heading off that little storyline.
Gift horses and all that. There's no such thing as 'free' in magic, after all.
In other words, they would start out willing to work with him, but the urge to do so lessens as they improve. Which is exactly how he'd want it, I suspect.
Nothing good for Earth, of course.
As he said, the hidden strings would make it unwise.
Says a lot when that's their reaction to a colleague's empowerment. Fits, given that the Shadowlands are basically an eldritch otherworld.
As for how powerful he is? Well, he spent years sandbagging against the Justice Society and still reliably handed them their rears until they employed his 'weakness'.
I imagine that if his self-control wasn't so strong, he'd probably be twitching at least an eye right now in horrified worry.
Ah, an actual Black Carapace? And he's taking the more modern (Read: HALO) interpretation of it as something akin to a 'gel underlayer' concept.
And it may get more people interested, knowing that they don't need to have it implanted subcutaneously.
Looking to upgrade her personal guard? Or provide some surface folks access to the deep?
Interesting. Scientific counterparts to the Atlantean biomancy that gave them waterbreathing in the first place.
And given Cranius' methods, that's quite literal, I imagine. No space-age polymers or liquidised metallic lattices here...
Still working at the artisanal level, eh?
Quite literal supersuits, huh? I bet many a wannabe would pay to get that.
Opening the floor to unmentioned issues, eh?
Well, then, Lex. What will it be today?
Oh-ho. That's right, I'm sure he was daytripping offworld before the Renegade nobbled him...
Of course, they likely didn't worry too much about how those plans would affect each other, which probably caused some friction.
Oh, joy. The 'Summon Bigger Fish' plan.
...Because of course the Simpsons have an episode about that sort of thing. Makes me wonder how such pop culture would differ in their universe. Would Radioactive Man and Bumblebee guy be written as actual superheroes?
Ah, a grand mistake many a nation has engaged in, before ecology really took off as a science.
With the Justice League or Light as a final safety measure if the plan went awry?
His spacefleet not exactly willing to travel that far, of course.
Sadly, I can believe the caveman thought that was a good idea...
Ironically, I imagine that is how the Reach heard about Earth in the first place. The metagene studies going on in season two would definitely be something various alien factions would have instigated too. It seems the Renegade will have to take action against the Reach properly now, instead of letting the Maltusians handle it...
timeForced
Getting out there.
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Robin thirsty huh.
CrazyNoVa
Not too sore, are you?
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Nah, it wasn't like that. Trust me, he was WAY thirstier for Starfire.
Plus, they did get together in the movie, so good for them.
Vaermina
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If something is stupid and works, its not really stupid.
CrazyNoVa
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Yeah, but sometimes, there is such a thing as a plan that works way too well. And by way too well, I mean that it would have worked, but then would have resulted in the extermination of the entire human race.
Darko
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No, it still is stupid.
It only means that the universe is a stupid place for letting a stupid thing work.
And anyone that's watched the show knows that the Light's plan with the Reach was a failure.
Look at the future Impulse came from.
The heroes were the ones that solved that.
Frozen20XX
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I expect Grayven will be having a chat with Construct Lantern Vandal to find out the specifics?
Chaoswind
Lord of nonsense
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Question about Red Lantern Paul: Since he lives on Teen Titans 2003 Earth, has he already dealt with the local version of Slade? It's been a while, so I don't remember if he has or not.
Furthermore, what about the H.I.V.E. 5, Terra and Ravager? What happened to them? In canon, I remember that Jinx dated Kid Flash, Terra became a normal student, and Ravager showed up in the tie-in comic where the Teen Titans convinced her to become a good guy, but did any of that happen with Raul around?
I think he scared the kids from HIVE straight before he was given a contract to kill them, the rest are up in the air, Slade even more so.
The only contract kill Raul refused was against Rachel, so I don't think he would just walk up to Terra or Ravager and kill them without giving them a chance.
Duke Long
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'pose'?
'zhey'?
'civilizations'
This is a comical plan, I really quite like Vandal.
AverusBlack
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Savage is doing this in the paragon timeline as well, I'd bet. That's gonna make the Illustres' life a pain in the ass. But at least Earth KNOWS about the Reach now. Their "no we're totally, definitely friends lol" thing won't work like it usually does. It's more like trying to subvert a world in the periphery zone, only worse because it's Earth.
BR549
This is filth! FILTH!!
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Mr Zoat
Dedicated ragequitter
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Thank you, corrected.
I'm going to say 'no, but he knew which room they were using in advance and bugged it'.
Thank you, corrected.
Comical as in silly, or comical as in 'like a comic'?
I can't think of any reason for him to specifically go after the HIVE academy, or to kill a villain who was being successfully contained by the Titans. So he probably didn't have much to do with them.
