TopHatWearer
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It was said earlier that Tang is an orange flavoured drink and that the seid came from darkseid.
so Tangseid
so Tangseid
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- self insert young justice
Ngamer11
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He's taken care of anyone who can try on Earth, and he isn't big enough to draw attention from any higher powers in the universe. Also, the gods of Earth may not care, as he probably ensured that what he does benefits them in some way.
Pez
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Have the readers ever been told what Jade saw in Paul? Or is it up for the readers to determine starting from their first meeting during the Roquette mission and his first trip to see her in prison and their slow courtship that mostly happened off screen?
Maybe it's telling that in the show, Artemis is my favorite character, followed by Jade. It's a shame that canon Jade was barely a better person than her father.
Nervaqus987
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And more than seven years of daily updates hasn't done that?
Pinklestia
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This is the one who brainwashed Wonder Woman.
This was an Origins episode.
Vaermina
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After what he did to Wonder Woman nothing short of complete destruction would have stopped the Greek God's from smiting him into oblivion.
And not even Paragon could stop that level of force.
Similarly the Silver City would have Smote him the same way they did Paragon. Only there wouldn't have been any last minute rescue because he would have ended up a brick in hell.
Ct613hulu
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The Greek Gods didn't do anything when Wonder Woman and the rest of the League were controlled by the Light. They also essentially never become involved in fighting off the various world-ending threats that the Justice League regularly deals with. It is also possible that they may simply fail to recognize what has happened to Wonder Woman as it was based on principles they are unfamiliar with, has no continuous energy signature, and has resulted in changes that are not readily apparent.
The only reason that the Silver City attacked Paragon is that he stole a fruit from the Garden of Eden. There has been no indication that they have any interest in actually coming to earth to punish wrongdoing.
The only reason that the Silver City attacked Paragon is that he stole a fruit from the Garden of Eden. There has been no indication that they have any interest in actually coming to earth to punish wrongdoing.
Vaermina
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There's a difference between magical temporary mind control and destroying someone's soul...
Someone missed the part about the invisible guardian Angel's and constant on Earth activity that made Paragon have pie on his face.
Ct613hulu
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My understanding is that the Orange Light personality rewrite wouldn't destroy the soul as it involves making changes to the mind. My point wasn't that the Gods would judge Tangseid more favorably than other mind controllers, it was that they had no knowledge or interest in preventing Wonder Woman from being enslaved. Young Justice and the broader DC universe generally depict the Greek Gods as simply being powerful people with supernatural powers with nothing like omniscience or an innate knowledge of events related to their domain. They are also depicted as being largely removed from world events with the exception of Ares and a few others that occasionally become involved to stir up trouble. It seems quite plausible that they would simply have no idea what Tangseid is doing.
I would actually appreciate it if you could send me a link to the chapter that discusses these "Invisible Angels". My understanding is that the limited numbers of these "Invisible Angels" and their focus on protecting individuals who were marked as being important to Silver City would prevent them from becoming aware of what Tangseid was up to. I would also say that there would have to be some explanation for why these "Invisible Angels" never bother becoming involved in combatting the many horrors that plague and threaten the world if we want to treat them as evidence of the Silver City's willingness to move against Tangseid.
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Someguy Somewhere
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Invisible guardian angels that have done nothing to help when:
Apalaixians invaded, prompting the creation of the justice league.
Giant killer plants threaten several cities around the globe.
The Entire world is separated parents from children.
A Titan gets loose and threatens then entirety of the surface world.
When demons freely pedal demonic power granting drugs.
This also doesn't count for any of the massive wars past and present in the DC universe, on or off earth.
Sure they might be around, heck they might even be fighting the good fight just off screen.
But they CERTAINLY aren't stepping in just because someone's being evil, sinner or generally a Dick. They don't appear to show up with flaming swords when the chips are down....because if they DID they'd actually be helping. God's not turning Luthor into a Pillar of Salt for Pride, nor are Kobra Cultists dropping dead for worshiping false idols. The Angels seem to be very much a hands off crowd when not specifically instructed to act. The only time they got off their asses was when they were both provoked and manipulated.
I assume this is simply because God is hands off and leaving things up to free will. Which considering the DC universe, might just be for the best.
God Helps Those That Help Themselves.
Tangseid is a mortal, he's not demonic, nor particularly spiritual. By OL's studies, those raised in christian background, even if they reject it, end up in limbo / purgatory. Maybe the angels are just waiting for him to die 'natural' causes and let the afterlife fit the crime. Doesn't seem like he's marked off a 'afterlife service provider' like OL has. Grayven hasn't looked into that either, mostly going by the New God expectation of 'I'll live mostly forever, and if something DOES kill me, I rejoin the source'.
Sauntering Downwards (part 2)
Mr Zoat
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Her legs bend, the muscles beneath the skin of her bare shoulders shifting and her breasts answer the call of gravity to the best of their bra-bound ability as she leans towards the pulley, then shifting back as she straightens her legs and then pulls the handle towards her so that it's resting just under them.
How to approach her?
I stand, walking over to my own weights and moving the pin… All the way up. That seems about right for unusually muscular humans and low-tier super strength. Boosted strength? I shouldn't sound like I'm claiming to be in Superman's league. Then I sit back down and take position, my eyes moving back to Artemis as her limbs tense and relax in the smooth motion of someone well accustomed to the machine they're operating.
I push against the footplate and… Yes, that's a bit more like it felt on my first time. Keep up a steady pace-. I find myself matching Artemis's delicious movements without really thinking about it, and… I suppose that she makes a reasonable metronome substitute.
"Are you going to be checking me out the whole time?"
"Probably. But I wouldn't want to be unfair about it." I pause with the plate in the halfway position, then take hold of my t-shirt and pull it off, tossing it to the side. With no ring on I've started to sweat normally, and while I'm no expert on masculine beauty… I wouldn't look like this if I didn't really like looking like this. "Fair?"
"Ahh. That's… Not how it works."
"You ogled Kaldur in the middle of a mission, in all of our heads." I carry on pushing the weight, keeping my own rhythm. "You can be a hypocrite if you want, or you can take the opportunity to engage in reciprocal staring."
She appears to take that on board, and returns to her exercise.
"What happened to your ring?"
"I can't get good data if it constantly refreshes me."
"What do you mean by that?"
"The ring stops me getting hot, or short of breath, or tired. It's great while I'm wearing heavy armour, but I can't exercise like that. What brings you here?"
"It's free."
I snort with amusement. "Good answer."
"And I'm pretty sure that criminals watch the gyms, see if they can spot the local crime fighters working out."
I chuckle. "Yeah, I can imagine Batman going down to his local gym, and everyone around him staring at his scars and deciding that he must be a super-tough mob enforcer."
Hm. There's something satisfying about moving a pile of weights this big. I'm not exactly… Feeling a burn, but it.. feels different. I assume it's just that I haven't adapted to the dramatic change in strength, but I'll have the ring check just in case.
"Batman's got scars?"
"He's a baseline human who fought the Gotham mobs at their worst. Of course he's got scars."
"Yeah, I-." She makes a small frown, then face-shrugs. "Just.. kinda assumed that he was too good for that."
"Very good at what he does, yes. Invulnerable, no. Everyone's got to start somewhere. He started using the bat motif after he nearly got stabbed to death by an underage prostitute on his first night back in Gotham."
"Robin tell you that?"
"No. Catwoman. She used to work for the same pimp."
"Catwoman was a hooker?"
"Where did you think she got the whip?"
"Oh. Ew."
"If you want to meet people with normal life stories, you're in the wrong vocation. Though if you don't, I'm free at seven."
"K-. Seriously?"
"What? You're hot, I'm hot, we've got this hobby in common. There wouldn't be any of that 'making up excuses why you have to dash off' nonsense that spikes so many superhero/normie relationships…" I shrug. "And don't think I haven't noticed that you've been taking me up on my offer."
"Yeah, I'm-. Not.. really looking for a boyfriend right now?"
"And yet, you found one anyway. Aren't you lucky?"
"Tch. Narcissist, much?"
"I'm an Orange Lantern. I'm very in touch with my desires, and you're what I desire. And you are not in touch with your desires. You want to stare, but you feel weird about it even though I've told you it's fine." Still pushing the weights up and down with my legs I tense and relax the muscles of my chest in turn. "Do you want to touch me? Because that's fine too."
She jerks her head away immediately, and I roll my eyes.
"You see, that's what I'm talking about. You want, then the moment you're offered what you want-."
"And you're so sure you know what I want."
"Everything you want? No. That you want a particular thing? The human body's reaction to sexual desire is perfectly predictable." I point to my right eye with my right forefinger. "Pupil dilation is the obvious-."
"Yeah, I-. Know about pupil dilation."
"Mine are pretty… Di-lat-ed."
She just exhales, then starts ignoring me. I wonder if she's got some other hang up I don't know about? I call the ring, making sure that I have absolutely no desire to have it aid in my exercise routine. It floats up and settles on my left ring finger-.
19th August 2010
16:16 GMT -5
Warning! Deviation from baseline thought processes detected!
I frown. I don't feel-. I don't think I feel any different, but I suppose that I wouldn't. That's why I set the ring to let me know.
In what regard?
For a start, you're hitting on a girl about half your age.
She doesn't know that.
I'm comparing your behaviour to baselines, here. I can't make moral judgements. And before you took that shot, you wouldn't have done that. And you certainly wouldn't have come on to the first hot girl you saw like you're doing now. And you wouldn't have responded with 'she doesn't know that' just now.
The animals I tested demonstrated an increase in dominance. Increased confidence. Do you think that's what it is?
I don't really think. So how about an experiment?
I'm listening.
What would you say to the idea of pulling her off the machine, tearing off her clothes and raping her right now?
It would be pointless. Aside from the fact that I don't think I'd enjoy it very much, I don't have any way to conceal it. I'd have the League after me, get you taken from me and end up in prison.
Yeah, see, that's definitely not the answer you would have given. What about the moral reasons relating to an individual's right to personal integrity? What happened to the fact that you like these kids?
…
Oh. Yes, I… Why… Aren't I… Considering that?
One obvious reason.
You can't just give someone an injection and remove their capacity for moral judgements. That's nonsense.
No, but psychoses can be seen in altered brain structures. And you still can make moral judgements because you understand what I just said. You just didn't.
Yes, but I would have done it automatically. Now I…
If you can't tell me…
It feels like a distraction. Something that would stop me getting what I want. And before, I'd have said that it was a way of forcing me to instinctively take into account the long term consequences. I can clearly still reason, but… That's undeniably a change.
I can still do a reset?
I get up off the exercise machine and head out of the gym, taking my clothes with me.
Not… Yet. I'm going to try finding another recipient again, now that I've got a better idea what I'm looking for.
That isn't what you were planning on doing.
Perhaps. But I'm not exactly that person any more, am I?
How to approach her?
I stand, walking over to my own weights and moving the pin… All the way up. That seems about right for unusually muscular humans and low-tier super strength. Boosted strength? I shouldn't sound like I'm claiming to be in Superman's league. Then I sit back down and take position, my eyes moving back to Artemis as her limbs tense and relax in the smooth motion of someone well accustomed to the machine they're operating.
I push against the footplate and… Yes, that's a bit more like it felt on my first time. Keep up a steady pace-. I find myself matching Artemis's delicious movements without really thinking about it, and… I suppose that she makes a reasonable metronome substitute.
"Are you going to be checking me out the whole time?"
"Probably. But I wouldn't want to be unfair about it." I pause with the plate in the halfway position, then take hold of my t-shirt and pull it off, tossing it to the side. With no ring on I've started to sweat normally, and while I'm no expert on masculine beauty… I wouldn't look like this if I didn't really like looking like this. "Fair?"
"Ahh. That's… Not how it works."
"You ogled Kaldur in the middle of a mission, in all of our heads." I carry on pushing the weight, keeping my own rhythm. "You can be a hypocrite if you want, or you can take the opportunity to engage in reciprocal staring."
She appears to take that on board, and returns to her exercise.
"What happened to your ring?"
"I can't get good data if it constantly refreshes me."
"What do you mean by that?"
"The ring stops me getting hot, or short of breath, or tired. It's great while I'm wearing heavy armour, but I can't exercise like that. What brings you here?"
"It's free."
I snort with amusement. "Good answer."
"And I'm pretty sure that criminals watch the gyms, see if they can spot the local crime fighters working out."
I chuckle. "Yeah, I can imagine Batman going down to his local gym, and everyone around him staring at his scars and deciding that he must be a super-tough mob enforcer."
Hm. There's something satisfying about moving a pile of weights this big. I'm not exactly… Feeling a burn, but it.. feels different. I assume it's just that I haven't adapted to the dramatic change in strength, but I'll have the ring check just in case.
"Batman's got scars?"
"He's a baseline human who fought the Gotham mobs at their worst. Of course he's got scars."
"Yeah, I-." She makes a small frown, then face-shrugs. "Just.. kinda assumed that he was too good for that."
"Very good at what he does, yes. Invulnerable, no. Everyone's got to start somewhere. He started using the bat motif after he nearly got stabbed to death by an underage prostitute on his first night back in Gotham."
"Robin tell you that?"
"No. Catwoman. She used to work for the same pimp."
"Catwoman was a hooker?"
"Where did you think she got the whip?"
"Oh. Ew."
"If you want to meet people with normal life stories, you're in the wrong vocation. Though if you don't, I'm free at seven."
"K-. Seriously?"
"What? You're hot, I'm hot, we've got this hobby in common. There wouldn't be any of that 'making up excuses why you have to dash off' nonsense that spikes so many superhero/normie relationships…" I shrug. "And don't think I haven't noticed that you've been taking me up on my offer."
"Yeah, I'm-. Not.. really looking for a boyfriend right now?"
"And yet, you found one anyway. Aren't you lucky?"
"Tch. Narcissist, much?"
"I'm an Orange Lantern. I'm very in touch with my desires, and you're what I desire. And you are not in touch with your desires. You want to stare, but you feel weird about it even though I've told you it's fine." Still pushing the weights up and down with my legs I tense and relax the muscles of my chest in turn. "Do you want to touch me? Because that's fine too."
She jerks her head away immediately, and I roll my eyes.
"You see, that's what I'm talking about. You want, then the moment you're offered what you want-."
"And you're so sure you know what I want."
"Everything you want? No. That you want a particular thing? The human body's reaction to sexual desire is perfectly predictable." I point to my right eye with my right forefinger. "Pupil dilation is the obvious-."
"Yeah, I-. Know about pupil dilation."
"Mine are pretty… Di-lat-ed."
She just exhales, then starts ignoring me. I wonder if she's got some other hang up I don't know about? I call the ring, making sure that I have absolutely no desire to have it aid in my exercise routine. It floats up and settles on my left ring finger-.
19th August 2010
16:16 GMT -5
Warning! Deviation from baseline thought processes detected!
I frown. I don't feel-. I don't think I feel any different, but I suppose that I wouldn't. That's why I set the ring to let me know.
In what regard?
For a start, you're hitting on a girl about half your age.
She doesn't know that.
I'm comparing your behaviour to baselines, here. I can't make moral judgements. And before you took that shot, you wouldn't have done that. And you certainly wouldn't have come on to the first hot girl you saw like you're doing now. And you wouldn't have responded with 'she doesn't know that' just now.
The animals I tested demonstrated an increase in dominance. Increased confidence. Do you think that's what it is?
I don't really think. So how about an experiment?
I'm listening.
What would you say to the idea of pulling her off the machine, tearing off her clothes and raping her right now?
It would be pointless. Aside from the fact that I don't think I'd enjoy it very much, I don't have any way to conceal it. I'd have the League after me, get you taken from me and end up in prison.
Yeah, see, that's definitely not the answer you would have given. What about the moral reasons relating to an individual's right to personal integrity? What happened to the fact that you like these kids?
…
Oh. Yes, I… Why… Aren't I… Considering that?
One obvious reason.
You can't just give someone an injection and remove their capacity for moral judgements. That's nonsense.
No, but psychoses can be seen in altered brain structures. And you still can make moral judgements because you understand what I just said. You just didn't.
Yes, but I would have done it automatically. Now I…
If you can't tell me…
It feels like a distraction. Something that would stop me getting what I want. And before, I'd have said that it was a way of forcing me to instinctively take into account the long term consequences. I can clearly still reason, but… That's undeniably a change.
I can still do a reset?
I get up off the exercise machine and head out of the gym, taking my clothes with me.
Not… Yet. I'm going to try finding another recipient again, now that I've got a better idea what I'm looking for.
That isn't what you were planning on doing.
Perhaps. But I'm not exactly that person any more, am I?
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NightmareWarden
Versed in the lewd.
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"I dunno how to put Paul's behavior into words... I suppose lately it seems like that ring has been the smarter of the two though,"
-This Paul's teammates
-This Paul's teammates
DrThoth
I trust you know where the happy button is?
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This was quite chilling, in a way I didn't really get from the previous Tangseid chapters. It seems like his plot should have showed up earlier and been resolved during the Crisis of Pauls episode, instead of only being introduced in the aftermath.
I think another Paul would make the best narrative antagonist responsible for Tangseid's downfall, ideally Paragon but I'd be fine seeing Renegade too (he can make up for missing out on the Crisis).
I think another Paul would make the best narrative antagonist responsible for Tangseid's downfall, ideally Paragon but I'd be fine seeing Renegade too (he can make up for missing out on the Crisis).
Darko
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Well renegade is planning to take down one mind controlling tyrant.
He might as well get some practice taking down another one.
Chojin Patriarch
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Oh, this would never have flown on the other sites...
Good lord, I honestly feel dirty reading this, knowing what he'll eventually become...Showing off for the girl. Dear gods, he's going headlong into Gym-douche mode...
Thank goodness she's on her guard here. Honestly, the way... Let's go with Tangseid... Tangseid is acting, you'd have to be blind not to be...
And she's eating the eye candy. Gods, this is skeevy as. It's all the worse because we know he's literally twice her age.
Honestly, that is fair. and from her perspective, he's only a couple of years older, because most Pauls put on the junior team don't reveal their age.
True enough. Unfortunately, it also can't monitor your psychological state like this.
Bad experimental practice, Tangseid...Damn, the stupid Hyde serum and its' morality-removing properties. He's still just as smart, but now he can turn it towards stuff he'd previously have balked at. This is a trainwreck...
Well, of course an Orange Lantern would think that......He's got a point. You see a dude like that, you'd keep your damn head down.
Would anyone care to post some pics? I doubt my Google-fu is good enough to find good ones.
Honey, you walk around in a crop top that bares your abs. You have no room to talk.
I mean, she's never had a junkie or mugger try and slice her if she got in close?No, Frank Miller did. Year One, if anyone's wanting to check that.
...The woman walks around in head-to-toe spandex and/or leather. It's Hooker or Supervillain.
Hah! How American of her...
And I'll say no more on that...Honestly, besides the whole 'sucked into an alternate universe by a clarketech ring', the average Paul was basically a normal guy. You know, we shouldn't really be surprised by the few 'evil' versions we've seen. What would you do in his situation, after all?
And she starts to feel a bit put off, I see. His behaviour must be sounding warning bells, after all.
Well, that's complicated...
Whoa, coming on way too strong there, boyo. Though by this point, you'd have to feel there's something wrong, wouldn't you? She's worked with him before, she knows what he's normally like. And this behaviour...
There we go, shutting down his shit. Or trying to.
And there's the alarm bells. I bet she's seen that kind of gym-douche behaviour before. The fact it's coming from the otherwise polite English guy? Hell no.
Now, will he listen to what it has to say?
And it immediately pegged the aberrant behaviour. Good.
Seriously, you were good about that before you went dosing yourself with improperly tested serums. Bloody hell, he can be so stupid...
And he's not going to listen, because of the morality whammy the 'Hyde Serum' caused him.
Yes, and animals don't have morality in the same way humans do, do they? How would you know if their personalities really changed?
Surprisingly insightful for a ring VI. And a very good question...
And there we go. He can't simply ignore that, can he?
Argh, if only he'd thought to have someone else look over his work before he went full Spark...Well, genius, what's changed recently, hmm?
And we're onto Denial already...
If it's anything like the Sally Sonic situation, he's been shorn of the Indigo light at least. The closest thing to a direct opposite to Avarice, no less. Because what is Compassion but a drive to fulfil others' wants?
Good. Now the real question: Are you going to fix it? But we know the answer to that, don't we?
Come on you prick...
And he's lost. If he'd just reset himself there, he might have been able to fix the problem... Now? He just doesn't care.
And so goes Tangseid Paul's start of darkness... Honestly, this was... ugh. Given how we know things ultimately go for him, things could have been so easily headed off... Still, it helps us appreciate the good alternate Pauls out there more, seeing how casually they could go so wrong...
Unnecessary word.
Gantradies
Not too sore, are you?
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*facepalms*
why didnt he leave a standing order to do a FORCED reversion in case of significant mental alteration/neural drift? i mean, its the software/chemical melange his MIND is running on- i cant internally tell the difference between before and after taking Ritalin without someone commenting on me being more/less focused,and thats just trying to ntoice a "relatively" minor change in mental state
-relying on your mind to notice its being effected/warped is.....
i mean, if he was concerned enough to program/prompt the ring to do monitoring in the first place....why..didnt he...
i dont know if that drifts into expecting "SB Competence" or not,but given the thought he went into researching alternative empowerment methods beforehand...
why didnt he leave a standing order to do a FORCED reversion in case of significant mental alteration/neural drift? i mean, its the software/chemical melange his MIND is running on- i cant internally tell the difference between before and after taking Ritalin without someone commenting on me being more/less focused,and thats just trying to ntoice a "relatively" minor change in mental state
-relying on your mind to notice its being effected/warped is.....
i mean, if he was concerned enough to program/prompt the ring to do monitoring in the first place....why..didnt he...
i dont know if that drifts into expecting "SB Competence" or not,but given the thought he went into researching alternative empowerment methods beforehand...
Handlewithcare
Versed in the lewd.
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Why is the Ring suddenly so much...not smarter,has more agency?
Because of Pauls desire to have someone to talk things through?
And if the Ring hasn't restored his instinctive moral considerations yet...that means he has no desire to have them, right?
Which is pretty terrifying.
Because of Pauls desire to have someone to talk things through?
And if the Ring hasn't restored his instinctive moral considerations yet...that means he has no desire to have them, right?
Which is pretty terrifying.
Darko
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That's how most rapists start off.
True enough. Unfortunately, it also can't monitor your psychological state like this.
Well he's not too bright.
Honey, you walk around in a crop top that bares your abs. You have no room to talk.
To be fair it is pretty difficult to imagine Batman suffering an injury from a teen hooker.
Or weird fashion choice.
Given some of the things people wear, it's not that much of a stretch.
But we can still hate him.
There's also his newfound sociopathy and control freak tendencies that will come later.
Probably not.
Ah, delusional villains that use every excuse to justify their evil.
Looks like it.
Sadly we do.
It also helps us appreciate the methods paragon uses for his uplift.
gustyeagle
Know what you're doing yet?
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Putting aside the cringe for a moment, for someone who is so afraid of death, isn't what he just did killing himself but with extra steps?
Darko
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Darko
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Either whoever made this ring gave it more of a personality, or this piece of shit altered it to have more of one for some reason.
He'll probably justify it to himself somehow, no matter how hollow it may sound. Villains tend to do that.
The Unaligned Player
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Query: Was a antidote to the Hyde Serum ever created?
Fellow
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I noticed in the last update that the ring seemed more upbeat than normal as well.
Vice Xarno
Versed in the lewd.
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honestly if Zoat had not said anything, i would have doubts this was Tangseid, and not some other Paul that is becoming evil, seriously we have seen morally ambigous pauls, god pauls, common sense pauls, unlucky Pauls, Tangseid was the only one i could easily say was evil, and with the law of the multiverse, there are bound to be othe revil pauls, so my main issue with the passt couple of chapters isnt what Tangseid is doing, its that it isnt another Evil Paul, just one we saw before
Chojin Patriarch
Veteran Lurker
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Perfect. Wasn't talking about pics of the Holly-stab anyway...Well I found this, but it's not about Holly, so sorry.
Seriously, how the hell does Bruce keep that shit hidden when he's running around being a playboy? I mean, you can only wear shirts around the pool so many times before someone gets suspicious...
Darko
Connoisseur.
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The answer is obvious.
He uses Bat Makeup to conceal the scars.
BlueMangoAdea
Alive. For now.
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I'm not sure if the ring would even be capable of a forced reversion if the current ring user does not want it.
Well, yes. But as he said himself, he's basically a different person from his previous self, so Tangseid doesn't want to change and kill his current self.
DAT_NOOB
Accused of writing in a far away land
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I'd have thought it's because he's often spunking, it rock climbing or going to adventurous trips to foreign lands to 'find himself'
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