With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Senevri · Mar 31, 2022

LiamOfOrmonde said:
I'm curious. Name two, and Egyptian gods don't count.

A lot of gods have passed through Egypt so that's a bit like, recommend a GPU, Nvidia does not count, or ignore Rome when talking about the history of Europe.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attar_(god) is the first that comes to mind.

Within the same pantheon? There are quite a few, starting with Loki, obv. Several indian gods have multiple names and avatars, and obviously tgere are many gods with ambiguous gender.

However, ones that stuck to one gender, then swapped and stuck with another? Not that common. Chicomecoatl to Centeotl is one.

Norse Mani (M) may be related to Sami Mani (F), but both names just mean the Moon, so that might be a coincidence.

Bud-E · Mar 31, 2022

I'm enjoying this story but apart of me is remembering what Paul said to Flash when he first came back to earth. If the League goes out of their way to try and fix a situation just because there worried Paul will do so with methods they don't like then there not really heroes they just don't like Paul or how he chooses to handle problems.

Sojiko · Mar 31, 2022

I really like the fact that the SI is perfectly aware that he suffers from tunnel vision and that his mindset is limited in a way that makes him unsuited to dealing with this situation. Especially since he recognizes that the best course of action for him is to sub in for those he acknowledges as better capable of making progress.

When a character is as powerful as Orange Lantern, it's easy to think they have no flaw. When a character is a SI, it's especially easy for the writing to give the impression that they are always right. This example of clarity and self-awareness shows that it is definitely not the case for this SI.

I think that there are scenes were Zoat is aware the SI is wrong even when it's not made explicitly clear. After all, the narration being entirely from the PoV of the SI, it makes it very tricky to communicate that to the reader when the SI himself doesn't realize it.

Khornelius · Mar 31, 2022

Ngamer11 said:
What are the odds that Paul's going to have to rescue Vulcan from Thanagar in the future?

I'd give it 45/55 odds, I just don't have faith in them not doing something stupid.

Rafin · Mar 31, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
Hephaestus and Vulcan are having a brew. They both look around, Hephaestus nodding politely while Vulcan is more appraising.

"My Lords."

Ask Vulcan about Jupiter! Ask Vulcan about Jupiter!

RichardWhereat · Mar 31, 2022

I wonder if merging Jupiter and Zeus would make Zeus more responsible, and provide a counter to Darkseid.

Stsword · Mar 31, 2022

RichardWhereat said:
I wonder if merging Jupiter and Zeus would make Zeus more responsible, and provide a counter to Darkseid.

In DC the gods of Earth don't seem to know how to do that, although New God technology can.

Highfather recreated the whole Infinity Man thing with Zeus, Jove, Odin, and Ares as well as himself to form the "The One."

PDV · Mar 31, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
"Okay, we'll cross that off the list. I'm guessing you're gunna keep doing that until Wonder Woman's at the top of the list, ain't cha?"

"Yes."

Ah yes, time for Flicker Mode.

Doccer said:
Who? And what did they do?

RichardWhereat said:
The third tribe of Quendi, from the Silmarillion. They stole a Silmaril, and invited the second and third kinslayings.

As opposed to the First Kinslaying, which was caused by Feanor's host stealing from the Teleri. And then lighting them on fire, mostly out of spite. Not the same Teleri, though. Supposedly the boats were equally irreplaceable as the Silmarils, too.

Though given that other ocean-going boats were eventually made and it's never clear whether the Silmarils actually do anything, it's hard to judge whether it was fair payback. Also unclear how metaphysically-binding the Oath was - if it was really unbreakable, this was stupid even if it was just. Don't challenge a family to Chicken when they already ripped out their steering wheels.

Duke Long · Mar 31, 2022

PDV said:
Also unclear how metaphysically-binding the Oath was - if it was really unbreakable, this was stupid even if it was just.

I'm no Tolkien nerd, but I always got the impression that it was unbreakable (or rather, that they would die in a horrific fashion if they broke it), given the suicidal lengths they went to, even millennia after the theft.

rkyeun · Mar 31, 2022

Vaermina said:
As someone who embodies truth she almost surely did and was giving you her trust by believing you wouldn't try and exact word it.

As someone who embodies truth, she can't be that self-deceptive.

Doccer · Apr 1, 2022

PDV said:
Ah yes, time for Flicker Mode.

Followed the link but still confused.

mastermenthe · Apr 1, 2022

Doccer said:
Followed the link but still confused.

Here you go, Flicker in action, aka Flicker-mode, aka outdoing The Flash:

"Good." said Doc, rubbing his forehead absently. "I think-" he stopped at a beep from the comm display and he peered at it. "Oh, hey, want to see something funny, take a look at the crisis list. Quickly."
Stella frowned as she studied the list. "I don't see anything unusual, what am I supposed to be-" she said, then stopped as entries started disappearing. Soon, the list had dwindled from nine crises to four. "I didn't see anyone claim them. Some kind of processing backlog resolving?"
"Nope." said Doc. "That was Flicker checking in."
"Just like that."
"Yup. More than half of the outstanding crises taken care of, in under thirty seconds. Of course, she cherry picks. Most of the time she'll only take ones that don't require any talking or moving innocents. Really annoys some of the other heroes, but it's hard for them to complain without sounding petty."

I've seen this done only a few times before, the best example I recall was a Black Lantern SI that abused his undead state to survive real-time FTL dash-dancing across the entire globe for the sake of keeping the brains and souls of his Harvesting victims unaffected by being murdered before being stored in a nulltime subspace pocket.

rkyeun · Apr 1, 2022

mastermenthe said:
Here you go, Flicker in action, aka Flicker-mode, aka outdoing The Flash:

I wouldn't say she outdoes the Flash. Flash can go FTL fairly easy, and Flicker can't. But Flicker has to understand more about how to use her power because she's more tightly bound to physical consequences than Flash is.
Flicker is what Flash could be if he tried. And if he had the world of cardboard problem.

"Why do they call her Skybreaker if she can't fly?"
"You've never seen her throw a rock."

Her visor flashed, and she sped up her subjective perception again. It was time. She left a note on the couch saying 'BRB' and a recorder bug so she wouldn't miss anything Journeyman was saying if she was gone for more than a word or two, then broke through the thin layer of plastic she'd placed over his doorway as a compromise between avoiding property damage and keeping out the cold air. She rounded the corner of his modest rural home and workshop, and headed out.

Jetgirl had a secret power.
Everyone knew about her jetpack, and her flightsuit wings. Most had heard of her telescopic goggles, and her 'Zap Gun'. Her fans, and there were a fair number, knew about the variety of equipment she carried on her utility harness, and that she was a superb forward observer, in the specific military meaning of the term. They also knew she had something extra, something special for dealing with really tough foes, out where there wasn't any chance of collateral damage, and, frustratingly for them, rarely any nearby witnesses.
The most popular theory was that she had some kind of heavy plasma cannon mounted on a truck driven by an assistant, kept it quiet because the authorities tended to frown on that sort of thing, and would lure opponents into its sights. But no one had ever seen it, so speculation continued.
In truth, it was a matter of being willing to do a lot of preparation and calculation in midair, and fly in a way that looked just clumsy enough, that surely the next shot or lunge would get her. Until her opponent–in this case a giant, magically animated, flying skull that fired energy beams from its eyes–was in a position where no debris would cause damage or injury when something specific happened.
Then she called Flicker.
And Flicker was willing to come when called, even when she was off duty, even when she'd been asleep. Because not only were they good friends, but she trusted Jetgirl to take care of all the details–especially the one about making sure there was a safe place for any wreckage to fall.
So all Flicker had to do was show up. And throw rocks. And then go right back to whatever she'd been doing, knowing she'd done something worthwhile and helpful for a friend, all in a few seconds.
Jetgirl was several states away, and High Speed Pathing had shown many of the highways as clogged with traffic, but there was a rail line handy, so Flicker followed that, picking up a few likely rocks from beside the tracks as she went.
It wasn't an emergency, so Flicker didn't go faster than 0.05 c. The locomotive engineers of the trains she passed by or over saw a flash of light and heard a peal of thunder, but the trains themselves were barely buffeted. In ninety-one milliseconds she was at the specified coordinates–in the middle of a stubble filled field–and looked up along the vector to find the skull. There it was, about two kilometers up, frozen in its midair ballet with Jetgirl, who had accelerated away to a safe distance off to the side before calling.
Flicker increased the magnification of her visor to get a better picture, and updated the position and velocity data on the skull, noting Jetgirl's estimate of its mass and internal structure. The wild card was the force field she had warned about, glowing a faint sullen red around the skull. Jetgirl's Zap Gun and grenades hadn't been able to touch it. She planned her first rock with that in mind.
It was a nice quarter kilo chunk of stone, and Flicker threw it at about 200 kilometers per second, an order of magnitude faster then the average meteor. The explosive energy equivalent would be a little over a ton of TNT, about the same as a shell from a battleship gun.
There was a thin line of light along the flight path from where Flicker was standing, a flash of light as it hit, a slight brightening of the force field in the area around it–and otherwise nothing. It hadn't dropped the force field, or gone through. There would be a boom eventually, but Flicker wasn't going to stand around and wait for something as slow as sound waves to arrive.
She sent the second rock on it's way at 600 kilometers per second, about ten tons of TNT equivalent. A brighter line, a bigger flash, a larger area of force field brightening–but still no penetration.
Fine. So it had a strong force field, one tuned to reflect most of the energy and prevent point penetrations. It was probably easier to overload over a longer time–cooling would be a serious problem if nothing else–but Flicker wasn't about to wait. Not when she could just throw the next rock harder.
Third rock, 2,000 kilometers per second, 100 tons equivalent. Jetgirl would definitely feel the shockwave from this one, even at half a kilometer away. But her suit had ear protection, and she was facing away and accelerating, she knew the drill. Flicker watched the rock hit, the bright flash much larger than the skull now. The whole force field wavered, glowing intensely–and held.
Okay, this was starting to get silly. She double checked the location of the nearest houses and vehicles. Some of them were going to get broken windows. She also sent a flash warning to Jetgirl, who was going to have one hell of a ride. Flicker estimated how far away she would be when the shockwave from the next rock hit her, and corrected for her velocity. She should still be okay, she'd had worse.
Flicker made sure her data recorders were capturing everything, Doc and Journeyman would want to see the telemetry from this. Ideally they'd want to inspect surviving pieces of the skull, too, but there wasn't going to be any.
Flicker threw the fourth, slightly heavier rock at about 6,000 kilometers per second, two percent of the speed of light, and it released a kiloton of TNT's worth of energy when it hit.
That, finally, was enough. The skull disappeared in the fireball–and didn't reappear afterwards.
She stayed long enough to watch Jetgirl resume controlled flight after the shockwave hit, and send an apology, then headed back.

Flicker had been gone a little over two seconds, most of it making sure Jetgirl was going to be okay, when she returned to Journeyman's workshop. She took a moment to replace the plastic over the door, then checked the feed from her recorder bug. She'd missed the words '–not her fault.' and Journeyman was just looking up and frowning as he realized she'd disappeared when she returned to her seat on the couch.
"Sorry," she said. "Took a little longer than I expected. But go on. Not her fault–why not?"
"Because," said Journeyman, "if she's too specific about what she sees in the future, her ability to affect it will stop working. And if she is specific only some of the time, people would be able to tell when she's predicting and when not. So it's probably a safety habit."
"Ah, okay. It's still irritating. Especially when I want advice about the present that depends on general principles rather than specific predictions."
"Yeah, I can see that." He raised an eyebrow. "So are you going to tell me where you went?"
"Nebraska. Jetgirl needed a hand taking out one of those giant flying skull things."
"A Necrocap? How big was it?"
"About five meters tall or so. I'm not sure whether that's big for one of them or not–Database didn't have any specific size data."
"That's huge. I wonder who made it, and what they fed it. They're really dangerous, because they have an impenetrable force field that's–"
"It's not impenetrable."
"Well, yes, but you have to use a trick to–"
"Nope, I just threw rocks."
"I suppose hitting it from more than one direction at a time would–"
"Same direction. Took four rocks, upping the energy an order of magnitude each time."
Journeyman stared at her for a moment, and she could see him calculating in his head. "Um. Just how hard did you throw the last rock?"
"At 0.02 c. Yield was about a kiloton. No one got hurt, because Jetgirl did a good job of luring it high up and way out in the countryside, but there will be a few broken windows, and it will probably make the news. Oh, and Jetgirl will be sore tomorrow from the shockwave, even with the protection from her suit. She was only half a kilometer away."
"You know, I could have given some useful advice on how to handle it, if you had stopped to ask me."
"You know, I wouldn't have to stop to ask you for advice, if you'd recorded some of this important information on fighting giant flying skulls in the Database, where it belongs. And where I can access it at high speed. Jetgirl might have found it handy, too. I didn't even know you were an expert."

RichardWhereat · Apr 1, 2022

PDV said:
As opposed to the First Kinslaying, which was caused by Feanor's host stealing from the Teleri. And then lighting them on fire, mostly out of spite. Not the same Teleri, though. Supposedly the boats were equally irreplaceable as the Silmarils, too.

Though given that other ocean-going boats were eventually made and it's never clear whether the Silmarils actually do anything, it's hard to judge whether it was fair payback. Also unclear how metaphysically-binding the Oath was - if it was really unbreakable, this was stupid even if it was just. Don't challenge a family to Chicken when they already ripped out their steering wheels.

The Falamari were attempting a kinslaying through negligence. Olwë knew where Moringotto was going, and that Elwë was there. They purposefully obstructed the Ñoldor to get them killed. It was the Ñoldor who came to the defence of the Þindar as the second action they did in middle earth.

Fëanáro Noldoran would likely have returned the boats, if loaned. Completely different to Moringotto.

But, yeah, playing chicken with someone who proved they'll keep going was never the smart move.

Stsword said:
In DC the gods of Earth don't seem to know how to do that, although New God technology can.

Highfather recreated the whole Infinity Man thing with Zeus, Jove, Odin, and Ares as well as himself to form the "The One."

The DC gods might not, but I bet Paul does.

Mr Zoat · Apr 1, 2022

27th October 2012
05:02 GMT

"Hawkman and Hawkwoman visited. Their world is having some sort of metal supply shortage."

"They can't produce enough Nth metal to meet their needs."

Vulcan might be frowning. His face makes it a little hard to tell. "You already knew about that?"

"I didn't know that it was bad enough that they were considering asking alien gods for help, but I knew enough about their utilisation and expenditure to know that something was up. They want to keep expanding their territory, but their fleet needs huge amounts of Nth metal."

"I suppose it's worth hearing about the situation from you as well. Are they a religious people?"

"No. Self-reliant authoritarian nationalists. The only organised religion I saw were people who worshipped a group of gods called the Seven Devils. They were fairly unpleasant. Actually, they were the dominant power on Thanagar until a popular revolt cast them and their churches down. If you mean, 'will they keep a bargain they freely make', then… Maybe? Certainly until the first wave of students are able to transmute metal without your assistance. Assuming that they can learn."

"No priests?"

"Only demon priests. And to their credit, the current government isn't interested in working with those."

"So they've got enough magic that it's possible."

"I'm not sure exactly what's going on. You might be able to crack it easily enough, or it might be literally impossible."

"Hm."

"Are you thinking of leaving us?"

"It's been a long time since I had a real challenge. Something that I wasn't setting myself for the sake of it. I've been drifting along, because what else could I do? Given the option…"

"You don't like working on cars?"

"The modern age doesn't have a great deal of need for smiths. I don't hate the work; this is the most focused I've been in centuries. But it's made me confront the fact that I've not been living up to my potential for a long time."

"The crown princess of one of their colonies is a friend of mine. If you want me to fly you over there for a visit, so you can get a better idea of what their culture is like, I'm happy to do that."

"That sounds like it would be the wise thing to do. I'll-" He finishes his tea in a gulp, then rises to his feet. "-finish off my current batch of projects first. Is a week good for you?"

"Yes, I'll speak to Bleez and arrange things."

He nods and then trudges off, scooping up his face mask and hammer as he goes. Hephaestus looks up from the notes he was scribbling about his leg.

"The frame I use isn't great, but it's as far as my domain takes me. Anything else and I'll be working on pure skill."

"What if that wasn't true?"

"Do you know someone who can make one without me?"

"No. It's… More complicated. You know how Hades draws power from Erebos?"

"Of course."

"Did you know that Zeus does the same?"

"With Metis?" He shrugs, sitting back down as he does so. "I didn't know he got any power out of it, but I'm not particularly surprised."

"No. With everyone imprisoned in Tartarus."

"That explains why they're still down there. Are you going to try to convince me to break their chains? Because I like you, but…"

"Do you know what it takes for new primordial life to form in the Dream?"

"Belief, life, magic. It's not really my area. You should talk to Hecate if you want to talk shop about pure magic."

"Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, by merging with a newly emergent titan."

"That-." He frowns, his eyes growing distant. "Titan of what?"

"Technology."

He regards me impassively for a moment. I regard him right back for a moment, then raise my eyebrows. He looks down and shakes his head.

"Is this that… God of Technology you were talking about? Because-."

"Merging would risk you losing your personality. We're talking about drawing power into your current framework."

"If that could work… I could… Hoh-hoh-hoo, you… You know how to tempt a man." He considers it for a moment, then shakes his head. "It wouldn't be enough."

"Wouldn't it?"

"To beat Zeus. I don't have anywhere that could store a titan. I don't have the knowledge-."

"Hecate does."

"You went there first. Of course you did. I didn't like Simpson's plan because I would stop being me. Just drawing power…" He shakes his head. "But it still wouldn't give me enough power. Not one versus a dozen."

"Not using Hecate's leaching method. But like I said, the demon was planning on binding it to him fully."

"Could that work?" I shrug. "What did Hecate say?"

"I didn't mention that particular innovation to her. She might have decided to sell the information on, or use it herself."

He looks intensely thoughtful.

"How powerful is it?"

"It's a titan." I shrug again. "You've seen how human civilisation has changed since the industrial revolution. How much it's become a part of what we are. Heck, just in your lifetime it's changed to the point that your domain doesn't extend to things we had for a couple of centuries. There are more humans alive now than there's been at any other point in history. How powerful do you think it is?"

"Powerful." He thinks a little more, then shakes his head. "But not necessarily enough to fight Zeus."

"And if it was?"

"If it was? Have you seen my leg? Do you know what he said when I dragged Ares and Aphrodite before him in a net?"

"I've only ever heard an outline."

"'We weren't actually expecting her to be faithful to you. I made her marry you so no one else would fight over her.'" Something occurs to him. "And if I was strong enough to beat Zeus, I'd be strong enough to beat Ares, wouldn't I?"

"I imagine so."

"Still, that's a lot of ifs."

"But are you interested?"

He leans forward, his face extremely serious.

"You know I am."

hance1986 · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
ertainly until the first wave of students are able to transmute metal without your assistant.

assistance

Mr Zoat said:
"Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, my merging with an newly emergent titan."

by

Mr Zoat said:
"I image so."

imagine

ungodlyone · Apr 1, 2022

Oh man I am so hopefull for this.

BlueMangoAdea · Apr 1, 2022

All hail Lord Hephaestus, God of Technology, King of Olympus.

Handlewithcare · Apr 1, 2022

Fuck yeah! My favourite god, getting a very literal upgrade.

God of technology, here we come

NightmareWarden · Apr 1, 2022

Soooo what happens if Hephaestus
A) Successfully binds the Titan of "Technology" (there'll be caveats, mark my words!),

B) Zeus orders Ares and some smart hench-gods to fend off Hephaestus,

C) Zeus delays most of Paul's allies after getting wounded,

D) Ares gets a sneak attack on Hephaestus, disrupting the Titan's cage (and possibly stealing for himself the energy fountain).

Ares might do as Zeus asks, but he'll obey in an Ares kind of way- attacking after Zeus intended (as opposed to being a meatshield between Zeus and Hephaestus). Then we have another Titan on the lose who could have a global range.

I suppose one of the more distant pantheons could interfere instead of Ares and the situation would be just as terrible.

Ngamer11 · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
"Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, my merging with an newly emergent titan."

That should say 'a'.

Mr Zoat said:
"Is this that… God of Technology you were talking about? Because-."

"Merging would risk you losing your personality. We're talking about drawing power into your current framework."

"If that could work… I could… Hoh-hoh-hoo, you… You know how to tempt a man." He considers it for a moment, then shakes his head. "It wouldn't be enough."

"Wouldn't it?"

"To beat Zeus. I don't have anywhere that could store a titan. I don't have the knowledge-."

"Hecate does."

"You went there first. Of course you did. I didn't like Simpson's plan because I would stop being me. Just drawing power…" He shakes his head. "But it still wouldn't give me enough power. Not one versus a dozen."

"Not using Hecate's leaching method. But like I said, the demon was planning on binding it to him fully."

This was a possibility I didn't expect. I wonder how the hierarchy of the Olympians will change if Paul's plan is successful?

Mr Zoat said:
"I didn't mention that particular innovation to her. She might have decided to sell the information on, or use it herself."

I think that should say 'information later on'.

Mr Zoat said:
"How powerful is it?"

"It's a titan." I shrug again. "You've seen how human civilisation has changed since the industrial revolution. How much it's become a part of what we are. Heck, just in your lifetime it's changed to the point that your domain doesn't extend to things we had for a couple of centuries. There are more humans alive now than there's been at any other point in history. How powerful do you think it is?"

"Powerful." He thinks a little more, then shakes his head. "But not necessarily enough to fight Zeus."

"And if it was?"

"If it was? Have you seen my leg? Do you know what he said when I dragged Ares and Aphrodite before him in a net?"

"I've only ever heard an outline."

"'We weren't actually expecting her to be faithful to you. I made her marry you so no one else would fight over her.'" Something occurs to him. "And if I was strong enough to beat Zeus, I'd be strong enough to beat Ares, wouldn't I?"

"I image so."

"Still, that's a lot of ifs."

"But are you interested?"

He leans forward, his face extremely serious.

"You know I am."

Once again, Paul gets some major backup by providing his ally something that they want or have been wanting for a long time. I'm excited to see how this all plays out.

Mr Zoat · Apr 1, 2022

hance1986 said:
assistance
by
imagine

Ngamer11 said:
That should say 'a'.

Thank you, corrected.

I think that should say 'information later on'.

No, that's correct.

Darko · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, my merging with an newly emergent titan."

"That-." He frowns, his eyes growing distant. "Titan of what?"

"Technology."

I think he already knew about this thing.

Mr Zoat said:
And if I was strong enough to beat Zeus, I'd be strong enough to beat Ares, wouldn't I?"

Ahh, one of the oldest motivations ever.

Revenge.

Radix · Apr 1, 2022

This actually seems like a competent plan that is potentially non-lethal. Especially given Hephestus is relevent to the modern world already. He could be a major step in a more modern pantheon as their King. A god of technology as thr new king for a new age.

It could even impact how humanity views leadership.

BlueMangoAdea · Apr 1, 2022

Eris probably becoming jealous that her follower does so much for Hephaestus. Though dethroning Zeus would count as an act of devotion…

Chojin Patriarch · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
27th October 2012
05:02 GMT

"Hawkman and Hawkwoman visited. Their world is having some sort of metal supply shortage."

"They can't produce enough Nth metal to meet their needs."

And now OL knows about the reason for the Thanagarian offer, eh? Probably more than a little amused at the fact that the too-proud rulers of an interstellar empire have to turn to a god from a 'backwater planet'. Hopefully a little humility does wonders for their hubris, before the tragedy begins.

Vulcan might be frowning. His face makes it a little hard to tell. "You already knew about that?"

"I didn't know that it was bad enough that they were considering asking alien gods for help, but I knew enough about their utilisation and expenditure to know that something was up. They want to keep expanding their territory, but their fleet needs huge amounts of Nth metal."

Meaning they're starting to get a little desperate, eh?

"I suppose it's worth hearing about the situation from you as well. Are they a religious people?"

"No. Self-reliant authoritarian nationalists. The only organised religion I saw were people who worshipped a group of gods called the Seven Devils. They were fairly unpleasant. Actually, they were the dominant power on Thanagar until a popular revolt cast them and their churches down. If you mean, 'will they keep a bargain they freely make', then… Maybe? Certainly until the first wave of students are able to transmute metal without your assistance. Assuming that they can learn."

Of course, if they do have a bout of megalomania-induced stupidity, Vulcan will certainly have thought of ways to chastise them, even without OL's help.

"No priests?"

"Only demon priests. And to their credit, the current government isn't interested in working with those."

Since doing so would mean giving up their own power.

And, you know, the whole 'evil deities of death and destruction' thing the Devils have going on.

"So they've got enough magic that it's possible."

"I'm not sure exactly what's going on. You might be able to crack it easily enough, or it might be literally impossible."

It took OL fusing with the Ophidian to reverse-engineer it, and that nearly created a black hole...

"Hm."

"Are you thinking of leaving us?"

Heh. I wonder how the Roman pantheon would take that?

"It's been a long time since I had a real challenge. Something that I wasn't setting myself for the sake of it. I've been drifting along, because what else could I do? Given the option…"

"You don't like working on cars?"

Given the number of 'Just Rolled In' and 'Customer States...' videos I've seen on the subject, he's probably sick of seeing how badly idiots can manage to ruin their cars...

"The modern age doesn't have a great deal of need for smiths. I don't hate the work; this is the most focused I've been in centuries. But it's made me confront the fact that I've not been living up to my potential for a long time."

"The crown princess of one of their colonies is a friend of mine. If you want me to fly you over there for a visit, so you can get a better idea of what their culture is like, I'm happy to do that."

And he can get a look at some fascinating new metallurgical methods in the process. A nice vacation, if nothing else.

"That sounds like it would be the wise thing to do. I'll-" He finishes his tea in a gulp, then rises to his feet. "-finish of my current batch of projects first. Is a week good for you?"

"Yes, I'll speak to Bleez and arrange things."

Assuming nothing else happens in the meantime.

He nods and then trudges off, scooping up his face mask and hammer as he goes. Hephaestus looks up from the notes he was scribbling about his leg.

"The frame I use isn't great, but it's as far as my domain takes me. Anything else and I'll be working on pure skill."

It's never too late to learn a new skill or a dozen.

"What if that wasn't true?"

"Do you know someone who can make one without me?"

I'm sure Ted Kord might be interested in the challenge.

"No. It's… More complicated. You know how Hades draws power from Erebos?"

"Of course."

The lesser Olympians probably look at that and go 'Man, that's a sweet deal. Wish I could have that..."

"Did you know that Zeus does the same?"

"With Metis?" He shrugs, sitting back down as he does so. "I didn't know he got any power out of it, but I'm not particularly surprised."

Good guess, but no...

"No. With everyone imprisoned in Tartarus."

"That explains why they're still down there. Are you going to try to convince me to break their chains? Because I like you, but…"

And I think Zeus would notice the second you pop the first lock.

"Do you know what it takes for new primordial life to form in the Dream?"

"Belief, life, magic. It's not really my area. You should talk to Hecate if you want to talk shop about pure magic."

Oh, OL loves this part, doesn't he? Being two steps ahead of everyone else?

"Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, by merging with a newly emergent titan."

"That-." He frowns, his eyes growing distant. "Titan of what?"

...Oh, my. [/takei] Now that is a stroke of genius.

"Technology."

He regards me impassively for a moment. I regard him right back for a moment, then raise my eyebrows. He looks down and shakes his head.

"Is this that… God of Technology you were talking about? Because-."

Heh. I bet a few of us had forgotten about that little debacle. I know I sort-of did.

"Merging would risk you losing your personality. We're talking about drawing power into your current framework."

"If that could work… I could… Hoh-hoh-hoo, you… You know how to tempt a man." He considers it for a moment, then shakes his head. "It wouldn't be enough."

He'll agree. The hook is already in his mouth and the bait is tickling his tonsils.

"Wouldn't it?"

"To beat Zeus. I don't have anywhere that could store a titan. I don't have the knowledge-."

And it's better than having the Machine-Titan growing wild. Just imagine what the early Hellenic Titans were like in their early emergence..

"Hecate does."

"You went there first. Of course you did. I didn't like Simpson's plan because I would stop being me. Just drawing power…" He shakes his head. "But it still wouldn't give me enough power. Not one versus a dozen."

It would let him step up to a higher tier of power within the pantheon. He'd no longer be the joke of Olympus, the cuckolded cripple of the forge...

"Not using Hecate's leaching method. But like I said, the demon was planning on binding it to him fully."

"Could that work?" I shrug. "What did Hecate say?"

Best to be very sure about it before you start, after all.

"I didn't mention that particular innovation to her. She might have decided to sell the information on, or use it herself."

He looks intensely thoughtful.

It's an enticing idea, isn't it?

"How powerful is it?"

"It's a titan." I shrug again. "You've seen how human civilisation has changed since the industrial revolution. How much it's become a part of what we are. Heck, just in your lifetime it's changed to the point that your domain doesn't extend to things we had for a couple of centuries. There are more humans alive now than there's been at any other point in history. How powerful do you think it is?"

Better to have it safely bound to someone OL can trust to use it wisely, than flapping around loose.

"Powerful." He thinks a little more, then shakes his head. "But not necessarily enough to fight Zeus."

"And if it was?"

Maybe not enough to fight him... But it would shake up Olympus' status quo nicely.

"If it was? Have you seen my leg? Do you know what he said when I dragged Ares and Aphrodite before him in a net?"

"I've only ever heard an outline."

Presumably because the bards telling the tale were more interested in laughing at the lovers being humbled and embarassed.

"'We weren't actually expecting her to be faithful to you. I made her marry you so no one else would fight over her.'" Something occurs to him. "And if I was strong enough to beat Zeus, I'd be strong enough to beat Ares, wouldn't I?"

"I image so."

Ah, the dream of the bullied and disrespected... Take care, Heph. Things might not go too smoothly if you poke the sleeping bear.

"Still, that's a lot of ifs."

"But are you interested?"

Like you even need to ask, OL?

He leans forward, his face extremely serious.

"You know I am."

Even Gods can want.

And I did not expect that. It does make sense, though. Hephaestus has one of the calmer temperaments amongst the Olympians, has enough pent-up feelings to want to improve his position, and a healthy desire for more respect from his peers. This would definitely set a cat amongst the pigeons in the halls of Olympus. Just imagine Zeus' face when he finds out about this, if they do it.

crazygrox · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
"Already done. I also spoke to a demon who was trying to make himself into something… Big, my merging with an newly emergent titan."

"That-." He frowns, his eyes growing distant. "Titan of what?"

"Technology."

He regards me impassively for a moment. I regard him right back for a moment, then raise my eyebrows. He looks down and shakes his head.

"Is this that… God of Technology you were talking about? Because-."

"Merging would risk you losing your personality. We're talking about drawing power into your current framework."

"If that could work… I could… Hoh-hoh-hoo, you… You know how to tempt a man." He considers it for a moment, then shakes his head. "It wouldn't be enough."

"Wouldn't it?"

"To beat Zeus. I don't have anywhere that could store a titan. I don't have the knowledge-."

"Hecate does."

"You went there first. Of course you did. I didn't like Simpson's plan because I would stop being me. Just drawing power…" He shakes his head. "But it still wouldn't give me enough power. Not one versus a dozen."

"Not using Hecate's leaching method. But like I said, the demon was planning on binding it to him fully."

"Could that work?" I shrug. "What did Hecate say?"

"I didn't mention that particular innovation to her. She might have decided to sell the information on, or use it herself."

He looks intensely thoughtful.

"How powerful is it?"

"It's a titan." I shrug again. "You've seen how human civilisation has changed since the industrial revolution. How much it's become a part of what we are. Heck, just in your lifetime it's changed to the point that your domain doesn't extend to things we had for a couple of centuries. There are more humans alive now than there's been at any other point in history. How powerful do you think it is?"

Thinking some more on this, Paul has even more options that I don't think have been discussed:

I have the vague impression that the way the New Gods of New Genesis and Apokolips differ from conventional gods is that they draw power from the Source, possibly instead of drawing from planetary magic systems.
I also have the vague impression that what sets the Christian God apart from various Pagan gods is that he's drawing power from both earth's magic systems, and from the Source at once. Possibly like a god-level version of what happens if someone who is already a magic-user gains access to Theurgy.
And supposedly the Maltusians have good data on how New God powers work.
PS -I imagine that most Titans who stop only drawing from the Dream and start drawing from the Source as well eventually end up stuck in the Source Wall.

Also on the Zeus issue, Paul might be able to convince those alien demi-gods who have access to those fragments of the Titans' power left by Rhea to contribute the things. If those things represent a link to the Titans in their prisons in Tartarus to potentially use to draw power, and the Titans have any ability to influence who gets power, they might throw their power behind literally anyone who is not Zeus, and there are an escalating array of other things to offer them to potentially gain their support, from getting a third party to run parole hearings, to promising to release them, to just trying to use the link to release them outright.

edit: and of course there's the ever-popular 'time travel and get the sword of the fallen back' option.

edit: it might also be a good idea to sound out other pantheons on what they'd do in a wide range of circumstances, and what would be required to modify those actions. There's an Angel right there on the Justice League to sound out regarding the Silver City's likely foreign policy. Paul has met king Rama and may have an in to speak with the Hindu pantheon. I'm not sure how he'd contact any other major groups of gods(Chinese, Japanese, Philippines, ?Mongolian? ?the god of Cocaine?, other?).

Darko · Apr 1, 2022

Chojin Patriarch said:
Of course, if they do have a bout of megalomania-induced stupidity, Vulcan will certainly have thought of ways to chastise them, even without OL's help.

Ehhh, maybe not.

Rememberthat Vulcan was a god of the Roman's, who were...basically a lot like the Thanagarians.

It's possible that he doesn't care about their methods, but still...

Chojin Patriarch said:
And it's better than having the Machine-Titan growing wild. Just imagine what the early Hellenic Titans were like in their early emergence..

Vulcan already explained what would happen.

According to Jupiter, when a Titan is born, mass chaos and death tends to follow.

BlueMangoAdea · Apr 1, 2022

Also, a Greek Pantheon god grabbing the Titan of Technology might elevate them above all other pantheons on Earth.

moralrelativity · Apr 1, 2022

Mr Zoat said:
finish of my current

of -> off

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Not too sore, are you?

Stand up so I can push you down!

Getting sticky.

Overlord of the Underworld

Not too sore, are you?

Aia airëa Fëanáro.

Versed in the lewd.

Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer

Glomerulus

Cabbitus Maximus

Versed in the lewd.

Mint Thistle

Cabbitus Maximus

Aia airëa Fëanáro.

Dedicated ragequitter

A pitiful excuse for a man.

Getting sticky.

Alive. For now.

Versed in the lewd.

Versed in the lewd.

Experienced.

Dedicated ragequitter

Connoisseur.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Alive. For now.

Veteran Lurker

Experienced.

Connoisseur.

Alive. For now.

Recovering pendant.

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