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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Versus the Rake Men (part 2)
21st year of the reign of King Randor I
Season of Chill
307th day, 16th bell


I lightly shove the book away with a frustrated sigh.

"So that's three sources that contradict each other. I know record-keeping went to pot after Hordak invaded, but I don't understand how these people can't agree about simple factual matters!"

Evelyn -who is sitting on the edge of the table, bare right thigh facing me- pulls the book across to her and closes it, running her right forefinger over the front piece with a pale golden glow.

"It's not contemporary. 'Records of Desolation' is a glorified collection of folk tales woven into a narrative a century after the events it alleges to describe. You'd be better off trusting either of the other works." She looks away. "Not that either of them had any direct contact with him."

"Do you know anywhere better to-?"

She tilts her head back, making a show of looking at the ceiling.

"What do you think Nolar would do if I appeared at the festival in disguise?"

"Ah-. The terms of your parole aren't widely known, so I imagine that if he recognised you he'd try to let Sir Duncan know. And possibly try to follow you so he could foil whatever your evil plan was."

She looks down at me, left eyebrow arched. "I think that you're overestimating his rationality."

"Perhaps, but you did try and burn him to death. That sort of thing can overpower even the strongest ardour. But if we could return to the matter of Hordak?"

"Did you know that I was there when he turned Keldor into Skeletor?"

I sit back in my chair, giving her my full attention. "No, I didn't. I always assumed that Keldor managed that himself."

"Hardly."

"With a little help from yourself?"

"I just brought him to Hordak's temple. Ske-. Keldor, performed the summoning himself."

I raise my eyebrows. "Hordak physically manifested? I didn't think he could do that."

"There was a cloud of smoke in the shape of his face." She turns a couple of pages in The Codex of the End Times, stopping on an artist's impression of Hordak's face supposedly copied from a pre-invasion hologram. "Something like that. He's the reason why Keldor wasn't killed by his own acid."

"Why his head is a floating skull."

"He just asked Hordak to save him. He never said how. Perhaps Hordak didn't like his face."

I frown. "Is his.. head actually a skull, or is his flesh just transparent?"

"It's actually a skull. His skin is cold to the touch and his flesh is shrunken. I believe that he's some sort of undead creature now, though I've never seen any record of something similar."

"Are you having regrets?"

"What, about saving Keldor? Or not asking Hordak to do the same to me?"

"About Mister Blok."

She raises her eyebrows. "I regret not winning. Does that count?"

"You brought him up. Know anything else about Hordak that I'm not going to find here?"

"Did you know that Prince Adam had a tw-?"

"Twin sister, yes, I did."

She frowns. "They told you? I thought they were keeping that-." Her eyes narrow slightly. "No. You found out. How?"

"Not all these books are particularly reliable. But I've seen enough pictures to know roughly what henchmen Hordak was banished with. If people matching that description turn up after fighting the Eternos guard in the modern era, that's worth noting. I take it that you were involved in that?"

"I took part in the ritual used to bring them here. I was left holding the gateway open until they returned." Her nose wrinkles. "An unpleasant experience."

I frown. "If Hordak can send soldiers through from his side whenever he wants, why doesn't he do it more often?"

"How would he maintain control of them? Skeletor ensures-. Ensured, that we were forced to compete for his favour and for the resources we wanted. That required us to stay put. If any of us were away from Snake Mountain for any length of time, we would build up our own resource base and so become less dependent on him. Personal loyalty is a fragile thing."

"So what were you in it for? He used the Ram Stone himself after you stole it for him. There's no way he would have shared the power of Grayskull with you."

"What are you in it for? If Hordak accepted Keldor as his servant he would be perfectly happy to accept you."

A reasonable enough question. And at this point I'd guess that she's sufficiently invested that she's not just looking for an escape route.

"There's a book series where I'm from, set in the fictional city of Ankh-Morpork. The city's ruler is a man named Havelock Vetinari, and the book describes one of the way he holds onto power as… Convincing powerful groups within the city that it's better to accept the same segment of a larger pie than try to claim the whole of a smaller pie with a knife in it. If he makes the city more powerful, then even if their power relative to other power blocs inside the city doesn't change, their absolute power does."

She nods. "A tenth of ten is one, but a tenth of a million is a hundred thousand."

"Right. When I joined, the Masters were the military elite of the city-state of Eternos. Now, we're the military elite of a continent-spanning alliance that Eternos leads. And if things keep going, with Keldor and King Hiss out of the way… Why not the whole of Eternia? Heck, as far as I've been able to discover-" I gesture to a small pile of books on the far side of the table. "-Eternia had a unified government before Hordak invaded."

"Your renown will be worldwide. But what would you do with it?"

"Hordak wrecked Eternia's technology base so badly that advanced machines are ancient relics that we can't replace and only a handful of people like Tri-Klops, Sortech or Sir Duncan can even begin to understand it."

She frowns in irritation. "Every single time we've spoken, you've called me Evelyn, and yet you call Tri-Klops by his preferred name. Why?"

"Because I have no idea what his name is. We have records of your father, and Kronis dealt in high tech weapons in Eternos's territory for years, but Tri-Klops..? No record until he appeared with Keldor."

"I suppose you can't have scoured every inch of Eternia for one man's name. Though for your reference, it's Trydor, and I'm still waiting to hear what you'd do with your fame."

"Rebuild the civilisation that Hordak destroyed. Make it so that the technology of your ancestors was commonplace again. Because the stronger Eternia is, the more secure I am. What matters to me is how good my life is; I don't care if other people have a life that's just as good. Surviving examples of the technology of that era are rare, and people hoard rare things. But if I'm trusted…"

I make a point of looking around the library, gesturing to it with my right hand.

"They will give you access, as the Sorceress did." She considers this for a moment. "Hmm. Not so different from my own plans, to tell the truth. I planned to follow Keldor's rise to the top."

"Keldor would never trust you with the power Teela Na has entrusted to me. Not even if he ruled the entire planet and had every artefact of arcane significance stuck in his backpack. And as powerful as he was, I'm not convinced that he has anything like the knowledge required to become more than the king of the molehill. And even if he did, if Hordak's still pulling his strings? Hordak's going to have his own inner circle that you wouldn't be a part of."

"True." She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh. "Despite the indignity, in the long run this may be the best thing that could have happened to me. And if you're being so noble about the command geas, there's no reason why you could not return tom-."

DOOOOOOONG!
 
Last edited:
I frown. "If Hordak can sent soldiers through from his side whenever he wants, why doesn't he do it more often?"
That should say 'send'.

"There's a book series where I'm from, set in the fictional city of Ankh-Morpork. The city's ruler is a man names Havelock Vetinari, and the book describes one of the way he holds onto power as… Convincing powerful groups within the city that it's better to accept the same segment of a larger pie than try to claim the whole of a smaller pie with a knife in it. If he makes the city more powerful, then even if their power relative to other power blocks inside the city doesn't change, their absolute power does."
That should say 'named'.

"Keldor would never trust you with the power Teela Na has entrusted to me. Not even if he ruled the entire planet and had every artefact of arcane significance stuck in his backpack. And as powerful as he was, I'm not convinced that he has anything like the knowledge required to become more than the king of the molehill. And even if he did, if Hordak's still pulling his strings? Hordak's going to have his own inner circle that you wouldn't be a part of."

"True." She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh. "Despite the indignity, in the long run this may be the best thing that could have happened to me. And if you're being so noble about the command geas, there's no reason why you could not return tom-."

DOOOOOOONG!
Looks like the other shoe has dropped. I'm interested in seeing what this version of Paul can do in an actual fight.
 
Hordak can sent soldiers

'send'

The city's ruler is a man names

'named'

frowns in irritation. "Every single time we've spoken, you've called me Evelyn, and yet you call Tri-Klops by his preferred name. Why?"

"Because I have no idea what his name is.

Also you may be trying to her out if her "Evil Lyn" mindset.

True." She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh

You have a thing for thighs.
 
21st year of the reign of King Randor I
Season of Chill
307th day, 16th bell


I lightly shove the book away with a frustrated sigh.

"So that's three sources that contradict each other. I know record-keeping went to pot after Hordak invaded, but I don't understand how these people can't agree about simple factual matters!"
The joy of investigating something that happened a long time ago. Especially in a world that has forgotten so much of that time. It's like modern archaeologists trying to piece together daily life in ancient Egypt from wall decorations and tomb-wards.

Evelyn -who is sitting on the edge of the table, bare right thigh facing me- pulls the book across to her and closes it, running her right forefinger over the front piece with a pale golden glow.

"It's not contemporary. 'Records of Desolation' is a glorified collection of folk tales woven into a narrative a century after the events it alleges to describe. You'd be better off trusting either of the other works." She looks away. "Not that either of them had any direct contact with him."
If there's one fashion trend in Eternia I approve of, it's the 'active ladies wear leotards.' Woof.

"Do you know anywhere better to-?"

She tilts her head back, making a show of looking at the ceiling.
And coincidentally arching her back and pushing her chest out? Yes, one guess what she's trying on Lantern.

"What do you think Nolar would do if I appeared at the festival in disguise?"

"Ah-. The terms of your parole aren't widely known, so I imagine that if he recognised you he'd try to let Sir Duncan know. And possibly try to follow you so he could foil whatever your evil plan was."
At least he won't be thinking with 'Little Blok' this time.

She looks down at me, left eyebrow arched. "I think that you're overestimating his rationality."

"Perhaps, but you did try and burn him to death. That sort of thing can overpower even the strongest ardour. But if we could return to the matter of Hordak?"
Yes, I rather think you've burnt any hope of reconciling with him.

"Did you know that I was there when he turned Keldor into Skeletor?"

I sit back in my chair, giving her my full attention. "No, I didn't. I always assumed that Keldor managed that himself."
...With his face melting off? That'd take some focus and control.

"Hardly."

"With a little help from yourself?"

"I just brought him to Hordak's temple. Ske-. Keldor, performed the summoning himself."
And a jumpstart from your magic. Though you only really played the role of 'starter motor'...

I raise my eyebrows. "Hordak physically manifested? I didn't think he could do that."

"There was a cloud of smoke in the shape of his face." She turns a couple of pages in The Codex of the End Times, stopping on a artist's impression of Hordak's face supposedly copied from a pre-invasion hologram. "Something like that. He's the reason why Keldor wasn't killed by his own acid."
And such an... Impressive face it is. Still a better interpretation that the toy version at the top of that page. Yow.

"Why his head is a floating skull."

"He just asked Hordak to save him. He never said how. Perhaps Hordak didn't like his face."
Or it was simply too damaged to put back together. You see his lips sliding off his mouth there, after all.

I frown. "Is his.. head actually a skull, or is his flesh just transparent?"

"It's actually a skull. His skin is cold to the touch and his flesh is shrunken. I believe that he's some sort of undead creature now, though I've never seen any record of something similar."
No neck either, you'll note. Wonder if the top of his torso has exposed flesh there, or is it a smooth lump with a hole for air and food to pass down?

"Are you having regrets?"

"What, about saving Keldor? Or not asking Hordak to do the same to me?"
...I don't think you quite have the bone structure for that look, dear.

"About Mister Blok."

She raises her eyebrows. "I regret not winning. Does that count?"
Entirely natural regret to have, especially since you were beaten by someone not using magic.

"You brought him up. Know anything else about Hordak that I'm not going to find here?"

"Did you know that Prince Adam had a tw-?"

"Twin sister, yes, I did."
He remembers that much from the eighties, I take it. Since he would have no knowledge of the Noughties version.

She frowns. "They told you? I thought they were keeping that-." Her eyes narrow slightly. "No. You found out. How?"

"Not all these books are particularly reliable. But I've seen enough pictures to know roughly what henchmen Hordak was banished with. If people matching that description turn up after fighting the Eternos guard in the modern era, that's worth noting. I take it that you were involved in that?"
And quite a motley and distinctive crew they are, for sure.

"I took part if the ritual used to bring them here. I was left holding the gateway open until they returned." Her nose wrinkles. "An unpleasant experience."

I frown. "If Hordak can sent soldiers through from his side whenever he wants, why doesn't he do it more often?"
Limited numbers of disposable troops? Management issues? Obscure rules enforced by cosmic entities?

"How would he maintain control of them? Skeletor ensures-. Ensured, that we were forced to compete for his favour and for the resources we wanted. That required us to stay put. If any of us were away from Snake Mountain for any length of time, we would build up our own resource base and so become less dependant on him. Personal loyalty is a fragile thing."

"So what were you in it for? He used the Ram Stone himself after you stole it for him. There's no way he would have shared the power of Grayskull with you."
Heh. He evidently hasn't been gone that long, if she still tends to refer to him in present tense... And if he's some kind of undead, there's no guarantee he's truly killable.

"What are you in it for? If Hordak accepted Keldor as his servant he would be perfectly happy to accept you."

A reasonable enough question. And at this point I'd guess that she's sufficiently invested that she's not just looking for an escape route.
The lady does have a taste for powerful men, doesn't she?

"There's a book series where I'm from, set in the fictional city of Ankh-Morpork. The city's ruler is a man names Havelock Vetinari, and the book describes one of the way he holds onto power as… Convincing powerful groups within the city that it's better to accept the same segment of a larger pie than try to claim the whole of a smaller pie with a knife in it. If he makes the city more powerful, then even if their power relative to other power blocks inside the city doesn't change, their absolute power does."

She nods. "A tenth of ten is one, but a tenth of a million is a hundred thousand."
And it did seem to work quite well for him, barring the occasional old-fashioned idiot trying their hand at rebellion.

"Right. When I joined, the Masters were the military elite of the city-state of Eternos. Now, we're the military elite of a continent-spanning alliance that Eternos leads. And if things keep going, with Keldor and King Hiss out of the way… Why not the whole of Eternia? Heck, as far as I've been able to discover-" I gesture to a small pile of books on the far side of the table. "-Eternia had a unified government before Hordak invaded."

"Your renown will be worldwide. But what would you do with it?"
Make the world better than it is. Which is a common theme amongst Orange-Ringed Pauls, I've noticed.

"Hordak wrecked Eternia's technology base so badly that advanced machines are ancient relics that we can't replace and only a handful of people like Tri-Klops, Sortech or Sir Duncan can even begin to understand it."

She frowns in irritation. "Every single time we've spoken, you've called me Evelyn, and yet you call Tri-Klops by his preferred name. Why?"
It's badass? I mean, he wears an obvious weakness on his face, yet rarely does anyone manage to hurt him...

"Because I have no idea what his name is. We have records of your father, and Kronis dealt in high tech weapons in Eternos's territory for years, but Tri-Klops..? No record until he appeared with Keldor."

"I suppose you can't have scoured every inch of Eternia for one man's name. Though for your reference, it's Trydor, and I'm still waiting to hear what you'd do with your fame."
Oh, no, it's even better than merely 'Trydor'. The Classic series of toys named him thus: Trydor Esooniux Scope. :confused: Imagine the childhood bullying.

"Rebuild the civilisation that Hordak destroyed. Make it so that the technology of your ancestors was commonplace again. Because the stronger Eternia is, the more secure I am. What matters to me is how good my life is; I don't care if other people have a life that's just as good. Surviving examples of the technology of that era are rare, and people hoard rare things. But if I'm trusted…"

I make a point of looking around the library, gesturing to it with my right hand.
...They'll hand you what you ask for, and thank you for the privilege of doing so. Perfect way to use people's own avarice for the better.

"They will give you access, as the Sorceress did." She considers this for a moment. "Hmm. Not so different from my own plans, to tell the truth. I planned to follow Keldor's rise to the top."

"Keldor would never trust you with the power Teela Na has entrusted to me. Not even if he ruled the entire planet and had every artefact of arcane significance stuck in his backpack. And as powerful as he was, I'm not convinced that he has anything like the knowledge required to become more than the king of the molehill. And even if he did, if Hordak's still pulling his strings? Hordak's going to have his own inner circle that you wouldn't be a part of."
Because Skeletor thought small. Sure, he dreamed big, but he wanted everything on a platter immediately. To become truly powerful takes time. He always sought out shortcuts, ones which had big drawbacks that would bite him in the ass.

"True." She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh. "Despite the indignity, in the long run this may be the best thing that could have happened to me. And if you're being so noble about the command geas, there's no reason why you could not return tom-."

DOOOOOOONG!
An alarm bell? Or merely the sound of Lantern's erection hitting the table? :p

Oh, this is not going to encourage the Sorceress to take another night off anytime soon. Lantern had better not let Grayskull get invaded on his watch, or he'll never hear the end of it. On the upside, he has a lot more options for dealing with intruders than the Sorceress does, between a Power Ring and a hopefully friendly ally. It'll be interesting to see how Evelyn responds...
 
Evelyn -who is sitting on the edge of the table, bare right thigh facing me- pulls the book across to her and closes it, running her right forefinger over the front piece with a pale golden glow.

She tilts her head back, making a show of looking at the ceiling

She looks down at the glowing lettering on her right thigh. Her toned and muscular right thigh.

I can't tell if OL is being dense or obtuse.
 
It seems obvious that Paul and Evelyn are interested in each other, I don't know what that sound at the end was, keep in mind that I haven't seen the entire show, but I do like that you kept Adora and what Paul's plans are. What other alternates are you going to create? Heroes of Might and Magic? Dragon Age? Mass Effect? Witcher? Skullduggery Pleasant? Star Wars? Also, will Paol from warhammer fantasy have to deal with the events from the total war games like the comet or Ursun being held captive? If so I see his mindset making negotiating with the dragons of Grand Cathay easier than most. Sorry about having so many questions all at once but I am curious.
 
I can't tell if OL is being dense or obtuse.
The last person she seduced early got set on fire. Also, as stated, he's in a position of mystically-enforced authority over her.
It seems obvious that Paul and Evelyn are interested in each other, I don't know what that sound at the end was, keep in mind that I haven't seen the entire show, but I do like that you kept Adora and what Paul's plans are. What other alternates are you going to create? Heroes of Might and Magic?
No.
No.
No.
No.
Skullduggery Pleasant?
What?
No.
Also, will Paol from warhammer fantasy have to deal with the events from the total war games like the comet or Ursun being held captive? If so I see his mindset making negotiating with the dragons of Grand Cathay easier than most. Sorry about having so many questions all at once but I am curious.
The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.
 
The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.

The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
 
What are the chances of Evelyn betraying Paul mid conflict? Are the magical bindings guaranteed to prevent that?
 
The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
Psst, that was Mr Zoat for "They are too powerful and my SI wouldn't be able to just walk all over them.".
 
The last person she seduced early got set on fire. Also, as stated, he's in a position of mystically-enforced authority over her.

No.

No.

No.

No.

What?

No.

The Cathay from the game doesn't exist, since it contradicts existing lore and the themes of the setting.
Good point, he really should be cautious but I don't see it as an impossibility

Pity but OK

Alright

Surprising but alright

Very well

It's an urban fantasy book series about a skeleton detective and his partner as they solve some mysteries and save the world, multiple times. Said detective is flamboyant egotistical dapper gentleman and very funny.

Missed opportunity in my opinion but your decision

Oh well, you're the boss but is there anything from the games you will include?
 
Thank you, corrected.
The incredibly minimal lore? There's already more written for this version than for all prior descriptions of Cathay put together. Like the old French Revolution version of Bretonnia, it's retconned because the old version didn't work. Themes is a more valid point, but I don't see how it's a problem there.
Warhammer dragons are animals. They can't talk or use magic. That's a fairly big departure.
What are the chances of Evelyn betraying Paul mid conflict? Are the magical bindings guaranteed to prevent that?
It would be very difficult for her to betray him. Not completely impossible, but very difficult.
Missed opportunity in my opinion but your decision.
I don't like any of the new stuff, and don't remember the old Star Wars books I read in my youth well enough to use those.
Oh well, you're the boss but is there anything from the games you will include?
...

No. Nothing. We're in the build up to Storm of Chaos.
 
It would be very difficult for her to betray him. Not completely impossible, but very difficult.
So she would have either had to have been preparing for a good chance to do it for a while now, and would have to decide that it's worth it to cut a deal with the attackers, or planned for something to happen that day, and been preparing specifically for it. Quite hard to do any of that when she is likely being watched and having her actions, intentions, and loyalties questioned semi regularly.
 
So she would have either had to have been preparing for a good chance to do it for a while now, and would have to decide that it's worth it to cut a deal with the attackers, or planned for something to happen that day, and been preparing specifically for it. Quite hard to do any of that when she is likely being watched and having her actions, intentions, and loyalties questioned semi regularly.
She would have to create a shell personality without using magic, and hope that Teela Na was careless for months at a time and have plan which gave her no way to receive instructions and didn't require her to attack any Eternian.
 
Wrong, that's literally stated to just be the common view of Warhammer Dragons.
Umm... I'm not sure precisely which part says it's a common view of dragons, but since at least 2005's Old World Bestiary for 2nd Edition Fantasy Roleplay, they could talk (Quote at the start and reference 2c). Although IDK if there's anything earlier and given Storm of chaos is before 2005 it might not have been made canon from before the cutoff point Zoats using?

(Responding to Vaermina)
 
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Umm... I'm not sure precisely which part says it's a common view of dragons, but since at least 2005's Old World Bestiary for 2nd Edition Fantasy Roleplay, they could talk (Quote at the start and reference 2c). Although IDK if there's anything earlier and given Storm of chaos is before 2005 it might not have been made canon from before the cutoff point Zoats using?

(Responding to Vaermina)
Ironically that very book.

Each creature entry has two to three different viewpoints of quotes about the creature in question. "Common View", "The Scholars Eye", and for sentient creatures "Our Own Words".
 
Ironically that very book.

Each creature entry has two to three different viewpoints of quotes about the creature in question. "Common View", "The Scholars Eye", and for sentient creatures "Our Own Words".
Wait, by "that very book" are you referring to the bestiary that I used as a reference or storm of chaos?

Given how you're talking I'd assume the Beastiary but that wouldn't make sense as an argument.

(responding to Vaermina)
 
Wait, by "that very book" are you referring to the bestiary that I used as a reference or storm of chaos?

Given how you're talking I'd assume the Beastiary but that wouldn't make sense as an argument.

(responding to Vaermina)
The Bestiary.

Contrary to what Mr Zoat might like to claim, there isn't actually any retconning in Warhammer. What there is, is a boatload of unreliable narrators.
 
I don't like any of the new stuff, and don't remember the old Star Wars books I read in my youth well enough to use those.
I haven't gone through everything in the Legends Timeline either but I agree that it is much better than Disney's works in general, while it did a good job in some cases it failed too badly in others. I'm sure if you were too look you would find videos or articles like wiki pages that might jog your memories like Luke's wife and son but while I am holding out hope it is still your decision.
 
The Bestiary.

Contrary to what Mr Zoat might like to claim, there isn't actually any retconning in Warhammer. What there is, is a boatload of unreliable narrators.
Ok, that might work for in canon or in story reasons but that isn't literally true IRL.

Unless you genuinely believe that Warhammer exists IRL either in this 'world' or another.

(responding to Vaermina)
 
Ok, that might work for in canon or in story reasons but that isn't literally true IRL.

Unless you genuinely believe that Warhammer exists IRL either in this 'world' or another.

(responding to Vaermina)
Unreliable narrators is also the reason GW has given for any narrative inconsistencies.
 
I wonder what a version of OL that landed in the DCU of the recent Harley Quinn series would be like.
 

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