With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[DAT_NOOB]

Which Sam does he mean here? Because if he means Uncle Sam then isn't he being impersonated by his evil twin right now?

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I think he means Sam Lane?

 

[TodaBruh]

"Merry Christmas. Hope you liked the pet rock."

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Tfw your subordinate is more bossy than you are. Kinda weird how comfortable she is threatening a guy who could past her any moment, anywhere, with a single thought. Talk about dead self-preservation instincts.

 

[Pinklestia]

Which Sam does he mean here? Because if he means Uncle Sam then isn't he being impersonated by his evil twin right now?

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Sam Lane, Lois Lane father.

Uncle Sam can't directly work for the USA government due to technically not being a person.

 

[Bud-E]

Why is Aquaman giving Arion sanctuary? Does Arion have some leverage over him?

 

[jasonh23761]

.....I strongly prefer Waller to Armstrong.

Never thought I'd actually want The Wall anywhere near power outside of the apocalypse but there we are.

 

[Stsword]

Why is Aquaman giving Arion sanctuary? Does Arion have some leverage over him?

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Nobody knows details.

But him showing up is somewhere between George Washington showing up in DC to the second coming of Jesus Christ, what with Arion being a mythic god king of ancient Atlantis.

So the leverage might be "Aquaman doesn't want a riot." The fact that Arion was a complete asshat in this story is not known, or at least not publicly known, in Atlantis.

.....I strongly prefer Waller to Armstrong.

Never thought I'd actually want The Wall anywhere near power outside of the apocalypse but there we are.

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Waller swings between ruthless person to hard men doing hard things while hard. So there's a chance that what she's doing is for a rational and maybe even ethical goal.

Armstrong is stuck at "What the fuck is wrong with your brain?"

 

[Vaermina]

Nifty thing about having Sam in charge of superhuman defence is that he doesn't believe in free will subversion.

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Your daily reminder that Renagade doesn't know that Boss Smiley has subverted Uncle Sam.

 

[Duke Long]

Clare actually stopped to wait for her sister, and Luna looks at me expectantly as we return to our place alongside them

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Missing full stop, I think.

"You want carry on teaching your kids to ride bikes."

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'want to'

piece of information Sunset shared with me for reason entirely separate

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'reasons'

 

[Mr Zoat]

if you want to handle if differently

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Missing full stop, I think.
'want to'
'reasons'

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Thank you, corrected.

 

[theaceoffire]

Is she trying to die?

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Because seriously most people with superpowers in this world are super unstable!

You never know if they're about to dress up in a costume that looks like mustard and try to steal some onions or just start stabbing everybody and collecting their lips.... You cannot be this aggressive with them!

 

[jasonh23761]

Waller swings between ruthless person to hard men doing hard things while hard. So there's a chance that what she's doing is for a rational and maybe even ethical goal.

Armstrong is stuck at "What the fuck is wrong with your brain?"

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I think part of is that in most depictions I can understand what Waller is doing even if I don't agree with it or think it's more extreme then it needs to be. I've always liked the version from the original suicide squad run, who is incredibly ruthless and willful but will listen to outside advice and assessments. She'd change her mind and incorporate views that disagreed with her.

Armstrong is just a caricature of the intelligence community at their worst most stupid and egotistical.

 

[Windona]

.....I strongly prefer Waller to Armstrong.

Never thought I'd actually want The Wall anywhere near power outside of the apocalypse but there we are.

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Depends on depiction. Some versions of Waller are power hungry, stubborn, and ruthless to the point of awfulness. Others are ruthless, not in a cruel way but in a 'here's how to get from point A to point B, nothing else matters' way, kinda more a slightly darker version of Nick Fury.

 

[Karmic Acumen]

Your daily reminder that Renagade doesn't know that Boss Smiley has subverted Uncle Sam.

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Well, he took out the Light at least. It's not like he's had a reason to look beyond that so far, and he does seem to be changing the world insofar as he's invested in that.

I remain more baffled that he's the brony.

 

[Lord Ernest]

I remain more baffled that he's the brony.

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I don't. The Illustres transformed himself into an eldritch humanoid entity with weird priorities and morality, while Grayven embraced the ham, the roleplay, the chuuni. Who else would end up dating the Pony if presented the opportunity?

 

[Darko]

Why is Aquaman giving Arion sanctuary? Does Arion have some leverage over him?

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It hasn't been stated here.

Nobody knows details.

But him showing up is somewhere between George Washington showing up in DC to the second coming of Jesus Christ, what with Arion being a mythic god king of ancient Atlantis.

So the leverage might be "Aquaman doesn't want a riot." The fact that Arion was a complete asshat in this story is not known, or at least not publicly known, in Atlantis

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Yep.

Heck, something like this happened in the show.

Aquaman may either be under control or is trying to lure Arion into a false sense of security so he can deal with him, and the reason he didn't call in the League is because he's worried a fight could destroy a lot of Atlantis.

And Arion's actions may be known in Atlantis, but most may not care.

Renegade-side Atlantis doesn't have as much to do with the surface world as the Paragon version, so they may not care all that much about it and could attempt to explain away Arion's actions in some way.

 

[Breadnaught]

I know who she has monitoring Rifle and none of them are outside the normal psychological profile for that sort of work. Most would abduct or murder my children if they were ordered to do so, but none of them would do it for fun.

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Mook: "Under most circumstances, you'd be right. But your kids? Nah, we both know that would end poorly for everyone involved. I'd disobey those orders for the same reason I'd ignore the President if he told me to detonate a nuke in Washington. Duty to the nation doesn't include endangering the nation."

 

[Ardy]

Mook: "Under most circumstances, you'd be right. But your kids? Nah, we both know that would end poorly for everyone involved. I'd disobey those orders for the same reason I'd ignore the President if he told me to detonate a nuke in Washington. Duty to the nation doesn't include endangering the nation."

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Poor example in Grayven's timeline, considering how many did that

 

[Breadnaught]

Poor example in Grayven's timeline, considering how many did that

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Yeah, then Grayven killed them, crushed their plans, toppled their regime, and undid all their works.

Mook: "I used that example for a reason."

 

[Ardy]

Yeah, then Grayven killed them, crushed their plans, toppled their regime, and undid all their works.

Mook: "I used that example for a reason."

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I'm pretty sure everyone involved in the firing of the nuke was A-OK. At least onscreen, Grayven pretty much forget about them the second after the second nuke went off.

 

[Breadnaught]

I'm pretty sure everyone involved in the firing of the nuke was A-OK. At least onscreen, Grayven pretty much forget about them the second after the second nuke went off.

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I don't remember that arc perfectly, but wasn't it a combination of Father Time and his SHADE-subverted government, and Apokilips factions supporting them?

Because Father Time is dead, the local-dimension version of SHADE underwent severe downsizing, at around neck height. And the New Gods he encountered on that Earth are either dead, or had a Bad Time.

Then he arranged the systematic dismantling off all that Anti-Life broadcast bullshit and everything connected to it.

 

[Ardy]

I don't remember that arc perfectly, but wasn't it a combination of Father Time and his SHADE-subverted government, and Apokilips factions supporting them?

Because Father Time is dead, the local-dimension version of SHADE underwent severe downsizing, at around neck height. And the New Gods he encountered on that Earth are either dead, or had a Bad Time.

Then he arranged the systematic dismantling off all that Anti-Life broadcast bullshit and everything connected to it.

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Shade wasn't in charge of nukes, to my knowledge. "Do you have any idea how many people you have to convince to let you fire a nuke at washington, even when you're the president?". No one involved in the order save the bot' was punished for firing a nuke at washington. Grayven's kids are viable targets.

 

[Prince Charon]

Wow. This lady needs a How-Not-To-Die-By-Suppervillain course run by Waller.

And when Waller is the less confrontational option, well...

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Waller is usually depicted as a pretty terrible person, but an intelligent one. Director Armstrong is mostly shown as a crazy idiot who it's hard to justify her still having power without throwing SoD out the window or being Alan Moore levels of cynical about the government.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Pete Tong

29th December 2012
12:08 GMT

Guy looks at me like he's not sure what to make of that statement.

"You serious?"

I mirror his expression, and wait for him to-

He looks away, shaking his head.

"Why'd I even ask?"

"Because it would normally be a odd thing to claim, and you still haven't fully internalised the fact that we're fairly odd people."

"Okay, but jus' sayin' that yer entire Lantern Corps picked God as an enemy-."

"The Silver City as an enemy, and they picked us."

Because while Hades made peace with them, technically the Orange Lantern Corps hasn't. Which is why Jade couldn't get the time off; worshipping your enemies is generally looked upon as a bad idea. Particularly when your biggest enemy is as good at mind control as the Reach.

Huh. Reminds me of the panel in The Boys where Jessica Bradley tries to work out what would happen if The Boys and The Seven fought. Butcher proved that he could kill Vought superheroes when he killed Payback. Heck, he killed an unnamed team with just a gun before he got super strength. But there's a level of power people like Homelander and Black Noir have that Vought didn't think people could plot around.

Dox aside, the Reach are cleverer than us. They're certainly more unified and more experienced. And it's increasingly looking like that isn't going to matter.

Lanterns have engaged Scarabs a lot in this war. A lot of ex-Darkstars literally can't resist the urge to hunt them down and show them why they're no longer hiding. And while Scarabs have killed Lanterns -stupid Lanterns who got high on their own fumes and decided that they didn't need backup- the results have been very much in our favour. Roughly seven out of ten fights have resulted in Lantern Corps victories. And yes, we're already recruiting the best motivated people and the Reach can stick Scarabs on just about everyone so those deaths technically hurt us a little more, but the Reach don't have anything above Scarabs. Those are their best super warriors.

I don't know what the feelings of the Reach citizens further in their empire is, but for most people, something like that would be a major psychological blow.

"Ya could always talk to Zauriel 'bowd it."

"I'm afraid that the political objectives of N.E.M.O. are irreconcilable with those of a being which declares itself to be 'King of the Universe'. Until such time as the title is formally renounced there really isn't anything to talk about."

"Kgrgahhaha!"

Guy bows his head, and I suspect that only enlightenment is preventing him from getting to experience the joys of vacuum exposure. He manages to open his eyes mid-cackle to see if I'm showing any sign that I meant if as a joke, and finds nothing.

"Oh, man. Ugh. Y'know, it's all in th' delivery."

Warning: will detected.

Guy and I both look up as Lantern K'ryssma arrives early, arriving just outside the outer limits of what was once Reach-controlled space. I wanted to meet up where we first met up seventeen months ago but apparently the location didn't work for her. She makes eye contact with me first, but then looks at Guy in surprise.

"Illustres. I didn't know that you had already begun negotiations."

Guy frowns in confusion, his eyes going from me to her. I'm a little puzzled myself. Guy didn't mention getting a promotion, and I'm fairly confident that he would.

At length.

He reorientates from his 'lying in space' pose to face her.

"I ain't the Illustres."

"The original use for the title was to refer to any Lantern who achieved enlightenment, as you have. The use for the rank in the Corps that does not require that development is a more recent affair."

"Okay, it was." He shrugs. "What's that got t'do with us?"

"My species has been aware of the Green Lantern Corps for somewhat longer than yours. We remember the older traditions. Am I to understand that you are not negotiating?"

"No, we're together for a human religious celebration. What negotiations?"

Lantern K'ryssma turns to me. "Illustres, you have my gratitude for following through on your pledge to push back the Reach."

"You're welcome."

"Indeed. I am here because you have pushed them entirely out of what was once a Sector which the Green Lantern Corps patrolled."

"Ah. And that means that you're allowed to go there now."

"Yes. Moreover, it seems likely that you will push them out of further Sectors soon."

"We're certainly going to try."

"We wish to resume our patrols. I would like to negotiate with the Orange Lantern Corps with a view to making that happen."

"Is this coming from the Guardians? Because-."

"No. it is coming from the Green Lanterns who had to leave their homes in response to the Guardians' treaty with the Reach and who would dearly like to return. The Guardians will not intervene if the parties involved discuss things between themselves."

"Not thinking of jumping ship?"

"No. After many decades of service, I do not think that I could adapt effectively to a new ring colour."

"Okay. And what do we get out of it?"

"Y'get ta have a Green Lantern watchin' yer back."

"But these are Lanterns who already left. And who can't fight the Reach. There's basically no organised crime around here that the Reach aren't connected to at least a little."

"For the most part they would not be Lanterns who-. Who did not fight the Reach. Their rings would be returning while they remain in the crypt."

"You understand that across most of this region, any Green Lanterns who get recruited are going to look to N.E.M.O. for direction. Which is good for me, but I can't see the Guardians liking it."

"Do you think that the Guardians 'like' the treaty with the Reach?"

"I can only assume that they do, given what the Controllers have been able to do with far less time and resources."

Guy puts his right hand on my chest and pushes me away from Lantern K'ryssma a little way.

"Okay, Paul. Dial it back."

"Alright, this needs to go to the N.E.M.O. governing board, but I can guess what they'll want. This is N.E.M.O. space. Any Reach-affiliated or Reach Empire personnel are external invaders. If you want to recruit Green Lanterns here then they better be willing to fight this time."

"That is perfectly acceptable."

 

[Ngamer11]

Pete Tong

29th December 2012
12:08 GMT

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Interesting. Will we be seeing the two Lantern Corps working together more closely from now on? At least in formerly Reach space? Also, I looked up what the new episode's title meant, and all I got was the name of a disc jockey, so I'm uncertain as to what to expect for this one. Anyone have any ideas?

 

[Darko]

Guy didn't mention getting a promotion, and I'm fairly confident that he would.

At length.

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Yeah,, he'd like to show you that you're not the only one going up in the Lantern Corp hierarchy.

There's basically no organised crime around here that the Reach aren't connected to at least a little."

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And if there is then it's probably very, very minor, so the local law officers should be able to deal with it.

"Do you think that the Guardians 'like' the treaty with the Reach?"

"I can only assume that they do, given what the Controllers have been able to do with far less time and resources."

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I'm guessing the Guardians thought the cost of a full-out war would be too great even for them.

And the thought Paul had about the war at the beginning makes me think that we'll see them potentially suffer a massive defeat.

RagnarokAscendant actually gave an explanation in one of his fics on why the Guardians did the things that they did.

The don't care about it.

Basically, they're primarily focused on protecting existence from eldritch forces and they pay little attention to things like different races and species and what they do.

The GLC primarily exists to stop mortal races from potentially damaging the universe, with a side-gig of being police officers, so they're fulfilling their role, even if it appears that it's half-assed.

They even thought the Reach were not a problem since they're conquering ways would not lead to a long-lasting civilization and they'd collapse in a short amount of time.

Sadly this is short by Guardians standards, so a short time could be a million years.

 

[Ngamer11]

And the thought Paul had about the war at the beginning makes me thing that we'll see them potentially suffer a massive defeat.

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If the Corps as a whole does suffer a defeat, I hope Paul personally pays the Reach back with a big move.

 

[Breadnaught]

I got was the name of a disc jockey, so I'm uncertain as to what to expect for this one. Anyone have any ideas?

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Cockney slang. "It's all gone Pete Tong" means it's all gone wrong.

Which doesn't say good things about upcoming events.

 

[Ngamer11]

Cockney slang. "It's all gone Pete Tong" means it's all gone wrong.

Which doesn't say good things about upcoming events.

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Hopefully it won't be too big of a setback for the OLC. Or maybe it's not referring to the OLC, but the GLC, since this part starts out with Green Lanterns asking to patrol the space that was occupied by the Reach.

 

[Vaermina]

but the Reach don't have anything above Scarabs. Those are their best super warriors.

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No, they aren't.

Their best warriors are the Super Scarabs.

"I can only assume that they do, given what the Controllers have been able to do with far less time and resources."

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Yes... Because they are smarter then you...

So far you've been an annoyance to The Reach... The moment you move past that to actual threat. Is the moment they go scorched Earth and trillions die.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

Pete Tong

29th December 2012
12:08 GMT

Guy looks at me like he's not sure what to make of that statement.

"You serious?"

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Huh. I wonder what he was asked? And I was not expecting this to be the start of a new episode, either. Guess the wrap-up of the Medina situation made a good stopping point. Of course, now the big question is, what's going to happen this time?

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

I mirror his expression, and wait for him to-

He looks away, shaking his head.

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Heh. Not often a Green Lantern loses a staring contest.

"Why'd I even ask?"

"Because it would normally be a odd thing to claim, and you still haven't fully internalised the fact that we're fairly odd people."

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'Fairly' odd? OL, you are way past 'fairly'...

"Okay, but jus' sayin' that yer entire Lantern Corps picked God as an enemy-."

"The Silver City as an enemy, and they picked us."

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Yeah, but mostly because you poked them first, OL. Don't forget that part.

Because while Hades made peace with them, technically the Orange Lantern Corps hasn't. Which is why Jade couldn't get the time off; worshipping your enemies is generally looked upon as a bad idea. Particularly when your biggest enemy is as good at mind control as the Reach.

Huh. Reminds me of the panel in The Boys where Jessica Bradley tries to work out what would happen if The Boys and The Seven fought. Butcher proved that he could kill Vought superheroes when he killed Payback. Heck, he killed an unnamed team with just a gun before he got super strength. But there's a level of power people like Homelander and Black Noir have that Vought didn't think people could plot around.

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In a fight like that, it'd come down to who shot first, for a lot of those involved. Superman-lites notwithstanding, as OL noted...

Dox aside, the Reach are cleverer than us. They're certainly more unified and more experienced. And it's increasingly looking like that isn't going to matter.

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Yes, but which side is more motivated to win, hmm? When one side is powered by that motivation, that's a quality all its own.

Lanterns have engaged Scarabs a lot in this war. A lot of ex-Darkstars literally can't resist the urge to hunt them down and show them why they're no longer hiding. And while Scarabs have killed Lanterns -stupid Lanterns who got high on their own fumes and decided that they didn't need backup- the results have been very much in our favour. Roughly seven out of ten fights have resulted in Lantern Corps victories. And yes, we're already recruiting the best motivated people and the Reach can stick Scarabs on just about everyone so those deaths technically hurt us a little more, but the Reach don't have anything above Scarabs. Those are their best super warriors.

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Whereas Lanterns can grow a lot further, as evidenced by OL and his students.

I don't know what the feelings of the Reach citizens further in their empire is, but for most people, something like that would be a major psychological blow.

"Ya could always talk to Zauriel 'bowd it."

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I expect those further in are given a very doctored spin on the conflict. 'Brave Scarab Warriors brought down by the trickery of jealous antagonists.'

"I'm afraid that the political objectives of N.E.M.O. are irreconcilable with those of a being which declares itself to be 'King of the Universe'. Until such time as the title is formally renounced there really isn't anything to talk about."

"Kgrgahhaha!"

Click to shrink...

...He wasn't joking, Guy.

Guy bows his head, and I suspect that only enlightenment is preventing him from getting to experience the joys of vacuum exposure. He manages to open his eyes mid-cackle to see if I'm showing any sign that I meant if as a joke, and finds nothing.

"Oh, man. Ugh. Y'know, it's all in th' delivery."

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Gee, so glad you're being entertained...

Warning: will detected.

Guy and I both look up as Lantern K'ryssma arrives early, arriving just outside the outer limits of what was once Reach-controlled space. I wanted to meet up where we first met up seventeen months ago but apparently the location didn't work for her. She makes eye contact with me first, but then looks at Guy in surprise.

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Man, talk about going back a ways...

"Illustres. I didn't know that you had already begun negotiations."

Guy frowns in confusion, his eyes going from me to her. I'm a little puzzled myself. Guy didn't mention getting a promotion, and I'm fairly confident that he would.

At length.

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Yeah, and you'd let him. The joy of being buddies with a guy like Guy...

He reorientates from his 'lying in space' pose to face her.

"I ain't the Illustres."

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Certainly doesn't have the most obvious leadership qualities, after all.

"The original use for the title was to refer to any Lantern who achieved enlightenment, as you have. The use for the rank in the Corps that does not require that development is a more recent affair."

"Okay, it was." He shrugs. "What's that got t'do with us?"

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Well, that's interesting. Wonder if the Orange Lanterns will do something similar when they begin to find Enlightenment.

"My species has been aware of the Green Lantern Corps for somewhat longer than yours. We remember the older traditions. Am I to understand that you are not negotiating?"

"No, we're together for a human religious celebration. What negotiations?"

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From the same homeworld, after all, Kryssy.

Lantern K'ryssma turns to me. "Illustres, you have my gratitude for following through on your pledge to push back the Reach."

"You're welcome."

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...Man, a link back to that meeting would have been good... Memories fade, after all. Ah, well.

"Indeed. I am here because you have pushed them entirely out of what was once a Sector which the Green Lantern Corps patrolled."

"Ah. And that means that you're allowed to go there now."

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And since it's on the edge of their space, a lot of those races will still have some measure of free will... And thus crime.

"Yes. Moreover, it seems likely that you will push them out of further Sectors soon."

"We're certainly going to try."

Click to shrink...

Indeed, you were just musing on that matter.

"We wish to resume our patrols. I would like to negotiate with the Orange Lantern Corps with a view to making that happen."

"Is this coming from the Guardians? Because-."

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Well, there's a turn-up for the books.

"No. it is coming from the Green Lanterns who had to leave their homes in response to the Guardians' treaty with the Reach and who would dearly like to return. The Guardians will not intervene if the parties involved discuss things between themselves."

"Not thinking of jumping ship?"

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Interesting that they'd allow such an exhibition of independence... But then, those on the borders tend to be the loosest about rules.

"No. After many decades of service, I do not think that I could adapt effectively to a new ring colour."

"Okay. And what do we get out of it?"

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And being users of Avarice, that's a pretty important detail.

"Y'get ta have a Green Lantern watchin' yer back."

"But these are Lanterns who already left. And who can't fight the Reach. There's basically no organised crime around here that the Reach aren't connected to at least a little."

Click to shrink...

I doubt the big bads would tolerate any such anarchic behaviour in their regions.

"For the most part they would not be Lanterns who-. Who did not fight the Reach. Their rings would be returning while they remain in the crypt."

"You understand that across most of this region, any Green Lanterns who get recruited are going to look to N.E.M.O. for direction. Which is good for me, but I can't see the Guardians liking it."

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Oooh, that could get awkward. 'Sorry, sir, but the orange guys do have better methods...'

"Do you think that the Guardians 'like' the treaty with the Reach?"

"I can only assume that they do, given what the Controllers have been able to do with far less time and resources."

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OL, can it, before this comes to blows. This is a very sensitive subject for the lady, after all.

Guy puts his right hand on my chest and pushes me away from Lantern K'ryssma a little way.

"Okay, Paul. Dial it back."

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And when even Guy is saying 'cool it', you know you've gotten carried away.

"Alright, this needs to go to the N.E.M.O. governing board, but I can guess what they'll want. This is N.E.M.O. space. Any Reach-affiliated or Reach Empire personnel are external invaders. If you want to recruit Green Lanterns here then they better be willing to fight this time."

"That is perfectly acceptable."

Click to shrink...

Let's hope said rookie Lanterns don't get too angry, or they might find their careers cut short...

Well, that's a thing that is happening, then. And I bet OL was looking forwards to a nice bit of time off. On the other hand, he can just pass the buck upstairs and let Dox handle the discussions. ...What's the bet the Reach are planning a big pushback, and it's about to kick off, just as he's sitting down to open his presents with the folks? Such is the life of a main character, after all...