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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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ForeverShogo said:
Well, I mean, the country was doing just fine until people kept killing Queen Bee in various timelines. As long as she's still alive to manage things, Bialya is stable, prosperous, and even downright progressive. Especially by Middle Eastern standards.
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Technically, Queen Bee committed Ankh Morpork suicide in both continuities.
 
ForeverShogo said:
Well, I mean, the country was doing just fine until people kept killing Queen Bee in various timelines. As long as she's still alive to manage things, Bialya is stable, prosperous, and even downright progressive. Especially by Middle Eastern standards.

Also, is this before or after Queen Bee tried to use her powers to peacefully annex one of her neighbors? I think it was "Not" Kuwait to her "Not" Iraq?
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Ganurath said:
Technically, Queen Bee committed Ankh Morpork suicide in both continuities.
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Pretty much, yeah. Unfortunately for Queen Beena, she doesn't have common sense. OTOH, CS-Paul is likely to behave rather differently on this matter than Grayven or ParaPaul, if they even meet the Logans in the first place, so Bialya might not loose its queen in the CS timeline.

Also, Queen Bee only committed Ankh-Morpork suicide because she wanted to get revenge on M'Gann. If she doesn't want to emotionally hurt someone she associates with the Logans, she won't try to get Marie killed.
 
Buggy123 said:
Huh. Honestly, I never actually thought of any of that. Or realized that the team exists as a way to get around the UN charter that binds the League.

That's some well-honed common sense, right there!
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Was mentioned in the original chapters for these events.
 
I brought up Common-Sense Paul fairly randomly but it's nice to see an update for him, though I agree with an above poster that gathering intel on a potential threat is worth the mission even if you can't directly publicize the gathered information.

I suppose things I'd like to see from Common-Sense Paul: scan Red Arrow for completeness' sake and discover his mole/clone status; make sure the Genomorphs don't use demonic magic and have a magical consultant or supervisor (from Atlantis seems reasonable); actually do something about Lexcorp (scry wards shouldn't be as prevalent in this timeline, I believe).
 
Hmm, if Bialya is not a part of the UN, and isn't required to allow UN representatives like the JL in the country, does that also mean they don't have UN protections?

If so, couldn't OL just conquer the place by killing Queen Bee and smashing up their schizo-tech?

doug89 said:
If anyone wants a reminder, here are the first two Common Sense chapters.

Common Sense part 1
Common Sense part 2
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Thank you for that.
 
RichardWhereat said:
Hmm, if Bialya is not a part of the UN, and isn't required to allow UN representatives like the JL in the country, does that also mean they don't have UN protections?

If so, couldn't OL just conquer the place by killing Queen Bee and smashing up their schizo-tech?
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Then he'd have to run the place. Also, it doesn't seem like a Common Sense thing to do.

Grayven or ParaPaul might, but again, then they'd have to run it.
 
Prince Charon said:
Then he'd have to run the place. Also, it doesn't seem like a Common Sense thing to do.

Grayven or ParaPaul might, but again, then they'd have to run it.
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True, but surely he could ask for UN help in running it, and in setting it up as a secular democracy, and running elections? He could be the figurehead King, with power of veto over laws and legal judgements.
 
Bialya is a member of the UN; I distinctly remember seeing Queen Bee speaking at the podium in one of the Cat-Grant-reporting bits.

Being a member of the UN doesn't mean you have to let their representatives do jack or squat,though.
 
BR549 said:
Bialya is a member of the UN; I distinctly remember seeing Queen Bee speaking at the podium in one of the Cat-Grant-reporting bits.

Being a member of the UN doesn't mean you have to let their representatives do jack or squat,though.
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They are indeed a member of the UN, in season 3 they showed their representative to the UN. He actually had the nerve to complain about there not being any Bialyan members of the Justice League, only to get the response to the effect of "It would help if you had any metahumans who aren't wanted criminals."

Which reminds me I still think it's a shame the YJ writers didn't include Queen Bee recruiting the Global Guardians.

They are not a signatory to the Justice League charter though, I get the impression that the JL is only allowed in the signatory countries.
 
Stsword said:
They are indeed a member of the UN, in season 3 they showed their representative to the UN. He actually had the nerve to complain about there not being any Bialyan members of the Justice League, only to get the response to the effect of "It would help if you had any metahumans who aren't wanted criminals."
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...

There's less than 10 people in the JL. You could count the countries they're from on one hand. That's a ridiculous complaint.
 
Bit of an old one I noticed while reading some of the story only thread. Page 46.

"This little star cluster is called the Vega Systems. It's unusually, because-."

Should be "unusual" I believe.
 
Buggy123 said:
...

There's less than 10 people in the JL. You could count the countries they're from on one hand. That's a ridiculous complaint.
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It's a complaint addressed in this fic. What's the term OL used? The Just Us League. Bunch o' MURICANS, some space aliens and peeps from hidden magical kingdoms like Atlantis or Themyscira? For something backed by the UN as a whole that's kinda dumb, and I'm not going to blame a representative of a country for backing one of their own over pointing that out in general.
 
Buggy123 said:
...

There's less than 10 people in the JL. You could count the countries they're from on one hand. That's a ridiculous complaint.
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Just a small nitpick-

According to the wiki, Alienated in season two established that the Justice League had 21 active members.

In Season Three, while I don't know how many active members they have, Steel is designation 36 in the zeta beam system.

Queshire said:
It's a complaint addressed in this fic. What's the term OL used? The Just Us League. Bunch o' MURICANS, some space aliens and peeps from hidden magical kingdoms like Atlantis or Themyscira? For something backed by the UN as a whole that's kinda dumb, and I'm not going to blame a representative of a country for backing one of their own over pointing that out in general.
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You do remember that Bialya is run by a supervillain who coordinates supervillain operations out of her country right?

So I guess I'm more judgmental than you, because yes, I do totally blame a guy who works for a supervillain regime that won't even let the Justice League operate in their country for whining about not getting to play too.
 
If I recall, Queen Bee was only suicidally stupid in the Renegade timeline when she got popped by that stealth drone.

I think Zoat at one point clarified that she wasn't actually being suicidally stupid when she got killed by Adom in the Paragon timeline. That she unconsciously released her pheromones as a fear response, unintentionally provoking him into flipping his shit and going way the fuck overboard by ripping her in goddamn half.
 
Stsword said:
They are indeed a member of the UN, in season 3 they showed their representative to the UN. He actually had the nerve to complain about there not being any Bialyan members of the Justice League, only to get the response to the effect of "It would help if you had any metahumans who aren't wanted criminals."
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Amusingly, Sumaan Harjavti is dead is both SI and Renegade timelines.
They are not a signatory to the Justice League charter though, I get the impression that the JL is only allowed in the signatory countries.
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No, they can go there. They just can't do anything in an official capacity. Or to put it another way, they would have exactly the same level of authority that all of them started their careers with.
Maxx Crowley said:
Now I'm just trying to remember what Artemis could be pissed about.
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Explained tomorrow.
King of Frost said:
Bit of an old one I noticed while reading some of the story only thread. Page 46.

"This little star cluster is called the Vega Systems. It's unusually, because-."

Should be "unusual" I believe.
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Thank you, corrected.
Stsword said:
Just a small nitpick-

According to the wiki, Alienated in season two established that the Justice League had 21 active members.

In Season Three, while I don't know how many active members they have, Steel is designation 36 in the zeta beam system.
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Yes, and they're still virtually all Americans.
 
Queshire said:
They expect it to be useless just because the scans can't be used in court? My common sense interrupt is saying that knowing what the bad guys are up to is pretty damn useful, and relying on ring scans both limits it to a single point of failure and relies on trusting OL. Wouldn't be surprised if Bats wasn't at that point yet.
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Not quite. Scans like that have 2 uses:

a) finding out what's up. The team has better tools to do so that they've already been using.
b) evidence, for when those other tools aren't admissible or convincing to someone else.

They already did A with ring/telepath, and are planning to follow up with more ring/telepath scans. B is irrelevant. Thus, the instruction of "use these instruments to take scans" isn't useful to them, unless there's something else going on (such as specifically testing the equipment, or the team's ability to follow instructions even when redundant, or the teams' ability to recognize redundant instructions and improvise).
 
ForeverShogo said:
Well, I mean, the country was doing just fine until people kept killing Queen Bee in various timelines. As long as she's still alive to manage things, Bialya is stable, prosperous, and even downright progressive. Especially by Middle Eastern standards.
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You forget that making deals with Darkseid never ever ends well.
 
bobsimmo said:
gotta love that exceptionalism.
just like the new 52
*sips tea hypocritically*
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One in-universe explanation is that superheroes are a mainly American phenomenon. They exist in other countries, but far, far fewer people as a percentage of the population have an urge to put on a costume and deal private justice. Paul has mentioned on multiple occasions that there are huge numbers of would-be vigilantes (they only get called 'superheroes' if they succeed) who get killed or arrested shortly after starting out, and that this is an American thing. And you need all those tries to find the wheat in the chaff. I'm sure there are plenty of people with powers in other countries, but many of them have no interest in becoming part of a... volunteer super-police/super-military/whatever the hell the League is.
 
Queshire said:
It's a complaint addressed in this fic. What's the term OL used? The Just Us League. Bunch o' MURICANS, some space aliens and peeps from hidden magical kingdoms like Atlantis or Themyscira? For something backed by the UN as a whole that's kinda dumb, and I'm not going to blame a representative of a country for backing one of their own over pointing that out in general.
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It's hardly a new observation. All the way back in '92, Tiny Toon Adventures had a Paul Dini-penned short called "The Just-Us League of Supertoons." If a comics geek like Dini was referencing the term almost thirty years ago...
 
Steelplaza said:
One in-universe explanation is that superheroes are a mainly American phenomenon. They exist in other countries, but far, far fewer people as a percentage of the population have an urge to put on a costume and deal private justice. Paul has mentioned on multiple occasions that there are huge numbers of would-be vigilantes (they only get called 'superheroes' if they succeed) who get killed or arrested shortly after starting out, and that this is an American thing. And you need all those tries to find the wheat in the chaff. I'm sure there are plenty of people with powers in other countries, but many of them have no interest in becoming part of a... volunteer super-police/super-military/whatever the hell the League is.
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And this is in fact canon for this story. Perfect Immortal Physician or whatever his name was had to be convinced to join the JL by Paul, and we saw that Brazilian supermodel her was helping get better fire powers so she could apply.


I would like to see this league eventually go the route of JLU with scores of civilian employees handling intelligence, medical, etc.
 
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